Dealing with my kids' father...

[sheath]

Hello again, All.

I'm having a problem with my ex-husband, "Bill". He is the father of my children...my son is five, and my daughter is three.

Bill and I were quite friendly during the divorce, and we always, always put the kids first. Bill has always been a great father. He always put the kids first, always spent time with them, always made sure that they knew just how much their daddy loved them. All that besides the fact that he's loads of fun when he's around little ones.

Bill and I have joint custody, and he's usually been with them at least three or four hours, two or three days a week, no matter how hellacious his work schedule is. It has been quite common for him to just drop in and whisk the kids away to McDonald's on a whim. I guess the point is, he was really living up to the 'joint' custody...he spent almost as much time with the children as I do.

The problem? Bill has found himself with a new set of friends and a new girlfriend. Good, fine, dandy, right? Only problem is, he's suddenly neglecting the children. Now they are lucky to see him once a week for an hour. This isn't a gradual decline...it's sudden and shocking for them. They have been crying the past three weeks, wondering why daddy 'doesn't like us anymore'. I reassure them that their daddy DOES love them. But what I say doesn't seem to matter, when their father isn't around to tell them himself.

When I asked Bill about this, he simply said that he's 'too busy' and that he will come see them when he can. But ironically enough, he's taking more days off work than he ever has before. I would never say this in front of the kids, but sometimes it seems like he really doesn't want to spend time with them.

The kids have the same attentions from me and my fiance that they have always had. We really strive to be good parents, and the kids are always well-loved. But the void of their father's time is very obvious to the kids.

My questions: How do I reassure a five-year-old and a three-year-old that they their father still cares for them?

How do I help them deal with his absence?

Thank you in advance.

S.

 

[PinkOrchid]

 

[Jaybird3]

I don't know that you can sheath. Help them with his being absent that is. Maybe a phone call or two a week would help. Just make sure that they know that you and the S/O love them very much. Maybe you could have him over for a sit down talk when the kids are not home.

Explain to him what their reactions are to the situation. I am seeing this same thing go on with a next door neighbor and it is because the new girlfriend doesn't want him around the ex-wife and wants nothing to do with the kids.

Other than that I have no advice in this situation.

 

[peachykeen]

Tough one. Hard on them, hard on you.

I don't have any really great advice about what to tell the kids. However I do think that maybe writing a letter to your ex, similar to what you've written here might not be a bad thing. Better than tryong to talk to him, you know how we start out conve4rsations with the best of intentions but then the other personis defensive and next thing you know there's yelling and blah blah blah. With a letter, he can't immediately argue back at you and has time to digest what you're really saying.

Tell him more or less what you've told us - keep it amiable, "we're on the same side, we both want the best for the kids" - tell him how even though it didn't work out for the two of you how you've always admired what a great father he is, how it makes you happy to see how much your kids enjoy spending time with him. And let him know, gently but firmly, that they are feeling 'left behind' and quite frankly you don't know what he wants you to tell him about that. Ask him, "Do you really want me to tell your son and your daughter that you are just 'too busy' to spend time with them? Because I don't really feel like I can break their hearts like that, and I don't know what else I'm supposed to say. They adore you, and they miss being with you."

 

[Mstrskey]

Wow sugar that's a tough one.

The only thing I can think of is that prior to his getting this new set of friends and girlfriend your ex was more comfortable continuing to play the familiar role of father. Maybe it gave him a security in his newly single situation to continue in a few of his old routines. Well, now he's got the attention and such that come with being free and single and he's going to try that role on for size. It sucks for your kids though and the role of father is one he should ALWAYS play first.

Other then continuing to remind him of the effect this is having on your children I dunno what to say. The only other thing I can think of is if he continues to ignore his custodial duties tell him that you want to reconsider the custodial arrangement you have in place. If he only "has time" for partial custody then you'd like that to be the arrangement so that you can use it as an explanation of his absence. Maybe if he sees that he could lose his kids he'll shape up, but I just dunno?

Best of luck to you hun. You're a tough, smart lady and I know those babies aren't going to go unloved or unhappy with you for their momma. Keep us posted and I hope for all your sakes that he gets his head out of his ass soon.

 

[SlickTony]

Everybody's given you such good advice, I have nothing to add to it. But I hope for the kids' sake especially that you get things worked out with the ex. I'd say cherchez la femme in this case but you probably know more about that than I do; I'm just conjecturing.

 

[DuckLover]

Your situation is similar to some that I encountered among students in my conflict resolution class. Among other things, we talk about how to bring up an issue with someone without initiating a fight.

Some of Peachykeen's ideas were good ones-- meeting with him one on one, mentioning your admiration for his excellent parenting and care for the children, etc.

I also recommend that you make use of the power of juxtaposition (comparing previous and current behavior). To do so effectively, it is crucial that you be very specific. For example, you could say "Last month, you came over and played with the kids at least twice a week; in fact, last week you saw them 4 different days. I noticed that in the past 3 weeks you've only been over 4 times total." You could then go on to describe the reaction of the children to not seeing their father and, as Peachykeen mentioned, that you don't know how to tell them why their father isn't visiting them.

Another step that can really help is to offer to do something YOURSELF to help resolve the issue. In your case, maybe it would be offering to drive the kids to his place, prearranging days/times for visits (perhaps regular days? every Tuesday at 4pm?), or keeping him more informed of your plans with the kids so that he doesn't attempt conflicting plans.

AFTER making some kind of offer to help, ask if there's anything else you could do to help. THEN you can tell him what you want from him, or alternatively, ask him to suggest what he can do.

It's very important to make your offer and ASK him if there's anything else you can do BEFORE telling him what you want from him. I'm not telling you to acquiesce and put forth all the effort yourself, but you should plan to be an active part of the solution.

People support plans that they help create. The least successful solution will be created by you alone and enacted by him alone.

If you have any more questions about my suggestions, feel free to PM me.

 

[wicked woman]

Sheath

All the advice given so far is admirable....but having been there....may I offer another route....get used to it! Yes by all means talk to him and try to help him understand the effect it has on your children...but the change in his behaviour...due to new friends and especially a girlfriend...is to be expected.


Bottom line...his actions are not in your control...you are not accountable for him....but yes because your children live with you you will unfortunately take the brunt of their reactions to his lack of attentiveness.

Don't know if my solution was right but when my ex remarried (and had 5 more children) he continually ignored our two sons...no regular visits, constantly calling at the last minute saying he couldn't take them when he was supposed to, his wife was jealous of me and our children so often didn't treat our sons well when they did visit and my ex's response was to send them back to me (instead of resolving things with his wife who married him knowing he had an ex wife and 2 kids)...and on and on. I never made excuses for him....just facts....sorry Dad just called said he can't make it. Of course I had to reassure them that Dad still loved them and cuddle them when they cried and put up with their outbursts of anger. But over time they got used to that's just how it was...their Dad saw them when it was convenient for him....like when he needed a babysitter or someone to help him move (when they were older). They eventually sometimes played his game....saying they were busy playing with friends when he wanted to see them.

Bottom line is ....they still love their Dad....but they don't like him very much. He missed out on great times with our wonderful sons. They now have a great role model NOT to follow as a Dad and their attachment is to their other brothers and sisters...not their Dad.

Sheath...people make their own choices. Good luck in your attempts to help your ex see the error of his ways...but don't be surprised if he doesn't. Just hold your children tight and give them all sorts of love.

 

[dreamer]

Love your kids. Be there for them as much as you can. With a good mom they'll be fine.

If he wants to wreck his relationship with his children, let him. When they're graduating, and getting married etc and don't care if he is around he'll relize his mistakes and pay for them a hundred times over. My sister wanted my step-dad, not my father to walk her down the aisle. Imagine how that would feel for him.

I know it must break your heart to see your kids hurt. But you can't make someone else love. Bring it to his attention if that helps you feel better, but it won't matter. He's making his choices...and the results of those choices will suck bigtime for him later in life.

 

[lorddragonwolf]

this is a tough one just be there for them. maybe dad will come around and see he is neglecting them.

 

[sheath]

Thank you for all the advice!

I agree that a very tactful and non-threatening approach would work best, and I plan to speak with him about it this week...assuming he will contact me at some point this week. If he doesn't, I will call him on Friday, the next day that I know he does not work.

I read through all the advice more than once, and one thing stuck out most of all: People make their own choices. And I can't make up for his mistakes. As a mother, I think I try to do that...I try to make up for all the injustices of the world so that my children don't have to hurt. *sigh* When we become parents, the protective instinct REALLY kicks in.

I feel bad for them AND for Bill, because he will regret that lost time. Bill himself had a very absent father, and he once told me how much he still resents him. Bill swore he would never do the same thing. I wonder if he realizes that he's taking a look down that road he promised he would never travel?

But of course, that's a route the discussion won't take. I don't want to make him defensive in the midst of all this.

Given the advice here, I've decided to do this: I'm going to sit down with him, just the two of us. I'm going to make a point of reminding him that he can see the children anytime he wants. My schedule is just as flexible as it has always been. I am also going to (gently!) point out the differences in then and now, and ask him what I can do to help the situation. It's putting the ball directly in his court, with all the facts behind it, and asking him to make a decision.

And if he continues down the road he's on, then I will consider other options for custody. The children know that he can see them at any time he wants to, and that makes his absence even more conspicuous. Perhaps having a set arrangement would work better for him, and especially for the kids' peace of mind.

Last night he came to visit, and was out in the yard with the kids for five minutes before he said he had to go meet a friend. Five minutes to see his kids on his day off, when he lives just down the street? Last night was the first time I went from confusion to anger about the situation. It hurt like hell to see the sadness in their eyes.

So...thank you all for the good advice. I'm going to be speaking with him soon, and I'll tell you how it goes.

S.

 

[James G 5]

Last night was the first time I went from confusion to anger about the situation. It hurt like hell to see the sadness in their eyes.

So...thank you all for the good advice. I'm going to be speaking with him soon, and I'll tell you how it goes.

S.

As a former kid who was in a similar (albeit much wore in some ways) situation, one thing I will stress is that it's imperative you keep this anger in check, for your sake as well as the kids'
It's understandable and natural in the face of his behavior
But at some point not only is it likely to leak out and poison your attitude about him as you present it to the kids (which is all sorts of destructive) but it can lend to a bitterness inside you that can do all sorts of harm
Some years back my mom went thru a ton of therapy & realized she'd held on to a lot of ranor for WAY too long about my dad and taken much of it out on me. That realization allowed us (mom & I) to repair some very deep rifts in our relationship. She was so resentful of my father, partly over his treatment of me, that she took it out in anger & nasty comments towards me ("you're just like your no-good father!" was a common remark).
I now as an adult have virtually no relationship with my dad due to HIS unwillingness to be involved in my life. I tried for years to build a relationship as an adult with him (I was younger than either of yours when my folks split) to no avail. If he's not going to be a dad, your kids will learn it & come to terms with it on their own. There's not much you can do about the hurt (and I know oms want to protect their kids from hurt, but often you can't...it's part of life) but you CAN try to make sure the attitudes it inspires in you dont' make things worse.
I know that's tough, but mom is never an easy job
Best of luck

 

[sheath]

As a former kid who was in a similar (albeit much wore in some ways) situation, one thing I will stress is that it's imperative you keep this anger in check, for your sake as well as the kids'
It's understandable and natural in the face of his behavior
But at some point not only is it likely to leak out and poison your attitude about him as you present it to the kids (which is all sorts of destructive) but it can lend to a bitterness inside you that can do all sorts of harm
<SNIP>

Thank you, James. That's a very good point. Bill and I both have divorced parents, and we both went through that same 'projecting' of one parent's anger onto the children. It's part of the reason our divorce was so amicable...we were dead-set and determined to make things as easy for the children as possible. And we did. I'm proud of us for that.

Feeling anger toward him for the things that went wrong in our marriage was never a problem...for I always kept the problems, and the children, separate. Bill was a really lousy husband, but that didn't mean he was a lousy father. On the contrary, he's one of the best dads I have ever seen. Until lately, that is, though I still have faith in him where the kids are concerned. I'm not writing off his parenting just yet.

I admit, this anger toward him concerning the kids worries me, because it's new. I'm used to feeling the anger and resentment for what he did to me. But I have never, ever before felt anything but pleased concerning the way he treats the children. I am making an effort to never say anything bad about their father, and I've managed it so far...I don't want to think that my anger can leach out at them in other ways. Yet another reason why I hope that the situation is resolved soon.

I know that was rambling, and perhaps confusing. But it helps to write it all out on the boards.



S.

 

[James G 5]

Thank you, James. That's a very good point. Bill and I both have divorced parents, and we both went through that same 'projecting' of one parent's anger onto the children. It's part of the reason our divorce was so amicable...we were dead-set and determined to make things as easy for the children as possible. And we did. I'm proud of us for that.

Feeling anger toward him for the things that went wrong in our marriage was never a problem...for I always kept the problems, and the children, separate. Bill was a really lousy husband, but that didn't mean he was a lousy father. On the contrary, he's one of the best dads I have ever seen. Until lately, that is, though I still have faith in him where the kids are concerned. I'm not writing off his parenting just yet.

I admit, this anger toward him concerning the kids worries me, because it's new. I'm used to feeling the anger and resentment for what he did to me. But I have never, ever before felt anything but pleased concerning the way he treats the children. I am making an effort to never say anything bad about their father, and I've managed it so far...I don't want to think that my anger can leach out at them in other ways. Yet another reason why I hope that the situation is resolved soon.

I know that was rambling, and perhaps confusing. But it helps to write it all out on the boards.



S.

We're all here to listen Ramble all you like
I think people can forget sometimes how their anger can bleed over
I was on the phone with a divorcing mom friend of mine the other day as her soon to be ex showed up late AGAIN to pick up their son, and then explained that he couldn't keep him overnight as planned because he had to do something with his new girlfriend
She went BATSHIT and started screaming at him
Her son was just in the next room (kitchen to living room, no door) and no doubt could hear every word
He's not quite 3 but is really smart & already talking
I gaurantee he heard more of that & it will affect him more than she was thinking about at the time
I understand (not condone, but understand) why your ex is behaving this way, up to a point it's a natural part of him moving on
Hopefuly he will realize it's taking him too much away from hsi kids & will work harder to be a better father
If not, it's unfortunately more burden on you to be the better person for the sake of your kids
Look at it this way, some day they will put you in a MUCH nicer nursing home than he will wind up in

 

[dreamer]

Look at it this way, some day they will put you in a MUCH nicer nursing home than he will wind up in

sorry to laugh at such a serious topic...but heheheh

 

[FFhotwife]

Hmmm...

I would definately just talk to him. If you have that good of a relationship he will listen to you. Tell him everything you have written here. Don't back him into a corner, don't yell, don't accuse. Just be a concerned friend/parent. Good luck and I am sure he will see the light.

 

[DuckLover]

I understand (not condone, but understand) why your ex is behaving this way, up to a point it's a natural part of him moving on
Hopefuly he will realize it's taking him too much away from hsi kids & will work harder to be a better father

I think James has a very good point here. Bill is re-establishing his social life, which is a good and healthy thing, but it will take time for him to balance it with the rest of his life. Yes, at the moment the pendulum has swung heavily in favor of socializing at the expense of time with the kids. However, if you are successful at presenting the facts of his prior/current time with the kids and their reaction to it, than the pendulum should swing back. Be prepared that it may not come all the way back-- he's cutting his "pie" of available time into a larger number of slices; by definition they must be smaller.

I believe you are right to maintain faith in his parenting. It doesn't sound like he's trying to cut the kids out of his life by any means, merely that he's in a transition phase and must learn to balance everything. Certainly 5 minutes isn't much with the kids, but he DID at least make an appearance. If such a short visit was noticable difficult for the KIDS, than you might mention that to him. Perhaps there needs to be an agreement that visits will all last at least 30 minutes. If on the other hand, the kids were happy to see Dad for 5 minutes and just a little disappointed that he had to leave quickly (especially if short visits are uncommon), than I would try to focus on the fact that he DID visit and leave it at that.

Particularly in light of your anger at him regarding parenting and your concern about that new feeling, you may find it beneficial to discuss this situation with a counselor. S/he may be able to help you process those feelings and identify positive ways to approach Bill about the situation.

Good luck!

 

[wicked woman]

Look at it this way, some day they will put you in a MUCH nicer nursing home than he will wind up in

woo hoo! Thanks James....that means I'm staying at the Taj Mahal nursing home!!!! Sorry just couldn't resist either.

 

[jeepman6]

Definitely have a long talk with him. My parents split when I was a kid and one day he had a new g/f and new friends and none of them wanted my brother and I around so my dad never spent any time with us anymore. It didn't take the 2 of us long to decide that life goes on and went about building our own lives. As adults we tried and tried to rebuild relationships with our father before we finally gave up and went on with our own lives.

My dad died 2 years ago and we never truly got to rebuild any sort of relationship together though he did apologize to us for the way he treated us after all those years. I have no doubt that he died with regrets that I wouldn't wish on anybody and I would hate to see your ex get himself to the point where he is neglectful towards the kids and THEY don't WANT to spend any of their time with their dad. Good luck to you and keep loving those kids as much as you can.

 

[sheath]

Interesting little discussion I had with Bill today.

I did all that I had intended to do...I was very polite, very open and willing to listen to whatever he had to say. I pointed out the differences in the time he spends with the children, told him how the kids are reacting, and asked what I could do to help the situation. It was calm and civil, just like all the other discussions we have had in the past concerning the children.

Strangely...he refused to discuss it with me. He said, "I'm busy, that's all you need to know." That in itself was strange, because Bill and I have always been pretty open about our lives in general. His attitude was very secretive and confusing, but I didn't comment on that...I wanted to talk about the children. When I asked him what he was going to do about time with the children, he informed me that the kids would understand, that he was simply working long hours.

When I pushed the issue by asking again if there was anything I could do to help, he retorted angrily by saying, 'Yeah. I don't like seeing you. I can't stand the happy little family scene that you and (your fiance) have going on.' I was floored. I didn't know how to respond, and told him so. The conversation ended with him saying that he would be off on Friday, and he would see the kids 'for a few minutes'. I told him that he hadn't spent a full day with the chidlren in a month, and if he wanted to have visitation instead of joint custody, that would make things easier to explain. Then, I said, perhaps his absence would be more excusable.

After a moment of digesting that, he said he would spend all day on Friday with the children. He agreed it was time he did that. Then he said goodbye and was gone, leaving me even more confused than before.

I'm not sure where to go from here. Especially considering the added twist of his comments about my fiance. Bill had always wished me well, and I had always felt the same toward him. I was glad to learn that he has a girlfriend. Bill always supported my relationship with my man, adamant that he was glad to see me happy with someone he called 'a very good man'.

Now I'm not sure what to think. I'm not even sure where to begin with figuring this one out. But of course, it's only been a few hours, so maybe I will get my thoughts in order soon.

Anybody else deal with something like this?



S.

 

[Vixandra]

Ouchies

Just saw this thread.
Sheath, I've been the eldest of three who felt Dad left us behind to move to CA, marry a new wife with a daughter 11 years younger then I with my same name!
The best thing you can be for your children is supportive and loving and not let your anger at ex show infront of them. My mother was none of those and I hated my father for years before being kicked off to live with him at 15. I've only recently been able to talk civilily to her. And I don't dare tell her I'm Wiccan, but that's another issue entirely.
I think your children are quite lucky to have a mom as loving and concerned as you are!
Perhaps if you offered to drop the kids off with him for the weekend?

 

[jeepman6]

Wow! This sounds like a man that has totally changed in the matter of just a few weeks.

I have never been in your situation before but I will help if I can. What I see from what you have written is that he can't " stand to see the happy little family scene you have going on". To me thats sounds like jealousy of what you have and what he would like to have. He hears all the stories of what's been happening at home from the kids and has developed this "jealousy" over a course of time. You have something he had and doesn't have any longer. You said he always wished you well but has he really or was he just going through the motions and telling you what he thinks you want to hear or did he really mean it? Another problem may be his new girl friend and whatever she may be filling his head with as far as you and the kids go. She may be one of those that wants his full attention at all times and doesn't want him distracted from her with anything or anyone else.

As far as the kids go I would keep an eye on the situation when he does spend time with them and see how they're reacting about the time they do get to spend with them, for example are they still doing the fun things that they used to do before or are they just staying at home watching tv all the time, those sorts of things. If he's spending the time with them just because he feels obligated to to keep you off his back then that is not a good thing and the kids will be the ones to suffer the most.

Hopefully he will get himself together and remember that his kids love him and want to spend their time with him as much as is possible. Good luck and god bless.

 

[sheath]

Thanks for those responses.

Jeepman, now that I think of it, maybe he really was just going through the motions with me...telling me what he thought would make for smooth sailing. I divorced Bill because he cheated on me, but he didn't want the divorce...not at all. He fought it pretty hard, but in the end, he had no choice. I'm sure it's not easy to see that 'happy family scene' he referred to.

Yesterday was the day he said he would take the kids, and he did take them. When he dropped them off yesterday afternoon, he kissed them quickly and left...and no call last night or tonight. It's the first time they haven't gotten their 'goodnight' call from their dad. At least they had a good time yesterday, though. Maybe things are looking up?

I'm trying to understand what Bill is feeling. I really, really wish I could help the situation. Are there any men out there who have been in his position, who could give some insight into what's happening with him right now?

Thanks again, all. I appreciate all of you, more than you know.

S.

 

[Mstrskey]

A few things...

dunno if they'll help, and forgive me if I ramble; the pregnant brain tends to be easily distracted...lol!

OK...you say that he has always wished you well and been supportive of your new relationship, but as Jeepman said, maybe it was all b.s. Or...maybe he did wish you well when it was just a hypothetical situation but now that it's very real to him that you have a secure loving relationship and aren't in fact sitting at home pulling splinters out of your ass as you pine away for him...well maybe it's hard for him to face.

Maybe he isn't so much jealous of your new relationship as he is of your fiances daily contact with HIS kids. Knowing that things are good between you and your man and that the kids are happy he realizes that another man is slipping easily into a role that used to be exclusively HIS. A good friend of mine could give a damn about how his ex's relationship is with her fella but the guys relationship with HIS kids makes him nuts.

Perhaps the new relationship with the woman in his life isn't filling whatever void ending the one he had with you left and when he sees you happy it's a slap in the face.
Now personally I say tough shit...shoulda kept his cock in his pants, but it's a thought.

Like everyone has said, do your best to not leach the anger at his behavior out onto the munchkins. I thankfully was not a child of divorce, but working in child care I see the damage it can cause every single day. If he really does continue to neglect his responsibility then seek to change the custody arrgt. The kids need the consistency and security and sadly thatmay be the only way to secure it.
Best of luck girl. I'll be pulling for ya!

 

[sheath]

Re: A few things...

dunno if they'll help, and forgive me if I ramble; the pregnant brain tends to be easily distracted...lol!

Maybe he isn't so much jealous of your new relationship as he is of your fiances daily contact with HIS kids. Knowing that things are good between you and your man and that the kids are happy he realizes that another man is slipping easily into a role that used to be exclusively HIS. A good friend of mine could give a damn about how his ex's relationship is with her fella but the guys relationship with HIS kids makes him nuts.

Ah, I like it when you ramble.

I think you have a good point there. My fiance tends to do things with the children that Bill never had the time to do. Bill is a self-proclaimed workaholic, and he lives up to the label, believe me. Simple pleasures, like football games and letting the kids help mow the lawn, are things that he never had the time to do. Not by necessity, because we didn't need the money. He has at least three months of vacation that he hasn't taken yet!

Anyway...my fiance does all those things. He makes a point of taking time off in his schedule to teach my son to throw a baseball, and to take my daughter out to ride the horses. Just the normal things that normal kids should have a chance to do, right? Then the kids tell Bill all about the new things they have done. I can see where he would be pretty upset about missing out on those things...but at the same time, Bill HAS the time to do it. He just doesn't take the time.

Now that I think about it, you are probably right. I can see that as being a huge problem. If I try to put myself in his shoes and imagine if the situation were reversed, I know I would feel pretty damn guilty and pretty shut-out.

I'm feeling pretty bad for Bill right about now.

S.