A piece of political erotica looking for feedback

[CyranoJ]

A lot of people seem to think an ellipse represents a dramatic pause -- it doesn't.

Well, it can. And in prose fiction it most frequently does. Ellipsis in fiction isn't the same thing as ellipsis in academic writing.

According to The Chicago Manual of Style: “Ellipsis points suggest faltering or fragmented speech accompanied by confusion, insecurity, distress, or uncertainty.”

. . .

In fiction, the most common usage of the ellipsis is to indicate a trailing off (technical term: aposiopesis) and to build tension. We all watched in horror as the asteroid drew closer and closer to Earth. If Captain Jack wasn’t able to set the charge in time…

You actually can't plausibly argue that Chloe is using it wrong. You can only plausibly argue that she's using it too frequently. Where you might have a point, but overall it's a question of taste.

 

[AwkwardMD]

I don't know how long it's going to take DO to make his point, but what he's likely going to say is that in FORMAL writing, ellipses are used to show that words have been omitted. You see them in a quote from someone when you aren't going to use an entire quote, but some words from the beginning and middle.

"I loved Schindler's List, and I thought that it was totally cool and amazing. Stellar performances all around."

becomes

"I loved Schindler's List. ... Stellar performances all around."

HOWEVER

Any grammatical guide worth it's salt will then continue to say that in INFORMAL writing, ellipses are used to in dialogue to show hesitation, pauses, or for a trailing off at the end of a sentence.

 

[CyranoJ]

Right. And prose fiction has hewed toward the informal standard for a long, long time. The "formal" standard applies more to journalism or academia. As the Chicago Manual recognises.

 

[Dream_Operator]

It's feedback for the purposes of improvement.

Go on. What is an ellipses for?

From Grammar Girl:

Ellipses: Use ellipses to show faltering, fragmented, speech or dialogue; enclose in quotation marks.

So, it is allowable to use ellipses to indicate pauses or breaks in the writer's train of thought as you see so frequently done in e-mail, especially where a break is meant to feel uncertain. Nevertheless (and this is a BIG nevertheless) most people who use ellipses in e-mail overdo it—a lot.

You should not replace all normal punctuation with ellipses. You should not allow the sweet lure of ellipses to muddle your ability to write a complete sentence. To quote the book Grammar for Dummies, “Using ellipses in this way can get annoying really fast.”

 

[AwkwardMD]

From Grammar Girl:

Ellipses: Use ellipses to show faltering, fragmented, speech or dialogue; enclose in quotation marks.

So, it is allowable to use ellipses to indicate pauses or breaks in the writer's train of thought as you see so frequently done in e-mail, especially where a break is meant to feel uncertain. Nevertheless (and this is a BIG nevertheless) most people who use ellipses in e-mail overdo it—a lot.

You should not replace all normal punctuation with ellipses. You should not allow the sweet lure of ellipses to muddle your ability to write a complete sentence. To quote the book Grammar for Dummies, “Using ellipses in this way can get annoying really fast.”

This advice is for writing emails, and largely it's attempting to get people to not end sentences with ellipses. That is not the same as using ellipses within dialog to represent a pause.

 

[Dream_Operator]

Well, it can. And in prose fiction it most frequently does. Ellipsis in fiction isn't the same thing as ellipsis in academic writing.



You actually can't plausibly argue that Chloe is using it wrong. You can only plausibly argue that she's using it too frequently. Where you might have a point, but overall it's a question of taste.

Yes . . . I can . . . Because real people . . . don't speak like . . . this . . . in real . . . life. L . . . O . . . L . . .

So . . . indeed . . . the . . . usage . . . is wrong!!!!!!!!

 

[AwkwardMD]

Yes . . . I can . . . Because real people . . . don't speak like . . . this . . . in real . . . life. L . . . O . . . L . . .

So . . . indeed . . . the . . . usage . . . is wrong!!!!!!!!

This reads like you're having an orgasm.

 

[CyranoJ]

This reads like you're having an orgasm.

It was actually kind of hot.

 

[Dream_Operator]

This reads like you're having an orgasm.

Wow, where did that come from (pun intended)?

No, I was just mocking the ridiculous of this kind of writing.

 

[CyranoJ]

No, I was just mocking the ridiculous of this kind of writing.

I... I was just... just mocking... the rih... ridic... ridiculousness of this... of this kind... of... of... of...

wriiitiiing... ohhh my GAWWWD...

 

[CyranoJ]

(Just sayin', I would completely use the ellpisis in that way during a sex scene and fuck what you think.)

 

[AwkwardMD]

Wow, where did that come from (pun intended)?

No, I was just mocking the ridiculous of this kind of writing.

The implication is that there is strain, from stimulation and muscle contractions, that is preventing the character from speaking clearly and smoothly. If you skip to the second page and follow the Protagonists dialog after the sex scene, the ellipses disappear entirely.

The argument could be made (and I did) that the sex scene was long, and that THAT led to some overuse, but her usage of it was technically correct.

 

[CyranoJ]

Thanks to DrAwkward* for making the point in much classier fashion than I did.

(* I hope it's not out of bounds to refer to you this way. I was just stoked to "get" your 'nym when I discovered it was originally meant to be a palindrome.)

 

[ChloeTzang]

Actually this is all rather interesting. About the only time I use ellipses is in sexual dialog, where it illustrates pauses and intermittent continuous speech of sorts where they're in the throes of sex where normal speech patterns just don't happen, or in dialog that tails away. I'd love to know alternative to ellipses in continual dialog to illustrate those gaps between words. As Cyrano I think it was said, you can't just write it flat, then it reads like a bad script.

So what would you use instead of as an alternative? Just blank spaces doesn't work and hyphens or dashes don't mean the same thing. And a new line for each word looks clumsy.

And thank you, it's a great point to raise coz it's something I use a lot.

 

[AwkwardMD]

(Totes legit)

 

[Dream_Operator]

(Just sayin', I would completely use the ellpisis in that way during a sex scene and fuck what you think.)

Great, good on you.

Not sure why you need to get so angry with someone who simply expresses a different opinion.

You seem to have anger management issues. Get some help before you hurt yourself or some one else.

 

[AwkwardMD]

Actually this is all rather interesting. About the only time I use ellipses is in sexual dialog, where it illustrates pauses and intermittent ontinuous speech of sorts, or in dialog they tails away. I'd love to know alternative to ellipses in continual dialog to illustrate those gaps between words. As Cyrano I think it was said, you can't just write it flat, then it reads like a bad script. So what do you use instead?

And thank you, it's a great point to raise coz it's something I use a lot.

There isn't one. Hyphens, in informal writing, are for hard stops.

"I'm not sure what to do with-"

The door frame exploded, followed shortly thereafter by the foot that had kicked it open in the first place. Dave and I gasped, knowing we were caught red handed.

OR interrupted dialog that will continue

"I don't know what I'm going to do with this shirt. It's too big-"

"That's what she said," Dave interjected.

"-to wear," I said, continuing while giving Dave the glare of a lifetime, "without some kind of undershirt."

 

[AwkwardMD]

Not sure why you need to get so angry with someone who simply expresses a different opinion.

Opinions are wonderful. Opinions are welcome. Don't conflate opinion with fact, like you did earlier when you insisted that no one else knew what the purpose of Ellipses is.

Personally speaking, I knew where this conversation was going (and that Chloe's usage was correct), but I dragged it out with you as a learning lesson for everyone else that reads it. Lots of people read these threads. Many more than contribute to them.

 

[Dream_Operator]

Actually this is all rather interesting. About the only time I use ellipses is in sexual dialog, where it illustrates pauses and intermittent continuous speech of sorts where they're in the throes of sex where normal speech patterns just don't happen, or in dialog that tails away. I'd love to know alternative to ellipses in continual dialog to illustrate those gaps between words. As Cyrano I think it was said, you can't just write it flat, then it reads like a bad script. So what do you use instead?

And thank you, it's a great point to raise coz it's something I use a lot.

I use:

Action to break up the dialogue

The other character to inject action and\or dialogue.

 

[CyranoJ]

As Cyrano I think it was said, you can't just write it flat, then it reads like a bad script.

... but that was the general gist.

Honestly I think it's a trade-off. I'm a fan of ellipsis and repetition because they're naturalistic, but if you're customarily a romance reader, say, they're uncomfortably so and you want to visualize the action in your mind with minimal cues. It comes down to what kind of erotica/smut you're writing.

 

[ChloeTzang]

There isn't one. Hyphens, in informal writing, are for hard stops.

OR interrupted dialog that will continue

Yes that's what I'd read. I read up on ellipses and the use thereof when I started using them. Love to know any alternatives that would work tho. I never found any but I'm not the best at grammar and all these techniques. I have these learning moments and this is one of them.

Cyrano? Anger management? Lol. Only when we talk politics and then I run and hide behind Chris or Boxlicker.

Action? It's all sex and that's interspersed. You don't generally scream ooooohhhhh and then do something. It's one continuous flow of noise and expression as one gets pounded. Speaking from experience anyhow, and I try to keep these things realistic and not break the flow.

 

[CyranoJ]

Not sure why you need to get so angry with someone who simply expresses a different opinion.

I ain't angry, son. I'm just having a bit of fun with you. Lighten up.

 

[CyranoJ]

Cyrano? Anger management? Lol. Only when we talk politics and then I run and hide behind Chris or Boxlicker.

I AM NOT ANGRY*!!! GRRRRR!!! HOW DARE ANYONE SUGGEST I'M ANGRY!!! I WILL FUCK YOU UP!!!!!!

(* For reals though. Humour only. I ain't mad at you.)

 

[Bramblethorn]

Yes . . . I can . . . Because real people . . . don't speak like . . . this . . . in real . . . life. L . . . O . . . L . . .

So . . . indeed . . . the . . . usage . . . is wrong!!!!!!!!

Where are you getting the spaces-between-ellipses thing? I didn't see Chloe doing that in the story, and I don't see anybody here advocating for that, so it seems a bit like a straw man.

also: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2lpIqVVSkE

 

[ChloeTzang]

I AM NOT ANGRY*!!! GRRRRR!!! HOW DARE ANYONE SUGGEST I'M ANGRY!!! I WILL FUCK YOU UP!!!!!!

SCREAMS. Runs and hides behind Chris. Sticks head out and laughes.

I know