A question for all subs

[njlauren]

How about you go back and read the original post?



Obviously you failed to understand that it is not about how YOU call YOUR SO, believe it or not, I couldn't care less, it is about how YOU label the SO or relationship of OTHER people.

I hate to quote text again, just because you are too lazy, too arrogant or too stupid to read properly what was written, but I'm in a good mood, so I do you this favor one more time:



A Dom doesn't have to have a _pet_, neither in the animal nor in the loving kind of interpretation. A Dom doesn't even have to have a long-term relationship, there are Pro-Doms out there, too, in case you didn't know, who care for their bottom as long as she pays and the time is not yet up and I seriously doubt you would call them "not true Doms". The quoted text is a stupid blanket statement from a HelloKittyLover, who thinks BDSM relationships should look like a Meg Ryan movie and I reserve the right to call this out, even if our transsexual friends here get all upset about my lack of tactfulness.

The implication that my job as a Dom would be to have a loving or careing relationship, is so wrong in so many ways that I can only shake my head. I married my wife because I love her and do want to care for her and want to be with her till either one of us dies and I dominate her because I'm a Dom. And if you mix these two things up, you not only insult me, but my wife also.

I don't know what planet you come from, but it would be great if you proof read your own posts. Hello Kitty never said a dom had to be anything, she was talking from her own perspective, and you ripped her for using the term pet, saying it was degrading and the like, and I wasn't the only one to comment on it.

And where did I say a dominant of any kind had to be in a long term relationship? I would argue about pro dominants necessarily being dom/me (hate to tell you, but more then a few pros do it for the money and aren't into it lifestyle). More importantly, your last paragraph makes zero sense, how the hell did anything I write insult you or your wife? I never said one word about what a dom should or shouldn't be, I simply defended hello kitty using the term pet, that's all. I don't give a shit what your relationship with your wife is, if your relationship works for you that is cool. Read some of my other posts on BD/SM and you will actually see something interesting, I am one of the first when people come up with terms like "a dom is" or 'a sub is', I am one of the first to say it is what the people make of it, what works for them. Don't put words into my mouth and please learn to read in context, you are reading stuff into my posts that isn't there, quite literally your assertions are hallucinations. You are the one making claims about reality, you are the one saying that a loving partner and a dominant have to be two separate things, not I, all I said was the Hello Kitty had her own opinion based on her own relationship.

BTW I would put my own experiences in the scene up against almost anyone on here, I am well aware of the many facets of the scene and its practioners and it is why I am not dogmatic about much (other then being safe). There are D/s couples where the participants are not life partners, there are people who are together only in play, I know of plenty of people who are married who have an outside D/s, all is quite 'real'. I also know married couples who have both their marriage and their D/s and they separate it, they have space where they are dom/sub M/s, whatever and they don't mix it up, others have it fully integrated, up to the couple.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I've realised that engaging with Primalex's arguments is really not worth the effort at this time. Whatever is happening in his world has nothing to do with you or I or anyone, and is no newbie's fault-- and I only hope he gets it fixed.

 

[Primalex]

I don't know what planet you come from, but it would be great if you proof read your own posts. Hello Kitty never said a dom had to be anything, she was talking from her own perspective, and you ripped her for using the term pet, saying it was degrading and the like, and I wasn't the only one to comment on it.

Yeah, your transsexual buddy who can't argue. And Iris, who agreed with me. Now what?

More importantly, your last paragraph makes zero sense, how the hell did anything I write insult you or your wife? I never said one word about what a dom should or shouldn't be, I simply defended hello kitty using the term pet, that's all.

Are you really too dumb to understand what a quote is? Are you too dumb to understand when I say that a sentence is insulting that I mean that the sentence is insulting and that, if you didn't write the sentence, obviously you weren't meant, but the sentence?

You defend her wrong description about Doms and wonder that I will disagree with you? Are you kidding me? Do you think "just because you defended her" I change my opinion about what she said?

all I said was the Hello Kitty had her own opinion based on her own relationship.

which she expressed as universal truth and then told me, I wouldn't even deserve a sub. I assume she meant everyone with my point of view, basically refusing a lot of Doms their right to top.

Sorry, I don't get how you can have your point of view, which does basically seem to correlate with mine (talking about the facets of BDSM now) and yet defend her expressions, which even contradict YOUR experiences. I don't get it, unless some weird reflex kicked in that makes you do these things.

If I would have written the stuff kitten wrote, I would have Stella all over me, disagreeing with me.

 

[Primalex]

I've realised that engaging with Primalex's arguments is really not worth the effort at this time.

Does this mean, I don't have to read a fourth useless reply from you? Yay!

 

[njlauren]

Yeah, your transsexual buddy who can't argue. And Iris, who agreed with me. Now what?



Are you really too dumb to understand what a quote is? Are you too dumb to understand when I say that a sentence is insulting that I mean that the sentence is insulting and that, if you didn't write the sentence, obviously you weren't meant, but the sentence?

You defend her wrong description about Doms and wonder that I will disagree with you? Are you kidding me? Do you think "just because you defended her" I change my opinion about what she said?



which she expressed as universal truth and then told me, I wouldn't even deserve a sub. I assume she meant everyone with my point of view, basically refusing a lot of Doms their right to top.

Sorry, I don't get how you can have your point of view, which does basically seem to correlate with mine (talking about the facets of BDSM now) and yet defend her expressions, which even contradict YOUR experiences. I don't get it, unless some weird reflex kicked in that makes you do these things.

If I would have written the stuff kitten wrote, I would have Stella all over me, disagreeing with me.

This is what kitten originally wrote that drove you off the deep end:

"Actually, as a sub, Id have to say confidence is a huge part of the equation. How are you supposed to please your master, be perfect for him, when you feel imperfect and dont please yourself? A dom is meant to care for his pet, so yes, he should be there to pick her up when she is down. I think its a bit insensitive for you to imply that simply sending nude photos will fix anything, shame on you."

She was disagreeing with your assertion that a dom had no role in the well being of their submissive (she used pet, it is simply a term). And in one sense she is correct, in play the dominant does have a responsibility with their sub, various types of scene play can cause emotional storms, or inadvertently trigger reactions and there is term called aftercare for that, to bring the sub down. If you wife had a bad reaction in scene play, was crying, was emotionally wrought, would you leave her in a corner crying or something? One of the roles of the dominant in a scene is exactly that. In terms of IRL issues, it depends on the relationship, I don't think a dominant necessarily has that responsibility, that is up to them, though if a domme/sub happen to be life partners, then because of that there is a responsibility to help their other, which has nothing to do with the d/s. I think Kitten was talking about a D/s when they are partners in some way, have an emotional commitment outside, and I can see where she is coming from. She didn't lay down rules; actually, you did with the post she responded to, where you said a dom has no responsibility for the self esteem of his sub and that if she wants to make it better send a nude photo....you laid down rules, not her. I kind of understand your point, you are trying to say that you would be there for your wife because you love and married her, that it has nothing to do with the D/s, and I can understand and respect that, but what disturbs me is you went after Kitten and myself claiming we attacked your relationship or whatever, which neither of us did.

BTW, Iris didn't agree with your methods either, she agreed you were an arrogant ass and several other people chastised you for your tone and vehemence in posting.

BTW, that shot at me being trans was uncalled for. As far as I know, none of the other people who responded to you are trans, and that was nothing more then a cheap shot, probably for your own titilation or something. It didn't bother me in the least bit, having faced things in my life that I have, that is not even really a shot (having 3 or 4 teenage thugs attempting to beat you to a pulp and rape you is).

You could have very easily told Kitty, who is probably a newbie on here and perhaps in the scene, that not all D/s people are life partners or share her view of things (which is what Iris in fact did, nicely). There are polite ways to call people on things, explain to them the difference between opinion and fact. This isn't war, no one threatened your hearth or home or your body parts, most people on these boards are expressing ideas and opinions and if it seems like they are laying down the law, most of them did so unintentionally, give them a break. This isn't right wing talk radio or what passes for political discourse, this is a group of people sharing kink or ideas or trying to learn. Put it this way, people tend to get impressed when you express yourself and they get turned off when it turns into personal attacks or being snarky at someone else's expense. And yes, I did get snarky, which was stupid of me, but keep in mind that you are snarky to a lot of people, and they routinely call you on it, arrogant ass is not a term of endearment.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Does this mean, I don't have to read a fourth useless reply from you? Yay!

It means that I will point out to people that your shitty comments have nothing to do with their questions, and they don't need to answer you.

 

[submissive_fire]

what the,hell...

Does this mean, I don't have to read a fourth useless reply from you? Yay!

Crawled up your ass and died? Typically I don't comment on what people say, but seriously you are quite rude. I find that people who are rude, abusive, defensive and feel the need to put others down are feeling badly about themselves. It is the reason bullies bully people they perceive to be weaker.

I feel the need to apologize to the OP for the horrid hijacking of their question.

And before you bother to reply, please remember I do not care.

 

[Que]

parachuting in and past my bedtime now that im back to work these days...but these two hit my internal quote button..apologies if this already better said:

I've met a LOT of people a LOT LOT LOT of people who are balancing out major responsibilities. Some are well paid, some are not.

I think this is it the relief a sub feels in contrast to their other responsibilities which could be in a workplace or not, well paid or not.

This couple is also one of the first "well paid" couples I've met that really sincerely play.

And also, maybe-- they are interested in that damn baroque toys idea of mine. I might finally get funding and biz partners.

I suspect you and I don't run in those circles because we wouldn't (apparently) have as much to lose as them so they would more likely keep it tightly secret or only play with others they perceive in their strata?

 

[rod43]

I've realised that engaging with Primalex's arguments is really not worth the effort at this time. Whatever is happening in his world has nothing to do with you or I or anyone, and is no newbie's fault-- and I only hope he gets it fixed.

The more people that block that insensitive moron, the better place Lit will be. He is a trouble maker.

 

[Primalex]

Typically I don't comment on what people say, but seriously you are quite rude.

No way, really? And you change your habit for this breaking news? Thank you so much for giving me more attention and reason to post in this thread.

I find that people who are rude, abusive, defensive and feel the need to put others down are feeling badly about themselves. It is the reason bullies bully people they perceive to be weaker.

There is no weaker on the Net.

And before you bother to reply, please remember I do not care.

I don't care either, yet it doesn't stop you from replying.

 

[Primalex]

The more people that block that insensitive moron, the better place Lit will be. He is a trouble maker.

If you wanted Lit to be a better place, you wouldn't have your cock as picture in your profile.

 

[Primalex]

She was disagreeing with your assertion that a dom had no role in the well being of their submissive (she used pet, it is simply a term).

What I didn't say. I said it's not the job of the Dom to fix psychological problems. She replied with her pet comment to this post of me.

How about you first read the thread and then post again? Can we agree to this simple rule? It gets on my nerves to correct your errors over and over again.

You could have very easily told Kitty, who is probably a newbie on here and perhaps in the scene, that not all D/s people are life partners or share her view of things (which is what Iris in fact did, nicely). There are polite ways to call people on things, explain to them the difference between opinion and fact.

You expect me to be polite, when she wasn't in the first place? Double standards much?

She starts with "I think its a bit insensitive for you to imply that simply sending nude photos will fix anything, shame on you." as a newbie, just because she didn't get the joke and after a quite polite reply for my standard, she decides to get the jerrycan. That's fine, but don't blame me for the result and expect that I will still let you live under the puppy protection act. Especially not if you pretend to be the all-knowing all-seeing trash heap. (The use of the word "you" means a "person writing here", not "njlauren". I thought I mention this because you (njlauren) seem to mix these two things up all the time.)

 

[Stella_Omega]

Translation:

"It was a JOOOOOKE! What's WROOOONG with you people, don't you have a sense of humor?"

Okay, this is now the Primalex thread. OP will have to start a new thread if she needs to address her original topic.

 

[Wannabe2012]

Stella - I feel no need to start another thread. It would only give Primalex another thread to high jack. I can't see myself giving him the satisfaction.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Stella - I feel no need to start another thread. It would only give Primalex another thread to high jack. I can't see myself giving him the satisfaction.

Did you get the answers you were looking for?

It suddenly occurs to me that you might be the Dom who is trying to instill confidence in your sub.

yes? If so, that's a very laudable impulse. I would look for books outside of D/s for guidance.

 

[Wannabe2012]

Stella - I did find several responses helpful.

 

[Primalex]

Translation:

"It was a JOOOOOKE! What's WROOOONG with you people, don't you have a sense of humor?"

If you didn't get before that "c) Next time just send him the nude pics." was a joke, then YOU need to check YOUR meds again.

 

[Primalex]

Stella - I feel no need to start another thread. It would only give Primalex another thread to high jack. I can't see myself giving him the satisfaction.

What for anyway?

It's not like we wouldn't have had this topic discussed before, in all variations. Of course, you wouldn't know, because you just arrived and the search function isn't used anyway these days.

 

[IrisAlthea]

I'm generally to lazy for this, but here goes:

This is what kitten originally wrote that drove you off the deep end:

"Actually, as a sub, Id have to say confidence is a huge part of the equation. How are you supposed to please your master, be perfect for him, when you feel imperfect and dont please yourself? A dom is meant to care for his pet, so yes, he should be there to pick her up when she is down. I think its a bit insensitive for you to imply that simply sending nude photos will fix anything, shame on you."

She was disagreeing with your assertion that a dom had no role in the well being of their submissive (she used pet, it is simply a term). And in one sense she is correct, in play the dominant does have a responsibility with their sub, various types of scene play can cause emotional storms, or inadvertently trigger reactions and there is term called aftercare for that, to bring the sub down. If you wife had a bad reaction in scene play, was crying, was emotionally wrought, would you leave her in a corner crying or something? One of the roles of the dominant in a scene is exactly that. In terms of IRL issues, it depends on the relationship, I don't think a dominant necessarily has that responsibility, that is up to them, though if a domme/sub happen to be life partners, then because of that there is a responsibility to help their other, which has nothing to do with the d/s. I think Kitten was talking about a D/s when they are partners in some way, have an emotional commitment outside, and I can see where she is coming from. She didn't lay down rules; actually, you did with the post she responded to, where you said a dom has no responsibility for the self esteem of his sub and that if she wants to make it better send a nude photo....you laid down rules, not her. I kind of understand your point, you are trying to say that you would be there for your wife because you love and married her, that it has nothing to do with the D/s, and I can understand and respect that, but what disturbs me is you went after Kitten and myself claiming we attacked your relationship or whatever, which neither of us did.

BTW, Iris didn't agree with your methods either, she agreed you were an arrogant ass and several other people chastised you for your tone and vehemence in posting.

BTW, that shot at me being trans was uncalled for. As far as I know, none of the other people who responded to you are trans, and that was nothing more then a cheap shot, probably for your own titilation or something. It didn't bother me in the least bit, having faced things in my life that I have, that is not even really a shot (having 3 or 4 teenage thugs attempting to beat you to a pulp and rape you is).

You could have very easily told Kitty, who is probably a newbie on here and perhaps in the scene, that not all D/s people are life partners or share her view of things (which is what Iris in fact did, nicely). There are polite ways to call people on things, explain to them the difference between opinion and fact. This isn't war, no one threatened your hearth or home or your body parts, most people on these boards are expressing ideas and opinions and if it seems like they are laying down the law, most of them did so unintentionally, give them a break. This isn't right wing talk radio or what passes for political discourse, this is a group of people sharing kink or ideas or trying to learn. Put it this way, people tend to get impressed when you express yourself and they get turned off when it turns into personal attacks or being snarky at someone else's expense. And yes, I did get snarky, which was stupid of me, but keep in mind that you are snarky to a lot of people, and they routinely call you on it, arrogant ass is not a term of endearment.

Iris admits that she thinks arrogant asses are funny sometimes, especially when they themselves agree that they are.

I could have very easily have told Kitty, who is probably a newbie on here and probably in the scene, that not all D/s people are life partners or share her view of things, less nicely if I had been the one she told "shame on you".

Realize that your master cherishes you, and when he puts you down or punishes you, it is because he is making a precious item all the more perfect, while keeping you in line. If you have a master, communicate this to them in so many words, so they can help to bring you up. What exactly are you having low self esteem about? or if its just generalized, know you are perfect as a sub and you dont need to feel down about yourself at all

This is actually a rather dangerous comment, because not everyone out there is nice and has your best interest in mind.
If you do say things like that, it's a good thing that you get called on it and if you take it upon yourself to chastise other grown ups on a message board you will run the risk that they will be less than nice about it.

 

[Stella_Omega]

If you didn't get before that "c) Next time just send him the nude pics." was a joke, then YOU need to check YOUR meds again.

Let me suggest to you that smilies have a purpose on the internet. They aren't just for sissies, they communicate intent.

I did get your joke, as inappropriate and ham-fisted as it was-- it's your wordsalad-y tantrum that people are remarking on.

It's not like we wouldn't have had this topic discussed before, in all variations. Of course, you wouldn't know, because you just arrived and the search function isn't used anyway these days.

If you feel personally put upon because people ask the same questions over and over, then this is probably a bad place for you to be.

 

[njlauren]

What I didn't say. I said it's not the job of the Dom to fix psychological problems. She replied with her pet comment to this post of me.

How about you first read the thread and then post again? Can we agree to this simple rule? It gets on my nerves to correct your errors over and over again.



You expect me to be polite, when she wasn't in the first place? Double standards much?

She starts with "I think its a bit insensitive for you to imply that simply sending nude photos will fix anything, shame on you." as a newbie, just because she didn't get the joke and after a quite polite reply for my standard, she decides to get the jerrycan. That's fine, but don't blame me for the result and expect that I will still let you live under the puppy protection act. Especially not if you pretend to be the all-knowing all-seeing trash heap. (The use of the word "you" means a "person writing here", not "njlauren". I thought I mention this because you (njlauren) seem to mix these two things up all the time.)

Given your track record of nasty comments, it is no wonder some might not pick up your attempts at humor as such, and as Stella said, there are little things called emoticons, because context in written stuff is difficult, your thing about sending naked photos came off as a snark, not as humor. Kitten got rude in response to your post which was demeaning, you set the tone. I have read a number of your posts on Lit and to be honest, most of them come off as someone who gets off on being a snarky jerk. I have met plenty of people IRL and they think they are the charming curmudgeon, the 'voice of piercing acuity in a fog of blather' and so forth, when most people think of them simply as people who get off on being a jerk. You were impolite to her first, her 'impoliteness' was in response to your hamfisted response.

As far as being a know it all, I am generally careful to say that I am writing from my own experience, my own perspective, and I also don't automatically assume that posters are writing that way, either. I also don't get off on knocking other people down, I may disagree with them but I try to give them the benefit of the doubt, which is different then yourself. You are the one who comes off as 'authoritative', and worse, you go off in the realm that a response to a post was somehow a personal attack, for example when you started whining that something I or anyone else wrote was 'an insult to you and your wife', you take things personally when there is no reason to, then you turn around and do exactly that with others. Hate to tell you, some may be amused by your antics, but I suspect many people reading your posts would be inclined to dismiss what you write, even if it has valuable ideas in it, because you present it so nastily and snarkily.

You were correct that D/s is played out in many flavors, and you were also correct that a dominant has no responsibility to 'fix' someone's psychological issues (in reality, no one, life partnered or elsewhere, can fix the issues of another; even if they were trained psych people, they wouldn't do that; all someone with someone, whether a dominant or a life partner, can do IMO is point the person in the right direction and support their work, but they can't 'fix' anything themselves. I once suggested something like that to a psych professional helping someone close to me work through some bad issues, maybe do role playing or whatever, and she was like "you don't want to go there, you don't know what it would be like, and you would be doing more harm then good for both of you". The value of your words, though, are lost in the wrapper they come in.

 

[Primalex]

You were impolite to her first

Didn't we agree that you read the thread first before you post again? How can I have been impolite to her first, if I wrote to the original poster, who was _not_ kitten?

As you ignored the rule to read the thread first, I refuse to read the rest of your post.

 

[kitten00]

What I didn't say. I said it's not the job of the Dom to fix psychological problems. She replied with her pet comment to this post of me.

How about you first read the thread and then post again? Can we agree to this simple rule? It gets on my nerves to correct your errors over and over again.



You expect me to be polite, when she wasn't in the first place? Double standards much?
B
She starts with "I think its a bit insensitive for you to imply that simply sending nude photos will fix anything, shame on you." as a newbie, just because she didn't get the joke and after a quite polite reply for my standard, she decides to get the jerrycan. That's fine, but don't blame me for the result and expect that I will still let you live under the puppy protection act. Especially not if you pretend to be the all-knowing all-seeing trash heap. (The use of the word "you" means a "person writing here", not "njlauren". I thought I mention this because you (njlauren) seem to mix these two things up all the time.)

I think Internet drama is stupid and should be ended here. Clear and simple, Primalex, you are being rude and defensive towards everyone on this thread who is simply trying to get past your big head to explain their point of view respectfully. Its not necessary, and with your goading everyone seems to continually be switching between composure and frustration with your rather childish antics. I did, in fact answer youPolitely in the first place, yet you frustrated me to a point where I lost my temper. I'm not going to apologize, because you were extremely rude towards me. T

he person who started this does not have psychological problems because they have self esteem issues, everyone does. I actually feel a little bad because the original purpose of this thread was a request for help, which has turned into a stupid cyber argument over a difference in opinions. Everyone is entitled to their own, an you don't need to push down those who voice theirs in a respectful way.

My experiencewith Doms have been that they have taken on the role of a caretaker, that does not fucking make me a little puppy, hello-kitty, and whatever other terms you used to insult me, that Is simply my experience and my opinion. I'm unsubscribing to this thread so I don't need to read anymore of this nonsense, but instead of spreading your negativity why not remain quiet? If you get off on bullying a young girl still in her teens, go for it! I hope you feel good about yourself.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Stop feeding the troll, folks-- I will too.

 

[Wannabe2012]

Thanks to all who offered legitimate advice to my original post. I really do appreciate it and it has helped. Let's all agree to call a truce and the let thread die off so Primalex doesn't have a platform for his nasty, hateful comments. I feel for the next newbie seeking advice when Primalex high jacks the thread for his own personal gain with no intent to help the OP.