And now for the part where I

[HarryHill]

You are both off topic watch you don't get deleted speaking of which, I'm up to page 8 in poem a week challenge, let me know when to start on my live poems

 

[butters]

You are both off topic watch you don't get deleted speaking of which, I'm up to page 8 in poem a week challenge, let me know when to start on my live poems

that would make me very sad

 

[HarryHill]

that would make me very sad

..
Page 9, never seen this one anywhere else, gee can I post a poem in a discussion thread?
..
There are tears in my eyes;
damn the written word;
damn poets playing them,
like the sweetest instrument
ever played;
damn the heartbreak
that lets me hear those songs;
damn me for reading them.
..
gone save here extraneous post please delete

 

[UnderYourSpell]

When there are so many threads comments are allowed, I can't see why this big hoohah over those that people are being requested not to.
1201 quite frankly you are a shit stirrer second to none (now why doesn't that surprise me?) , sure Smithpeter is gone but have you never heard of respect? (obviously not and that doesn't surprise me either!)

 

[twelveoone]

When there are so many threads comments are allowed, I can't see why this big hoohah over those that people are being requested not to.
1201 quite frankly you are a shit stirrer second to none (now why doesn't that surprise me?) , sure Smithpeter is gone but have you never heard of respect? (obviously not and that doesn't surprise me either!)

show me, if you can, that would be respect for his work, not some lame ass idolization, how many others have died since then?
and I if I where you would tread lightly on this shit stirring thing.

 

[Angeline]

show me, if you can, that would be respect for his work, not some lame ass idolization, how many others have died since then?
and I if I where you would tread lightly on this shit stirring thing.

Twelve since when does anyone need to prove to you that someone is or is not a good poet? Who made you judge of that? You are more than welcome to judge for yourself and agree or not and show respect or not. Bottom line is the guy is gone and can't argue his own case so if you don't like his poetry that is your business.

And sorry but the only argument between free verse and formalism here is in your head. It's certainly not with me or anyone else here I know.

I simply made a request--a respectful one--and asked for discussion. If people don't feel reasonable discussion is an option they will do whatever they need to do. But arguing over who deserves respect as a poet or what kind of poetry is better is, frankly, a distraction from what this forum is supposed to be about--writing and discussing poetry. I thought we all had a basic shared understanding of that.

 

[UnderYourSpell]

show me, if you can, that would be respect for his work, not some lame ass idolization, how many others have died since then?
and I if I where you would tread lightly on this shit stirring thing.

It is respect for his wishes, he disliked chatter in poetry threads and it's hardly his fault he's not here to ask for that request to be adhered to.

 

[twelveoone]

Twelve since when does anyone need to prove to you that someone is or is not a good poet? Who made you judge of that? You are more than welcome to judge for yourself and agree or not and show respect or not. Bottom line is the guy is gone and can't argue his own case so if you don't like his poetry that is your business.

And sorry but the only argument between free verse and formalism here is in your head. It's certainly not with me or anyone else here I know.

I simply made a request--a respectful one--and asked for discussion. If people don't feel reasonable discussion is an option they will do whatever they need to do. But arguing over who deserves respect as a poet or what kind of poetry is better is, frankly, a distraction from what this forum is supposed to be about--writing and discussing poetry. I thought we all had a basic shared understanding of that.

back it up a few posts, don't just respond to an a response to something that was clearly a provocation

 

[Angeline]

back it up a few posts, don't just respond to an a response to something that was clearly a provocation

I read the whole thread. What are you asking me to respond to here?

 

[GuiltyPleasure]

Lawdy, lawdy. lawdy. What is this? Grade five? Just write poetry, chat in the threads designated to chat and be grateful there's this great free site here for you to use. All Ange did was respond to thoughts from posters in this board putting out suggestions - and asking for in-put.

I'm not trying to single anyone out. I love you all and cherish your discussion, flirting, nattering, etc. I do it, too! But we need to keep some threads just for poems.

If anyone has suggestions, please speak up. Maybe if we talk about it together we can come up with a way that works for everyone.

How to say this gently, dear mod, So someone has to read through the interaction of poets 'living' poetry? boo hoo. you want to go to a library and read single moments of poetry, not see how they were influenced by the world that surrounded them when they wrote it.
So in fact I think that this is (pointed at ALL of us) because...
you'll lose the mortar that binds us together

I've read poetry in libraries and didn't get a hint of " how they were influenced", just enjoyed the poetry, or not, my prerogative. I know what we need! A thread devoted to work-shopping - poems and chat about how, why and what.

The whole thing got hijacked by HH's paranoia and twelveoone's ego. I think I'll take a sabbatical for a bit.

 

[HarryHill]

Lawdy, lawdy. lawdy. What is this? Grade five? Just write poetry, chat in the threads designated to chat and be grateful there's this great free site here for you to use. All Ange did was respond to thoughts from posters in this board putting out suggestions - and asking for in-put.

im inputting but your comment is very off putting, the discussion is progressing and I am supplying my own thoughts



I've read poetry in libraries and didn't get a hint of " how they were influenced", just enjoyed the poetry, or not, my prerogative. there are some love letters sent between poets that include poetry written between the, if you have not read them then that's a shameI know what we need! A thread devoted to work-shopping - poems and chat about how, why and what.
snore
The whole thing got hijacked by HH's paranoia and twelveoone's ego. I think I'll take a sabbatical for a bit.

E TU Tess?

 

[UnderYourSpell]

Lawdy, lawdy. lawdy. What is this? Grade five? Just write poetry, chat in the threads designated to chat and be grateful there's this great free site here for you to use. All Ange did was respond to thoughts from posters in this board putting out suggestions - and asking for in-put.





I've read poetry in libraries and didn't get a hint of " how they were influenced", just enjoyed the poetry, or not, my prerogative. I know what we need! A thread devoted to work-shopping - poems and chat about how, why and what.

The whole thing got hijacked by HH's paranoia and twelveoone's ego. I think I'll take a sabbatical for a bit.

Don't you dare or I'll come and haunt you

 

[todski28]

so here are some of my thoughts,

Tristess2 made a thread a little while ago "favourites from various threads" I have bumped it to the top might be stickied so that comments and general chatter on poems be easily accessible, and transparent, especially on the passion thread and the running threads that constantly produce poems, companion threads are great but sometimes the searching for them gets to a point where I give up, if I could simply click out of the thread go straight to the top and find it in the stickied section might make life easier.

I think the old writing live thread might as well remain as it, it is full of character that is added by the chatter, and that thread has been subverted from its original purpose as a live write erotic thread for a long time,

I understand Neo's frustrations especially the endeavour he has undertaken to round up his lost sheep, and appreciate that part of that problem must have been compounded by having to read through tons of general chitchat etc, I can't offer a solution to that particular problem but we may be able to limit it for the future.

 

[butters]

i've given this a lot of thought overnight, and agree with todski about the nature of live writes now. the inbetween material is as important to the character and immediacy of the thread as the actual poetry being laid down there day after day. i also understand some don't like this.

i propose a new thread (perhaps harry could start it) dedicated to live writes + asides, where anyone would be welcome to post their lives and chit-chat as they desired. those who prefer to keep to the purity of just poems would choose to keep posting in the new/old live writes thread and anyone else post in the LR+A thread. it's a splitting, which seems a shame, but i don't want to see the forum thrown into upheaval when so many of us love it here.

as an ex mod, i appreciate all the difficulties attached to the position; i went looking and it's mostly in the live/passion threads that some of us have been bantering back and forth. i also noticed material in live that would have been better posted in passion, and vice versa. since this is the case, maybe the new thread would allow for all of those plus the responses.

on the question of respect, though, i feel Harry's direct contributions to smithpeter's thread - in particular his direct communing with smithpeter's e-spirit here - shows more respect to the man than how the thread pretty much ran dry before, with only a few contributors. those posting poetry (with or without asides) and taking the time to comment on others' writes wherever they lie on this site are all worthy of my respect. i didn't know smithpeter, but i would hazard a guess that he'd be as dismayed as i to see the forum wracked by ugliness. EDIT: i went back to the very start of live writes and there're comments right from the start, right the way through - from smithpeter, angie, eve and many others.

so: do people think a new thread, dedicated simply to live writes and comments and welcome to all, a workable solution? OR should live writes remain as it stands, banter included? if people feel it too divisive, then perhaps harry and i will start one just for ourselves, but i feel that would run against the sense of inclusivity i'd wish to see prosper here.

 

[butters]

i'd also like to say, here, that harry has a point about the nature of 'live writes' and how they influence/are influenced by others and living in general. i find the inbetween stuff in LW a fascinating insight (and i'm not just speaking of harry and me) into the worlds and minds of fellow writers. almost a historical scrap-book of thoughts and ideas and interactions.

 

[twelveoone]

for starters Angeline, the premiss of the whole thread, how it was presented, the various invocations, incantations, not to mention the ever popular 1201 is a dick shit.
The premiss seems to be you have at least one (possibly more) poetry producers taking offense at one or two poetry responders. Ridiculous from the start. Don't you think?
I wish to retract my previous helpful suggestions, i.e keep it on a hard drive if you don't anybody looking at it, and threads are easily controlled through manipulation. i.e. ask.
As I now find this minefield is rich and overrun with ridicule,
that I have not yet begun to generate.
Perhaps a story about the poetry fairy is in order.

 

[champagne1982]

The Writing Live thread has always had a different personality (smithpeter wrote poems with several alts if you recall, so 'tis fitting) than the All of a Sudden Passion Suddenly one. Live has always had some interaction between poets about the poetry and Passion has always been about the poetry only - just couch your convos in poetic form and respond that way! I know there are several other threads on the forum where we should strive to stay on topic. There are no rules that state that topical discussions can't be fun and serious at the same time, nor is there some unwritten law that all threads need to be serious. Just enjoy each others' company and poetry in a healthy, adult kinda way.

I know I have often erred and I will try my damnedest to return and edit my posts to be poetry in threads where chatter has been requested to be kept at a minimum. I don't believe it is necessary to have moderation move posts that don't follow thread rules, that should always be reserved to as a way to handle spam and Literotica Guideline violators only.

One of the reasons we have the Poets' Hangout child forum now is because where once a Poetry Discussion Circle languished, the Hangout came to be. There was much discussion and strife back then, but now, as a fait accompli there is a thriving place where any poetry thread started is fair game for live interaction and conversely, any live interaction thread is fair game for poetry. As to those threads where the thread starter requests that it remain about the poetry in the opening post, it's not so difficult to keep interactive chat to a minimum.

No matter what the discussion is about, its certainly not necessary to get all passive aggressive, editing away posts and grousing that the request is unreasonable. (Yes, you know who I'm referencing and I am not going to get apologetic about it, you two.) Moderating poets must be like herding chickens. Good luck with that.

 

[butters]

The Writing Live thread has always had a different personality (smithpeter wrote poems with several alts if you recall, so 'tis fitting) than the All of a Sudden Passion Suddenly one. Live has always had some interaction between poets about the poetry and Passion has always been about the poetry only - just couch your convos in poetic form and respond that way! I know there are several other threads on the forum where we should strive to stay on topic. There are no rules that state that topical discussions can't be fun and serious at the same time, nor is there some unwritten law that all threads need to be serious. Just enjoy each others' company and poetry in a healthy, adult kinda way.

I know I have often erred and I will try my damnedest to return and edit my posts to be poetry in threads where chatter has been requested to be kept at a minimum. I don't believe it is necessary to have moderation move posts that don't follow thread rules, that should always be reserved to as a way to handle spam and Literotica Guideline violators only.

One of the reasons we have the Poets' Hangout child forum now is because where once a Poetry Discussion Circle languished, the Hangout came to be. There was much discussion and strife back then, but now, as a fait accompli there is a thriving place where any poetry thread started is fair game for live interaction and conversely, any live interaction thread is fair game for poetry. As to those threads where the thread starter requests that it remain about the poetry in the opening post, it's not so difficult to keep interactive chat to a minimum.

No matter what the discussion is about, its certainly not necessary to get all passive aggressive, editing away posts and grousing that the request is unreasonable. (Yes, you know who I'm referencing and I am not going to get apologetic about it, you two.) Moderating poets must be like herding chickens. Good luck with that.

to clarify, champers, would you be averse to Live Writes remaining more or less as it stands now?

as to this: Just enjoy each others' company and poetry in a healthy, adult kinda way. - i thought we were.

 

[champagne1982]

to clarify, champers, would you be averse to Live Writes remaining more or less as it stands now?

as to this: Just enjoy each others' company and poetry in a healthy, adult kinda way. - i thought we were.

Ah! Damn this text medium anyway. I didn't mean anything outside of my parenthetical comment to be mistaken as an admonition. It was a blurt, s'all.

As far as any post on any thread, I trust that the participants of the forum would be able to decide if they're conversing appropriately on it. For instance, if I were to drop in to neo's Neo Classic thread with you and start chatting about this thread as an example, and go on for 16 posts there, I think anyone would be justifiably annoyed and offended.

I'm sure neo would be frustrated too. No one is empowered to move the inappropriate conversation out of that thread and short of him putting us on his blocked list, there's nothing he could do to erase our conversation and, to add insult to injury, as long as we're following Literotica's Guidelines, there's nothing a moderator could rightly do without our mutual consent.

So, I understand both sides and the ruffled feathers here, but really, it doesn't matter how I think anyone should be posting it's totally up to each individual to be considerate. This is how I feel we should conduct ourselves on the 2 threads started by SP:

"... Live has always had some interaction between poets about the poetry and Passion has always been about the poetry only - just couch your convos in poetic form and respond that way! ..." ​

 

[butters]

 

[Angeline]

Just to try to keep things real here, let me point out again that I made a request on behalf of some users and asked for discussion. To those of you who have offered rational, reasonable responses, thank you. I am not conspiring to piss people off or hurt them or step on anyone's toes. I am trying to moderate the forum.

Note that yesterday I made the following suggestion.

Would it help if I started a Live Writing and Discussion thread? I could and then people could choose to write and discuss in the same thread or not.

But I have to do it soon if you want me to start it today because I have to bake like a gazillion cookies. Packages must be in the mail by Thursday.

And it was met with the following responses.

*unmoving*

You are both off topic watch you don't get deleted speaking of which, I'm up to page 8 in poem a week challenge, let me know when to start on my live poems

..
Page 9, never seen this one anywhere else, gee can I post a poem in a discussion thread?
..
There are tears in my eyes;
damn the written word;
damn poets playing them,
like the sweetest instrument
ever played;
damn the heartbreak
that lets me hear those songs;
damn me for reading them.
..
gone save here extraneous post please delete

From there things went totally down the rabbit hole and here is a perfect example.

for starters Angeline, the premiss of the whole thread, how it was presented, the various invocations, incantations, not to mention the ever popular 1201 is a dick shit.
The premiss seems to be you have at least one (possibly more) poetry producers taking offense at one or two poetry responders. Ridiculous from the start. Don't you think?
I wish to retract my previous helpful suggestions, i.e keep it on a hard drive if you don't anybody looking at it, and threads are easily controlled through manipulation. i.e. ask.
As I now find this minefield is rich and overrun with ridicule,
that I have not yet begun to generate.
Perhaps a story about the poetry fairy is in order.

Yes Twelve I'm picking on you again and you know why? You're not being rational or reasonable. You're acting snotty and sarcastic and alluding to what you think are past battles because you seem, at least to me, to think everything is a past battle. I honestly don't know how to respond to that because it's just wrong on so many levels, so I just try to ignore it. I can talk about writing and reading and commenting and I have ideas about all of it that I love to share but I am not at war with anyone. If you can't deal with that, I can't deal with you.

butters, I also noted earlier that we all at times have gone off topic in the original writing live and passion threads. In the beginning of the writing live thread, especially, there's a lot of banter. I only ever brought up smithpeter's wishes because I know them to be true, whether people followed them or not. But to blow that up into some big thing about who is better serving his original interest, whatever that was, seems like a monumental waste of time to me.

I think my point was more along the lines of what Desejo was saying that a stray comment here and there is fine, but when the off-poem talk goes on and on, the original intent of the thread gets lost. I also feel personally that when I spend too much time focused on others' writing, I lose my own focus. But that is just what works best for me. Now maybe you and Harry and a few others disagree with that. That's fine. I don't expect everyone here to move in lockstep. What would that serve?

Since we just remade the Writing Live thread, I have no problem with emending the title to reflect the current practice of talk and chat in there. I do think though that in the future, if someone starts a thread they should make it clear if they prefer poems only in it and create a companion thread if necessary. And people can post where they want and not post where they don't want and try to respect the thread starters' requests. Like always.

But I do think that the majority of people here will be most comfortable with reason and not jumping to conclusions or automatically assuming that because one is a moderator they are automatically out to get people. I hope we can proceed with that understanding and just work on our poems.

 

[butters]

Since we just remade the Writing Live thread, I have no problem with emending the title to reflect the current practice of talk and chat in there. I do think though that in the future, if someone starts a thread they should make it clear if they prefer poems only in it and create a companion thread if necessary. And people can post where they want and not post where they don't want and try to respect the thread starters' requests. Like always.

sounds good to me

 

[Angeline]

sounds good to me

Ok it's done. Note the change in the first post's title.

 

[Tsotha]

Forgive me for intruding (I don't even have an av yet).

Since the problem is that there is chatter in threads where only poetry should be posted, wouldn't it be easier to point out which threads should be kept discussion-free?

It just seems silly to get people all worked up only to find out that no, actually, the thread you're worked up about is fine (i.e. writing live).

 

[Neonurotic]

It just seems silly to get people all worked up only to find out that no, actually, the thread you're worked up about is fine (i.e. writing live).

It looked like to me it was compromise. I'd rather we let it go and move on.