Bottoming from the top

[P. B. Walker]

You're welcome, PB.

Thank you for taking the time to read that monstrosity. ~smiles~

LOL... it didn't take that long. You have a way of writing that allows a person to just breeze right through it.

PBW

 

[MsWorthy]

LOL... it didn't take that long. You have a way of writing that allows a person to just breeze right through it.

PBW

PB, that is quite a compliment!

~checks her head for swelling and smiles in pleasure~

 

[Shadowsdream]

Re: Domme/sub Down Time - an article I wrote on downtime

Does a dominant ever not feel like being dominant? No, being dominant is part of one's personality, like being outgoing, a nature lover, or butch or femme. Does a dominant ever want to temporarily alter the balance of power in her relationship? Yes, certainly. There are times when all of us want or need a break from our responsibilities. Having a power exchange in a relationship is definitely a responsibility, one that must be tended to daily (unless your relationship is only one for play or scening), but there are certainly times when either domme or sub may not feel comfortable with the amount of power (responsibility) they are carrying. On any given day, a person must wear many hats and deal with many emotions, stresses (both internal and external), and challenges. It is perfectly natural that this person may find herself unable to meet the responsibilites of her power exchange for a specific and limited period of time (usually no more than a few hours unless one is dealing with a serious illness).

Being excused from performing one or all of your given tasks (or responsibilities) for a specified amount of time does not make you less submissive or less dominant, it simply means that you honor your humanity. No one can be "on" or "up" all of the time. Everyone calls in to work at some point, everyone has days when she is just too tired to cook, everyone has moments when she simply does not want the responsibility of deciding what to have for dinner. We are all human beings first, with limits on our stores of energy. Being in a D/s relationship does not change these human limits, and honoring these limits does not make us less domme or sub.

In my opinion, this dispute is not about whether needing down time means you are not really dominant or submissive but rather needing down time is an indicator of how much power you need to have or give up in a relationship. There are many dominant people in the world but there are few dommes (dominant people who NEED control in a relationship). Just as there are many passive people around, but few submissives (those who NEED to give up power in a relationship). What distinguishes these two types of dominant people is the fact that one group (the domme) needs and wants the responsibility of taking control of another person, whereas the other group (dominant people) would like to control things in the relationship but she doesn't NEED to control another person.

Many people want control, but few are willing to take that much responsibility for another person. Being the one in control carries with it the responsibility for knowing the best decision to make in all areas under her control (if one does not know the best decision to make, she researches all avenues until she is as informed as possible) and then acting on these decisions. These areas can include safety, sexuality, finances, emotional traumas/health, hotspots, and any other area she has control over. People who are dominant in temperament may want their partner to satisfy their sexuals desires first, be allowed to make decisions without argument, and have dinner served to them, but the vast majority are not willing to take the responsiblity that comes with accepting this submission to their desires. These people are more concerned with whether they can be "up" adequately (take responsibility) than if they are allowed to have down time.

Unless one has accepted more power than she can responsibly handle, a domme (or sub) will have very little trouble being "up" or taking responsibility the vast majority of the time. There will only be certain times, under certain circumstances in which this will become difficult to do. How often this will occur for any given person is determined by how much responsibility she has in the first place and how comfortable she is with this power (or lack of).

There is a wide range of areas to control as well as a range for the amount of control to have. Some of us want only a small range of control (i.e., sexuality) and only want control of this area for a temporary period of time. Others want much more control (i.e., decision making, sexual control, financial responsibility, and service in all areas of life) and they want this control all of the time. One who needs less control in fewer areas naturally has more down time than one who needs more.

It is easy to see how one who needs much more control may want occassional down time if life decides to hand her additional challenges in her life at some point. By down time, I do not mean taking days or weeks off from being responsible for her submissive (or her tasks), I mean taking a few hours after a particularly difficult day to think of no one but herself. This is healthy, centering time and it can usually be taken within the parameters of the relationship, but at times life hands us more than we can process in the midst of things and we need a bit of time alone to work through it. Asking your submissive to handle things for a few hours while you go for a walk, close your bedroom door, or veg in front of the TV does not make you less dominant than you were, and asking your domme if you can leave the dishes, take a long bath with the door locked, or take a nap does not make you less submissive. It simply means that life or nature has temporarily handed you more lemons than you can make into lemonade.

Do not commit yourself to accepting more responsibility (power) than you can comfortably handle. If you find yourself needing down time often, this is probably a sign that you have overextended yourself. Having more power in a relationship does not make you more domme. It is not a sign that you are higher on the pole or hierarchy of dommehood (there is no such thing), it simply means that you need more control and are comfortable taking this much responsibility. If you find that you are not comfortable with the amount of responsibilty that you have, renegotiate with your submissive. Remember, this is not a contest and the one with the most extreme BDSM wins; this is your life and your happiness. Take what makes you and your submissive happy and discard the rest.

Remember, having power means having responsibility. There is not a person living (or dead for that matter) who did not need, at some moment in her life, to take a short break from her responsibilties. This does not take away from her strengths or make her less than she was, it simply makes her human.




What Lord Colm and jade have to say about down time.
http://www.castlerealm.com/library/upsdowns.shtml

What Mistress Steel has to say about down time.
http://www.steel-door.com/Dominant_Drop.html

ok...common sense and not what I was addressing...I was addressing..

((it is conceivable to me, in Your above example, that such a Mistress may find it difficult to stay "on Top" all of the time.......in fact, She may decide to experiment and bottom once in awhile with Her newly found playtoy) )

..as in *She may decide to experiment and bottom once in awhile with Her newly found playtoy*

No one in their right mind would say they NEVER needed a break from control..responsibility in the BDSM world any more than a human being with a job would say they never need a day off.

The issues have nothing to do with each other.

 

[Shadowsdream]

MsWorthy..

Other than Our discrepency in what You think I am saying...

Your web information is well thought out..interesting common sense that really does need to be said..and You have said it very articulately..You have written it from your own thoughts and the information available to You..and wonderfully at that. There is room for all styles..all opinions and it would appear from Your post that You also have a desire to show those who wish to seek out information that no one is a God or a Goddess but all are based in a reality day to day life structured whether they be Dom or sub.

 

[luvsubbbbb]

Re: Re: Re: Bottoming from the top

Heehee... thanks luvsubbbbb for the warning. Skull and crossbones duly noted.

you have nothing to worry about Red.....the warning only applies to Dominants.........us subs can wallow peacefully in our naivete without having to deal with these important potential pitfalls..........we leave that up to the Dominants

and besides........isn't it a full time job to just think up new ways that we can be pleasing to them??

 

[MsWorthy]

MsWorthy..

Other than Our discrepency in what You think I am saying...

Your web information is well thought out..interesting common sense that really does need to be said..and You have said it very articulately..You have written it from your own thoughts and the information available to You..and wonderfully at that. There is room for all styles..all opinions and it would appear from Your post that You also have a desire to show those who wish to seek out information that no one is a God or a Goddess but all are based in a reality day to day life structured whether they be Dom or sub.

Thank you, SD.

And, if you feel that my post was critical of you in some way, I apologize. Criticizing you was certainly not my intention.

 

[Shadowsdream]

Thank you, SD.

And, if you feel that my post was critical of you in some way, I apologize. Criticizing you was certainly not my intention.

You and I have more in common than We have differences.

 

[zipman]

There has been a lot of talk about manipulation and Topping from the Bottom on the board recently.

The one thing that Bottoming from the Top and topping from the bottom seem to have in common are:

1) The sub is really controlling the action

2) The Dom/me is not exercising their control over the scene/relationship

3) The manipulation is still occuring, only it is the Dom/me that has the ulterior motive.

Interesting stuff though!

 

[A Desert Rose]

There has been a lot of talk about manipulation and Topping from the Bottom on the board recently.

The one thing that Bottoming from the Top and topping from the bottom seem to have in common are:

1) The sub is really controlling the action

2) The Dom/me is not exercising their control over the scene/relationship

3) The manipulation is still occuring, only it is the Dom/me that has the ulterior motive.

Interesting stuff though!

Concise and well said. This has always been something I have trouble understanding and try to make a deliberate effort to avoid. I do, however fail at times.
Thank you Zip.

 

[zipman]

Concise and well said. This has always been something I have trouble understanding and try to make a deliberate effort to avoid. I do, however fail at times.
Thank you Zip.

Thanks Rose. Good to see you back!

I figured you would get tired of discussing politics on the GB and need a quick break to get a little BDSM fix.

 

[A Desert Rose]

Thanks Rose. Good to see you back!

I figured you would get tired of discussing politics on the GB and need a quick break to get a little BDSM fix.

LMAO. You know my kind all too well, don't you? ~smiling~

 

[MissTaken]

LMAO. You know my kind all too well, don't you? ~smiling~

Ahh but you are doing an awesome job on the GB!


*I am trolling DR!*

 

[A Desert Rose]

Ahh but you are doing an awesome job on the GB!


*I am trolling DR!*

And I too, am trolling, Miss.... LOL Love how we "look after" one another, you and I. ~smile~

 

[MissTaken]

Shhhh

People will talk!

 

[luvsubbbbb]

There has been a lot of talk about manipulation and Topping from the Bottom on the board recently.

The one thing that Bottoming from the Top and topping from the bottom seem to have in common are:

1) The sub is really controlling the action

2) The Dom/me is not exercising their control over the scene/relationship

3) The manipulation is still occuring, only it is the Dom/me that has the ulterior motive.

Interesting stuff though!

i see the two aspects noted above as being very different, zipman......

Topping from the bottom usually denotes the bottom manipulating the Top into getting what he/she wants, but its negative conotation really only applies to a D/s relationship, as opposed to an exclusive S/m one......for without the power exchange, it isn't "a sin" for the bottom to direct a scene...........

i see bottoming from the Top as a Top seeking a break from directing a scene and empowering a bottom to take control....if the bottom is also a submissive and manages to pull off the scene convincingly, i see that as a successful exchange....no manipulation there unless the bottom is unfulfilled when all is said and done.......

i know.........it is complicated.........hope i didnt confuse the issue even more......

 

[MissTaken]

You did a great job explaining it, lovsubbbb.

Such a great job that after being all over htis thread today, I FINALLY realized we aren't talking about topping from the bottom!

What a bonehead I am!



Sorry all!

 

[Sandia]

Bottoming from the top: maybe could describe someone who's so concerned about living up to his sub's expectations, he's afraid of doing or saying the things he really wants to do.

 

[luvsubbbbb]

no problem, MT

You did a great job explaining it, lovsubbbb.

Such a great job that after being all over htis thread today, I FINALLY realized we aren't talking about topping from the bottom!

What a bonehead I am!



Sorry all!

no problem, MT......you are entitled to "slip up" now and again.......thanks for the compliment

.....altho we have not officially met or communicated to date, i believe, i have always found Your posts to be well thought out.....and at a high level.......hhmm...i think the first one i noted was when you were posting an ad of sorts a few months back......when i first joined Lit..........questioning whether or not it would be accepted.........or something......

nice to meet you!!

 

[luvsubbbbb]

Bottoming from the top: maybe could describe someone who's so concerned about living up to his sub's expectations, he's afraid of doing or saying the things he really wants to do.

i am not certain how that is an example of the Top bottoming, Sandia.....

i think i would call that being afraid to be assertive.......

 

[MissTaken]

It is nice to meet you, as well, lovsubbb.


Bottoming from the top?

Well it would be manipulating your sub to do things that don't come naturally or comfortably for her.

I remember being with someone, a Dom and after many hours of play and introduction into activities I had only fantasized about, he rolled over and told me I could spank him.

IT so rocked me, I couldn't do it.
Then, I fell into that "I am a lousy lover/submissive" mode that accompanies disappointing someone.

We had never discussed switching of any type. It really bothered me.

Another time, the first Dom I became involved with.....ultimately upon meeting him and spending time with him, I realized (among other things) that he wanted his sub to take control of his affairs. His finances were a mess. He completely lacked any self discipline, whether it concerned personal hygiene, housekeeping, laundry or again, money. I know the gal who moved in with him and she finds his need for control in his life a burden to her. She is a manager and is handling it well, but it doesn't sit well in her gullet.

I dont' know if these are examples of bottoming from the top, but they are examples of things that made me feel very uncomfortable and question the Domly traits of someone.

 

[luvsubbbbb]

very good examples MT

It is nice to meet you, as well, lovsubbb.


Bottoming from the top?

Well it would be manipulating your sub to do things that don't come naturally or comfortably for her.

I remember being with someone, a Dom and after many hours of play and introduction into activities I had only fantasized about, he rolled over and told me I could spank him.

IT so rocked me, I couldn't do it.
Then, I fell into that "I am a lousy lover/submissive" mode that accompanies disappointing someone.

We had never discussed switching of any type. It really bothered me.

Another time, the first Dom I became involved with.....ultimately upon meeting him and spending time with him, I realized (among other things) that he wanted his sub to take control of his affairs. His finances were a mess. He completely lacked any self discipline, whether it concerned personal hygiene, housekeeping, laundry or again, money. I know the gal who moved in with him and she finds his need for control in his life a burden to her. She is a manager and is handling it well, but it doesn't sit well in her gullet.

I dont' know if these are examples of bottoming from the top, but they are examples of things that made me feel very uncomfortable and question the Domly traits of someone.

actually, MT...i believe that they all are very good examples of bottoming from the Top.....probably better than mine, even......as i referred to examples where the Top empowered the bottom, and you gave examples where the Top took the bottom role without the sub "buying in" to that dynamic.......

thanks for the examples!!

 

[MissTaken]

Well, it is very disappointing when that happens.

Umm if I wanted to top someone, I would call myself a switch or even a Domme.

It is risky getting involved with a sub who isn't on firm ground, but equally risky getting involved with a Dom/me who is walking through a quagmire of resolution.