Don't Beat Me!

[DeservingBitch]

I say, what you need is the soft touch of a woman.

OK seriously, I have nothing more to contribute after what Cat and SweetErika already told you. So, what they said.

I just came in here to offer my moral support.


ETA: and what it is that I am missing again because of my criminal lack of pop culture knowledge?

 

[graceanne]

Another quote from princess bride.

 

[rooky2]

Don't beat me...How much is enough?

Have you seen Olympics weight lifting? The big guys lift real heavy weights 300kg, 400kg, etc. But when they have reached their limit, even an ounce more makes them break down. Limits change with time, you know your limits, it would be healthy to stay within them, if you try to extend and increase the limit, probability of injury would only increase not to say can be a fatal one…making you potentially lose the enjoyment you are enjoying even now…

 

[SweetErika]

Have you seen Olympics weight lifting? The big guys lift real heavy weights 300kg, 400kg, etc. But when they have reached their limit, even an ounce more makes them break down. Limits change with time, you know your limits, it would be healthy to stay within them, if you try to extend and increase the limit, probability of injury would only increase not to say can be a fatal one…making you potentially lose the enjoyment you are enjoying even now…

If I followed this advice, I'd likely not be having sex at all because a certain sound and having weight on top of me made me panic, divorced and really unhappy now.

But I'm not because I realized my limits weren't particularly healthy for me or my relationship and I wanted to enjoy sex without the fear of freaking out looming all the time. They were a matter of self-preservation and catharsis in some respects, but I didn't want a deep, illogical emotional reaction dictating something I knew I could enjoy again. So, I diligently worked on changing my thoughts and feelings, and my limits did change in time with a lot of effort and support from my partner.

I agree that some limits are healthy and should run their course, but if they happen to pertain to something one really wants to do or enjoys, or are an impediment caused by a traumatic experience, it's often best to work on changing them. Otherwise, it can feel like we're being held captive by the bad experience and our past will always dictate our future. That's a feeling many of us don't like, and it can feel really good to take charge and make the changes that are likely to lead to more enjoyment/fulfillment.

 

[the captians wench]

Yes. There is. It's top-secret, though. Those of the strictly Domly persuasion aren't supposed to know about it. Oops....

Seriously, though, I think it's more about it being something I used to enjoy and would still like to do than being a good bottom. I liked it back then, and I would like to derive enjoyment out of it again. I just have this stupid mental block that's standing in my way.

I remembe my first play time with Jounar after 1) the insident with the asshole that lead to me ending that relationship, and 2) his telling me that he felt it was time for me to find some one out in the real world.

Now Jounar and I have been togeter for 2 years and playing for just a bit more than that. I love our time together and he's always made me feel as if he was right beside me holding me and stroking my hair as I come down, but that first play time I crashed, and I crashed hard.

I felt alone, abandoned, empty. I burst into tears and could not stop crying. for two hours he worked as best he could to calm me down, but it seemed almost like nothing would. It scared him, as much as it did me.

I think I did a thread on this, on what I called emotional flash backs. It's like my head went to that spot where the asshole had beaten me badly, took me deep into my slave head, and then told me that I didn't deserve his time to come back up and I'd have to do it myself (after he had promised once before that he would not leave me like that).

I couldn't help going to that place, but after revisiting it, I didn't want to do it again. But at the same time, like I said, I love what Jounar and I do. I love our time together and wanted to continue, and be able to continue that.

I talked to a friend, and some one else I play with (as this would effect him as well if I was having these flash backs). He basicly told me that if I wanted to continue, I was going to have to consider that I would face these things, and who knows what will trigger what reaction. The asshole did a lot of mental damage and the only way to tell what would happen would be to do it. But eventually I would be able to work through these things.

So I did, Jounar and I set a plan, and while I haven't gotten to where I used to be (with him or in face to face settings) I have come a long way, and every time it gets easier. The main key is having some one to play with whom I can talk to. If I can't talk these things out, if I don't have some one to stop me and say "okay, you're stressing, let's talk. What are you feeling?" then I wouldn't have made it so far.

I'm a big talker, and it's what's helped me.

 

[BiBunny]

I remembe my first play time with Jounar after 1) the insident with the asshole that lead to me ending that relationship, and 2) his telling me that he felt it was time for me to find some one out in the real world.

Now Jounar and I have been togeter for 2 years and playing for just a bit more than that. I love our time together and he's always made me feel as if he was right beside me holding me and stroking my hair as I come down, but that first play time I crashed, and I crashed hard.

I felt alone, abandoned, empty. I burst into tears and could not stop crying. for two hours he worked as best he could to calm me down, but it seemed almost like nothing would. It scared him, as much as it did me.

I think I did a thread on this, on what I called emotional flash backs. It's like my head went to that spot where the asshole had beaten me badly, took me deep into my slave head, and then told me that I didn't deserve his time to come back up and I'd have to do it myself (after he had promised once before that he would not leave me like that).

I couldn't help going to that place, but after revisiting it, I didn't want to do it again. But at the same time, like I said, I love what Jounar and I do. I love our time together and wanted to continue, and be able to continue that.

I talked to a friend, and some one else I play with (as this would effect him as well if I was having these flash backs). He basicly told me that if I wanted to continue, I was going to have to consider that I would face these things, and who knows what will trigger what reaction. The asshole did a lot of mental damage and the only way to tell what would happen would be to do it. But eventually I would be able to work through these things.

So I did, Jounar and I set a plan, and while I haven't gotten to where I used to be (with him or in face to face settings) I have come a long way, and every time it gets easier. The main key is having some one to play with whom I can talk to. If I can't talk these things out, if I don't have some one to stop me and say "okay, you're stressing, let's talk. What are you feeling?" then I wouldn't have made it so far.

I'm a big talker, and it's what's helped me.

Thanks, wenchie. I'm not much of a talker (believe it or not), and I think that's what gets me in trouble a lot of times. I'd rather make a smartass comment and laugh something off than actually talk about it. I've gotta change that pattern. *Sigh* 'Specially if I want to stop having relationships with emotionally unavailable men.

 

[the captians wench]

Thanks, wenchie. I'm not much of a talker (believe it or not), and I think that's what gets me in trouble a lot of times. I'd rather make a smartass comment and laugh something off than actually talk about it. I've gotta change that pattern. *Sigh* 'Specially if I want to stop having relationships with emotionally unavailable men.

honestly, when it comes to these flash backs, I tend to clam up. This is how the people who know me best know something is wrong *giggles* If I'm not talking, or not making a smart ass comment, then some thing is wrong, so I understand.

In most cases I'm really forward about what's wrong and good with talking it out, but some times, some triggers send me to a space where...well honestly I feel like I don't deserve to be heard. This is one of the things I'm working on erasing, that feeling of being "just a slave" and "not worth" what ever.

 

[YourCaptor]

[bitch mode] Ok that totally when overrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr your head and besides I think we are all adults here and know how to google the word "conditioning." Besides, Bunny has her bachelor's degree in psychology she doesn't need you to explain operant conditioning to her. [/bitch mode]

Confused.

I thought I was talking to you

I guess it did go over my head, I don’t understand what the bread means

*Shrugs*

 

[BiBunny]

You know what? The longer I think about this, the more I think I've got it figured out.

It's not the impact that sets off the "Must Kill Attacker" mode. Normally, I can be beaten all day long with a heavy flogger (provided I know that the person wielding it has at least some idea what he/she is doing) with no problems at all. It's the sting from the impact that sets it off. Too much top-of-the-skin "ouch" makes me homicidal or terrified, depending on how it's done, I suppose.

Which, of course, still doesn't actually answer any of the deeper psychological questions, but it does identify a somewhat more specific trigger.

 

[callinectes]

We all have our panic triggers: stingy things, blindfolds, frogs..for me it is gags. Why force the issue?

 

[callinectes]

With compulsories, like ice skating or diving or some other so-called sport?

Ahem. Diving is a so-called sport? Dude, if you also dis synchronized swimming, I am going to have to consider pulling out of the non-fan-club JM fan club. humph!

 

[BiBunny]

We all have our panic triggers: stingy things, blindfolds, frogs..for me it is gags. Why force the issue?

Because this isn't something that's always been a panic trigger for me. I used to enjoy it immensely, and I'd like to do so again.

Frogs, on the other, hand...always have been and always will be a hard limit. I'm terrified of the little bastards.

 

[JMohegan]

Ahem. Diving is a so-called sport? Dude, if you also dis synchronized swimming, I am going to have to consider pulling out of the non-fan-club JM fan club. humph!

Threats are very un-sub-like, you know.

 

[Netzach]

Because this isn't something that's always been a panic trigger for me. I used to enjoy it immensely, and I'd like to do so again.

Frogs, on the other, hand...always have been and always will be a hard limit. I'm terrified of the little bastards.

It's something you can work ON alone, it's something you can possibly get past with the right person right time, lots of conversation, right attitude, patience etc. Maybe. Maybe not.

I will say that if you're putting a lot of pressure on yourself to get over it, it's less likely to happen smoothly and it's more likely to be hard and not happen. This is where other people become handy - we're really good at 1. grounding a person in the objective reality at hand "it's ok, look, you don't have to kill me, you're safe" and 2. throwing in other variables that actually can mitigate panic and suffering. Like, oh, sexual arousal.

That's pretty much how most SM play works.

"Oh shit that hurt sonofabitch"
"Oh but you're OK, you don't have to hit me back, look how hot I am and how turned on you are *hump hump*"
"Mmmm, I'm horny....do it again"

Basic synopsis, vary it around, but as a narrative it's as solid as Oedipus.

It's probably more likely to work well if the sensation is question is explored in a really pressure free, non results-oriented way, almost like "hey did you see that?, huh. Oh now it's not there, hey look, I'm kissing you now (or screwing or spilling warm wax on you) now and it's just me" kind of way.

After it's reached a point where you can feel a little more casual and a little less terrified, after a lot of viewing it rationally and talking about it. You need to go there with a smart top, you've talked to a LOT in advance about it, who's not bored by that, and also not so wrapped up in "I shall help you past this little woman" that they want the credit. The credit goes back to YOU.

 

[fishercat]

"Oh shit that hurt sonofabitch"
"Oh but you're OK, you don't have to hit me back, look how hot I am and how turned on you are *hump hump*"
"Mmmm, I'm horny....do it again"

That is the single most lucid explanation I've ever seen of SM, and it made me giggle and get all hot and happy at the same time. I Netzach.

This whole thread has been really interesting; I'm so glad you started it BiBunny. I can see myself going to the same place with one particular sensation, kind of a flashback thing. If I do, I'll be rechecking this thread for ideas. Good luck to you Bunny!

 

[BiBunny]

It's something you can work ON alone, it's something you can possibly get past with the right person right time, lots of conversation, right attitude, patience etc. Maybe. Maybe not.

I will say that if you're putting a lot of pressure on yourself to get over it, it's less likely to happen smoothly and it's more likely to be hard and not happen. This is where other people become handy - we're really good at 1. grounding a person in the objective reality at hand "it's ok, look, you don't have to kill me, you're safe" and 2. throwing in other variables that actually can mitigate panic and suffering. Like, oh, sexual arousal.

That's pretty much how most SM play works.

"Oh shit that hurt sonofabitch"
"Oh but you're OK, you don't have to hit me back, look how hot I am and how turned on you are *hump hump*"
"Mmmm, I'm horny....do it again"

Basic synopsis, vary it around, but as a narrative it's as solid as Oedipus.

It's probably more likely to work well if the sensation is question is explored in a really pressure free, non results-oriented way, almost like "hey did you see that?, huh. Oh now it's not there, hey look, I'm kissing you now (or screwing or spilling warm wax on you) now and it's just me" kind of way.

After it's reached a point where you can feel a little more casual and a little less terrified, after a lot of viewing it rationally and talking about it. You need to go there with a smart top, you've talked to a LOT in advance about it, who's not bored by that, and also not so wrapped up in "I shall help you past this little woman" that they want the credit. The credit goes back to YOU.

Thank you, Netz. This I can relate to. This I like, a lot. I think I'll bookmark it for future reference. Sort of have a smart top in mind, anyhow.

 

[HottieMama]

It's probably more likely to work well if the sensation is question is explored in a really pressure free, non results-oriented way, almost like "hey did you see that?, huh. Oh now it's not there, hey look, I'm kissing you now (or screwing or spilling warm wax on you) now and it's just me" kind of way.

This is awesome advice!!!!!!!

 

[sexycaz22]

After it's reached a point where you can feel a little more casual and a little less terrified, after a lot of viewing it rationally and talking about it. You need to go there with a smart top, you've talked to a LOT in advance about it, who's not bored by that, and also not so wrapped up in "I shall help you past this little woman" that they want the credit. The credit goes back to YOU.

*nods* I do have to agree, brilliant piece of advice, Netz!

 

[Evil_Geoff]

I secretly fantasize about canes, but I know that the reality would be totally different than the way it plays out in my head.

That _can_ be negotiated you know.

 

[BiBunny]

That _can_ be negotiated you know.

Oh, you charmer, you.

 

[AvaAdore]

I totally identify with that - not being able to do something you once enjoyed. I used to enjoy anal sex, but a few bad experiences later (bad emotional experiences rather than physical) and not doing it for a long time, and suddenly I panic!

I've gotten past it to a point where as long as it happens in a particular format, I'm okay. However, I don't feel that I really enjoy it

 

[MasterPhoenix]

You're right. I shouldn't worry about it, but I do. Silly rabbit.

best advice...

let it happen a few times with someone you REALLY trust to get it back...

It sounds like one newb that maybe you shouldn't have let smack you around took away something that you enjoyed...

Just my drunken two cents...

 

[MsErica]

BiBunny--

One thing that might help you get past the block is to work with a top who will let *you* control the stingy pain for a while.

A good way to do this is to play 'Thank you Sir, may I have another?" After every hit, you need to ask for the next one. Until you speak, he does not hit you again. You could modify the game to allow you the option of also saying, "Thank you sir, but I'm not ready for another." That would be his cue to do something non-stingy instead.

I'm thinking it might be enough the first few times to take just a couple stingy hits. It starts--you stop it, and the scene then continues with other stuff. After a while you might start fantasizing about taking more. An ex of mine had a phobia based on past abuse (not stingy hits, but the principle is the same). We set a hard limit where I could go up to a certain point, but not further. After a few sessions like that, she could not think about anything else. Having me come so close but not go further built the trust, and also brought back her desire for the activity.

Another issue is that many tops do not allow enough time for you to process the pain in between hits, which can make any psychological issues worse--especially with stingy toys. Playing this game can make sure you have control of the situation so you can get what you need physically and psychologically.

 

[Netzach]

BiBunny--

One thing that might help you get past the block is to work with a top who will let *you* control the stingy pain for a while.

A good way to do this is to play 'Thank you Sir, may I have another?" After every hit, you need to ask for the next one. Until you speak, he does not hit you again. You could modify the game to allow you the option of also saying, "Thank you sir, but I'm not ready for another." That would be his cue to do something non-stingy instead.

I'm thinking it might be enough the first few times to take just a couple stingy hits. It starts--you stop it, and the scene then continues with other stuff. After a while you might start fantasizing about taking more. An ex of mine had a phobia based on past abuse (not stingy hits, but the principle is the same). We set a hard limit where I could go up to a certain point, but not further. After a few sessions like that, she could not think about anything else. Having me come so close but not go further built the trust, and also brought back her desire for the activity.

Another issue is that many tops do not allow enough time for you to process the pain in between hits, which can make any psychological issues worse--especially with stingy toys. Playing this game can make sure you have control of the situation so you can get what you need physically and psychologically.

This is rockin' advice. And a great how-to guide for a top playing with a bottom in this situation, too. Sometimes you *let* them dictate in the interest of getting what you want in the long range.

 

[serijules]

Bunni,

I had this problem about 6-7 years ago. I was a heavy pain slut with canes and could take a lot. I met up with a guy who claimed to have much more skill and knowledge than he did, and the results left me really damaged for a long time. My love the canes crashed into a deep fear. It SUCKED!

I got over it with time and playing with people I trusted who knew the history and were willing to help talk me through it. I still panic if anyone but Oldtom or Ma'am cane me though, so it's just something that only Ma'am does with me now. BUTTTT....with her, I now love and crave them again, so all is well

Not much help, I know Just wanted you to know you are not alone in the experience and it's no fun at all, I know.