Editors not responding

[CopyCarver]

I've been submitting stories for almost a year now and when I finally decided to find a Volunteer Editor, I ran into the same problems as described; No Reply. I deliberately chose VE's who had recently signed up to make sure they might be "keeners", but still no luck. I have had one volunteer (a reader who corresponded with me), but he is ill and unlikely to be able to continue. I would appreciate any assistance that might be forthcoming.
Coaster2

I suspect you'll have better luck posting your request here instead of contacting names on the list, if only because VEs who are on the forum are more likely to be active. With any luck, someone who isn't overloaded will probably respond shortly.

 

[cloudy]

I suspect you'll have better luck posting your request here instead of contacting names on the list, if only because VEs who are on the forum are more likely to be active. With any luck, someone who isn't overloaded will probably respond shortly.

I'd already offered earlier in the thread to edit for someone - I have a bit of free time now - but no one took me up on it.

Am I that scary?

 

[fieryjen]

I'd already offered earlier in the thread to edit for someone - I have a bit of free time now - but no one took me up on it.

Am I that scary?

I'm waiting until I write something worthy of your attention. Then I'll take you up on it.

 

[AsylumSeeker]

I Like Closure... Where Is It?

Okay, so I don't know where we are.

I'm a writer first, and also an editor. I feel as a talented person, I should dedicate some time to helping others. I am willing to do some editing for writers, especially new ones, or those struggling. I've posted the invitation before, but apparently it keeps getting lost in the quagmire that is Lit.

No, you won't find me on the editor list. I was at one time in a previous life, but now I'm a renegade. I like it that way, offering my services when I can focus on providing the service.

So, PM me if you'd like to consider having me edit. I will say up front I have only a high school education, no college, and I do the best I can. So if you're looking for a professional, keep looking. But I have successfully posted 111 stories here, so I know enough to get published at Lit.

So where's the beer? Damn, LadyC told me there'd be beer after this speech!

 

[CopyCarver]

I'd already offered earlier in the thread to edit for someone - I have a bit of free time now - but no one took me up on it.

Am I that scary?

Nope, there are those who'd rather curse the darkness than light a candle.

 

[CopyCarver]

So where's the beer? Damn, LadyC told me there'd be beer after this speech!

I tried to e-mail you a 40, but the cap popped off when I jammed the bottle into the CD-ROM drive

 

[AsylumSeeker]

The Local Radio Station Said It's Okay

I tried to e-mail you a 40, but the cap popped off when I jammed the bottle into the CD-ROM drive

The local sports radio said its' okay to have a man-love. For them it was Tiger, but CC, you're mine. It's not what it seems, it just means a person you have tremendous respect for. You have earned that many times over.

 

[AsylumSeeker]

Lalah got one real quick.

 

[LadyCibelle]

So where's the beer? Damn, LadyC told me there'd be beer after this speech!

Yep, that's what I said, hun; but it wasn't really a speech, was it? It was more like a proclamation on your part.

Make a speech, a good one and I'll even open the beer for you.

 

[NALA CAYENNE]

I don't think you're being unreasonable either. As a matter of fact, I just sent an email to an author that needed a re-write as well. I apologized at not being about to complete the edit and gave the reason why.

While I have not heard a response from the author, I felt it was better for me to pass on a story that I unwilling to re-write. There have been a few cases where an author needed a re-write as opposed to just making a few corrections in grammar, spelling and structure.

My best advice to folks that need re-writes (which is the same advice I have posted on the submission page of my e-zine) "...The Elements of Style by Strunk and White is an invaluable source for correcting issues of wordy sentences, incorrect punctuation and grammar, incorrect use of quotes in conversations between characters..."

Here's something. Last week I got an editor request and was sent a very long story. Personally, it was so bad that the scope of work needed was beyond mere editing. The author basically wanted me to rewrite the story, which I was unwilling to do. Am I being unreasonable? What I did was write back with two very specific suggestions for revision (dealing with good writing, not with grammar or other technical issues), asked the author to make changes based on those suggestions, and send it back to me.

Just so you can understand my response, here is the first page just as I received it:

 

[snooper]

Here's something. Last week I got an editor request and was sent a very long story. Personally, it was so bad that the scope of work needed was beyond mere editing. The author basically wanted me to rewrite the story, which I was unwilling to do. Am I being unreasonable? What I did was write back with two very specific suggestions for revision (dealing with good writing, not with grammar or other technical issues), asked the author to make changes based on those suggestions, and send it back to me.

Just so you can understand my response, here is the first page just as I received it:

Reading this carefully, and trying to understand the position, I come to two conclusions:

1) English (in any form) is not the writer's native tongue;
2)Judging from some of the constructs used, the most likely mother tongue is some form of Hindi.

What I think you have there is one of our Indian friends' attempt at writing English. I am considered fluent enough in French to work in the language, but its structure is so like English that this isn't too difficult; even so I wouldn't begin to try to write a story in French for Lit. How much more difficult it must be for someone whose mother tongue is constructed so differently from English, and who is surrounded by other people who do not speak English properly.

 

[Fflow]

India is indeed the country of origin for the text I shared with you. As I said, though, the problems I noted were not technical in nature but, rather, conceptual. Regardless of the language one writes in, one does not need to restate the same or similar ideas multiple times on the first page. To me, that is so aggregeous that having to explain it seems.... challenging.

I'm glad to hear that I'm not being unreasonable. I love to help writers, and have done so for many years, and in many contexts. (I used to help budding journalists) Still, I want to feel like I'm being met half way.

FieryJen? Wow! I thought you'd gone. *hugs*

 

[snooper]

... the problems I noted were not technical in nature but, rather, conceptual. Regardless of the language one writes in, one does not need to restate the same or similar ideas multiple times on the first page. ...

Many writers do that in their early works, even those writing in their native tongue. That never worries me as an editor - I just explain politely in terms of re-writing a single paragraph and leave them to correct that problem in the rest of the piece themselves.

For me the real problem is when something is grammatically and syntactically correct, but no Anglophone would ever use that phrase. An example (a true one) which springs to mind is the fake English policeman during WWII who was revealed as a German spy when he demanded "Produce your card of identity." "Card of Identity" is not wrong in any technical sense; it just isn't used, ever, in English.

A further problem with second language writers is the misuse of prepositions. This is always a difficulty, since one preposition in one language may have different translations according to the context. For example "depuis" in French is sometimes "since" but occasionally "for" in English.

Adverbs also have this problem. For example "Comment ...?" in French is sometimes "How ...?" and sometimes "What ...?" in English.

... I'm glad to hear that I'm not being unreasonable. ...

Not in the least unreasonable; just setting different priorities among a plethora of problems.

 

[Fflow]

Many writers do that in their early works, even those writing in their native tongue. That never worries me as an editor - I just explain politely in terms of re-writing a single paragraph and leave them to correct that problem in the rest of the piece themselves.

For me the real problem is when something is grammatically and syntactically correct, but no Anglophone would ever use that phrase. An example (a true one) which springs to mind is the fake English policeman during WWII who was revealed as a German spy when he demanded "Produce your card of identity." "Card of Identity" is not wrong in any technical sense; it just isn't used, ever, in English.

A further problem with second language writers is the misuse of prepositions. This is always a difficulty, since one preposition in one language may have different translations according to the context. For example "depuis" in French is sometimes "since" but occasionally "for" in English.

Adverbs also have this problem. For example "Comment ...?" in French is sometimes "How ...?" and sometimes "What ...?" in English.

Snooper, strangely, I find all of the problems you mentioned fairly acceptable. I wouldn't necessarily change "Produce your card of identity" because, in a way, I think it reveals the writer's authentic voice, even if it is incorrect. I had relatives who, coming from Europe, mixed up sentance structure in English and came up with unfortunate mixups like "Throw me down the stairs a hat." I wouldn't necessarily "fix" that either, if I felt it was part of the writer's authentic voice. What bothers me, and which I can't abide, is the agonizing and pointless redundancy found in that first page. It is also devoid of subtlety. To me, it reads as if written by a teenager. (maybe it was)

Anyway, I'm glad I'm not being overly anal.

Peace!

srw

 

[snoopercharmbrights]

... I had relatives who, coming from Europe, mixed up sentance structure in English and came up with unfortunate mixups like "Throw me down the stairs a hat." ...

Presumably your relative was going out golf to play?

 

[MsWenchiness]

question for the ve's

I posted my first story on Lit and because of the feedback, I decided a re-write was in order. I went looking through the VE list and found one that actually responded. I sent my revised story but have yet to receive a response. After letting it go for 2 weeks I emailed this person asking them how the editing was going and a week later have received no response. How long should I wait before I seek another editor? I do understand the constraints the real world will have on their time and I do not wish to appear rude or pushy, but, I'd really like to get my little project finished so I can move on to my next idea.

 

[starrkers]

So it's three weeks and they haven't contacted you at all? A week after a "hello, how's it going"?

I'd write them off as a loss and look elsewhere. Post a query here on the forum in its own thread. You're more likely to get a live one that way

 

[sr71plt]

I posted my first story on Lit and because of the feedback, I decided a re-write was in order. I went looking through the VE list and found one that actually responded. I sent my revised story but have yet to receive a response. After letting it go for 2 weeks I emailed this person asking them how the editing was going and a week later have received no response. How long should I wait before I seek another editor? I do understand the constraints the real world will have on their time and I do not wish to appear rude or pushy, but, I'd really like to get my little project finished so I can move on to my next idea.

If you really feel there are writing issues intruding on your stories (and you want to continue posting them for readers to read and, you hope, enjoy), getting an editor here, which is an iffy proposition for a couple of reasons, isn't really the long-term solution. Editors are neither substitutes nor permanent crutches. Buy or check out some books on writing and grammar, buy a good dictionary (preparably Webster's Collegiate if, you want to write for publication) and/or sign up for a basic creative writing program. They are being held all over the place cheaply in community education programs. You shouldn't need much development to be able to post at Lit., unless you really don't have any talent for writing at all.

Seems like you could get a lot of that done on your own and become largely independent just in the time you are waiting for someone to respond to you here who may or may not know even as much as you do about writing.

In the meantime, if you've written something you want to share, and you can get it past the selection mechanism on the site, go ahead and post it. There are so many/varied readers here that you're likely to get an appreciative audience at some level. The more you read and write here, the better you will naturally become if you pay the least bit of attention to what others are writing and what seems to the working for them as well as what seemed to work for you in your previous stories.

If the "get an editor" public comments on your story annoy you, just erase them. If you get a "get an editor" comment in a more public venue, just say you've tried that and it hasn't been successful yet and if they don't want to vounteer to help you themselves they can just pack it in.

This "listed as a VE but won't respond" issue seems pandemic here. Maybe if some of the nonresponders were identified publicly, it both would embarrassment them enough to delete themselves from the VE lists and would warn other writers looking for VE help from the nonresponders not to spin their wheels contacting them. The system certainly doesn't seem interested in cleaning itself up.

 

[LadyCibelle]

[....]Cut to get to the heart of the matter

This "listed as a VE but won't respond" issue seems pandemic here. Maybe if some of the nonresponders were identified publicly, it both would embarrassment them enough to delete themselves from the VE lists and would warn other writers looking for VE help from the nonresponders not to spin their wheels contacting them. The system certainly doesn't seem interested in cleaning itself up.

Don't go burst an artery but I agree with you on this. The thing though is how could you, me or anyone else, be able to stop it from becoming a witch hunt?

I'm serious here, lets say you (not YOU in particular, general you) get your copy edited and for XYZ reason you don't agree with the editor. Lets say the editor told you you needed a writing course, not to quit your day job or whatever else, and you're pissed off at the editor. Wouldn't it be easy for you (once again not you in particular) to come here, or whatever that thread of complaint function would be, and give this editor a bad name?

What could stop any Dick, Tom and Harry to complain about X editor because of a disagreement?

Let me repeat, I fully agree with what you said. I'm just wondering out loud how it would be possible to stop a witch hunt on someone who doesn't deserve it.

 

[sr71plt]

Don't go burst an artery but I agree with you on this. The thing though is how could you, me or anyone else, be able to stop it from becoming a witch hunt?

I'm serious here, lets say you (not YOU in particular, general you) get your copy edited and for XYZ reason you don't agree with the editor. Lets say the editor told you you needed a writing course, not to quit your day job or whatever else, and you're pissed off at the editor. Wouldn't it be easy for you (once again not you in particular) to come here, or whatever that thread of complaint function would be, and give this editor a bad name?

What could stop any Dick, Tom and Harry to complain about X editor because of a disagreement?

Let me repeat, I fully agree with what you said. I'm just wondering out loud how it would be possible to stop a witch hunt on someone who doesn't deserve it.

Apples and oranges. I don't think the boards are any place for a pissing contest on perceptions of how well services were rendered. (This is pretty much the topic of a thread here yesterday where I indicated the same position.)

But nonresponsiveness to either requests to edit or for status report on edits in progress (although that could be argued a bit too) is pretty cut and dried "did or didn't." It's not tied up with the subjective issues of the quality of services rendered. (On these issues, more often than not writers get disgruntled over services because either their expectations were unreasonable or they are reacting out of the same ignorance of their own abilities and knowledge base that sent them to an editor in the first place--I think).

If the "system" won't police its VE records, I don't see why the writers shouldn't help each other not get bogged down by nonresponseness by helping trim the deadwood out publicly themselves.

 

[LadyCibelle]

Apples and oranges. I don't think the boards are any place for a pissing contest on perceptions of how well services were rendered. (This is pretty much the topic of a thread here yesterday where I indicated the same position.)

But nonresponsiveness to either requests to edit or for status report on edits in progress (although that could be argued a bit too) is pretty cut and dried "did or didn't." It's not tied up with the subjective issues of the quality of services rendered. (On these issues, more often than not writers get disgruntled over services because either their expectations were unreasonable or they are reacting out of the same ignorance of their own abilities and knowledge base that sent them to an editor in the first place--I think).

If the "system" won't police its VE records, I don't see why the writers shouldn't help each other not get bogged down by nonresponseness by helping trim the deadwood out publicly themselves.

Yeah, apples and oranges as you say, but my question remains. What could or would stop you to post an editor's name on such a thread just because you didn't agree with what he said, didn't like him or her for XYZ reason or whatever else you (general you) can come up with. What mechanisms could be put in place to insure that the complaint is really about the responsiveness or not of the editor?

How could you make sure that it's not just sour grape on the part of the writer?

 

[sr71plt]

Yeah, apples and oranges as you say, but my question remains. What could or would stop you to post an editor's name on such a thread just because you didn't agree with what he said, didn't like him or her for XYZ reason or whatever else you (general you) can come up with. What mechanisms could be put in place to insure that the complaint is really about the responsiveness or not of the editor?

How could you make sure that it's not just sour grape on the part of the writer?

Nothing. There's nothing stopping anyone from doing that now. There's a whole mountain of unfounded/unevidenced personal insults and innuendo being heaped on posters' heads on the board already. there seems to be little holding back and propriety honored in what already goes on here. And there are no forum rules against doing it.

At least this would have some use/purpose to it--and, again, the simple point of whether a declared VE is responsive to either queries or status check requests is pretty much a did/didn't issue.

 

[LadyCibelle]

Nothing. There's nothing stopping anyone from doing that now. There's a whole mountain of unfounded/unevidenced personal insults and innuendo being heaped on posters' heads on the board already. there seems to be little holding back and propriety honored in what already goes on here. And there are no forum rules against doing it.

At least this would have some use/purpose to it--and, again, the simple point of whether a declared VE is responsive to either queries or status check requests is pretty much a did/didn't issue.

I agree wholeheartedly with you. And that's what's scaring me in your suggestion. There is nothing that can be done to make sure that the editor's name posted is really about her/his responsiveness or not and not for other other reasons, nothing at all to prevent it from becoming a mudslinging-witch hunt because you didn't like him/her. That's truly scary when you think about it.

 

[smidgeon]

Not sure how, but...


... what if there were a rating system for editors? I haven't thought this through, but once you've worked with a writer, he/she could provide some feedback for others. Even some of the most basic info, like "responded within 48-72 hours? provided helpful feedback? able to work with Word? or blah blah blah..." I guess the questions would be geared more toward yes/no answers rather than ascribing numeric values.

Now that I've started thinking it through a bit more, I realize there are quite a few gaps in my theory where things "magically" happen. I have no idea how to implement such a system, whether it would be feasible - or even susceptible to the same kinds of abuse as naming names system. I blame it on the late afternoon hour and lack of caffeine.

That is all.

 

[AsylumSeeker]

Standing on my Soap Box

... what if there were a rating system for editors? I haven't thought this through, but once you've worked with a writer, he/she could provide some feedback for others. Even some of the most basic info, like "responded within 48-72 hours? provided helpful feedback? able to work with Word? or blah blah blah..." I guess the questions would be geared more toward yes/no answers rather than ascribing numeric values.

Now that I've started thinking it through a bit more, I realize there are quite a few gaps in my theory where things "magically" happen. I have no idea how to implement such a system, whether it would be feasible - or even susceptible to the same kinds of abuse as naming names system. I blame it on the late afternoon hour and lack of caffeine.

That is all.

<Still thirsty for that beer, although having already sipped from a flask. But if you open it up...>

Four score and seven years ago...

Been there and did that. In a perfect world and all that. Just glad I'm not the only idealist in the crowd! It would never work. Hell, it's impossible to even keep up on the current list of active editors, much less which are poor, average, good, better, and best! And what if they get better with experience? And whose opinion would be used?

I'm not mocking you at all, but rather myself. I've had similar thoughts and voiced them only to be, admitted lovingly, smacked down by Queen LadyC <that was meant in a good way>.

The intention is good, but its application is simply not feasible. Just my opinion.