Feminism and being a submissive

[sunfox]

From Feminism to jacking off zoo bears. Interesting. Now if we started with jacking off bears and ended up at Feminism, that would be a story.

I love it when a thread ends up miles off target.

 

[TaintedB]

Horse Sex Ed. 101

Yeah, that right there falls under the heading of 'too stupid to live', in my opinion

Having been around horses most of my life, I'm inclined to feel that way about people who have sex with horses, too. Having seen stallions savage mares, or cut them up with their hooves while mounting, not to mention the mares who kick the hell out of stallions they don't want (some mares are highly particular.. we had one that didn't like grey stallions. Anything else was fine.. but no greys.)... I can't see why you'd want to risk your life to do that.

Okay, and the whole animal thing makes me violently ill. But that's another thread.

Or maybe not a thread at all (talking about the present, not the past) as criticizing other people's sexual enthusiasms that you happen to dislike or hold personal prejudices against, however personally justified you think such prejudices are, is a pretty clear and certain way of getting your own kinks severely criticized in the future, as well as those of innocent others, as it initiates a pretty ugly pattern: it begins to create an atmosphere of hurt, hostility, and strong mutual distrust in a forum. But I suspect you already know that. (sigh)

I don't dispute your firsthand knowledge of horses, Sunfox, but the circumstances you are describing never seem to happen in the hundreds of horse sex films I've seen. (If they did happen, the "edited" film bits would eventually get out on the net, as there's a huge, ravenous audience for sensational and horrifying "accident clips." While I am not an accident freak, I I would have come across such clips had they been issued, given the search terms I use and given the way such shock footage is distributed.)

Maybe you don't know about how safe horse sex seems because, if the stuff makes you "violently ill," then you probably haven't seen these hundreds of films that I have? If you could bring yourself to actually watch representative samples of such movies and learn a little about the subject, you'd see that the way horse sex is usually done, at least with the stallions (I'm not too interested in mare sex so I haven't seen too much of it) is quite routine and safe. The horses are usually so calm, in fact, that I wonder if they're given horsie Xanax before the shoot (although if they did that, I am not sure if the stallions could get it up). But what I do see is excellent handling. The handlers are always around the animal, although in the films you only catch brief glimpses of them, and they seem to know their animals quite well. And the women tend to be the active partners in this sort of sex. I am not sure why this is so, but the stallions are not particularly aggressive--although they get hard and ejaculate, they kind of "lay back and enjoy it," so to speak, there's very little danger of human internal damage.

Only a very few "actresses" in this genre do really wild risky things, such as let a pony stand up on his hind legs (forelegs on the top of a stall) and take her at will. and even in those clips, I suspect there's someone lurking in the background. The only woman I've seen do things like this, in fact, is an expert animal handler who seems to have been around animals all her life. She's something of a stuntwoman in the beast crowd, and like most stuntpeople, prides herself on the dangerous peformances she gives. But she is very unusual in this genre, most people don't go near the stuff she does.

Despite the precautions taken during horse sex, a horse could always panic or get upset and do something unexpected, but then isn't that true in almost every nonsexual circumstance of dealing with a large animal? The point, I think, is that whatever you do around a large animal that could easily kill or severely injure you, you do what you can to minimize the risks, because the benefits of being around the animal outweigh the risks. Still, I've got to wonder if the person who is frequently around horses doing non-sexual things with them isn't at much higher risk of injury than the person who occasionally does a sex thing with them with several handlers and half a dozen other people around in case of problems.

So given the way horse sex is done, at least if you're smart and experienced, I don't think a person who's been around horses all her life has the right to criticize those who are around them only occasionally in carefully controlled circumstances, as the former, due to sheer frequency of association, appear to be taking far more physical risks than the latter. What ought to be criticized, in my opinion, is the inexperienced and inexpert approaches to any sort of physical contact with a beast much larger (or even just much fiercer) than yourself, although, unlike you, I do classify wilder and more ferocious animals, such as lions, tigers, and bears--even so-called "tamed" bears,"--in quite a different category of risk than creatures, such as horses, that have been thoroughly dometicated and bred for human use and companionship for thousands of years.

 

[Netzach]

A forum in which no one can say anything is reprehensible or gross to them without being browbeaten for it is equally as oppressive.

 

[sunfox]

A forum in which no one can say anything is reprehensible or gross to them without being browbeaten for it is equally as oppressive.

Agreed.

And while I fully support someone's right to pursue whatever kink floats their boat.. I am well within my rights to be disgusted by something.

TaintedB... you will now, instead of going off half-cocked on whatever you thought you read in my comment, notice that nowhere in my post did I say "You're disgusting for being interested in zoo". What I said was "that whole animal thing makes ME violently ill" (emphasis mine). Which is, thankfully, a right that I have in the world nowadays, to say 'okay, that particular subject makes me twitch and search for a porcelain god to annoint'.

I may find the idea of it tantamount to sex with a two year old, in particular because it's not possible to obtain consent from the other party, but that's just my personal viewpoint of it, and why I would never indulge in it.. why it is an absolute, rock solid, hell no don't even suggest it, hard limit. Luckily, I suspect C would beat me to the bathroom puking if I mentioned it.

I honestly couldn't possibly give a shit less if other people do it. It is disturbing to me ... which is the point around which my statment revolved, not a passing of judgement as you seemed to feel that it was.

Such panicked defense always makes me curious where the kneejerk reaction is coming from. Guilt?

 

[sunfox]

Maybe you don't know about how safe horse sex seems because, if the stuff makes you "violently ill," then you probably haven't seen these hundreds of films that I have? If you could bring yourself to actually watch representative samples of such movies and learn a little about the subject, you'd see that the way horse sex is usually done, at least with the stallions (I'm not too interested in mare sex so I haven't seen too much of it) is quite routine and safe. The horses are usually so calm, in fact, that I wonder if they're given horsie Xanax before the shoot (although if they did that, I am not sure if the stallions could get it up). But what I do see is excellent handling. The handlers are always around the animal, although in the films you only catch brief glimpses of them, and they seem to know their animals quite well. And the women tend to be the active partners in this sort of sex. I am not sure why this is so, but the stallions are not particularly aggressive--although they get hard and ejaculate, they kind of "lay back and enjoy it," so to speak, there's very little danger of human internal damage.

Let me add more directly here that I have no desire to watch something that makes me ill. Call me quirky, but vomiting isn't fun, and I'd rather not do something that I know without question will result in it.

Secondly.. it is never excellent handling if an animal is drugged. Period. That's why people get suspended in equine sports for drugging horses. It is eventually harmful internally, and when done unnecessarily (which to me, doping them so you can fuck them falls under the heading of unnecessary drugging) is cruel.

Stallions are not necessarily 'aggressive' during breeding. They just act like stallions, which involves biting the mare's neck to stay up on her, and his hooves being draped on either side after he's tossed his entire weight up on her.

BTW, if they don't get to physically mount.. it's not really sex. It's semen collection. Just a useless side note that I felt like adding in there.

Despite the precautions taken during horse sex, a horse could always panic or get upset and do something unexpected, but then isn't that true in almost every nonsexual circumstance of dealing with a large animal? The point, I think, is that whatever you do around a large animal that could easily kill or severely injure you, you do what you can to minimize the risks, because the benefits of being around the animal outweigh the risks. Still, I've got to wonder if the person who is frequently around horses doing non-sexual things with them isn't at much higher risk of injury than the person who occasionally does a sex thing with them with several handlers and half a dozen other people around in case of problems.

I'd have to disagree that the person not fucking horses is more in danger. But then, I've never broken a bone or been badly injured by a horse in 25 years. I figure that by not wedging something three foot long and as wide as my wrist up my hoohah, I'm avoiding quite a bit of disturbing injury.

My own curiosity far more is about the question of what becomes of an animal that has been taught to present for a female human when the filmmakers tire of him and want a younger animal. Market being the way it is, I rather imagine they either end up in a kill sale, or go to a home with people, where due to aggressively being physically pushy without the drugs to calm them, they end up.... oh yes... right back at the kill pens.

So shame on me for pitying the probable end of beasts taught to view humans as the objects that provide them with ejaculations. But then, I suppose that's a regrettable side effect of having seen beautiful young healthy horses subjected to a kill mallet for considerably less reason than being sexually aggressive towards people with an expectation of getting some, hanging upside down from torn legs hung aloft by rusty chains, bleeding and screaming while they aim the mallet the second time because it didn't finish the job the first time.

Perhaps, though, that too is sexually exciting to someone, and should therefore be given all understanding and consideration. After all, the well-being of the animal is not our concern... just getting off is. I could find plenty of anti-slaughter sites, if anyone feels those images would arouse them, rather than make them cry the way they do me.

So given the way horse sex is done, at least if you're smart and experienced, I don't think a person who's been around horses all her life has the right to criticize those who are around them only occasionally in carefully controlled circumstances, as the former, due to sheer frequency of association, appear to be taking far more physical risks than the latter. What ought to be criticized, in my opinion, is the inexperienced and inexpert approaches to any sort of physical contact with a beast much larger (or even just much fiercer) than yourself, although, unlike you, I do classify wilder and more ferocious animals, such as lions, tigers, and bears--even so-called "tamed" bears,"--in quite a different category of risk than creatures, such as horses, that have been thoroughly dometicated and bred for human use and companionship for thousands of years.

People die all the time around horses, despite their domestication. A horse is a prey animal, which renders him always floating in a state between calm and panic that can be triggered by ridiculous things. So I have to be inclined to snicker at anyone who ever thinks you can control a thousand plus pound animal if he should decide to have an episode. Part of being knowledgeable about horses is understanding that they are always capable of killing you, and that it will never be on purpose like it is with tigers/bears/etc. Discounting that is foolish.

And my being around them all my life gives me more reason to criticize, rather than less. The eleven horses we own, including my very much beloved Arabian, depend upon us for vet care, grooming, food, exercise... it is an abuse, IN MY OPINION, of their trust to utilize them as a living dildo for my amusement.

Okay, now I'm done. And yes, obviously, this is a hot button issue for me. But since you took it upon yourself to attack me when I hadn't attacked you, I figured it was my turn.

 

[Marquis]

Stop fucking the horses TB!

 

[babiesmiles]

Okay, and the whole animal thing makes me violently ill. But that's another thread.

I completely second that !

...... and before you say anything I'm NOT stalking you !!!!! I just agree with most things you say

 

[catalina_francisco]

Bump...

 

[Netzach]

How the fuck did this turn into horse sex?

 

[Netzach]

I find this common amongst many BDSMers and nothing could be further from the truth for me. I always imagine wives back in those days being submissive in theory only. I've been with too many women from more traditional countries like those in Latin America that have been taught every trick in the book on how to top from the bottom imaginable.

Since we're necromancing stuff, this would indicate that in ANY society with ANY rules you are going to find Dominant ------->>> submissive continuums in each gender.

 

[catalina_francisco]

How the fuck did this turn into horse sex?

LOL, I had forgotten about that when I came across it and bumped it. Adds to the mood after interviews I just watched with Adam Sandler discussing how he would jump right into a 'hands on' gay role, lick his own dick if he could, how his dog can't quite lick itself anymore, dog masturbation, how to get someone pregnant and a few other topics followed by Keira Knightly discussing various things including her breasts and the latest movie....was an fun show.

Catalina