Is initiative a four letter word?

[catalina_francisco]

Well yes it makes perfect sense but i'm not sure how just telling someone you want them to feel another way is much, if any, better.

LOL, I didn't say it did. This is a huge misconception of many in this lifestyle (at various levels of participation), that a 'good' pyl can be ordered or told how to feel/act and it is so from that point forward. Hmmm, it might appear to be so in some cases, but more often than not it is pretence which is far from what was desired, and then leads to built up resentment, anger, insecurities, or any number of negatives which can result in a deterioration of the relationship. It all comes back to the good old communication message.

Catalina

 

[madetotakeit]

I have found that when I am hesitant to initiate it is because I am reacting to a wall the other person has. I have to see that he is open to me being that way before I feel comfortable in doing so. I thought about the men I have been involved with before posting in this thread. I noticed the pattern. With those that gave me a signal before hand I was at times the instigator, playful, and more responsive. With those who never let down that wall, I was always careful not to overstep the boundaries. In a way it was me who held back, but overall how I am depends on who I am with.

Making a decision on where to go however is another matter all together. I'm hopeless when it comes to that. As long as seafood is not an option I'm good with anywhere. If I am in the mood for something specific, I'm more likely to make it myself than to go out. Of course that could have something to do with the lack of decent restaurants in my area.

 

[eastern sun]

This is a huge misconception of many in this lifestyle (at various levels of participation), that a 'good' pyl can be ordered or told how to feel/act and it is so from that point forward. Hmmm, it might appear to be so in some cases, but more often than not it is pretence which is far from what was desired, and then leads to built up resentment, anger, insecurities, or any number of negatives which can result in a deterioration of the relationship. It all comes back to the good old communication message.

Catalina

Hear. Hear. This totally agrees with my experience.

Having witnessed very few loving relationships as a child, I think I entered the D/s world to simplify the playing ground. The rules seemed to be so clear. s does what D wants. D agrees not to endanger s. M does whatever.

But of course, it proved to be as complicated as all human relationships are.

And I, while trying to serve, have wrestled with intense resentments, subtle and not-so-subtle forms of sabotage, jealousy, sloth, self-righteousness, and pride. (I'm tempted sometimes to say that the intensity of these relationships just accelerate the development of these rather normal tendencies.)

And, really, there are no rules.

The basic groundrules and goals provide some structure to work towards, but it ultimately comes down to the reality of how we're treating each other, and the life we build together.

I agree with Catalina.

Trust. Communication. Patience. Crucial tools in this psycho-sexual journey.

 

[castagnus]

It has been a long standing complaint of my husband that i do not take initiative. Since incorporating D/s into our relationship i have actually begun to take more initiative simply by making myself available in a more flirtatious way and being willing to put myself out there and be rejected if he isn't in the mood. Before when everything was strictly vanilla i could not bear the rejection of coming onto him and then having him not want to have "marital relations" with me. Now i touch him, lean over his chair in such a way, smile, kiss, tease etc pretty much all the time. i try to give little indicators that i am "in the mood". He honestly doesn't take me that often these days, once a week maybe but the flirting is still fun and i still enjoy demonstrating to him that i am very happily available and desiring to play all the time.

Several times i have initiated a bj while he has been watching TV or something. He usually lets me get started. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't but its always fun. If he doesn't want that and just wants a kiss or for me to sit next to him i don't get my feelings hurt. i have learned to enjoy overtly offering myself and being content with whatever he decides to choose from the menu. Its sort of like do you just give him the menu and make him read and choose (or worse create the menu every time) or do you go ahead and roll out the dessert tray with a little sales pitch and some sampling and then be okay with it if he decides that well... actually... no dessert tonight.

This is not how i am or how i want to be with my Daddy at all. i actually think one of the reasons i am able to go ahead and be sexy-woman sub with my husband is because i have my little girl-never have to initiate with Daddy.

Dammit girl, you just highlighted the main reason my formerly submissive wife divorced left me.

But only once a week?

 

[catalina_francisco]

Hear. Hear. This totally agrees with my experience.

Having witnessed very few loving relationships as a child, I think I entered the D/s world to simplify the playing ground. The rules seemed to be so clear. s does what D wants. D agrees not to endanger s. M does whatever.

But of course, it proved to be as complicated as all human relationships are.

And I, while trying to serve, have wrestled with intense resentments, subtle and not-so-subtle forms of sabotage, jealousy, sloth, self-righteousness, and pride. (I'm tempted sometimes to say that the intensity of these relationships just accelerate the development of these rather normal tendencies.)

And, really, there are no rules.

The basic groundrules and goals provide some structure to work towards, but it ultimately comes down to the reality of how we're treating each other, and the life we build together.

I agree with Catalina.

Trust. Communication. Patience. Crucial tools in this psycho-sexual journey.

Yep, I have found that a huge problem with discussing M/s relationships in forums is that the minute a slave wishes to discuss issues they are having, feelings they are trying to deal with which may not be ideal for a slave, or a M discusses crossing that SSC line from being always mindful of a slaves wellbing into darker areas, the discussion quickly becomes one of recriminations or preaching about what a slave should do if they wan to be a slave and what a M should adhere to if they don't want to be considered an abuser...though it is more frequent toward a slave than a PYL I find. It seems many people are disturbed by the thought of M/s and look for the opportunity to show why it can't exist and be real.

The reality is the reason I think many do not pick slavery and M/s as a relationship type is because it is anything but easy and these things are not something which happens and is fixed forever in a couple of hours. They recur, they resurface, and they are a continuous work in progress requiring equal effort from both sides of the whip. When I hear a slave proclaiming how devout they are and above any of these negatives (or a M doing the same in regard to their property), I either assume they are in the new flush of the relationship, or hiding what is really happening out of fear or guilt. As time progresses the challenges continue to raise their head, and the solutions are not always easy or simple. Comminment to trying to continue that journey in a way which remains authentic to those involved is what counts.

Catalina

 

[Bandit58]

I have trouble initiating sex. I'm shy and find it difficult, even though I love Him to bits. I'm also afraid of rejection. Damn self esteem issues and damn my ex husband

If He initiates however, I really get into it. But He's tried waiting for me to start something and I just can't....in the end He gets so horny that he just has to get me into the bedroom. It's like hell will freeze over before I'll do anything.

During my first marriage I learned to switch off sexual feelings. I still do it, subconsciously I imagine. He's told me that I can feel free to ask for sex or play anytime, and if He's not feeling up to it He will tell me and not to feel bad, that it's nothing to do with me....but it hasn't happened, yet.

Something to work on....

 

[cromsgirl]

I have also had problems with this in the past. Even though my husband told me I could ask for sex anytime, I always felt like I was "bothering" him if he was doing something else (usually on the computer). After several years, and the addition of BDSM into our sex life, I am finally able to initiate sex. It basically boiled down to practice. I'm not even sure when I "flipped that switch in my head" to be able to ask, and I do have occasional slips back. It helps that he has never rejected my advances ( he still has a teenager's sex drive).

I also have problems with ordering food. Hmmm. I'd never actually conected the two.

 

[the captians wench]

I could never decide where to go eat and still cannot, but I never had problem showing initiative with men, especially if I don't care about them.
If they turn me down, it was disappointing but since I am not invested emotionally, it doesn't matter much.

This is me. When I'm horny, the whole fucking world knows it. Jounar told me more than a few times to "calm down and watch tv" while I was there. But I drove him mental when it came to decide to do something for the day. I never can make up my mind when it comes to where to eat or something like that. He'd ask me if I saw something I liked on the menu, and I'd answer "I could". That was not helpful apearently. Most of the time tho it was an honest answer, if something really popped out at me that I wanted to try, I would tell him. And if I didn't find anything I would tell him that. I learned to also tell him when everything seemed "meh".

At work it's actually in my monthly evaluations that improving asertiveness is an on going goal. We do things to work on me being more assertive, and it is starting to leak out into other aspects of my life. but it takes time and practice

 

[ataxia.girl]

Dammit girl, you just highlighted the main reason my formerly submissive wife divorced left me.

But only once a week?

Yea... He's just not that into it. We're really busy people with careers and kids and its just not that high on his priority list. i don't really mind as it is partly my fault. i was so frigid and rejected his advances for so many years i think he just learned to go without until he no longer really wanted it. The past few years have been a lot better and 6 months ago we were fucking like bunnies but as i have calmed down he has gone to a level more natural to him.

Personally i'd love to be used\fucked 2-3 times a day. He's happy with 1-2 times a week. It ruins the whole experience for me if he's trying to keep up with me. i want him to fuck me when he feels like it, not because i feel like it.

It is difficult to balance that with the feeling of also wanting to be of service by initiating because he wants me to but we're managing. i have just gotten used to laying myself out there. Showing that i am "in the mood" and not worrying about it if he chooses not to take advantage. It hasn't actually been as big a deal as i would have thought but ultimately in my mind i belong to Daddy and He ALWAYS wants me and wants me always "in the mood" so when my husband only wants me once a week i enjoy being used and like the connection but my ego is not really invested. i enjoy pleasing my husband and being used by him but my identity is tied to belonging to Daddy if that makes sense.

 

[unregistered]