LDR: How DO you do what you do?

[artful]

Re: For once, I have an answer, and not a question! :j

My point is, keep the Dom & sub aspects as long as you just want the fantasy. But if you're looking for something real, something you can wake up to in the morning - then take the time to get to know each other, out of the context of just the relationship, but as friends as well.

That's my 2¢, anyway...

Not wanting to offend you,...but BEING a Dom/me, a sub, or a 'switch' is not a fantasy. It's a fact.
Sure,...the roles can be fantasized, just like cops and robbers,...but remember,...there ARE real cops and robbers.

Your Friend,...................................Art

 

[TheWanderer]

Re: Re: For once, I have an answer, and not a question! :j

Not wanting to offend you,...but BEING a Dom/me, a sub, or a 'switch' is not a fantasy. It's a fact.
Sure,...the roles can be fantasized, just like cops and robbers,...but remember,...there ARE real cops and robbers.

No offense taken, and forgive my poor choice of words.

The sentiment I was going for was to contrate not just on the roles, but on the people. Not just on the fantasy (which IS only fantasy if it's LDR and not having yet met IRL), but on the real life - so you don't wake up one day wondering how you ended up with a great sub but a lousy housemate.

In other words, if you're looking for something serious, be serious about it, always and in all ways.

 

[artful]

I think this is the area where MOST people get confused. They have difficulty in separating REALITY from FANTASY,...fact from fiction.

That's why it is SO damned difficult for a 'sub' to find a REAL Dom/me online. LDR's are the MOST challenging relationships to develope and maintain JUST because of this.

I STILL think it's the safest way, but it DOES require a lot of effort from each participant. It also allows a BETTER selection of people to choose from.

Many of us reside in small communities or rural areas. A town of 983 people does not support a LARGE selection of subs or Dom/mes.

(JMHO),...but it's mine,...and I own it.

 

[Persephone36]

I understand what Wanderer is saying Art. It's not that a D/s relationship is all fantasy -- it's that when you're meeting online you have to be *extremely* rigorous with your own emotions regarding projection.

It's a natural aspect of *any* new relationship whether you're meeting in person right from the start -- or you're meeting online. However, the danger's are that much more inherent online because you can't read tone in an email. It's natural to want to read between the lines and fill them in with the sentiments we all long to hear.

So, it's all about taking things incredibly s-l-o-w-l-y.

Also, and perhaps my perspective my cause some controversy here -- as much as I enjoy being "in love" like the next person -- I think being in love is quite akin to infatuation. And both are based more on self-ego than an understanding of other. I think loving someone deeply -- takes time. A lot of time. And it takes having lived through the day to day mundane irritants of life together -- as well as the heights of passion. In fact, it's in my opinion being able to survive, and actually *enjoy* getting through the day to day mundane things of life -- that makes you realize you've got a partner you really can love and be truly committed to.

Believe me -- I'm not knocking meeting online and developing a relationship that way. God forbid! LOL, after all -- it's what I'm in the middle of now myself. But it has *enormous* pitfalls -- and I think it's important, even if it's painful, to be conscious of them at all times. Even if it's painful to be honest with ourselves about our own deepest needs and desires to project what we most desire onto another person, make them our object of love.

Let's put it this way -- it's the rarer person rather than the average one that can get past their narcissism -- actually, recognize it -- and see it for what it is -- begin to work at it -- and *then* understand that by getting outside of themselves -- that's how they are going to learn to truly love another. See the other for who and what they are -- an individual. And an individual who has their own thoughts and feelings that more often than not will not jibe with our own. When you can live with that -- and still love them...well, that really is true love.

All my personal perspective of course.

P.

 

[artful]

Perse

You say the same thing as I do,...but in more concise manner. Damn,...I wish I could do that!
LOL

 

[MissTaken]

Re: fantasy

That is a wonderful point to bring up.

When you im ing with someone or playing on the lit BBs, the interaction is you and them, exclusive of outside stimulus.

A bad mood or bad hair day can be covered up.

The chaos of living with two children isn't a reality to the person talking to me.

I think it is very easy to feel a strong infatuation on line as all of the interaction is focussed on the two involved.

Truth be told, divorces and break ups don't always happen because love isn't there. Sometimes, it is that love is forgotten amid the stressors of daily life.

Perhaps I have little patience with my children and a certain, telling ugliness shines through in real life? It is safely hidden behind text.

Yes, fantasy is something to enjoy when your perspective is "Let's fantasize." However, fantasy can destroy a potential real life relationshp in that dreams are shattered and expectations not met in the real world.

 

[~Dream~]

IN REersephone

I understand what Wanderer is saying Art. It's not that a D/s relationship is all fantasy -- it's that when you're meeting online you have to be *extremely* rigorous with your own emotions regarding projection.

It's a natural aspect of *any* new relationship whether you're meeting in person right from the start -- or you're meeting online. However, the danger's are that much more inherent online because you can't read tone in an email. It's natural to want to read between the lines and fill them in with the sentiments we all long to hear.

So, it's all about taking things incredibly s-l-o-w-l-y.

Also, and perhaps my perspective my cause some controversy here -- as much as I enjoy being "in love" like the next person -- I think being in love is quite akin to infatuation. And both are based more on self-ego than an understanding of other. I think loving someone deeply -- takes time. A lot of time. And it takes having lived through the day to day mundane irritants of life together -- as well as the heights of passion. In fact, it's in my opinion being able to survive, and actually *enjoy* getting through the day to day mundane things of life -- that makes you realize you've got a partner you really can love and be truly committed to.

well well at last a subject I CAN very well relate to,being 'in love"
while my Master chooses to use the words that HE "CHOSE" or chooses to love me ,I KNOW I am HIS "IT' aka the ONLY woman for HIM THAT MAKES Him feel the way that ONLY I can..I HAVE BEEN " infactuated' before and I do KNOW THE DIFFERENCE..not saying that you insinuated that I didnt or anything hun it's just that Artful and my love is so STRONG and so REAL and yes after even only knowing each other all of 3 mo's now but that's not to say that there is still not more yet to learn..I KNOW we are committed to each other and I know we DO love each other not only deeply but passionately as well ,this does NOT always take alot of time to develop as both Artful and I have had relationships in the past that have been both good and bad experiences for us so I think we are going into this one alot more slowly in 'some' aspects but wholeheartedly with alot of true emotion also
it can happen fast both online and off and I believe that the skin to skin meeting only serves to cement the feelings even stronger

 

[MissTaken]

Dream???

IN the past, I have struggled hard and lost the battle with my sadness after meeting my Dom.

How are you doing?

I find that after skin to skin, all those other tricks and tasks seem empty. My longing for His touch was so great as to impede my ability to do anything else, but be sad.

Of course, in the long run, the Dom(s), (there have been two), weren't for me.

That may have been part of my problem. They weren't for me, so serving long distance didn't "feel" like it should have?

 

[Persephone36]

Re: IN REersephone

well well at last a subject I CAN very well relate to,being 'in love"
while my Master chooses to use the words that HE "CHOSE" or chooses to love me ,I KNOW I am HIS "IT' aka the ONLY woman for HIM THAT MAKES Him feel the way that ONLY I can..I HAVE BEEN " infactuated' before and I do KNOW THE DIFFERENCE..not saying that you insinuated that I didnt or anything hun it's just that Artful and my love is so STRONG and so REAL and yes after even only knowing each other all of 3 mo's now but that's not to say that there is still not more yet to learn..I KNOW we are committed to each other and I know we DO love each other not only deeply but passionately as well ,this does NOT always take alot of time to develop as both Artful and I have had relationships in the past that have been both good and bad experiences for us so I think we are going into this one alot more slowly in 'some' aspects but wholeheartedly with alot of true emotion also
it can happen fast both online and off and I believe that the skin to skin meeting only serves to cement the feelings even stronger

Hey Dream -- please don't think anything I was saying was directed at you and Art specifically. Although I can see why it might be something that you're sensitive about -- because people from the outside can be intensely judgmental.

Truly -- I don't know the details of your and Art's relationship -- how long you've been together or how much time you've spent physically in each other's presence on a day to day basis.

What I'm talking about is just a basic common human foible. We all have an intense desire to be loved -- but on our own terms. When we are able to realize that we can fulfill most of our needs ourselves -- by loving ourselves first -- then we're more truly open to loving another.

Time is a practical thing. But it's different for all people. I've watched marriages go slowly assunder over many years -- and relationships do the same over a few months. And in both instances -- it had to do with assumptions, projections -- an unwillingness to see that relationship -- ALL relationships are based on compromise. And a willingness perhaps even more so -- that when you feel the *most* misunderstood, the most alone, the most angry with your partner -- that is perhaps the moment to drop your ego and look at things from their perspective.

Terribly hard thing to do -- but then again, loving someone is about loving them unconditionally. As hopefully we learn to love ourselves unconditionally as well.

That also touches on what MissT mentioned -- see I think if you really want to feel love -- you have to be able to love yourself for the days you scream at the kids and lose it, the days we feel ugly, the days we're having a bad hair day, the days we feel like idiots. And then you have to be able to allow someone *else* to love you for those things too. As long as we want to hide our imperfections from another -- then no one can truly KNOW us. And then how can they possibly love us? To know you're loved -- you have to let someone else see the things we don't like about ourselves (and hopefully, at the same time, we work each day learning to accept ourselves unconditionally as well.)

But in all those things Dream -- I don't think there are time frames. I genuinely try to not judge others in how they chose to live their lives -- I just try to be supportive on the path they're walking. I do think there's common sense -- but I think you also have to trust your instinct as well. And you have to be able to look honestly inside your own heart and see what are your deepest hopes and fears and not have your life ruled by them.

And that's my buck fifty for the day!

(and btw -- thanks Art for the compliment.)

P.

 

[artful]

Let me add

Dream and I are totally honest and open with our communications. We EACH knew what we wanted. Some days we have misunderstandings,...some days either of us may make a MISTAKE, but we know ENOUGH truth about the other that we are COMMITTED to resolving our differences. NOTHING is perfect,
and certainly not ME, but she is TRUSTING that even if I *DO* make an error,...it won't be because of us not being able to fulfill each others needs, wants, and desires. Communication IS the key,...but it has to be done in honesty, truth, and knowledge.

 

[~Dream~]

Re: Dream???

IN the past, I have struggled hard and lost the battle with my sadness after meeting my Dom.

How are you doing?

I find that after skin to skin, all those other tricks and tasks seem empty. My longing for His touch was so great as to impede my ability to do anything else, but be sad.

Of course, in the long run, the Dom(s), (there have been two), weren't for me.

That may have been part of my problem. They weren't for me, so serving long distance didn't "feel" like it should have?

it is very very difficult for me to not be able to SEE Him or to FEEL His touch now,dont think for 1 minute that it's not but I truly believe that the foundation of mine and Artful's deep and lasting relationship is and ever shall be our open honesty and continued communication with one another..without the phone,the net and letters ,it would be alot more painful than it is now..
I KEEP Hope alive in my heart and my very real committment of submissiveness to Him will remain intact whether we are in the same room,state,or miles apart..but quite frankly yes Miss T it DOES hurt alot..but I am strong and WE are as one now so I WILL survive..

 

[Shadowsdream]

Persephone36

I must say I am popping it and out of threads today and am enjoying the depth and openess of your posts all over the place.

Keep sharing and absorbing as you take Us on a ride in your personal journey.

 

[cellis]

Speaking of LDR....

When I was looking for someone, and I had been expliciting in what I wanted, I received an "offer" from a lawyer in South Africa. He was so serious and had a list of demands and things that I should do and when I should do them. I made him send them to me in writing. He had it all thought out.

I realized that a long distance relationship was not for me prior to this, but I had never been approached in this manner.

I personally think that it is laughable to expect me only to masturbate sitting in front of a web cam (which I didn't and still don't own). And I might add that I was expected buy one at my own expense, even thought it was for his enjoyment... Or to record my voice and the sound of my masturbation on a special program set up on the computer... There was more, but the thought that he wanted me to buy equipment for him just totally turned my off.

In the long run, unless a LDR is moving towards a full time real life experience, I don't think that it can work.

 

[cellis]

Just as a side note...

It is my opinion that trust is made and broken in the everyday little things. I can tell you right now that I could not handle someone saying one thing and then not doing it.

I made this very clear to Himself in the beginning... trusting someone is hard for me and I asked not to tell me that he was going to do something and then not do it. That means that he can't just say things in a passing way and not consider their affect on me.

For me that would be all it would take to decide that the LDR was not worth it. If I cannot trust him to call when he says he will, how can I ever trust him to respect my other limits.

 

[Persephone36]

Persephone36

I must say I am popping it and out of threads today and am enjoying the depth and openess of your posts all over the place.

Keep sharing and absorbing as you take Us on a ride in your personal journey.

Thank you Shadowsdream -- what a lovely thing to say.

Lol, I think the harder thing would be to *stop* me from sharing rather than vice versa ...but I genuinely appreciate your encouragement.

(Now...about that Domme training we were discussing in that other thread...)

P.