Reading Books For Pleasure

[traill]

I started it, then put it down, and haven't gotten back to it. I've read several of her books, and enjoyed them all. In particular, Bird Cloud captured my imagination. I recommend it.

Thanks, I'll add it to my reading list. What made you put it down again, if I may ask? Just a bit too many other things right now or it wasn't as engaging?

Currently reading Archie Brown's The Rise and Fall of Communism, and funnily enough Communist and the fall of the Soviet era was discussed at the top of this page ha. It's an incredibly interesting, although dense book.

 

[twister947]

Thanks, I'll add it to my reading list. What made you put it down again, if I may ask? Just a bit too many other things right now or it wasn't as engaging?

I just got overwhelmed with reading material. I have every intention of returning to this book.

 

[Scareltt]

Sissy by Jacob Tobia

 

[seela]

I read a book by Niina Mero:
https://www.helsinkiagency.fi/death-of-romance/

It’s basically a funny, gotic romance set in modern times with a goth/punk heroine. Nice way to spend a couple of hours.
I wanted to ask @seela and other Finnish speakers though, if you have read it because the language is a bit strange to me in the Swedish translation.
I’ve seen several reviews praising her language and I wonder if it is the writer’s background as a researcher with the references to English poetry and history and concepts like vanitas and ozymandias that impresses, because I don’t think it flows well and the way some things are expressed just seems off.
Possibly just a bad translation though?

I’ve never heard of the book or the writer before so I can’t comment on the language.

Sometimes translations are bad and clumsy and detract from the language and the reading experience, so that could be the issue, too. It’s not like Mero is a very famous writer who’d get the best of the best translators.

That said, people who don’t appreciate translations and translators suck big time. Definitely not saying Iris is one of those people. But I keep running into people saying they refuse to read any translated literature and I want to stab them all. People who only read books written in the original language close off huge parts of the world, usually they are only able to read in maybe two or three languages, tops.


I’m currently reading Demian by Herman Hesse and I can’t decide what I think of it.

 

[twister947]

Sometimes translations are bad and clumsy and detract from the language and the reading experience, so that could be the issue, too. It’s not like Mero is a very famous writer who’d get the best of the best translators.

That said, people who don’t appreciate translations and translators suck big time. Definitely not saying Iris is one of those people. But I keep running into people saying they refuse to read any translated literature and I want to stab them all. People who only read books written in the original language close off huge parts of the world, usually they are only able to read in maybe two or three languages, tops.

I read quite a bit of Nordic fiction, and am constantly impressed with the quality of the translations. At least, I assume they are translations, and that's exactly the point; I can't tell, for sure.

 

[IrisAlthea]

Sometimes translations are bad and clumsy and detract from the language and the reading experience, so that could be the issue, too. It’s not like Mero is a very famous writer who’d get the best of the best translators.

It’s interesting though, because it was released by the publisher [sekwa]. They are small, independent and focused on high quality translations, originally from French but now also from Nordic languages.
And it isn’t badly translated as you’ll sometimes see, with actual mistakes, it just…feels like I stumble on it somehow. That’s why I wondered if it is something that is actually there in the original and that I just don’t get.

That said, people who don’t appreciate translations and translators suck big time. Definitely not saying Iris is one of those people

No, I’m not.
I’ve only translated scientific or technical texts, but that is enough to inspire mad respect for those able to interpret and translate artistic qualities.
Sadly, I think translation work is underpaid and undervalued these days, to the point where it’s hard to do a good job in the fast moving popular culture business.

That said, I sometimes feel very differently about texts depending on the language. I’m fond of Canetti for example, but don’t feel quite the same about translations as I do about the original German and it’s not because the translation is bad, just different.
When I have looked for translations of poems or song lyrics to show someone, it has sometimes even been a kind of striking ”wait what, that wasn’t what I wanted to show you?!”- feeling.

I’m currently reading Demian by Herman Hesse and I can’t decide what I think of it.

I read Steppenwolf and some of the short stories, as a teen in German class and remember being fascinated with some of the themes Hesse wrote about and especially by Steppenwolf. I haven’t read Demian though.

 

[IrisAlthea]

I read quite a bit of Nordic fiction, and am constantly impressed with the quality of the translations. At least, I assume they are translations, and that's exactly the point; I can't tell, for sure.

I’ve read some translations to English and German where and I think they have been good mostly.
I think there is a problem especially with translations from English here in Sweden, because we tend to think our English is way better than it is and because so much is being translated and so quickly for subtitles and books.
There is even an old joke about ”Yes”, lisped the count, being translated to ”Ja”, läspade greven - ”Ja” not giving much opportunity to lisp.
Another example would be transtlating
”their”: In Swedish, you use different words referencing the subject of the sentence than when referencing the object. These days, a lot of hasty translations use ”deras” even for cases where ”sin” would be the correct form, to the point where you’ll even hear young native speakers getting it wrong when not translating.

 

[seela]

It’s interesting though, because it was released by the publisher [sekwa]. They are small, independent and focused on high quality translations, originally from French but now also from Nordic languages.
And it isn’t badly translated as you’ll sometimes see, with actual mistakes, it just…feels like I stumble on it somehow. That’s why I wondered if it is something that is actually there in the original and that I just don’t get.



No, I’m not.
I’ve only translated scientific or technical texts, but that is enough to inspire mad respect for those able to interpret and translate artistic qualities.
Sadly, I think translation work is underpaid and undervalued these days, to the point where it’s hard to do a good job in the fast moving popular culture business.

That said, I sometimes feel very differently about texts depending on the language. I’m fond of Canetti for example, but don’t feel quite the same about translations as I do about the original German and it’s not because the translation is bad, just different.
When I have looked for translations of poems or song lyrics to show someone, it has sometimes even been a kind of striking ”wait what, that wasn’t what I wanted to show you?!”- feeling.

It’s sometimes nice to read a book in the original and in translation because of those differences.

I think there is a problem especially with translations from English here in Sweden, because we tend to think our English is way better than it is and because so much is being translated and so quickly for subtitles and books.
There is even an old joke about ”Yes”, lisped the count, being translated to ”Ja”, läspade greven - ”Ja” not giving much opportunity to lisp.
Another example would be transtlating
”their”: In Swedish, you use different words referencing the subject of the sentence than when referencing the object. These days, a lot of hasty translations use ”deras” even for cases where ”sin” would be the correct form, to the point where you’ll even hear young native speakers getting it wrong when not translating.

Oh yeah, people definitely think their English is a lot bette than it is here, as well. And that kind of comes back to translations. Often people who declare they “only read books in the original language” (ie. 99.9% in English) miss the finer nuances and are only able to read the surface, because they’re not nearly as familiar with the culture or the vocabulary as a good translator is.
I’m not a huge fan of Harry Potter or the Discworld books, but the translations are so incredibly good and detailed. The way the place and character names, for example, are translated, gives a lot of insight into the world itself. They pick up on nuances that an average English user here would never pick up on, yet people complain because they go deeper into the meaning that the utter surface.
My favorite example of a translation people love to complain about is how the title of The Big Bang Theory is translated. The name of the show would literally translate back to English as “Foggy Glasses”. It is such an excellent translation that picks up on the sexual innuendo of “bang” (and trying to get laid was such a big part of the show especially early on) as well as the nerdy aspect. But people don’t get the innuendo part at all, they only see the surface meaning.

 

[IrisAlthea]

Often people who declare they “only read books in the original language” (ie. 99.9% in English) miss the finer nuances and are only able to read the surface, because they’re not nearly as familiar with the culture or the vocabulary as a good translator is.

True.
In Sweden I think the problem is aggravated by the lack of classical education to the point where even translations might not help.

What you wrote reminds me of my childhood edition of One Thousand and One Nights. I think it had been my grandmothers and it was beautifully leather bound and illustrated and also contained translators notes. One such note said that when this edition said that the wife ran to her husband and hugged and kissed him, it was changed from the original to protect western ideas about decency and decorum. I was soo deadly curious about the original!

I’m not a huge fan of Harry Potter or the Discworld books, but the translations are so incredibly good and detailed. The way the place and character names, for example, are translated, gives a lot of insight into the world itself.

I like both.
I think it is quite common to think that fantasy/scifi or children’s books need less care when translated. In Sweden the translation of Tolkien for example has been a very long and involved conflict though and as for Rawling and Pratchett, there are papers and reading guides written…

 

[seela]

True.
In Sweden I think the problem is aggravated by the lack of classical education to the point where even translations might not help.

Yep, same here.

(And just to be clear, I, too, read books in the original language and miss nuances because of the language. But also miss them in translations. Like everyone does.

I just hate it with a passion when people say that reading in the original language is somehow automatically better and more noble and offers more to the reader than reading a translation, when in reality they’re often missing oceans, but don’t even know it.)

What you wrote reminds me of my childhood edition of One Thousand and One Nights. I think it had been my grandmothers and it was beautifully leather bound and illustrated and also contained translators notes. One such note said that when this edition said that the wife ran to her husband and hugged and kissed him, it was changed from the original to protect western ideas about decency and decorum. I was soo deadly curious about the original!

Did you ever find out what the original said?

 

[IrisAlthea]

Did you ever find out what the original said?

Nah, I did ask the parental ones about it and how come the Arabic story would be more daring than westerners would tolerate, because it didn’t fit with my idea about how it would be. I got a long lecture on history and religion and while it was interesting and educational, it turned ot that they didn’t know about the original version either.

 

[twister947]

The Maze, Nelson DeMille

The Grail Bird, Tim Gallagher

 

[twister947]

The Winners, Fredrik Backman

Fine writing. It involved me as few others have.

 

[twister947]

I am rereading The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo, because Lisbeth Salander is just so fucking cool. Jack who?

 

[IrisAlthea]

I am rereading The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo, because Lisbeth Salander is just so fucking cool. Jack who?

Yes, she is written very well, I think.
I’ve thought about watching the movie with the kids. Haven’t read the books again because the fighting over Stieg Larssons inheritance gave me a reallybad taste in my mouth.
I haven’t read the later books written by Lagercrantz either for the same reason and because I think he does better when ghostwriting.

 

[twister947]

Long Bright River
Liz Moore

 

[seela]

Chernobyl: The History of a Nuclear Catastrophe by Serhii Plokh is absolutely top notch!

It’s very thorough regarding what all went wrong to allow for the catastrophe to happen in the first place. And a lot went wrong. Besides the horribleness of what happened, it also made me think about how hard it is to stand up for what you know is right. How easy it is to get lost in the hubris. How impossible it is to admit your own mistakes even when you’re forced to face them.

The parts that I found very interesting about the book were the bits that talked about how what happened in Chernobyl formed Ukraine and the USSR, too.

 

[IrisAlthea]

The parts that I found very interesting about the book were the bits that talked about how what happened in Chernobyl formed Ukraine and the USSR, too.

I don’t know if we have talked about this already, but there is a great book on the aftermath of Chernobyl in Belarus, that I really like. Since I know you like Kapuscinski too, you might find it interesting.
Vitryssland : 89 millimeter från Europa by Kjell Albin Abrahamsson is about the hisory of Belarus and why it is developing the way it is.
Abrahamsson was a foreign correspondent for Eastern Europe.

He wrote about Ukraine too:
UKRAINA YKPAÏHA – Öster om väst, väster om öst (2011)

 

[IrisAlthea]

I’m just finishing How Far the Light Reaches: A Life in Ten Sea Creatures by Sabrina Imbler, and I really like it.

It is ten short stories about themes in the life of the author, linked to stories and facts about sea creatures.

The excerpt below is how I found the book.

Excerpt (full short story) here:
https://www.theatlantic.com/science...pus-vigil-motherhood-eating-disorders/672340/

 

[seela]

I don’t know if we have talked about this already, but there is a great book on the aftermath of Chernobyl in Belarus, that I really like. Since I know you like Kapuscinski too, you might find it interesting.
Vitryssland : 89 millimeter från Europa by Kjell Albin Abrahamsson is about the hisory of Belarus and why it is developing the way it is.
Abrahamsson was a foreign correspondent for Eastern Europe.

He wrote about Ukraine too:
UKRAINA YKPAÏHA – Öster om väst, väster om öst (2011)

I read 89 millimeter before I went to Belarus. And I’ve read the Ukraine book too as part of my studies back in the day.

Both are really good suggestions for anybody who’s interested in that corner of the world!

 

[IrisAlthea]

I read 89 millimeter before I went to Belarus. And I’ve read the Ukraine book too as part of my studies back in the day.

Both are really good suggestions for anybody who’s interested in that corner of the world!

Should have guessed you woud have read it.

He had a nack for picking up and conveying the mood of a situation or a place.
I remember his voice on the radio, reporting from the Lenin shipyard and Jaruzelskis Poland when I was a kid.

 

[twister947]

The Professor's House.
Willa Cather

 

[seela]

The Professor's House.
Willa Cather

Willa Cather was a crossword answer last week and I was once again reminded that I still haven’t read anything by her. Maybe one day. Did you enjoy The Professor’s House? Would you recommend it?

I’ve been reading chick lit in Swedish. Kärleksdans i obalans is up next. It’s by Anna Jansson, the same that writes the gruesome Nordic noir detective stories. This series is about a hair salon in Visby and there’s nary a corpse to be found.

 

[twister947]

Willa Cather was a crossword answer last week and I was once again reminded that I still haven’t read anything by her. Maybe one day. Did you enjoy The Professor’s House? Would you recommend it?

I just finished it. Yes, and yes. I'll be reading more of her work.

It was written a hundred years ago...I enjoyed a pov that lacks the experience of the century past.

 

[seela]

It was written a hundred years ago...I enjoyed a pov that lacks the experience of the century past.

Yes, that’s always interesting to me as well when reading books from decades and centuries ago. People are people with all their relatable happy and sad moments, some things never change. But it’s often poignant how the lack of experience or knowledge of certain cultural concepts, technological advances or major historical events shapes the characters and the choices the writer makes.

In Last and First Men by Olaf Stapledon (great book btw) the writer imagines the future of humankind thousands, millions of years into the future, but somehow space travel seems so out of reach that it doesn’t occur in the book until centuries into the future. The book was written in 1930, and less than 40 years later man was in the moon.

I’ve always found this bit intriguing and a reminder of how difficult but important it is to imagine the future.