references of age of characters...and rejections.

[lovecraft68]

Well, Lovecraft, I understand where you're coming from about the "obscenity factor". Yeah, rape is a lot more"hardcore" than sex with a 17 year old. Morally, if you're gonna ban one, why not ban the other? But that doesn't necessarily mean that someone who strokes it to rape stories is sick or necessarily has anything wrong with them. I think just about everyone who has contributed to the more risque sections of Lit, including you with your incest stories, would be considered by mainstream society to be a sexual deviant. You like incest. Johnny down the street strokes to rape stories. Who's to say which is sicker? What I'm saying is, how can someone with a kink for incest criticize someone with one for rape? There's nothing wrong with anyone's fantasy and no one's fantasy is any "sicker" than anyone else's.

You have to look at the rule from Lit's point of view. It's (probably) not in place because the people who run the site have a personal vendetta against underage sex. Like you said, if that were the case, nonconsent/reluctane, incest and some other categories would probably not be on the site. It's probably for legal reasons. Authorities may crack down on depictions of underage sex and Lit doesn't want to get in any trouble.

That said, I don't have a problem with the rule, I just want to know that the rule is being applied fairly to every author. As in, there's no favoritism going on. I just got my first story rejected for having an underage character (technically, an underage character in an of-age character's body, but that's another story), and looking back I know I have read stories with characters as young as 14 engaging in sex acts on Lit.

Of course you are correct with incest being a "deviant" category and I am aware of that to the point that I am very selective with the people that I will tell about my writing (because I have 2 daughters and would never want that thought of me. for the record I have never and will never write daddy/daughter stories) But of course deviancy is in the eye of the beholder "gay male" is deviant to me BDSM is deviant to many. What i am trying to (and failing) is to point out the difference between a sexual fetish and a crime. Now of course incest is a crime but really more of the "moral variety" when incest is really a crime is when it is molestation father/daughter older brother/sister and guess what crime it is? Well it's Rape! 99% of the incest stories here are either romantic involvement between siblings or stroker grope and goes "sis looked hot why not?" but very few are non consensual
to go to the women having rape fantasies of course many do-my wife does and we have played it out- so a woman reading these stories and getting off is getting off to fantasy it's not happening to her and she would never want it to. There are many "vanilla" non consent stories where the woman does get into it, secretly wanted it, or we find out it was a harmless sex game. those stories to me are not non consent it's role playing or reluctance. And these stories many times get blasted by the hardcore non consent fans. I am speaking of the pure unwatered down hard core rape stories women held down and fucked while screaming and crying. A woman may still get off reading them for the aforementioned reasons but i am telling you that the men who get off to it are the type that will potentially do it someday. I have had fantasies of you know "giving some snotty bitch what she needs" but they are passing thoughts not obsession or fetish. Going back to some psych classes i took some years ago I can tell you that the average guy with hardcore rape fantasies has a dominating wife or girlfriend that runs him and he can't stand up for himself or had that type of mother figure, or sometimes they are socially inept or perhaps unattractive or maybe even a little "slow" something that would trigger them not to be able to relate to or "score" with women. It's frustrating, that frustration turns to anger which turns to seeing women as "whores" who want it whether they admit it or not. These stories should never be blamed for pushing someone to do that just like Ozzy Osbourne's music should never be blamed for suicide but often people look to things like that as "triggers" Rapists often have tons of rape pornography in their household (go ahead and say it child molesters have tons of kiddie porn and you are correct) once again I am saying i have no desire to write/read about 13 year olds but I just look at "reality" people lose it at 16 most first times are younger than 18 most incest would be before 18 I mean a brother sister by 18 usually don;t even live together anymore. My point here is that the site is so paranoid you cannot even write non sexual scenes if they are under 18 which in a "non stroker" series is a big deal because it would be nice to show a history. I had a story tossed because I wrote the sister at 18 would lie down in her brothers bed and hold him if he had terrible nightmares fully dressed non sexual and it got the boot. I wasn't going for sex I was going for this led to sex. I do not write grope and go in my stories (much like the author candlelight062) I always have a build up and a way to "justify" the incest by either giving them emotional issues, or in my current series they were separated for ten years and did not grow up together. For me underage is the past to develop a character but even that is not allowed. Consensual under age sex is not a crime Rape is. Age of consent in many states has been lowered to 16 it is no longer statutory rape for an 18 year old with a 16 year old. Incest is actually becoming legal in some parts of Europe. Rape is a crime in every city in every country in the world. In closing my bottom line is you want to write rape stories? go for it I don't have to read them. Want to stroke to rape stories? go ahead just stay the fuck away from my daughters. I think it's a sick category but that's my opinion bottom line is you got this bullshit on the site and no one can screw at 17 I think as you stated there is some favoritism going on or as you also stated a personal vendetta. Debates like this generally are a waste of time as nothing one party will say will change the mind of the other. Rape is a crime no other "fetish" on this site from BDSM to transexuals is. All I'm saying is if the yare going to take a "moral stance" then they should really take a good look around because there is a far cry from "kink" to criminal behavior.

 

[Darkniciad]

All I'm saying is if the yare going to take a "moral stance" then they should really take a good look around because there is a far cry from "kink" to criminal behavior.

Once again:

I've always believed that words are just words. I don't put fiction in the same class as reality - if it was, then war novels and murder mysteries would be appalling. I've also been a teen, and know that teens are sexual beings. We're not saying that no one under 18 has ever had any sexual thoughts. We know that most people lose their virginity under the age of 18. I know I did.

I know it's an inconvenience for writers at times, but I want you to know that our over-18 policy is not born out of some moral nor legal standard (though we are staunchly against pedophilia). It is there to keep us out of unnecessary trouble. No matter where we draw the line, there will be people who think it unfair. However, as we are not ready to publish stories involving children, we must draw a line. Minors in the US are those under the age of 18, so that's the safest line to draw. If we were in GB, the age would probably be 16...and those in countries where 12 is the legal age of consent might find THAT constraining.

Here in the US, the age issue is a touchier deal than rape or anything else. Technically, fiction featuring under age sex is perfectly legal - as is fiction which features murder or rape - but those currently "in power" would like to make such fiction (as well as all adult material) illegal. A man was recently put in jail for writing fictitious stories about underage children IN HIS PRIVATE JOURNAL. The man was on parole, but it still sets a very bad legal precedent. Like I said, we feel the need to draw the line somewhere, and 18 just makes the most sense for us in many ways.

Search for "convicted for porn" and tell me what you find? 99% of the google hits will be for "child porn" which is defined as under 18 in the U.S., and there is precedent for text only brushes with the law -- one of which Laurel cites in her post explaining the reason for the rule.

The rule is in place to protect the site -- not from some moral stance, or to personally inconvenience you.

 

[lovecraft68]

Once again:



Search for "convicted for porn" and tell me what you find? 99% of the google hits will be for "child porn" which is defined as under 18 in the U.S., and there is precedent for text only brushes with the law -- one of which Laurel cites in her post explaining the reason for the rule.

The rule is in place to protect the site -- not from some moral stance, or to personally inconvenience you.

The pedophile stuff is usually porn involving kids as in kids not 16 but under 10 like not even sexually developed that is a serious sickness that goes beyond reading a story of a couple of 16 years olds fooling around. 16 is too old for those people (how much of that stuff is wandering around the Vatican this oh so bitter against the Catholics pagan wonders out loud)

So when is someone going to take 15 and pregnant off the air would be my next question. Or is she pregnant through immaculate conception. It does fall under specifically targeting porn as obviously underage as well as rape and every other crime run rampant in regular fiction. Now how is porn not fiction I wonder? I mean we make this shit up don't we? Just another sign that this country stands for nothing but it's own hypocrisy. Oh well back to writing. Sad thing is most of my series takes place with the "siblings" in their 30's the underage rule doesn't even overtly really effect me. I just get caught up in the "what's next" like Amazon booting under age and now targeting BDSM how much longer before even "vanilla" erotica becomes the target. It sounds cheesy but check out the movie V for Vendetta we're getting there.
On one closing note I do not hold the operators of this site responsible they are obeying rules put into place by disgusting hypocrites who point fingers at sinners while they drink all day, fuck little boys and probably practice necrophila while going to church every Sunday and asking for forgiveness.
This is why I love being a pagan no expectations. no rules sets a low bar and you can't be accused of being a hypocrite. Okay I am done now. I need to go into my e-mails where my editor sent me a story he wrote about 2 14 year olds having sex. I only skimmed it and told him he's nuts if he thinks he can do anything with it. But I better get if off my computer before I get locked up.

 

[AsylumSeeker]

I was a juror on a trial recently (within the past couple of years). A 43 y/o uncle raping/sodomizing his 5 y/o niece. The pictures and movies we were forced to watch still disgust me and give me nightmares. You will not find me to be an ally to pushing for an under-than-18 rule.

I have written nearly 300 stories here at Lit (have e-published some and removed them from the site so my total now reflects 250). The point being is that it's no hardship to write all characters to be 18 or older. Sure, I have had some reader feedback criticizing me for writing about characters "first learning" about sex at 18, but "dem's the rules!"

 

[racheldearest]

Want to stroke to rape stories? go ahead just stay the fuck away from my daughters. I think it's a sick category but that's my opinion

Wait a minute. I thought you were okay with women who fantasized about rape. And what kind of thoughts are these "giving it to some snotty bitch"? Do they arouse you? Are you aroused by the rape roleplay with your wife? Something isn't quite adding up here. I personally don't fantasize about rape, but I have written some Nonconsent/reluctance stories. If I was a parent and I found out my husband had a thing for incest, I would be wary of him being near our daughters!

Ahh, oh well, no need to beat a dead horse. I guess we all understand each others' points of view and the fact that the rule is probably never going to change.

 

[lovecraft68]

Wait a minute. I thought you were okay with women who fantasized about rape. And what kind of thoughts are these "giving it to some snotty bitch"? Do they arouse you? Are you aroused by the rape roleplay with your wife? Something isn't quite adding up here. I personally don't fantasize about rape, but I have written some Nonconsent/reluctance stories. If I was a parent and I found out my husband had a thing for incest, I would be wary of him being near our daughters!

Ahh, oh well, no need to beat a dead horse. I guess we all understand each others' points of view and the fact that the rule is probably never going to change.

There is a far cry between a role play with a partner of 10 years and a brutal assault on a woman. "the "snotty bitch" remark is a thought many men have had but would never act upon it just like the women who fantasize about being raped would never want it to happen. My comments are aimed strictly at the non fantasy, non roleplaying, flat out rape stories and the guys who truly get off on them. Your right this could go on forever our opinions vary one persons fantasy is anothers "sickness" good luck with your stories.

 

[estragon]

The Rules Are The Rules Are The Rules

And so I threw away my one fetish story, because it involved the underwear of an underage person, even though the person herself was never less than 20 miles away from where the sexual activity took place and was totally unaware of it. After it got bounced by Laurel, I wouldn't publish it on sites like asstr, because I won't have anything I write come within a kilometer of the filth they publish (although, as my man Francois Marie Arouet remarked, I will defend to the death their right to publish it, and the right of anyone, however degraded, to read it). If Literotica has a certain atmosphere of unreality about that particular characteristic, it also has some of the best erotic writing going. We all have our favorites, who do quite nicely with persons over the age of 18 years. So press on, says I!

 

[palisa]

Damn, even the champagne has to be 18 or older? Good thing I'm drinking 20-year Scotch!

Ya beat me to it!

 

[AsylumSeeker]

Ya beat me to it!

Sorry, but the opening was there and I had to take it. Just ask the guys where I work, lol.

One thing that I don't understand is when, unfortunately, adults take sexual advantage of children. Saw a news report a few days ago where they were reporting that a female teacher was having sexual relations "with a child under eighteen". Is there a child "over" eighteen?

 

[AsylumSeeker]

I'm worn out reading this thread almost as much as mowing and pulling weeds.

<wiping dirt off knees>

I don't care how much one complains, but 18 is the age. I might disagree but dem's the rules. I write incest too. Not that I engage or approve, which I firmly do not, as it destroys families. So you might ask why, and it's because people want this.

I started out writing erotic horror and celeb and quickly became disillusioned, had a few votes one could place on one hand. An author recommended incest and I was hooked to the attention. Lots of votes and quickly. A lure I could not ignore.

I'm having second thoughts now. If one can't take pride in what they create, then why create it?

 

[ErosArtist]

Wow.

I had no idea this thread was still buckin' along. Thanks for all the replies and input.

However, for the foreseeable future, it's a moot point.

My work has been lost. First drafts, drafts in revisions, finals; gone. Some images too. Everything was stored on two external hard-drives; one primary, the other back-up. Some minor drafts are still on my laptop HD, but the major stuff is in the abyss.

The drives were stolen, along with the laptop, when my car was broken into this past weekend. Kudos to the local cops, as everything's been recovered, (the idiots tried to pawn them, using their real names and addresses), and the mongrel bastards arrested, charged, and sitting jail. However, the external drives are toast. My guess is they were wailed on with a hammer (that's how they look) in frustration when they couldn't unlock them. They also tried to magnetize the laptop; no reason not to think they did the same to the externals. Regardless, they've failed mechanically and are useless.

Remarkably, the laptop seems functional. The only thing not recovered was my SanDisk card reader. Cheap enough to replace.

Thank god for insurance - and lessons learned about off-site back-up!

 

[bambi33]

There is no such thing as rejection people. It's just a made up thing and you can live without even needing to feel it. It's actually a good thing for you because it forces change.