Sadism vs. Masochism

[graceanne]

Posts like this are why i Netzach.

Yeah, me too.

 

[catalina_francisco]

If I wanted to train something I'd get a dog.

Whacking someone is a reward in my house, not a punishment. A punishment is a denial of pleasures and privileges, works fabulously well. It's also very rare.

LOL, I don't tend to think of training in these terms and can see the purpose of it, but then I might also put a different meaning to it. As ADE says, she doesn't go into subspace anymore, which I would see as part of training in a way as it was something that did happen in earlier days of their relationship...it doesn't mean there was anything wrong with it, just that it is not something JM desires her to do for the same reasons F is not about to encourage me to do the subspace thing. I don't equate training where a sub/slave is concerned to that of a dog or cat, though there can be similarities in some circumstances...rather I see it as finding someone compatible, and then refining it to the submissive learning how the Domionant wants things done, what they want, when, or even if they want x,y,z, etc. As no 2 people are the same, Dominants included, it is almost impossible to expect a person to know 100% of what is expected and how in each particular relationship without being told, guided, and instructed....training IOW's in the D/s dynamic IMHO.

Catalina

 

[Joe Schmoe]

Quite a few people seem to understand the need or desire for pain. Anything from a little nibble all the way to the extreme.

It also seems that quite a few of the same people harbor a loathing for sadists.

Causing pain, the desire or need to cause pain must be the ultimate taboo.

I am just taking a generalized stab at the perspective of mainstream in all of this.

I think more people loathe sadists over masochists because sadists are viewed as taking advantage of the masochistic tendencies in others. Masochists may be seen as victims because they tend to make the 'bad choice' of putting themselves into situations where sadists will exploit them ala the battered woman that keeps cycling through abusive partners. The women tends to be pitied more often than held accountable for her choices.

When I used to look for the reasons or meanings behind the enjoyment of sadistic activities in myself I found I befuddled myself even more. I say this because I not only find it stimulating to be the "villian" or "cruel Master" at times, I am also drawn to the contradiction of being the hero and/or protector. Safeguarding or snatching the "damsel in distress" from the jaws of harm. None of this is dwelled upon, focused on or is the driving means behind who I am, they develop in the course of situations. Not every woman I come across do I want to inflict pain or be her guardian just like not every woman I want to dominate. There is something passed from one to the other that triggers these responses and only then do they come up in thoughts, feelings, desires and sometimes actions.

Long ago I have given up trying to figure out the why's with me behind all of this. I have come to realize it was just beyond me to fathom. Far too deep rooted to figure out how the seed was planted in the first place. There are just too many underlying factors to be able to sort them all out. It is no different than planting the seed, it still needs more than that to grow and bear fruit. Soil, sun, water and wind. So somewhere it was planted but over the course of time the other needed elements came into play aiding in the manifestation of what I now enjoy.

 

[AngelicAssassin]

Thanks Q-BoU

If I wanted to train something I'd get a dog.

Whacking someone is a reward in my house, not a punishment. A punishment is a denial of pleasures and privileges, works fabulously well. It's also very rare.

Out of curiosity, how many times (hubby aside) would you allow an "oops" with subsequent isolation or denial before you kicked the offender to the curb?

And here's my sadistic exercise for the day. Click me. If it were real, the poor victim would have lowered self-esteem (based on the arbitrary judging) and a frozen fingertip before they finished.

 

[Netzach]

Depends on the understandings agreements and degree of prior training. The slave I have was very well trained in the early 80's, has his head screwed on quite well in terms of what his role is. There is not and will not be a serious "oops."

I guess it's subjective. If I start hearing myelf repeating myself a lot and come to the conclusion I'm not somehow failing to get my point across through bad communication, the answer is "not many times."

But then there's the "pet" relationship, where it can pee all over the place and you still would not dream of giving it up, you just try to reassure it so it doesn't keep marking. I'm kind of a sucker when it comes to pets.

 

[AngelicAssassin]

If I start hearing myself repeating myself a lot and come to the conclusion I'm not somehow failing to get my point across through bad communication, the answer is "not many times."

Thank you for highlighting both bad communication, and intolerance for crossing the line once too often.

 

[RJMasters]

Succinct and to the point. I love it. Things work this way in our house as well.

One of the things I love about him is he has absolutely zero confusion about his sadism. He loves hurting me. He has no interest in me zoning off into subspace and missing all the hurty parts. He'll snap me back to reality if I even try. I've come to love being present in my pain, and adore him for every stroke, whack, punch, lash, whatever.

I don't want a sadist with apologies. I want one who revels in hurting me.

~Anelize

Damn just damn!

 

[dirtydingoe]

I gotta admit. i love sseing a girl in my control. Seeing her bend to my will using her as i see fit. her watery eyes as she stares at me seeing the darknes in mine. letting her know that the pain will not stop untill i want it to. every time she crys in pain its like you can feel the energy of pleasure running through your body. something like this just causes you to be more primal and much more dark. its a very powerful feeling. gotta love it...

 

[Mike260]

Perhaps a bit off topic. But when I was younger I was into sadism. Biting. Pinching. Really hard ass-fucking.

Then, over time, I gradually lost interest in it.

Until I got into masochism.

And realized, I think, that what I liked about sadism was identifying with the person I was hurting.

 

[BeachGurl2]

I always place a high value on your advice but I want to hear from Francisco. The hunger I feel goes beyond just a sexual desire to cause a little pain for pleasure. When I am with a woman I can smell her. I sense the heat of her skin and there is an urge to take her in my mouth and taste her, to consume some part of her that God never meant for me to take. It's not like the eating of flesh but more like the absorbing of her spirit. I crave to sense and to taste and to consume her. I don't mind if it is the salt off of her skin that I'm tasting. I adore the cannibalistic taboo of taking her menstrual blood into me or her blood in general. Menstrual is special though as it was meant as the creation of life.

I view it as something akin to what a hummingbird does to a flower by feasting on its nectar. Taking the life force of the flower into its body and making that it's own posession. Merely tasting her pussy is an incredible thing on it's own and I can't get enough of that but that life energy, just to take a sample on your tongue is magical. The same hunger is present when any part of her body is in my mouth, I can feel the flesh and blood and bone under my teeth and a part of me wants to eat her. Not to kill or maim her of course but there is a hunger that can be satisfied by having her cum in my mouth and ingesting that most special part of her.

I'm talking about the very root of my sadism. The ravenous hunger for female flesh.

There is also a part of me that can feed from her fear and her pain and her confusion. The daddy part of me is stronger and I want her to be healthy and happy and focused. I can get what I crave from her body in ways that please both of us. There is still that cannibal within me though. What I really want is a woman who understands my hunger and who can feed me in ways that only she can. A woman who knows what it is that I'm taking from her body. A woman that is giving it to me for our mutual pleasure.

I want a woman who is as sick as me.

Up until that last line, I think what you wrote was incredibly beautiful. Why does the way you feel about being a sadist have to be considered sick? Just because it doesn't conform to some norm? And who decided what the norm is anyway - ugh, pet peeve here? I think for me the difference between a beautiful expression of your sadism and a sick one would be the willingness of your partner. Are you choosing partners at random who have no say in their reception of the pain you want to inflict? I don't think that's what you're doing - at least that's not the impression I've gotten from your writings. So it would seem that my need to feel that pain and your need to inflict it would negate any "sickness" involved. Just my rambling 2 cents, anyway.

 

[Netzach]

Perhaps a bit off topic. But when I was younger I was into sadism. Biting. Pinching. Really hard ass-fucking.

Then, over time, I gradually lost interest in it.

Until I got into masochism.

And realized, I think, that what I liked about sadism was identifying with the person I was hurting.

Same only opposite.

Funny how that goes sometimes.