Subs NEED, Doms ??????

[entitled]

Oy! Go awy for a little bit and come back to all these responses more or less saying I don't know what I'm talking about. Truth be told, I don't. At least I don't know what I'm talking about when it comes to all of you.

I have read all the responses and thought on them, and decided that I'm still right. In a way. All of you are also right, in a way. This is one of those arguements that will never end if we choose to keep on about it - something like the one about why people cheat on their significant others.

Maybe there is a developed "need" that comes with being in the lifestyle or using the lifestyle to fill some void in a person's life. To me that's still a want. As tropix said, this want can become strong enough to be counted as an addiction. The addiction is seen as a need, though it can be slowly taken from a person's life, making it just another want - which is what it started out as.

I didn't necessarily mean to say that Dom/mes are that much smarter than subs (I've run into quite a few that are dumb as a post) but many of those that I talk to realize that their feelings on the subject are a matter of wants. Many of the subs rationalize these wants as needs to keep from feeling guilty about wanting to be in the lifestyle. I'm plenty guilty of doing the same thing for a time. Then I kicked myself in the butt, decided that the world and it's views can more or less go fuck itself, and got over it.

Netzach said:

Putting needs at the most basic level is something I think people....women especially, hate to say it....have been encouraged to do throughout long and grim centuries.

This is something I find myself doing much more than I probably should. It's what I did in my first post on this thread. Maybe it's part of my upbringing - if it wasn't food, drink, or shelter it wasn't a need - but what was put into my brain as a child stays there and has been confirmed over the past few years. Everything can be boiled down to the basics. They will be, in my mind. The BDSM lifestyle is not a basic need, even if procreation is, and therefore is a want, IMO. It can be a strong want, but it IS a want.

 

[SweetDommes]

Just a couple of grouchy cents worth, but imho the subs that say they need these things really need to get a grip on reality.

I am a submissive person. That's just what comes naturally to me. It does not mean that I need to be abused to feel good, or that I need to be controlled. It really helps sometimes, but it is not an actual physical or mental necessity. It never has been.

Each and every person should be able to more or less take care of his/herself in a fairly independent manner. If they can't, they really have no business indulging in the lifestyle. They won't be able to make good decisions about relationships, limits, etc. and will end up causing somebody to be injured. Having certain things as absolute "needs" or necessities is very much a deterrent to being able to take care of themselves.

Maybe the Dom/mes know this and are able to admit to themselves that these things are NOT actual needs. They are wants. Maybe that's why you don't hear them saying that they are needs. They simply know better.

Saying that it is a need does not mean that it is a requirement for life. I need some things (like chocolate, Mt. Dew, etc) but I can live without them.... I do feel a need to dominate - domination is a natural thing for me, I can live without it, but I feel more complete when our boy is here for me to control, and I know that Holly feels the same. I also know that our boy lived more years than he cares to think about without domination. He can live without it, but he does need it, and he feels that need when we aren't together. It's along the lines of a person without a job - a teacher can say that he/she is a teacher, but without students to teach, it's just words. Without a boy to dominate, I can't be much of a Dominant - I can say that I am dominant, I can act dominant to people, but I do not feel that I am truly being dominant without my submissive.

If you can say that you don't need to submit, that's fine, but don't look down on everyone who says that they do.

-Miss Karen

 

[NCShin]

great input from everyone...

I'm still on the fence on this. I'm not sure that it's a need for me or not.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Maybe there is a developed "need" that comes with being in the lifestyle or using the lifestyle to fill some void in a person's life. To me that's still a want. As tropix said, this want can become strong enough to be counted as an addiction. The addiction is seen as a need, though it can be slowly taken from a person's life, making it just another want - which is what it started out as.

Not my take on it in my life. I had a life which was so full and happy there weren't enough hours in a day, but I was aware that there was something which could bring me more joy, more peace, and a realisation of living life the way I was going to be happiest and most secure in all ways. So it wasn't filling an empty void so to speak as that seems to me to be saying there could be a variety of things used to fill that void which is not so.

As to becoming an addiction so then seen as a need, that doesn't fit either for me as I had never had any experience with the lifestyle when I realised it was where my future lay to the point I made it my number one focus. I had long had desires to live the lifestyle in the extreme, but had not experienced so much as a spanking when I began my search with a notion of what I needed..so I wasn't addicted and therefore needing to feed that addiction. Is just the way I am and why I had fantasies and dreams of such a lif from early childhood.

Catalina

 

[Quint]

I'm now thinking about Maslow's Pyramid of human needs. BDSM isn't food or shelter or even necessarily acceptance, but it IS self-actualization for me. It comes higher on the pyramid and is certainly optional but I wouldn't say that I don't have that need. There's only so far that a person can live as an animal.

And I certainly wouldn't say you don't know what you're talking about, even with regards to my life and my relationships---I just think we're disagreeing about what constitutes a "need," and the effect having a "need" does to a person. I don't think I get unreasonable when I'm hungry. And I've never felt guilty about craving these particular things or even with being dissatisfied with anything else, so I don't think I ever use "need" as my scapegoat, though I can see how it is possible. Very much a believer in the "I can't overcome/change/do it/etc" fallacy.

 

[SweetDommes]

I'm now thinking about Maslow's Pyramid of human needs. BDSM isn't food or shelter or even necessarily acceptance, but it IS self-actualization for me. It comes higher on the pyramid and is certainly optional but I wouldn't say that I don't have that need. There's only so far that a person can live as an animal.

That's what I was thinking of, but I couldn't remember which developmental theorist did it. I agree with you totally - it isn't something that you need for survival, but it IS a need.

 

[catalina_francisco]

That's what I was thinking of, but I couldn't remember which developmental theorist did it. I agree with you totally - it isn't something that you need for survival, but it IS a need.

And it depends on which theories you read and believe as many developmental psychologists consider love and relationships as survival needs. Experiments have shown that those who are starved of the type love they need, begin to suffer in a variety of ways, some which can lower immune systems, and can create a loss of will to live....so in that sense BDSM for those of us who have tried it both ways and find this is the one which provides us with the impetus to grow and survive may identify it as a survival need.

Catalina

 

[AngelicAssassin]

Need versus want

... I want ...

... The BDSM lifestyle is not a basic need, even if procreation is, and therefore is a want, IMO. It can be a strong want, but it IS a want.

Chuckling reading the whole thread. Procreation isn't an individual need. Those that don't have children by desire, or circumstance lead healthy and productive lives. The species overall needs procreation for the species to continue, although the gene pool could use a good cleaning now and then.

Interesting that gene combinations include the term "dominant."

i'll simply agree with Mistress Tae.

i want dammit!

 

[MissTaken]

A dear friend of mine shared his culture's belief that we all need balance in our lives in order to find peace...perhaps self actualization as put forth by Maslow?

D/s brings balance to mine.

I think that there is much concern on this thread over people saying "I need..."

If you expand the statement, as most will do and have done here to be, "I need______ in order to _______" it puts the original question into perspective.

A Dominant may not need D/s to survive, but may need Dominance in order to feel peace, happiness or fully realize the benefits of a relationship. The same for submissives.

I do need D/s in order to feel peace and happiness. Like pet discussed, I also need a certain balance of activity to meet my maso needs and I do need to Dominante. For me, the balance is weighted more on the Dominant side, with maso topping!

As ADR said, play partners do not complete me, help me find peace or bring me anything more than a momentary release into fantasy land.

And Des nailed my feelings quite well. When I don't have these things in my life, it is that itch you can't scratch.