Vampire - Non-Human/ Erotic Horror - HELP?

[Trudy_Antone]

*****

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Thanks everyone for weighing in,

And Elfin, regarding ego... surely none of us would be here posting stories if it weren't for ego? It takes a certain amount of ego and balls to put yourself out there - albeit a lot easier when we're hidden behind our nom de plumes. Do people write for themselves or for their readers? How about writing for the sake of expression whilst keeping in mind the readers? If you specifically write for readers, how can there be any heart in it? Serious question.

An interesting question. However small the audience you are aiming at, a writer writes to be read. Don't fall into the trap that any serious writer writes for the sake of expression. Shakespeare wrote to please the Queen and earn a buck, Dickens got paid per hundred words. Writing is down in the trenches.

Another interesting point re: Literotica thrown out by Selena Kitt (a goddess and brilliant writer IMO) that good writing doesn't necessarily equate to popularity. I would rather be the former than the latter, but I guess achieving both is the pinnacle.

Agree totally. Dan Brown and Stephen King don't usually provide good writing, but they won't starve in this lifetime or the next. Good writing is an amorphous concept but it still demands discipline and popularity, albeit in a smaller pond.

If you follow Sir Twat's egotistical bile, you will be writing unreadable stuff in years to come. If you want to become a good writer, work hard at the basics, learn the craft and slowly spread your wings. Just ask sir T if he gave you the courtesy of reading your story. I know the answer.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Here's the definition I found:

Verb

to procure

1. To acquire or obtain an item or service, sometimes rare, usually by extra effort.

Usage seems perfectly acceptable here.

'Bundle' is also fine. It's a neat shortcut to describe what it looks like from the POV of the hunter character.

I agree with the 'incoherent ramble' comment.

Yes, of course, all major industrial companies have 'procurement departments' to use care and skill to acquire THINGS - goods or services (intangibles) The OED gives that as a main meaning. My point was that the supposed baby is a human being and then 'procure' kicks in with the sexual context because you can only 'procure' people in the pimp sense. HR departments aren't called 'procurement resources'.

If the phrase had been, ‘looked like a bundle’, I’d agree with you. For me, the definitive grates and I get a bit edgy with the connotations – just me I guess.

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

Yes, of course, all major industrial companies have 'procurement departments' to use care and skill to acquire THINGS - goods or services (intangibles) The OED gives that as a main meaning. My point was that the supposed baby is a human being and then 'procure' kicks in with the sexual context because you can only 'procure' people in the pimp sense. HR departments aren't called 'procurement resources'.

If the phrase had been, ‘looked like a bundle’, I’d agree with you. For me, the definitive grates and I get a bit edgy with the connotations – just me I guess.

No, not just you El. The writing is imprecise using word choices that carry confusing connotations. Just looking at the word "Procure", Websters give the general meaning of gaining something through careful purchase, but also has it as another meaning for pandering prostitution.

"Bundle" in Dictionary.com as a noun or object means a group of objects packaged together. The active word "group" means the word was misused in any sense.

 

[sr71plt]

If you follow Sir Twat's egotistical bile, you will be writing unreadable stuff in years to come.

That would be, of course, unless Truant wanted to take example into consideration. But then why would a writer here want to do that when he/she has self-annointed, anal-retentive, nonwriting critics around to beat up on her/him?

In fact, let's see what Truant could look forward to in terms of readability in following one of us. If you go to the AllRomanceEbooks erotica distribution site today, you'll see that of 516 total short story anthologies on the market, I have 5 short story anthologies in the top 50--#s 2, 8, 35, 40, 45. These include anthologies that are GM, Straight, and Menage. These are readers voting with their money.

Your turn . . .

Actual facts can be so inconvenient, can't they? Innuendo is so much easier to toss out.

 

[manyeyedhydra]

No, not just you El. The writing is imprecise using word choices that carry confusing connotations. Just looking at the word "Procure", Websters give the general meaning of gaining something through careful purchase, but also has it as another meaning for pandering prostitution.

I dunno. Imprecise word choices can be good at conveying additional meanings.

Bundle - For me created an image of the vampire feeding on something wrapped in rags. We assume it's a baby, but it turns out not to be. Confusion is good here as the scene is not what it appears.

Procured - For me implies a lack of humanity in the watcher. It's a bloodless word when someone else would use a more emotive verb. Also raises the disturbing connotation that she might have actually bought the baby from an intermediary rather than snatched it herself.

It can also go horribly wrong. I did find the rest of the chapter a real slog to get through.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

That would be, of course, unless Truant wanted to take example into consideration. But then why would a writer here want to do that when he/she has self-annointed, anal-retentive, nonwriting critics around to beat up on her/him?

In fact, let's see what Truant could look forward to in terms of readability in following one of us. If you go to the AllRomanceEbooks erotica distribution site today, you'll see that of 516 total short story anthologies on the market, I have 5 short story anthologies in the top 50--#s 2, 8, 35, 40, 45. These include anthologies that are GM, Straight, and Menage. These are readers voting with their money.

Your turn . . .

Actual facts can be so inconvenient, can't they? Innuendo is so much easier to toss out.

No, innuendo is not my style. You are an arrogant, opinionated, second-rate writer, who takes pleasure in crapping on a forum that is ostensibly 'writing skills and self-promotion 101' . We don't do 'comma splices', the uses of the subjunctive, and we read stories before commenting - more than you can be bothered with in your cloud of superiority.

If you want to persist in telling new and enthusiastic writers that they should ignore (or not learn) the basics of fiction writing I will be convinced of your stupidity and lack of understanding.

 

[sr71plt]

I don't tell anyone to ignore the basics of fiction writing, Elfin. I just tell them they can ignore some of your half-baked silly notions of the basics of fiction writing. And I will continue doing so.

And after I've done so, it's entirely up the writer to decide which direction they want to go in.

Are you still operating under the inane notion that you are some sort of authority on either writing erotica or basic writing and grammar skills--against next to no evidence that you are?

Hey, you didn't respond to my question how your short stories are doing in the market place in comparison to mine--not something I brought up but that you brought up by attacking my marketability.

Wander over to Fictionwise and take a look at the current best-sellers list for Gay-Lesbian. Oh, look #10 out of 1,093 is one of my short story anthologies.

Just the facts, lady, just the facts.

 

[sr71plt]

By the way, Elfin and Jenny, you might step out of your box and read the thread on 3rd versus 1st person over on the AH. You would learn something, I think, if any itty bitty part of your minds were open to what real fiction writing is about.

 

[Skorpion49]

No such thing as bad publicity?

Well at least TruantOne has received some attention from the "Gurus" though not all of it flattering it seems. I don't suppose my opinions will carry any weight with the "elite" but a forum is for all to be heard. This site I thought was for amateurs - let's say horny amateurs - for me the erotica is more of a reason to be here than the literature. A place for ideas too - to discover or rediscover all things sexual. And remind oneself that if I'm a pervert, I'm not the only one...

Who has not experienced the sense of abandon in the sexual act, the need to have someone, whatever the cost - perhaps even never seeing a dawn again? Will Liam tame and redeem Grace or will she seduce him to the dark side? In return for immortality and a life of hot sex? Hmm. Tricky!

And who cannot help but feel a bit sorry for the vampires - the rest of us are allowed to satisfy our hungers in the name of survival...

The combination of danger, pain, lust and distrust is very appealing in this story. And as the author promises even more sex in the next installment, I for one am going to read it, and urge others to do so, whatever the "literati" say!

 

[Trudy_Antone]

Thanks Skorpion,

Any merit or meaning found in my incoherent ramblings is better than none! Personally, I think the second and third chapter are better than the first (as reflected in the scores, the first is hovering at 4.53, the second is at 4.74, the third in between). Maybe people just like reading about blow jobs? Perhaps I should forget the story and keep writing penile oral pleasure over and over and over again...

Neh, bored already...

Off to write
x

 

[elfin_odalisque]

I don't tell anyone to ignore the basics of fiction writing, Elfin. I just tell them they can ignore some of your half-baked silly notions of the basics of fiction writing. And I will continue doing so.

And after I've done so, it's entirely up the writer to decide which direction they want to go in.

Are you still operating under the inane notion that you are some sort of authority on either writing erotica or basic writing and grammar skills--against next to no evidence that you are?

Hey, you didn't respond to my question how your short stories are doing in the market place in comparison to mine--not something I brought up but that you brought up by attacking my marketability.

Wander over to Fictionwise and take a look at the current best-sellers list for Gay-Lesbian. Oh, look #10 out of 1,093 is one of my short story anthologies.

Just the facts, lady, just the facts.

You are the biggest cretin on lit. Scouries just wades about in the primeval swamp but you are a thousand times more destructive to Lit than that neanderthal.

You have been on courses, you have studied to ass-numbingly futility the relevance of semi-colons, comma splices and the immediacy of first person narrative.

The simple reason you make BFW seem like an intellectual is that you seem to have no idea of where we all set off in an adventure of creative writing. I want to drive a Porsche in the Indy 500. Your response is 'Just go for it'. I'd kill myself.

Just accept there is a learning curve and it will take us mortals some time before Dan Brown stops calling you and PM's us to talk about his use of independent clauses.

You do serious damage here and I wish you'd take your ego and unpleasantness away. You hijack so many threads here of guys just wanting to get some steer towards making their next post more popular. Your over-arching vanity is not pleasant.

 

[sr71plt]

Umm, OK. I do get that part about you not being pleased, Elfin.

And I don't mind you exhibiting as you are at all.

But I'll continue to work on bringing balance to the arm-chair critic flimflamming you're bringing to the board.

Read the thread on 1st person vs 3rd person on the AH yet--or, on that ole what's "popular" front, come up with some recent examples of how well your own example-providing writing is doing in the marketplace?

 

[_Lynn_]

You are the biggest cretin on lit. Scouries just wades about in the primeval swamp but you are a thousand times more destructive to Lit than that neanderthal.

You have been on courses, you have studied to ass-numbingly futility the relevance of semi-colons, comma splices and the immediacy of first person narrative.

The simple reason you make BFW seem like an intellectual is that you seem to have no idea of where we all set off in an adventure of creative writing. I want to drive a Porsche in the Indy 500. Your response is 'Just go for it'. I'd kill myself.

Just accept there is a learning curve and it will take us mortals some time before Dan Brown stops calling you and PM's us to talk about his use of independent clauses.

You do serious damage here and I wish you'd take your ego and unpleasantness away. You hijack so many threads here of guys just wanting to get some steer towards making their next post more popular. Your over-arching vanity is not pleasant.

Though I agree at times with some of the feedback you offer others, this is tiring. So you don't like sr. So what? He has as much right to voice his opinion as anyone else does. An author has the right to follow or ignore any advice they receive. I don't see how writers will benefit from your repetitive voicing of your opinion about another author. We're supposed to be adults here. Act like one and let it go.

Just my opinion.

 

[sr71plt]

OK, bottomlining, Elfin. What you want is free reign to flog your writing preferences and not being called a charlatan when you are being a charlatan (which isn’t all the time—or even a majority of the time, certainly). That ain’t gonna happen, so get over it.

I don’t get into specific stories (although I have done that on this board—responded in great detail. And you’re a flat liar if you continue saying otherwise) as much as you do because I’m actually writing and posting stories to this board and editing for Lit. authors—and you’re not. I’d think that alone would give folks coming here for help a clue.

You have four erotica stories posted to this site—all more than three and a half years old. This does not an erotica authority make. Real writers hone their skills by writing and experimenting; they don’t do so by going on a four-year hiatus from writing. And you’ve given no evidence that you either have editing training/experience or do any actual editing for erotica authors.

I have 372 stories posted to this site (373 tomorrow), with my latest one posted today and my next one posting tomorrow. (So, I'm just a little busy actually "doing.") These cover most of the categories here and all of the gender preferences, and I have both red Hs and green Es across the gender preference board here. (I’m sure there are authors here with more green Es than I have, but it would be interesting to know how many can match me for green Es in all three gender areas—Straight, Lesbian, and GM.)

Beyond that I have over 30 erotica e-books in the for-pay marketplace, with 10 more sitting complete and with release dates over the next year. My books currently sit on top of the publisher’s listing for both best-selling and quality rating at Fictionwise, and best-selling at AllRomanceEbooks (which doesn’t have a quality rating list). You can easily find reviews of my e-books at the various review sites. I have review blurbs and a link right here in my signature line.

(You call this egomania simply because you don’t have any counter to it. When you post that I’m unmarketable or don’t know what I’m talking about on writing erotica, of course I’m going to roll the guns out that clearly show you are full of crap—and are trying to hide your own inadequacies in these departments.)

I edit for some of the top-ranking authors here at Lit. (anyone wanting to check me out with these writers need only PM me for a reference or two).

Readers of this thread can check out the comparative credentials for themselves. If they want to write like you do, they have four examples to look at. If they want to write like I do in any of the many categories and gender preferences I post here in, they have nearly 400 examples to look at—and links to over 30 published works in the paying marketplace.

It’s fine with me if they like how you write and emulate it. It’s not fine with me when you try to tell writers that only your way works.

You talk down to the writers and suggest they have to go through some sort of simplistic phase of writing—based on your screwed-up notion of what that is—to feel like they are worthy of posting stories to this board. Nertz to that. This isn't the New Yorker. You can have fun and experiment and develop into your style by actually writing--see what works and what doesn't by actually putting it out there. (You might try it yourself.) If you feel you've screwed up totally with earlier works, you can pull them back, or rewrite and resubmit them, or even start all over again with a new writing persona. But you learn writing by writing (and reading the stories by others and learning from what you think they've done well).

And you (and Jenny) have this crazy notion that writers have to write in 3rd person until you give them some sort of graduation certificate, all the while pointing to irrelevancies on why someone shouldn’t be writing in the 1st person (like using too many I, me, my references—which is not a problem of writing in 1st person, it’s a possible problem of overusing I, me, and me, which a writer is just as prone to do in 3rd person with he/she, they. Or suggesting that starting a story “This is a true story” is a problem of writing in the 1st person, when using this clichéd opening is simply a problem of using a clichéd opening.)

I say a writer can write in any voice they damn well want to write in for that story whenever they want—and that the problems that may arise are problems in their own right, not because of the voice the writer has chosen to use.

You don’t half understand what you’re talking about—and you’ve failed to step up to challenges for proof of expertise in writing that reaches the level of being able to work constructively with the writing of others.

When you make asinine generalized, off-the-mark statements about writing, I don’t have to read the specific story you are damaging to call you on the asinine generalization. And I will continue to do so when I think you are harming new writers.

It can only be good for developing writers to hear different takes on an issue—and to decide for themselves what they want to do with their own writing.

Forget your campaign of choking me off and having clear reign for pushing some of your idiotic writing notions.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Though I agree at times with some of the feedback you offer others, this is tiring. So you don't like sr. So what? He has as much right to voice his opinion as anyone else does. An author has the right to follow or ignore any advice they receive. I don't see how writers will benefit from your repetitive voicing of your opinion about another author. We're supposed to be adults here. Act like one and let it go.

Just my opinion.

Thanks, Lynn.

I totally agree that getting into spats on this forum does nothing to help new writers. It is just I get riled by someone who doesn't read any stories or give any specific help feels he has any right to pontificate about fiction writing.

I will put him on ignore and try to be a better person.

I feel suitably chastised.

 

[sr71plt]

It is just I get riled by someone who doesn't read any stories or give any specific help feels he has any right to pontificate about fiction writing.

Once again, that's a lie (which you've gone back to time and time again over that past year or more). I give a lot of specific help to a lot of specific writers. I've even responded to a load of editorial questions from Mistress Lynn herself from time to time, if truth be known (and admitted).

Reality can be just so pesky, can't it, Elfin? And it's oh so impolite to point to it in the midst of character assassination.

 

[_Lynn_]

Once again, that's a lie (which you've gone back to time and time again over that past year or more). I give a lot of specific help to a lot of specific writers. I've even responded to a load of editorial questions from Mistress Lynn herself from time to time, if truth be known (and admitted).

Reality can be just so pesky, can't it, Elfin? And it's oh so impolite to point to it in the midst of character assassination.

Yup. You have been very patient answering my questions, which I appreciate a great deal. I try to find answers myself, but that doesn't always work. My first thought then is always 'sr will know'.

 

[sr71plt]

Yup. You have been very patient answering my questions, which I appreciate a great deal. I try to find answers myself, but that doesn't always work. My first thought then is always 'sr will know'.

Thanks.

 

[Trudy_Antone]

*****

 

[Trudy_Antone]

PS. One day when I write something I actually consider to be really good (unlike my stories here which though doing well by readers, I still think of us mediocre writing), I hope to call on the services of Mistress Lynn, or Sir Pit. If they're available, if they're willing, if they'll have me...

 

[Skorpion49]

Too true

Regardless of what anyone says, even if everyone hated everything I wrote, I write because I have to, because I'm compelled to, because the words MUST come out.

This I think is a trait common to most artists - they just have to or they will go mad. And there should always a place for the iconoclast who rewrites the rule book or even throws it away. But there always has to be some content; something said, that no-one dared to say before, because they were afraid, or whatever. That alone is not enough; they have to find an audience, or indeed they are truly mad, or at best, before their time. Keep at it - and when White Heart is finished, I shall patiently await the weightless sex and juices!

 

[_Lynn_]

PS. One day when I write something I actually consider to be really good (unlike my stories here which though doing well by readers, I still think of us mediocre writing), I hope to call on the services of Mistress Lynn, or Sir Pit. If they're available, if they're willing, if they'll have me...

Somehow, our ' services' mentioned on a porn site doesn't bring writing/editing to mind.

 

[Trudy_Antone]

Somehow, our ' services' mentioned on a porn site doesn't bring writing/editing to mind.

Mistress Lynn - LOL

 

[_Lynn_]

Mistress Lynn - LOL

Just saying, you know?