Why do women like Gay Male stories?

[sunandshadow]

I am a straight female and this thread caught my eye. I love reading fanfiction and have long been puzzled by the fact that most of the female authors exclusively write M/M fanfics, centering around characters who are not gay in the TV shows or in movies in which they appear.

These stories, no matter how badly they're written (some even spell the names of the characters incorrectly) invariably get many positive comments and wild raves. Het stories, even ones I find to be very well written, sexy and hot, get almost no attention.

I've been curious to find an answer about why mostly young women are so enthralled with male homosexuality, so I read the posts in this thread with great interest. All the theories are plausible and offer insight, but I must admit I'm still in the dark.

Well, from my perspective as a woman who doesn't like het fanfic and does like gay fanfic, it's pretty simple. I mostly don't identify with female characters in tv shows, anime, and movies. They are usually nothing like me in terms of their personality, philosophy, goals, looks, etc. I generally don't like reading about women if I can't identify closely with them. I don't find it either touching or hot to see them paired up with male characters (and it would be extra boring if it was a canon relationship, I don't understand why anyone bothers writing fanfic about those; the author already did it!). On the other hand I'm interested in reading about men (or masculine-identified herms, which is often what the 'male' characters in mpreg or omegaverse fics really are) even if they are quite different from me because attraction can replace identification as a source of liking a character.

(Romance novels do occasionally succeed at making me identify with a female character, if you were curious. They're better at that then most movies/tv shows/animes for some reason. Science fiction and fantasy novels sometimes succeed at making me identify with a female character, but then often fail to have attractive male characters.)

 

[Cactus34]

I've been scratching my chin on this since yesterday. With your indulgence, a little armchair, amateur anthropology.

Down, down to the basic levels of the brain we go.

A man sees two women rubbing their sleek and gleaming curves together. There could be a flashing neon sign with "LESBIANS" and a voice shouting in his ear "They don't have any interest in you!", but the caveman inside secretly knows any moment the women will wink and invite him to join in. And the more barbaric caveman might not wait for the invite.

Which leads directly into the flip side. A woman watches two fine slabs of beefcake all nude and sweaty. If these two fellows were heterosexual, she would have to be on her toes whether their inner caveman might dominate. Her thoughts have to churn, ready to decide if she wants to run, get out the pepper spray or join in. Very distracting. Since the flashing sign says "GAY", she can sit back, get comfortable and enjoy the show.

 

[PrettyKitty10]

I love gay male erotica, always have. Both written and visual. Probably for the same reason men love lesbian erotica? But since that's more socially accepted, the women I know who share the same interest don't vocalize it.

I love men. Everything about them. Why not get it doubled? I don't think it emasculates them in any way, and it turns me on. I would even say I like it more than straight porn/erotica. But that's just me

 

[Rckymtn110]

Interesting thread

Just found this thread and found it interesting. I am a straight male who has written several gay stories and posted a couple on here. There are lots of reasons for writing them but I must say that I loved seeing the comments and getting emails from the females who enjoy them. I wrote them with a female audience in mind. I also wrote them from imagining what sex must be like from the females perspective.

 

[LupaSolaris]

And I thought I was the only one!

I am glad to find that many other women love gay male stories. But I don't like the idea of writing them purposely for women... And I would say that some of my favorite GM stories lost some marks when I found out they were writen by women.

My first answer to the main topic is that I like to feel I am not part in any way of what is happening in the story. No one represents me because "she is so like me", no one threatens me because "she is so better than me". I can be empathic without being sympathetic, very interested but not involved. And for an hetero woman, it is easy and natural to care for male characters! :-D

But mostly, I think GM stories are usually much more balanced between heart and body, feelings and sex. It is so HOT when pure love is mixed with earthshaking sex! I found this perfect balance in more GM (and werewolf!) stories than all other genres together.

Not in topic and none of my business, but real love goes along with physical desire and monogamy, no matter you're man, woman, hetero or homo. I am sad for those who did not find it yet and "play" love like children playing space trips, not able to tell a planet from a satellite. Lucky these children don't write stories about space... ;-)

Lupa

 

[Meltnmold]

I don't know that I can exactly answer your question but I think what I have to say has some connection to it...

Have you ever noticed that most men who work in the wedding industry selling wedding gowns, planing weddings, arranging all the details, contacting all the people who supply things like the food, tents or whatever is necessary, are almost universally gay?

Do you realize that the only men who will NOT hit on a woman, are gay?

Did you know that women can talk to gay men about their sex life and not be ridiculed or embarrassed?

As for the reading and writing part, I can only assume that the woman who writes gay stories is telling you what she feels when she does have anal sex that really turns her on and/or maybe she's trying to tell someone what she really wants instead of what she normally gets when she has anal sex?

The gay guys that I know seem a lot more concerned about their partner's enjoyment than a lot of men do about their girlfriends or wives.

I know a lot of women fantasize about anal sex but are afraid to because of a past experience or are just plain scared to try it. It's been my experience that if you don't go in seeking it, it's a lot more likely to happen if you prime the pump right.

I know this isn't exactly the answer, but I really believe there is a connection.

 

[PrettyKitty10]

It literally has NOTHING to do with anal sex. At all.

I don't know that I can exactly answer your question but I think what I have to say has some connection to it...

Have you ever noticed that most men who work in the wedding industry selling wedding gowns, planing weddings, arranging all the details, contacting all the people who supply things like the food, tents or whatever is necessary, are almost universally gay?

Do you realize that the only men who will NOT hit on a woman, are gay?

Did you know that women can talk to gay men about their sex life and not be ridiculed or embarrassed?

As for the reading and writing part, I can only assume that the woman who writes gay stories is telling you what she feels when she does have anal sex that really turns her on and/or maybe she's trying to tell someone what she really wants instead of what she normally gets when she has anal sex?

The gay guys that I know seem a lot more concerned about their partner's enjoyment than a lot of men do about their girlfriends or wives.

I know a lot of women fantasize about anal sex but are afraid to because of a past experience or are just plain scared to try it. It's been my experience that if you don't go in seeking it, it's a lot more likely to happen if you prime the pump right.

I know this isn't exactly the answer, but I really believe there is a connection.

 

[sunandshadow]

It literally has NOTHING to do with anal sex. At all.

2nded. Generally gay fic written by women treats a man's ass as the equivalent of a woman's pussy (and the prostate is the g-spot) even to the extant of male characters sometimes getting pregnant from anal sex, and subsequently lactating and nursing the baby. (Biological sense = dubious at best, but that's not the point.) If it had anything to do with anal sex at all, it would be more likely that the women would be interested in pegging a man's ass than the other way around.

 

[alex_d]

The plot in het romance generally boils down to "feisty woman tamed by a man". It's a genre crammed with tropes, stereotypes and dull, beaten-to-death plots. With gay romance you can experiment with different dynamics between two men or two women, it seems a bit more flexible in that respect although male pregnancy and endlessly crying men are turn offs and generally indicate a female writer in my opinion.

 

[Tsotha]

Do you realize that the only men who will NOT hit on a woman, are gay?

Did you know that women can talk to gay men about their sex life and not be ridiculed or embarrassed?

Sigh. Commence the straight male bashing.

 

[PrettyKitty10]

Sigh. Commence the straight male bashing.

I thought the same thing. Plenty of straight men are gentlemen and don't come on to women all the time. Secondly, I've had a gay male friend grab my boobs without warning...

Don't label or make preemptive judgments!

I just don't understand why it's really even relevant to be honest. Men love lesbians. I doubt they watch lesbian porn or read lesbian stories for anything other than the visual and or mental thrill of it. (um hell...no giant cock and overly muscled dudes you'll never compare to in the way right?) So why is it a question if a woman enjoys the same thrill but in the opposite.

As I said before, lesbians are so socially accepted that girls kissing girls has become something that is not even a taboo or questioned. Girls make out with other girls in bars or elsewhere to have fun and turn men on...BECAUSE THEY ENJOY THE VISUAL thrill of two women. I spend a lot of time in a fan-fic group and this is a heavily used topic among the writers I spend time with, myself included. It's hot. End of story.

 

[PennLady]

The plot in het romance generally boils down to "feisty woman tamed by a man". It's a genre crammed with tropes, stereotypes and dull, beaten-to-death plots. With gay romance you can experiment with different dynamics between two men or two women, it seems a bit more flexible in that respect although male pregnancy and endlessly crying men are turn offs and generally indicate a female writer in my opinion.

Don't forget the other plot in a straight romance, where the carefree single man is tamed by his love for a woman. Every genre, though, is crammed with cliches, etc. So don't bash romance for that.

Sigh. Commence the straight male bashing.

I read the comment about gay men not hitting on women and thought, man, every guy I met in my 20s must have been gay. Trust me, plenty of straight men don't hit on women either.

 

[sweet_lusciousdesire]

Enjoy the people around you while you have the opportunity.

 

[Hypoxia]

I've had a gay male friend grab my boobs without warning...

Understandable, if that avatar is really you.

 

[PrettyKitty10]

Understandable, if that avatar is really you.

LOL yes, it's really me

 

[nicknick1]

hm i think they don't?? though i wish they do...nothing hotter than hot woman sharing the bed with your boyfriend ha

 

[WifeWatchman]

There is a psychological phenomenon called "projection", which works like this: take a porn picture of a man and woman having sex. A hetero man will "project" himself as the man in the picture and be making love to the woman, so he has no problem. A lesbian woman would also project herself as the man making love to the other woman.

Show a pic of two women having lesbian sex, and the man can project himself as either woman having sex with the other. But a hetero woman cannot project herself as either woman because she's then with another woman. A pic of two men having gay sex will be rejected by a hetero male because he cannot project himself as either man without having sex with another man.

This partially explains why hetero men can accept lesbianism but reject male homosexuality as repugnant, and why hetero women are more accepting of male homosexuality than female lesbianism.

Ergo... a gay male story can be read by hetero women who are projecting themselves as one of the men with the other man.

 

[JKendallDane]

Lots of interesting theories and explanations being offered.

All I can say at this point is that I love and appreciate the female fans for my GM stories just as much as I do the male ones.

 

[sr71plt]

Lots of interesting theories and explanations being offered.

All I can say at this point is that I love and appreciate the female fans for my GM stories just as much as I do the male ones.

I do too, unless they push to have me write something other than my intended audiences for GM, which usually is the active GM.

 

[CountGustaf]

There is a psychological phenomenon called "projection", which works like this: take a porn picture of a man and woman having sex. A hetero man will "project" himself as the man in the picture and be making love to the woman, so he has no problem. A lesbian woman would also project herself as the man making love to the other woman.

Show a pic of two women having lesbian sex, and the man can project himself as either woman having sex with the other. But a hetero woman cannot project herself as either woman because she's then with another woman. A pic of two men having gay sex will be rejected by a hetero male because he cannot project himself as either man without having sex with another man.

This partially explains why hetero men can accept lesbianism but reject male homosexuality as repugnant, and why hetero women are more accepting of male homosexuality than female lesbianism.

Ergo... a gay male story can be read by hetero women who are projecting themselves as one of the men with the other man.

It's an interesting theory. My problem with it is it doesn't tally with my reality.

I'm strictly straight. I know because I tried the gay scene and realized that men just don't turn me on. Pretty much like lesbians feel, I suppose. Yet lesbian porn, sorry, erotica, doesn't either. It bores me.

And I just wrote a GM story, and enjoyed doing it. I don't find homosexuality in any way repugnant. IRL it just doesn't turn me on.

Anyway and anyhow I've enjoyed the comments and theories. It turns out my original question was relevant. I'm still confused but at a higher level.

 

[Cruel2BKind]

In fact author Cruel2bkind has 66 GM stories and everyone of them has an H and many are "high H's) in the 4.7's and 8's.

She is a 20 year old straight female college coed, yet apparently she has the knack for these.

Thanks.

The plot in het romance generally boils down to "feisty woman tamed by a man". It's a genre crammed with tropes, stereotypes and dull, beaten-to-death plots. With gay romance you can experiment with different dynamics between two men or two women, it seems a bit more flexible in that respect although male pregnancy and endlessly crying men are turn offs and generally indicate a female writer in my opinion.

My personal hypothesis is that a lot of women who like GM might have a mild to moderate sense of penis envy.

Don't quote me, because I am seriously just speaking about my own experiences, plus a few friends and internet accounts.

When I am reading, writing, or watching GM erotica, I can throw myself 100% into the fantasy of being able to both penetrate and be penetrated. If I were actually a gay man, I would probably be just as much of a scaredy-cat of anal sex as I am now, but for the erotica, I can do it.

I understand that for het or lesbian women that strap-ons are an option, but strap-ons are a purely psychological kink. I think that a decent comparison can be drawn between women writing GM with assholes as a substitute for vaginas, and men writing Lesbian porn with women wearing strapons.

I love writing GM because of how fluid the power shift can be. I have characters where one man may as well be the wife, and I have characters where they take turns being on top and are completely equal in their relationship. I write as both the penetrating partner and the bottom partners.

With GM, you don't have any of the built-in stress that just comes in with writing female characters. You don't have to worry about pregnancy, diseases are less of a thing in certain historical or sci-fi settings. The characters already have a very intimate bond just because they are the same gender. I love tapping into that.

The one time I slept with a girl, I really didn't enjoy it much. Other than the sheer physical sensations, and other than the fact that we were both women. That was just a thing we had in common no matter what, and it made me feel a lot closer to her than I've felt with anyone else, regardless of whether I enjoyed it more with the fellas.

The trademarks of unexperienced female writers in GM are many. Not all of these mean that it is written by a woman, but if there are a lot of these, it's a red flag.

-Long flowing brightly-colored hair
-excessive crying (I was very guilty of this one)
-An obsession with deflowering and virginity
-Extremely defined dom/sub roles, with or without BDSM elements
-Tiny physical dementions, men who are less than 5'2" and very skinny (also guilty)
-a lack of focus on the physical act of penetration. 'I thrust into him and he moaned' without any stretching or preparation
-Focus on nipples
-Feminine, pathetic, or childish characteristics, constant trembling, whimpering, fearfulness, flinching, fear of eye contact, tearfulness, etc. (very guilty)

Again, not a black-and-white list, but if you have more than three, you're probably reading a woman's fiction.

 

[WifeWatchman]

It's an interesting theory. My problem with it is it doesn't tally with my reality.

And I just wrote a GM story, and enjoyed doing it. I don't find homosexuality in any way repugnant. IRL it just doesn't turn me on.

The theory was a general psychological theory based upon research, and doesn't apply to every individual in an equally exact manner. My own belief is that they're on the generally correct track about it as a basis of behavior.

There is another theory out there that 80% of homosexuals are actually bisexual (even if they don't admit it out loud), and that factors into everything.

All just general stuff and dry academia for those that might be interested in such things...

 

[sr71plt]

There is another theory out there that 80% of homosexuals are actually bisexual (even if they don't admit it out loud), and that factors into everything.

The theory is also out there that at least that percentage of heterosexuals are actually bisexual. I find that comforting.

 

[JKendallDane]

But mostly, I think GM stories are usually much more balanced between heart and body, feelings and sex. It is so HOT when pure love is mixed with earthshaking sex! I found this perfect balance in more GM (and werewolf!) stories than all other genres together.

I think that those of us that write primarily gay romances spend countless hours trying to achieve that balance in our works. This is an erotica site, so we have to work in the hot sex of course; but I have been noticing lately that the most glowing comments on my stories and series usually mention the love, tenderness, and romance that I make sure is the underpinning key to most of my plot lines. I will occasionally pop off a one-night-stand type of story, but even in those I usually include some sense of intimacy beyond "just guys getting off."

That's the great thing about the gay male category...it is a true smorgasboard with everything from glory hole hook-ups to virginty being lost, and from werewolves to college boys falling in love with each other...and there is a fan base for all of it. I just happen to prefer mixing heart, mind, and souls with the orgasms in mine.

 

[JKendallDane]

There is another theory out there that 80% of homosexuals are actually bisexual (even if they don't admit it out loud), and that factors into everything.

Even Kinsey, more than 50 years ago, discussed the fluidity of human sexuality and pretty much said that everyone has the physical ability to be bisexual; but that the innate preference for one or the other genderwise will fall heavily to one side or the other of the straight/gay scale in the overwhelming majority of people.

I would agree that 80% (or more) of gay males have "been bisexual" at least once in their life, if for nothing more than to clarify to themselves who they truly are and that they gave "being straight" a shot. But satisfying a curiosity doesn't make a gay male bisexual any more than a one-time walk on the gay side makes a straight man bisexual.