Are you alone?

[cymbidia]

One of the issues is how unique are we? I have never bought into the romanticized few of the individual.

I've never thought we were all like dandelion seeds adrift in the wind, either, to borrow a perhaps-irritatingly romanticized metaphor for what i see is the bottom-line singluarity of our existence.

We're as unique as genetic drift would have us be. We're closer to being alike than we are not-alike from a genetic standpoint, of course. We have, however, widely disparate sets of experiences. These differenign experiences cause us to see and feel and react to our world in very different ways. It is this emotional canvas upon which we fashion our self, moment by moment, each falling atop the next.

On that canvas, we write our lives. We dream our dreams. We spill our guts. We cry our tears. We love hotly and scream wildly and ache in ultimate solitude.

On that canvas, we are the only artist.
We're alone but not terribly unique.

Life is too stingy to put so many years of striving into the creation of one singular individual anything. Life exerts tremendous effort making more life; to make those new lives one at a time and then destroy the mold is for designer planets. Here, life spends itself on millions and millions of the same copies, the press run only differing in tiny almost insignificant details.

It's what happens to the copies after they leave the factory which is so interesting. They go different places. They see different things. They react to different stimuli. They become different beings - separated from the other millions of copies of Homo sapiens sapiens by their awareness.

In that way, all of us are fundamentally alone.
None of us can see "green", for instance, in precisely the same way because we've all experienced "green" in slightly different ways in our lives. Fundamentally, we exist alone in the universe in terms of our concept of "green".

Now substitute "green" for...everything else that defines us as people and that's the basis of my maintaining that we're all fundamentally alone.

This 'wonder' of being alive and human may be nothing more than a set of default responses due to similat internal architecture.

Or it may be the delight we feel and our need to edge closer to that person who sees "green" in a way that we think nearly approximates the manner in which we've learned to see that color.

And does that frighten you or does the recognition come as a fresh wind? The reaction to such a fact has much to show us about what our needs and desires are and how in control we are of ourselves. As you said above, how much is masked by 'social context'. [/B]

Oh no! I see challenge, adventure, and hope in bridging the spaces between my perceptions of reality and those held by others. Some people's thinking is too far from my views, and i cannot spend time or energy on constructing a span of understanding betwen us - if such would even be possible. Reluctantly i let them fall from meaning in my life. Many, however, hold to be real much that i share as being of importantce and relevancy. Many see "green" in much the same way that i do. The challenge is to find them, and then to see if they feel toward "yellow-orange" and "aquamarine" as i do.

 

[erosman]

Erosman:I am fucking maudlin today.

Grrrr

hugs to you, lady.

I have given up on the half/whole idea. For me, my life is more a stew pot...and each individual adds their own flavor. Some palatable, some not so palatable, but in the end, though I may be the pot and feel solitary, the resulting RL concoction is distinctively appetizing. Focusing on my individuality only alienates me from the connections that are the very best part of my life. Bon appetite.

 

[cymbidia]

Yes, we are alone.

Empirical proof:

You are talking about something that I've "known" for many years. If we had any connection at all, you would have "known" also and had no reason to talk about it.

You don't know it in the same way that i know it. Your reality will always be slightly skewed from mine, no matter the similairty of our ideas and experiences.

Besides, if we never talked about that which on which our ideas converged, how would we know we were similar in that matter?

Talking things over, trying to wrestle meaning from them, is as much as part of who we are genetically as are our ultimately solitary lives.

 

[erosman]

I see challenge, adventure, and hope in bridging the spaces between my perceptions of reality and those held by others. Some people's thinking is too far from my views, and i cannot spend time or energy on constructing a span of understanding betwen us - if such would even be possible. Reluctantly i let them fall from meaning in my life. Many, however, hold to be real much that i share as being of importantce and relevancy. Many see "green" in much the same way that i do. The challenge is to find them, and then to see if they feel toward "yellow-orange" and "aquamarine" as i do.

Well put, cym. It is a glorious adventure at that. The adventure is not discovering our solitude, but losing our loneliness to the convergence. How often we get put off by someone's perception of green, and miss the intimacy of the flavor of mango. Solitude can be a spring-board that propels us to spiraling isolation, or catapults us to greater realizations of our inter-connectedness. What a privilege to generate a choice.

 

[cymbidia]

~laughing at the juxtaposition of realites in my life~

And now i have to leave. I'm off to take my 13 year-old daughter graduation-dance-dress shopping at the mall. If a mall trip isn't a big-ass dose of alternative-reality, i don't know what would qualify as such!




A good day to all...

 

[pierced_boy]

Time and lonesomness

My father once posed the question "how do we know time passes" I answered that time can be measured in hours etc. He pointed out that the measure was a human artifact and that it was completely arbitary. I thought some more, i was on the hook and entangled in the line.

The answer for me (and him it seems) was that events happen. They happen to the collective us all the time binding and separating. (there are better words but they elude me now).

The passing of time and the occurrence of events convinces me that we are not alone. The interconnectedness of everything and the seemingly unique nature of our experince ensures we are constantly puzzeled by our existence. We make "permenmant conections" that disolve to dust at a moments notice while other things remain reliable beyond our expectations. Just when we feel we are the only being thinking certain thoughts we find a multitude of others think the same. Events happen to us and around us. Time passes for us and to others in conjunction. "It happens to "Us"

Then take your worst pain and talk to an other about it. They will ask you "do you think you are an orphan". Very humbling. The more remote the other the more likely the honesty of the response. We are not alone when we do this!

We are free of the tribal camp fire but we need to make the mental break, find others able to feel as we do. Those associations are what frees us(me) from the "i am alone " catastrophy.
The expression of the remaining private space is what may power our creativity and our passion.

H

 

[erosman]

yes cym, my reality is pulling me away too

Funny how the solitude and quiet of my morning was exchanged for virtual relationships, and delightfully convergent dialogue. Thanks, MM, for the moment. Make a great hash of your day, litsters. This was real...


good.

 

[Cheyenne]

I have given up on the half/whole idea. For me, my life is more a stew pot...and each individual adds their own flavor. Some palatable, some not so palatable, but in the end, though I may be the pot and feel solitary, the resulting RL concoction is distinctively appetizing. Focusing on my individuality only alienates me from the connections that are the very best part of my life. Bon appetite.

I like that description! It fits me, also.

 

[Quiet_Cool]

"Once you have realized that there is no objective external world to be found, that what you know is only a filtered and processed version, then it is a short step to the thought that, in that case, other people, too, are nothing but a processed shadow, and but a short step more to the belief that every person must somehow be shut away, isolated behind their own unreliable sensory apparatus. And then the thought springs easily to mind that man is, fundamentally, alone. That the world is made up of disconnected consciousness, each isolated within the illusion created by its own senses, floating in a featurless vacuum"

~ Peter Hoeg
From the novel Borderliners



Are we alone?

Not a particularly new thought or question. One which most of us have addressed at one point or another.

This passage stuck out because it is buried in a semi-autobiographical novel by Mr. Hoeg (My favorite Danish novelist and one of the few authors I read through translation). It arises in the context of Hoeg looking back on his childhood and discussin a German theorist/reasercher's take on life and the accompanying experinces.

To my mind, an unpretentious way of saying what some have used voluminous works to flesh out.

I, in fact, think we are alone. That that inner monologue that is inherent to who we are is isolated. It exists with influences from others, form places, from events... but is in fact never communicated fully with any other person. That much is obvious.

That is not to say that there is a magical quality to such an existence, there is not. Being human doesn't entitle us to a world of deep meaning and special care. Sure, people are unique, but even the most different of us remains but a bit changed from any other.

At the end of the day when your head is on the pillow. Those thoughts, whether your lover or child or dog is close, are your existence. The exposure and dissection of them with others (Humans are in fact primates, the most social of creatures) is not without merit and the crux of life at times but in no way complete. It should not be complete, in my opinion.

People, by this definition, which is fairly accurate at least, we ARE alone.
Deal with it, don't keep miking excuses.The hal/whole theory might be more enlightening, but it isn't real, that's why we write about it...
Love is a perception, and it's a false one that we all live with the fantasy of. We want, and we convince ourselves that we can have, so as not to be alone, but it isn't real, because we can never truly know another person well enough to feel so deep a connection with. Sad, but true...
Some people, including myself, live with this perception of religion as well, and it holds as a viable argument.

 

[Private Vasquez]

there are some people here, but I don't like any of them, so, yeah, I'm alone. Jerks!

 

[MissTaken]

Re: Re: Are you alone?

People, by this definition, which is fairly accurate at least, we ARE alone.
Deal with it, don't keep miking excuses.The hal/whole theory might be more enlightening, but it isn't real, that's why we write about it...
Love is a perception, and it's a false one that we all live with the fantasy of. We want, and we convince ourselves that we can have, so as not to be alone, but it isn't real, because we can never truly know another person well enough to feel so deep a connection with. Sad, but true...
Some people, including myself, live with this perception of religion as well, and it holds as a viable argument.

Yes, I realize that train of thought is naive. I am not giving up on it, though.

Not yet.

Maybe someday.

 

[lavender]

 

[MissTaken]

Being alone isn't necessarily a bed thing.

Even feeling lonely isn't necessarily a bad thing.

It is what it is.

We are who we are.

And so life moves forward.

 

[claude_moveml]

It's what happens to the copies after they leave the factory which is so interesting. They go different places. They see different things. They react to different stimuli. They become different beings - separated from the other millions of copies of Homo sapiens sapiens by their awareness.

In that way, all of us are fundamentally alone.
None of us can see "green", for instance, in precisely the same way because we've all experienced "green" in slightly different ways in our lives. Fundamentally, we exist alone in the universe in terms of our concept of "green".

Hell, I see green differently with my different eyes - with my left eye green seems more bluey, and more yellowy with my right eye.

 

[naudiz]

There are so many places to take this topic. It's a good one. Very interesting.

The mere concepts of alone and connected are human constructs, though. Even in trying to define oneself outside human perception, one must rely upon these constructs to give those definitions a name. Are we alone? Connected? Both and neither. They're human constructs. We made them to give ourselves dimension, to place ourselves in relation to everyone else.

I think either/or is too narrow a view. Physically we're not alone. I refer to the parable of the half-case of beer. Mentally, socially, we interact. We share information, and we receive information in turn. What we do with that information is entirely up to us, and in that we are alone, possibly unique.

Unique is another human concept: the division of things into alike and different. Am I special snowflake? Maybe. Maybe not. We define the world around us by our perceptions, so I would say that in my own mind, I'm as unique and special as I want to be.

This is simultaneously empowering and pointless. Empowering in that I can make myself what I want to be. Self-talk is a powerful thing. People can convince themselves of all kinds of stuff, and after awhile, those convictions seem terribly real. Pointless, however, in that the only one for whom that definition of unique will ever have deep meaning is the self. In that, I suppose, we are alone.

The notion doesn't fill me with fear, loathing, or depression. On the contrary, it's kind of liberating. Life is... what it is. Life for me is what I make it. If nothing is real, then it doesn't really matter, does it? If the only one for whom my reality will matter is me, then I'm free to make of it what I want, right?

Well, if I were to, for example, take a rocket launcher to the maintenance people when they run that damned leaf-blower right outside my bedroom window, my perception of a singular reality would become challenged rather quickly. We are connected socially. Individually? Well, the very nature of the word 'individual' implies a singular existence.

It's an interesting topic, but in the end, I'm fairly ambivalent. So no one will ever truly know me. Boo hoo. I guess I just don't care enough about being understood to be heartbroken by this notion. Then again, I like to be alone. I think those gurus living isolated on their lofty mountain peaks are really on to something. I treasure the moments were I am left with my own thoughts. I like the freedom that comes with being able to simply be.

Being alone doesn't have to mean being lonely. The very concept of alone isn't even real, no more than the concept of connectedness. We are... Period. We are.

Everything else is just playing with words and perceptions. And yet, in another thread, I made the argument that is? Isn't.

Life is a gorgeous paradox.

 

[Svedish_Chef]

Sometimes I realize I dont want to use my mind and I really am stupid.

Hi, she who rocks lots. Stop writing that fantasy crap already!

 

[Oilpainter]

We are not alone

I tend to disagree with those who say we are alone. Perhaps our everyday consciousness tends makes our egos believe we are alone and that is by in large our perception of reality. But I believe, not unlike many Eastern religions, that everything is interconnected. Me, you, the grass, the trees, the wind. It is all a part of what Terrence McKenna called the "logos,"-One large interconnected collective conscious. Perhaps ordinary humans can't regularly access the logos. But there are individuals who have claimed to do so, to wit: Edgar Casey, Nostrodamis, Aldus Huxley, Timothy Leary, Buddah, just to name a few. Just food for thought.

 

[naudiz]

Ahahahahaha, Cheffie! Never!

Elves, and trolls, and wizards, oh my!

I think I'm going to go write several chapters now just for you.

 

[IA951]

Erosman

I believe that we are not meant to be alone. That we are to find, have and maintain that partner who fits as a puzzle piece.

Two halves, making the whole.

I am fucking maudlin today.

Grrrr

As social animals perhaps we were not meant to be alone, however you can not deny that the more "advanced" we become as a society the further apart we grow.

I dislike this assesment as I feel that something is being imposed upon you here.
By assuming that you are a half of something, rather than a whole, a being unto yourself, I think that you foster some rather unhealthy attitudes.

 

[cymbidia]

As social animals perhaps we were not meant to be alone, however you can not deny that the more "advanced" we become as a society the further apart we grow.

In some ways, in the last 10 years, the world has grown perceptibly smaller and many of us have grown correspondingly closer. The net has done that. We are all here discussing this in a way that would have been patently impossible 15 years ago.

The world is smaller due to the net. It's smaller due to planes that can take me from my home in the San Francisco area to Chef's home in Australia in almost the blink of an eye (or two). It's smaller due to instaneous communications, the pathways for the dissemination of information (the 9/11 terrorist acts, for instance) that we all rely on so heavily, but almost without concious thought. The world is smaller cuz we're growing and eating the same varieties of the same foods worldwide, corn, wheat, rice, beans. (Ecoterrorists are going to have a field day - and i don't mean to offer a bad pun, either - when they figure out what to do with that one.) The world is smaller because McDonald's is everywhere, and so is sushi, and so are french fries.

The world is much smaller than it was in Galileo's day, for instance, or back when men took off for years to go fight for God and agains tthe infidels during the Crusades.

We inhabit a small world, now.
It's a small world after all.
It's a small, small world.

But the smaller it gets, the more we use our technology to create space between us and them. I am "talking" to you now, but you don't have to listen, don't have to hear, don't have to allow my thoughts into your world at all. My words and presence isn't necessary for your survival - and so you can use your technology to ignore me.

I think we all need some aloneness. We're ultimately solitary animals and we crave the space that allows us time to think and just be within the skin of our lives and restless contact we have with others.

We evolved as solitary beings who survived best within social groups. We learned to communicate, to get along. We always, however, turned our back to the campfire at some point and gazed up at the stars to wonder, is this all there is?. In the end, we go out of this life in the same way we came in: alone.

 

[Svedish_Chef]

Ahahahahaha, Cheffie! Never!

Elves, and trolls, and wizards, oh my!

I think I'm going to go write several chapters now just for you.

Oh you vicious evil cruel bitch!

And you LIKE it

Thats it. No Bowie for you.

 

[IA951]

Exactly...I've often thought about people who are labelled/diagnosed as mentally ill (particularly schizophrenics or manic/depressives)...often they are highly creative even brilliant and yet our society deems them potentially dangerous because they do not conform to the reality of the masses. And so we medicate them to try and alter their perception to fit the norm.

First off, let me say this is an excellent thread and that I have enjoyed very much reading everyone's contributions.
This is one of the reasons why I come here.
When someone can drag themselves away from hedonism and pose a very interesting question and discuss it intelligently.


I will agree that those who are manic-depressives or have schizophrenia are quite often very creative.
However we can not afford to romanticize the seriously mentally ill as being simply harmless or misunderstood.
I will agree somewhat that the seriously mental ill are regarded as dangerous due to the idea that they don't fit into our rather narrow ideal of what "normal" is.
However, when they become a threat to others as well themselves, they need to be isolated from society.

My father was a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic, so I am well aware of what it does to people and how they behave.
He was not diagnosed until he was in his 50's.
His condition had become so bad that we finally had to commit him, he was no longer functional and a clear danger to others as well as himself.

 

[cymbidia]

My father was a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic, so I am well aware of what it does to people and how they behave.
He was not diagnosed until he was in his 50's.

I'm sorry for your situation. My brother was a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic and killed himself in a particularly brutal and final manner when he was 19 and i was 25. I was the last person in the family he talked to, he left a note to me, the authorities called me, and i had to tell our parents. What does mental illness and how the whole family suffers along with the mentally ill person have to do with time?

 

[naudiz]

Oh you vicious evil cruel bitch!

And you LIKE it

Thats it. No Bowie for you.

Now that's the kind of alone I don't like! No Bowie?

Not even a little?

*sniff*

I think I'll congratulate Rhys on his AV. Hoot!

 

[Svedish_Chef]

You heard me.

NO bowie