Boycott homophobic Mars/Snickers

[sophia jane]

I get your drift Stella and I wasn't thrilled with the ad either, because of the very reason you said- the way others would react to it. And maybe we, in the community, are overly sensitive, but I can't really blame us considering the general attitude toward gays in this country.

If you check the blog link in Stella's first post, it seems the site has been yanked.

 

[Stella_Omega]

How could they have put the ad or website together before when they didn't know until two weeks earlier that it would be the Colts and Bears in the Super Bowl?

Personally, it it's anti anything, it's anti-homophobia. It shows how stupid two guys, apparently homophobes, act when they accidentally touch their mouths together.

I am calming down a little here. And you guys may be right, but.

It was the player's reactions, the football team going on and on about how "That's not right" that made me worry about the baseball bats. The fact that those reactions were showcased on the site. Don't know why that made my heartbeat accelerate and my gorge rise, but it just fucking might have something to do with the freinds that I've sat by in hospital after they'd been beaten up by men screaming "FAGGOT!" or "DYKE!"

To me, it's too close to hearing someone say "What's the matter? I only called you 'nigger' as a joke, where's your sense of humor? I was making fun of the guys who say it!"
The first ad was funny. If this world weren't so homophobic, the second, third and fourth ads would have been funny, too. But in the context of what goes around, it just... isn't. Not to this queer.

And Box, they had the website done in advance trust me. The had alternate new bits ready to drop in, that's how it's done.

 

[Stella_Omega]

When we were living in Saskatchewan, my older brother came across an anthill and exclaimed to my dad, "Look! A mountain!"

Why am I getting the same vibe here?

Molehills turn into mountains pretty quick on the south side of the border, Xelebes. I don't like it when they fall on me or mine, yanno?

 

[EllaRegina]

My personal theory for a long while has been that Gay-bashing is the last frontier (the penultimate frontier being fat-people-bashing). Just watch Conan O'Brien or Jay Leno on any given night. If you substituted the word "Jew" or "Black person" for "Gay" in their "jokes" it would be totally unacceptable; Homophobia seems Network-sanctioned. It disgusts me.

 

[Liar]

From the comment Stella mentioned (my bolds):

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"but it's not what is shown but how it is interpreted that is the problem. the way the website glorified the football players' reactions is what is more damaging. atheletes are admired by many impressionable children who will perhaps model themselves after their favorite sports stars.
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and

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the commercial itself is perpetuating the idea that it's both acceptable and humorous to be "grossed out" by homosexuality"
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Ok, now I've watched it. Found a clip.

And. Uh. No. It doesn't. It does exactly the opposite, propagates the idea that being grossed out by homosexuality is riciculous. I can't even with my wildest stretch of imagination intepret it any other way. As far as messages go, it's as PC as it can get.

Have no coment on the athletes' reactions, since I can't see those with the site down and all, but I guess that's a more mixed mesage that the Mars folks didn't think fully through. In this day and age, words travel fast, and it's easy to cook up a storm if you have a reason to. They're supposed to be marketing pros. To not anticipate the reaction and do a better job at edtiting the player's part in the campaign to at least appear less homophobic, that's just unprofessional.

 

[sophia jane]

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory?id=2854084

 

[Stella_Omega]

From the comment Stella mentioned (my bolds):

----------------------------------------------------------
"but it's not what is shown but how it is interpreted that is the problem. the way the website glorified the football players' reactions is what is more damaging. atheletes are admired by many impressionable children who will perhaps model themselves after their favorite sports stars.
----------------------------------------------------------

and

----------------------------------------------------------
the commercial itself is perpetuating the idea that it's both acceptable and humorous to be "grossed out" by homosexuality"
----------------------------------------------------------

Ok, now I've watched it. Found a clip.

And. Uh. No. It doesn't. It does exactly the opposite, propagates the idea that being grossed out by homosexuality is riciculous. I can't even with my wildest stretch of imagination intepret it any other way. As far as messages go, it's as PC as it can get.

Have no coment on the athletes' reactions, since I can't see those with the site down and all, but I guess that's a more mixed mesage that the Mars folks didn't think fully through. In this day and age, words travel fast, and it's easy to cook up a storm if you have a reason to. They're supposed to be marketing pros. To not anticipate the reaction and do a better job at edtiting the player's part in the campaign to at least appear less homophobic, that's just unprofessional.

*siffles and lets self be comforted*

I do hope hope hope you're right, Liar. I did say in my first post that I am having a hard time explaining myself about this.

here's my bolds;
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"but it's not what is shown but how it is interpreted that is the problem. the way the website glorified the football players' reactions is what is more damaging. atheletes are admired by many impressionable children who will perhaps model themselves after their favorite sports stars.

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To me, what's scariest now, after following various conversations about it- is the number of (sorry guys) straight men share those same athletes reactions. Who don't actually see what's so funny about those guy's reactions beyond a little exaggeration. Myself, I figure, I don't see funny there because I've known guys like those two. it really is only a little exaggeration.

 

[EllaRegina]

I'm trying to find the correct words here. These will have to do.

It may, on some level, indeed be an "anti-redneck" ad - I certainly don't think it's anti-Homophobia. And I agree with Stella_Omega - if it were the Onion or a similar context filled with people who have finely tuned and discerning satirical abilities I wouldn't worry. But the "masses" - Joe 6-pack and Nascar Dads, actual rednecks!? I don't want to seem like a snob but that crowd isn't going to see it as anything other than what Stella_O describes. I cannot believe (or maybe I can) that the oh-so-clever Ivy-grads at the Madison Avenue ad agency who put this garbage together didn't consider who they were playing to. If they did, well that makes it all even scarier.

And the football players? Horrifying. The clips have been pulled from the website. I would have liked to see them just to give myself a reason to vomit.

 

[Xelebes]

Now you're just being condescending to the average North American.

A bigoted racist will always see a black man advertising something as a bad thing. It doesn't add to it - if they have already decided that way, they are going to be that way. I see it as a neutral ad, neither for nor against.

 

[EllaRegina]

Now you're just being condescending to the average North American.

A bigoted racist will always see a black man advertising something as a bad thing. It doesn't add to it - if they have already decided that way, they are going to be that way. I see it as a neutral ad, neither for nor against.

I'm sorry if it comes across that way, Xelebes. I said I didn't want to sound like a snob but I guess I did. The problem, even in interpreting whether this whole thing is offensive to begin with, is that we do come to the table with our own perspectives, from wherever it is that we are coming from. I, in fact, don't feel "at home" (obviously) with the "average North American," and the fact is, many of them would rather I didn't exist because of who I happen to be. So I guess I am reacting to this from that mindset.

You're absolutely right about the bigoted racist. But, in this case, with SO many people being Homophobic I say why create something that will fuel their fire? I don't see it as a neutral ad at all. I really don't.

 

[Goldie Munro]

I'm trying to find the correct words here. These will have to do.

It may, on some level, indeed be an "anti-redneck" ad - I certainly don't think it's anti-Homophobia. And I agree with Stella_Omega - if it were the Onion or a similar context filled with people who have finely tuned and discerning satirical abilities I wouldn't worry. But the "masses" - Joe 6-pack and Nascar Dads, actual rednecks!? I don't want to seem like a snob but that crowd isn't going to see it as anything other than what Stella_O describes. I cannot believe (or maybe I can) that the oh-so-clever Ivy-grads at the Madison Avenue ad agency who put this garbage together didn't consider who they were playing to. If they did, well that makes it all even scarier.

And the football players? Horrifying. The clips have been pulled from the website. I would have liked to see them just to give myself a reason to vomit.

I think you found all the correct words.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Now you're just being condescending to the average North American.

A bigoted racist will always see a black man advertising something as a bad thing. It doesn't add to it - if they have already decided that way, they are going to be that way. I see it as a neutral ad, neither for nor against.

there was no "black man advertising something" there were bigots advertising something. They were, I am now agreeing, meant to be funny.
But you ask a black guy if he thinks a KluKluxKlan parody would give him the happy giggles or make him want to rush out and buy the product.
And you ask him if, upon watching the reactions of the people around him and realising that they thought the bigotry wasn't so unusual or inexplicable- how comfortable he would feel.

 

[Svenskaflicka]

OK, maybe the ads were supposed to make fun of homophobes. But the athletes making faces saying "that's not right" - that's nothing BUT homophobia.

OK, so everyone has a right to like or dislike homosexuality. But even if they don't like to see two men kiss, they shouldn't show their disgust in public, because they are role models, and if role models publically show their disgust regarding a sensitive subject like homosexuality, they WILL have a negative impact on society, especially those members of society are very young and impressionable.

Role models should say things like "OK, I don't like to watch two men kiss, but that's my problem, not theirs. I think they have every right in the world to kiss each other, and I think it's wrong to treat homosexual or bisexual people badly just because I myself have problems with them."

 

[lipsofanangel]

As a female who's on the lesbian side of bisexuality, I laughed my ass off at the commercial. I thought it was hilarious. I didn't see the rest but I'm sure, like most things in the media, the "reactions" were probably edited and blown completely out of proportion.

 

[Boxlicker101]

I still think the message is: See these guys? They're HOMOPHOBES! Silly, aren't they?

Which is strange, because the message should be something like: Buy Snickers and Mars and other stuff we make, because they're GOOD!

 

[Samandiriel]

I wonder what the reaction would have been if it was two women?

Curious.

 

[Boxlicker101]

I wonder what the reaction would have been if it was two women?

Curious.

Probably none, especially if it had been just a brief touch. Women kiss each other all the time on television, although not usually on the lips. I remember one long kiss on the lips by two women on "L. A. Law" a few years ago. This was no accidental encounter, and caused some discussion at the time.

I remember also one long kiss on the lips of two men on "Will and Grace". This was no big deal, because the two men were Will and Jack; both characters were gay and close friends.

 

[Liar]

You're absolutely right about the bigoted racist. But, in this case, with SO many people being Homophobic I say why create something that will fuel their fire? I don't see it as a neutral ad at all. I really don't.

So...poking fun at stereotype bigotry is out of the question, because people who are the stereotype bigots won't get the point even if you whack it over their head with a crowbar?

 

[Liar]

there was no "black man advertising something" there were bigots advertising something. They were, I am now agreeing, meant to be funny.

And if you ask me, everything was, until those damn rolemodel jocks started making disgusted faces on the webcast. That's where the problem is, bad sense of decorum from the producers and editors of the website.

But you ask a black guy if he thinks a KluKluxKlan parody would give him the happy giggles or make him want to rush out and buy the product.

Dave Chapelle comes to mind. Is he really that controversial? If so, the American zeitgeist is more elusive to a foreigner than I could have ever imagined.

 

[S-Des]

there was no "black man advertising something" there were bigots advertising something. They were, I am now agreeing, meant to be funny.
But you ask a black guy if he thinks a KluKluxKlan parody would give him the happy giggles or make him want to rush out and buy the product.
And you ask him if, upon watching the reactions of the people around him and realising that they thought the bigotry wasn't so unusual or inexplicable- how comfortable he would feel.

There was a parody, it was called Blazing Saddles and it was utterly brilliant. All In The Family used a biggoted oaf to point out how bigotry was wrong (even though the main character constantly spouted bigotry, the writers weren't afraid that kids would see it and want to be like Archie Bunker). I don't think this commercial comes remotely close to that level of depth, but it's the same concept. These guys tore out their chest hair (something that's physically impossible) to prove how manly they were to each other...that takes a special kind of stupid. The players reactions were not homophobic. They were grossed out. If the commercial had been a beautiful woman kissing a guy with rotted out teeth, too much facial hair, oily skin with pimples, with a lazy eye, how many women seeing it would have had the same reaction? To a straight guy, the thought of kissing another man is gross. That's not fear of homosexuals, that's just a gut reaction to something that isn't attractive to them. It's different with women because even straight women usually find other women attractive.

BTW, this commercial is not original. In the movie Planes, Trains and Automobiles, there was the same type of scene. John Candy and Steve Martin had to sleep in the same bed. When they woke up, they were cuddled against each other. Martin asked where Candy's hand was and he said it was between two pillows. Martin shrieked that it wasn't pillows and they jumped out of bed, fidgeting uncomfortably and asking about football in artificially deep voices. Straight guys are uncomfortable with that kind of contact. That's why it's funny. You have the right to be insulted, but everyone can be insulted by something. I'd really rather not take all the humor out of our lives because we're afraid stupid people might use it to form life decisions.

 

[Stella_Omega]

And if you ask me, everything was, until those damn rolemodel jocks started making disgusted faces on the webcast. That's where the problem is, bad sense of decorum from the producers and editors of the website.

The website was produced by the exact same corporation that owns the candy bars that the ad was selling. That was when I got upset.

Dave Chapelle comes to mind. Is he really that controversial? If so, the American zeitgeist is more elusive to a foreigner than I could have ever imagined.

Dave Chapelle is edgy and known for it. He is not advertising candy bars at Daytona.

So...poking fun at stereotype bigotry is out of the question, because people who are the stereotype bigots won't get the point even if you whack it over their head with a crowbar?

well... in a way, you have it exactly right. Especially since what I worry about is bigots whacking ME over the head with the crowbar. And there are plenty folks who are slightly less stereotyped, but still bigots.

We expect that kind of thing in, as a couple people have mentioned, The Onion. During the superbowl- and remember a couple of years ago, the FCC came down on them because Janet Jackson flashed a tit- we really don't expect satirical humor. It's a family show.

 

[TheJungian]

I was just watching tv, and a baskin robbins commercial came on that stated men's minds are composed of 3 parts:

50% beer
49% pro wrestling
and 1% remembering valentine's day.


I'm outraged. We should boycott baskin robbins.



Honestly, humor is derived from the society in which it dwells and the stereotypes the people in that society use on a daily basis. Fact remains, whether or not it is morally right, the majority of our society is still uncomfortable with homosexuality (and in the case of straight guys, this is perfectly normal). Because of this, and the stereotypes that go with it, much of our current humor revolves around homosexuality and making fun it, along with religion, politics, sex (women/men) etc. etc. etc. Just look at the jokes used in any current comedic shows, from the tame sitcoms to shows like south park and family guy.

Much of advertising uses humor, often -satirical- humor to promote their product. Where is humor derived from? (see above) Hell, if you want to boil it down, you get laid by dousing yourself with Axe body spray because all attractive women are so shallow that a simple scent will have them jumping all over you. ....

If we're going to jump up and revolt against every stereotype and controversial issue used in comedy we'll not only have quite a work load on our hands, but no comedy left behind.

Perhaps the interviews with the players is a bit far (though I don't know about the whole "role model" thing.. if so a lot of kids might be quitting their sports to smoke weed (anyone get the reference?) ) and these are personal opinions. But as for the advertisement itself... really now. This hub bub is blown out of proportion as a result of a certain sensitive spot in the stereotype used.

I gaurantee the same people drastically offended by this simple 'gay joke' used in this ad (and it's not the first ad employ gay jokes), are the very same people who have laughed their asses off at the expense of other groups being made fun of in comedy. I know I've even been a little annoyed when my own culture has been teased, but it would be selfish to go in uproar. If you enjoy comedy, you have to accept that everyone is at risk of being targeted. That's why comedy is so friggin funny.

 

[Liar]

I was just watching tv, and a baskin robbins commercial came on that stated men's minds are composed of 3 parts:

50% beer
49% pro wrestling
and 1% remembering valentine's day.


I'm outraged. We should boycott baskin robbins.

Indeed. It's at least 65% beer.

 

[Liar]

Dave Chapelle is edgy and known for it.

Seriously? Then I better stop applying my frame of reference to a culture that may look similar to mine, but might as well be from another planet.

I expect, and think I've seen, similar kind of humor, and similar bigots targeted, in prime time sitcoms and Hollywood comedies. Have I mixed up apples and pears somehow? (No, not apples and oranges, they're not that different)

 

[RedHairedandFriendly]

Maybe they were reacting to the idea of having their chest hair ripped out. I'm thinking that could make a person wince.