Consent? Are people entitled to their partner’s body?

[LeSabreur]

Late to the party...the OP clearly describes acts of nonconsensual sexual assault.

I'll toss out another twist to the consent issue: our bodies betray us even when we do not consent to sexual activities. After my dear spouse went through the ravages of menopause her libido pretty much evaporated. We had previously been intensely sexually active and adventuresome...then, nothing, no interest. Frustrated, I would initiate sex by furtively moving my hand to her groin and would start rubbing her clit. She would soon start pumping her hips, getting wet, and moaning. Then I would proceed to start sucking on a nipple or would even go down on her. She would awaken and we would have sex, but this wasn't the same highly sexual woman that had previously enjoyed it tremendously...this was a woman putting no feeling into it, going through the moves simply because her body had become aroused. Her mind, however, had not.

I had been reading a couple of books by sex therapist Emily Nagoski and was ashamed to learn that I had been coercing my wonderful spouse into sex without her consent. This horrified me and I stopped immediately. Such physical responses even happen to men when they are victims of sexual assault; men can have erections and ejaculate...responses of the autonomic nervous system...even when they have explicitly withheld consent and do not wish the interaction to occur.

 

[UnexpectedLuggage]

No. What happened to you was rape, plain and simple.

A relationship is a partnership, with all parties having an equal say in things. If I'm all riled up and my wife says she isn't in the mood then I just go rub one out. I'm not entitled to her body, not now, not ever.

 

[lil_jenni]

Late to the party...the OP clearly describes acts of nonconsensual sexual assault.

I'll toss out another twist to the consent issue: our bodies betray us even when we do not consent to sexual activities. After my dear spouse went through the ravages of menopause her libido pretty much evaporated. We had previously been intensely sexually active and adventuresome...then, nothing, no interest. Frustrated, I would initiate sex by furtively moving my hand to her groin and would start rubbing her clit. She would soon start pumping her hips, getting wet, and moaning. Then I would proceed to start sucking on a nipple or would even go down on her. She would awaken and we would have sex, but this wasn't the same highly sexual woman that had previously enjoyed it tremendously...this was a woman putting no feeling into it, going through the moves simply because her body had become aroused. Her mind, however, had not.

I had been reading a couple of books by sex therapist Emily Nagoski and was ashamed to learn that I had been coercing my wonderful spouse into sex without her consent. This horrified me and I stopped immediately. Such physical responses even happen to men when they are victims of sexual assault; men can have erections and ejaculate...responses of the autonomic nervous system...even when they have explicitly withheld consent and do not wish the interaction to occur.

I have a curiosity. Did you ask your wife what she thought, or did you decide for her that she did not consent to the described situations?

 

[lil_jenni]

No. What happened to you was rape, plain and simple.

A relationship is a partnership, with all parties having an equal say in things. If I'm all riled up and my wife says she isn't in the mood then I just go rub one out. I'm not entitled to her body, not now, not ever.

It can be difficult for me if Hubby is not in the mood. I have a higher sex drive than him, plus my anxiety and self esteem issues kick in if he isn't in the mood, leaving me feeling rejected and even more anxiety ridden than normal. But I have learned to talk these moments out with him, and usually he can talk me down. Hell, sometimes I don't even feel rejected anymore because he is careful to explain why he's not in the mood at that moment. And sometimes, talking about it leads him to be in the mood.

I have also tried to let him be the primary initiator, but that is horribly anxiety inducing when he doesn't as frequently as normal, for whatever reason. Plus, he likes it more when I initiate, so that's usually what happens, and he makes sure I'm okay if he's not in the mood when I am. It's all about the communication and respecting each other's needs as well as agency.

 

[UnexpectedLuggage]

It can be difficult for me if Hubby is not in the mood. I have a higher sex drive than him, plus my anxiety and self esteem issues kick in if he isn't in the mood, leaving me feeling rejected and even more anxiety ridden than normal. But I have learned to talk these moments out with him, and usually he can talk me down. Hell, sometimes I don't even feel rejected anymore because he is careful to explain why he's not in the mood at that moment. And sometimes, talking about it leads him to be in the mood.

I have also tried to let him be the primary initiator, but that is horribly anxiety inducing when he doesn't as frequently as normal, for whatever reason. Plus, he likes it more when I initiate, so that's usually what happens, and he makes sure I'm okay if he's not in the mood when I am. It's all about the communication and respecting each other's needs as well as agency.

My wife and I have run into that as well. But like you guys we can usually talk it out if I'm not in the mood and assure her that it's not her fault in any way.

 

[LeSabreur]

I have a curiosity. Did you ask your wife what she thought, or did you decide for her that she did not consent to the described situations?

Oh, we have talked about it all quite a bit. She was just "going along for the ride" after her body responded, without having any real desire or heightened emotions about what was essentially a purely physical event. Although she wasn't angry about me stimulating her in this way, nor did she receive any real reward from it. Even having an orgasm, though it felt good to her in the moment, wasn't in alignment about how she felt about it, and she wouldn't have engaged in the activity had she been awake and aware of what was happening.

I know her well, and would never put pressure on her for my needs. The poor thing has even seen her gynecologist and used hormones in an effort to prop up her libido, but...well, the last thing I would want is to make her feel even worse about it than she already does.

 

[DustysSweety03]

No they aren’t entitled to their partners body.

 

[sandybrooke]

No they aren’t entitled to their partners body.

I guess not. My wife shut that shit down years ago!!

 

[Pavlovsdog6862]

Do you think people are entitled to their partner’s body?

As in “You’re mine and I should be able to fuck you whenever I want whether you like it or not”? Or do you prefer explicit consent every time?





Years ago, there was a period of a few months where my partner was very sexually aggressive and would just do whatever he wanted to do to me even if I said No. I literally slapped, punched, kicked, etc. and he would just laugh and continue what he was doing. It seemed like he liked me hitting him. He’s never ever raised a hand to me, but instead would use his penis to cause me pain if he was mad at me.

We ended up separating for almost a year because of it.

I know some people think it’s sexy to have someone want you so bad they “can’t help themselves”, but it made me feel like crap. It was painful physically and emotionally. Sometimes I’d be sore for days



People knew we had broken up but they didn’t know the real reason why. It’s kinda embarrassing to talk about with people who actually know us, so I’ve never mentioned it. This is only the second time I’ve written anything about it- the first time was in my diary.



This is also kinda confusing because I do like that he’s kinda dominant, so why did it hurt my feelings?



Anyways, what’s your preference?

So by saying you broke up for a year , means your back with him I assume??

 

[ChloeOfCascadia]

Do you think people are entitled to their partner’s body?

No, that's EXTREMELY immoral and wrong.

I was married for 10 years, for 8 of those years I did not have sex.

I was not entitled to my wife's body.

Anytime a girlfriend of mine wasn't in the mood, and I was, that wasn't her problem ever.

This is also kinda confusing because I do like that he’s kinda dominant, so why did it hurt my feelings?

Because your consent was not gained.

I am a dom in the bedroom and everything I've ever done has been with consent. Always.

You can in fact be dominated, without it being abusive. In fact, any implication that the nonconsent fantasy is less than 100 percent fantasy, it's immediately a crime.

It's VERY wrong. It's a breach of trust. Run, run away. Tell your friends. Do not give this person another chance ever.

If a person is willing to circumvent consent once, they're a severe danger.

They're a psychopath, they're a predator, they will hurt you.

He hurt you, it was wrong, it's a crime.

You can enjoy a dom in the bedroom and experience rough sex that is consenting and even roleplay where you are fake forced, tied up, put in submissive positions, but when you say "no" the game ends, if this is done without agreeing on a signal for how it ends even if you can't speak, this isn't a game, it is a crime in progress.

If your partner "surprises" you with fake nonconsent anything, it's nonconsent. It's wrong.

Anything you do should be agreed on.

Like, if you want me to climb in your bedroom window, and we lived together so it's my bedroom, and dress like someone else, and strip you bare, tie you to a bed, and take you, that's a GAME.

No one is being hurt. It's fantasy and if it is your thing, it can be fun.

When you say no, the game is over. If it continues, it is a crime.

Nothing else.

 

[DaddyLovesKitten]

Do you think people are entitled to their partner’s body?

Never.
For safety and moral reasons, and because it's a crime, and because it is abusive, that's the biggest red flag ever.

As in “You’re mine and I should be able to fuck you whenever I want whether you like it or not”? Or do you prefer explicit consent every time?

There may be situations where consent can be assumed if you don't say no, because my partner who I am having regular sex with has initiated things, or is cooperating and can freely say no and isn't. Like..... I have almost never given affirmative consent for myself. If my girlfriend goes down on me and I don't try to stop her, and we've had sex before, I think she can safely assume consent exists. If I have sex with her, and never say stop, even if I'm the passive partner laying down, she can assume consent exists.

However-

A red flag for me is if your partner ever suggests that there are circumstances where they just always have consent and you can't no.

That person is looking for a loophole to do a crime. That person is dangerous.

Look, there's a lot of stuff with BDSM which toes the line of fantasy versus reality. But it always has to be a game. It needs to be safe. If there's no "no" and no safe word and nothing like that, those aren't safe practices. People need to be able to say yes to an idea, and change their minds mid-play.

You need to be able to walk away at any time. Doesn't matter if you're in a D/s thing or roleplay CNC. You actually feel uncomfortable and it's not fun, you need to be able to stop, always.

Years ago, there was a period of a few months where my partner was very sexually aggressive and would just do whatever he wanted to do to me even if I said No.

Red flags, a crime happened. My advice would be to avoid anyone who behaves like that or suggests it ever again.

Anyways, what’s your preference?

I'm iffy about even the consenting games that play out like this, but im not going to stop them from happening by objecting.

I would give the advice to everyone of every kink that it's always a red line when someone suggests you can't remove consent at any step, at the beginning or at any point during.

That's a crime always, and always morally wrong, and sometimes when you have strong feelings for a partner, you want to forgive and excuse them. Also, the body can involuntarily feel good at parts of something that is bad for you. You could get excited during a bank robbery and being held hostage at gunpoint- that doesn't mean it's not a crime. If you follow the analogy. Those persons are dangerous and could hurt you. Removing your ability to consent is hurting you.