Cyclical vs. Linear History

[gauchecritic]

I'll just put some words in Rob's mouth here.

I think he meant that people are happier with what they're told rather than with what actually happens.

Maybe I read your reply wrong, you could have meant it in the same spirit. Ah well.

 

[ottohauser1977]

I'll just put some words in Rob's mouth here.

I think he meant that people are happier with what they're told rather than with what actually happens.

Maybe I read your reply wrong, you could have meant it in the same spirit. Ah well.

Yes, that is how I meant it.

 

[gauchecritic]

Wow, you're fast. Is there nothing to do in Texas? or are you just efficient?

 

[ottohauser1977]

Wow, you're fast. Is there nothing to do in Texas? or are you just efficient?

On a Sunday? Not that much. The damned taverns are closed. Where can a man get some decent schnapps here on a Sunday?

And I don't go to church. If I did, it would probably be the Lutheran church. But I'm not too keen on religion. I was brought up an atheist, and I haven't seen anything to make me more religious than an agnostic at most.

 

[neonlyte]

On a Sunday? Not that much. The damned taverns are closed. Where can a man get some decent schnapps here on a Sunday?

No moose shooting, then. Don't those Hunter chappies have hip-flasks. One of those might have moonshine, that's like schnapps.

 

[ottohauser1977]

No moose shooting, then. Don't those Hunter chappies have hip-flasks. One of those might have moonshine, that's like schnapps.

I grew up without guns. I am still getting used to their availability. Hunting? Never did it. As for moonshine, I'm tempted, but I hear it's illegal and I wouldn't know whom to approach if I did want to break the law.

 

[rgraham666]

The Thirty Years' War was more of an anomaly, since there was a lot of foreign intervention and a lot of mercenaries involved, rather than simply local militia.

From what I recall, no, neither of the English Civil wars were nearly that bad. In fact few in the history that I know were that bad.

Not many people here in North America know how bad the Thirty Years War was. As I understand it about half the population of what is now Germany died. To get worse you'd have to look at the genocide of the American natives.

 

[ottohauser1977]

From what I recall, no, neither of the English Civil wars were nearly that bad. In fact few in the history that I know were that bad.

Not many people here in North America know how bad the Thirty Years War was. As I understand it about half the population of what is now Germany died. To get worse you'd have to look at the genocide of the American natives.

Half died, more or less. The rest were destroyed, more or less. Spiritually destroyed, if you know what I mean. It really did give birth to my native country's worst demons. It certain shattered any semblance of national unity and exacerbated our national paranoia about being divided and conquered by Auslanders- foreigners.

 

[Weird Harold]

Half died, more or less. The rest were destroyed, more or less. Spiritually destroyed, if you know what I mean. It really did give birth to my native country's worst demons. It certain shattered any semblance of national unity and exacerbated our national paranoia about being divided and conquered by Auslanders- foreigners.

If you need something to do on a Sunday besides watch theDallas cowboys get their butts kicked -- again -- check out the Ring of Fire series originated (and edited and co-authored) by Eric Flint. It is an alternate history/time travel look at the 17th century from the perspective of a West Virginia coal-mining town dropped into the middle of Thuringia during the Thirty Years War.

I would be interested in your opinion as to the accuracy of the basic political and social situations portrayed as compared to the history you were taught in East Germany.

ETA: the first book of the series that introduces many of themain characters and set up the premise: http://www.amazon.com/1632-Assiti-Shards-Eric-Flint/dp/0671319728

 

[ottohauser1977]

If you need something to do on a Sunday besides watch theDallas cowboys get their butts kicked -- again -- check out the Ring of Fire series originated (and edited and co-authored) by Eric Flint. It is an alternate history/time travel look at the 17th century from the perspective of a West Virginia coal-mining town dropped into the middle of Thuringia during the Thirty Years War.

I would be interested in your opinion as to the accuracy of the basic political and social situations portrayed as compared to the history you were taught in East Germany.

Interesting idea. That is quite a transfer, and culture shock, I imagine. 17th century Germany was a real wasteland and a barbarous place compared to today. All of the bad stereotypes about us Germans started there, I think. I also think that's where we got our national obsession with order and discipline.

Not sure how it compares yet. But I can tell you that our history courses were highly politicized. Very thorough Communist indoctrination and all. The adjustment to post-unification education and such was a shock in itself, and I was especially behind, having been further brainwashed by my staunchly Stalinist father.

 

[Weird Harold]

Interesting idea. That is quite a transfer, and culture shock, I imagine. 17th century Germany was a real wasteland and a barbarous place compared to today. All of the bad stereotypes about us Germans started there, I think. I also think that's where we got our national obsession with order and discipline.

I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by the lack of "stereotypical germans" in the series. There are stereotypes, but not the ones you would expect.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

It's both, of course.

As for Eric Flint, his work is quite intriguing. Mostly accurate, near as I can tell. And being from West Virginia, I can certainly understand Mike Stearns and others. They are a lot like people I know from the Mountain State.

 

[Weird Harold]

It's both, of course.

As for Eric Flint, his work is quite intriguing. Mostly accurate, near as I can tell. And being from West Virginia, I can certainly understand Mike Stearns and others. They are a lot like people I know from the Mountain State.

The whole Ring of Fire/Assiti Shards/Grantville Gazette universe is well reserached by ALL of the participants.

Interesting coincidence: Last night I was half-heartedly watching "The Universe" when they brought up Galileo's trial for heresy and unlike most treatments of Galileo's trial in history books, they emphasized the distinction between the solar centric solar system and his actual heresy of daring to contradict official intepretation of scripture to support his observations.

That's a distinction I'd never actually seen made clearly until I read 1634: The Galileo Affair.

 

[ottohauser1977]

Now, Galileo, there was a real man of conviction.

 

[Weird Harold]

Now, Galileo, there was a real man of conviction.

No, actually he was technically no "conviction," -- he pled guilty to a minor heresy in exchange for house arrest instead of execution for major heresy.

Galileo made several advances in science, but if you really dig into his life and what else was happening in science, he was more science populist than hard scientist -- Sort of like the late Dr. Isaac Asimov who had a doctorate in biochemestry but was best known for his pop-science essays and science fiction.

Galileo plagiarized most of his ideas, but did occasionally put them together with other plagiarized ideas to come up with something orignal -- like using a spyglass for astronomy.


(Asimov was actually a better mystery writer than he was a science fiction writer, but he became well-known for science fiction first and most of his fans didn't like mysteries all that much.)

 

[rgraham666]

His trial was one of the first examples of how reason can triumph over reality

 

[impressive]

No one ever talks about writing here. If we're not talking about politics we're talking about the color of our underwear or what we take in our coffee.

But we have to write in order to talk... so, really, it's all about writing.

Of course, don't you dare pick on someone's spelling or grammar or style in their posts. That's when writing doesn't have to be good. It's the meaning that counts.

Perhaps we should simply start critiquing posts like we would stories. Put a new sticky at the top of the forum.

Meh. It's early. Too much blood in my caffeine stream.