Do guns make us more safe?

[phrodeau]

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/09/12/...inmate-search-pennsylvania-tuesday/index.html

An emergency alert sent Monday night to area residents asked them “to lock all external doors and windows, secure vehicles, and remain indoors.”

While you’re at it, make sure that your fucking guns are locked up.

 

[Dribble]

This is going to end with an innocent dying.

 

[Bray123]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1701314096354754712

responsible gun owner, yay

I know him, he was on that Gas Monkey show.
https://hookandbarrel.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/04/DSC9265-1536x900.jpg.webp

 

[Sean Renaud]

You're an idiot. You make stupid statements just to object rather than debate out of spite and a desire to think you're being relevant by being obstinate.

NO ONE. NOT ONE FUCKING SOUL on the planet will legitimately trade a diagnosis that they now have cancer merely for access to health care. Because no one will trade being healthy and lacking health care for them dying but with health care.

But, people CAN compare the numbers and statistics for cancer to the numbers and statistics of gun deaths. And when placed side by side they will see that gun deaths aren't even close to the number of people who die every year from something as common as cancer despite the wads of cash and scientific/medical expertise being thrown at cancer.

Which would serve to illustrate that your statistics about gun deaths aren't as horrible as you'd like them to be even after you padded the fuck out of the data.

No I do not make stupid statements. I make fact based statements. You do, like most Conservatives do a damn good job of picking and choosing what you read so you can make a chicken shit argument. Grand scheme of things are you more likely over the course of your life time, to have a bad case of the flu, to have a disease that could have been stopped early (including cancer) if you went in for annual checks. We know now that dental problems can spread to the heart and brain. If you wouldn't trade day to day problems for maybe problems you're fucking insane.

Placing cancer numbers against gun numbers is insanely dishonest but that's how you roll. One is something that nature or God does to you. There is nothing you can do to make the world better. Guns are something people do to you, you can do something about that..

No the gun deaths are just are horrible and I don't pad, I take straight from the CDC and FBI and mostly low ball.

 

[HisArpy]

No I do not make stupid statements. I make fact based statements. You do, like most Conservatives do a damn good job of picking and choosing what you read so you can make a chicken shit argument. Grand scheme of things are you more likely over the course of your life time, to have a bad case of the flu, to have a disease that could have been stopped early (including cancer) if you went in for annual checks. We know now that dental problems can spread to the heart and brain. If you wouldn't trade day to day problems for maybe problems you're fucking insane.

Placing cancer numbers against gun numbers is insanely dishonest but that's how you roll. One is something that nature or God does to you. There is nothing you can do to make the world better. Guns are something people do to you, you can do something about that..

No the gun deaths are just are horrible and I don't pad, I take straight from the CDC and FBI and mostly low ball.

And yet somehow cancer deaths outnumber gun deaths by about 300%.

That's not cherry picking, it's a FACT. That you insist on being a bullshit artist trying to promote the lies fed to you by those who will control and own your ass if they ever get their way doesn't change that FACT.

BTW, the statistics you cite include suicides as "violence" and which wouldn't be stopped by banning and seizing guns. Trying to say otherwise is yet another lie on your part.

 

[Bray123]

There might be lots of people on the planet who would rather live with cancer in a country where cancer is curable rather than in a country that has no healthcare.

 

[Bray123]

Suicide rate per 100K population:
USA, 14.5
UK, 6.9

The difference being that one has access to guns, the other has access to healthcare.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate
/Not cherry-picking.

 

[Bn2f]

You're an idiot. You make stupid statements just to object rather than debate out of spite and a desire to think you're being relevant by being obstinate.

NO ONE. NOT ONE FUCKING SOUL on the planet will legitimately trade a diagnosis that they now have cancer merely for access to health care. Because no one will trade being healthy and lacking health care for them dying but with health care.

But, people CAN compare the numbers and statistics for cancer to the numbers and statistics of gun deaths. And when placed side by side they will see that gun deaths aren't even close to the number of people who die every year from something as common as cancer despite the wads of cash and scientific/medical expertise being thrown at cancer.

Which would serve to illustrate that your statistics about gun deaths aren't as horrible as you'd like them to be even after you padded the fuck out of the data.

C’mon man.
You brought up cancer the other day but even I didn’t think you’d be stupid enough to lean in and actually advocate this analogy.
No one is going around claiming MORE cancer is the solution to cancer.
Folks want cancer eradicated, senseless gun deaths too. That’s your comparison.
Geez.

 

[PastMaster]

And yet somehow cancer deaths outnumber gun deaths by about 300%.

That's not cherry picking, it's a FACT. That you insist on being a bullshit artist trying to promote the lies fed to you by those who will control and own your ass if they ever get their way doesn't change that FACT.

BTW, the statistics you cite include suicides as "violence" and which wouldn't be stopped by banning and seizing guns. Trying to say otherwise is yet another lie on your part.

do you think that if the US healthcare system didn't have to spend so much on gun related injuries... there might be better access to healthcare for other things - maybe like cancer?

Each year in the U.S., firearm-related injuries lead to roughly 30,000 inpatient hospital stays and 50,000 emergency room visits, generating more than $1 billion in initial medical costs. In 2020 alone, deaths from these injuries cost $290 million, an average of $6,400 per patient.

Just saying....

But trying to convince the average gun owning american, that guns are dangerous and should be regulated, despite ALL the research, figure, statistics, and information that is constantly and consistently published, is like trying to convince the average american that they didn't actually win ww2, they only believe what they want to believe, and you are banging your head against a wall trying to convince them otherwise.

 

[phrodeau]

And yet somehow cancer deaths outnumber gun deaths by about 300%.

That's not cherry picking, it's a FACT. That you insist on being a bullshit artist trying to promote the lies fed to you by those who will control and own your ass if they ever get their way doesn't change that FACT.

BTW, the statistics you cite include suicides as "violence" and which wouldn't be stopped by banning and seizing guns. Trying to say otherwise is yet another lie on your part.

SWIMMING POOLS!!

 

[Bray123]

MAGAts view the lack of guns like I used to view quicksand.

 

[HisArpy]

do you think that if the US healthcare system didn't have to spend so much on gun related injuries... there might be better access to healthcare for other things - maybe like cancer?

Each year in the U.S., firearm-related injuries lead to roughly 30,000 inpatient hospital stays and 50,000 emergency room visits, generating more than $1 billion in initial medical costs. In 2020 alone, deaths from these injuries cost $290 million, an average of $6,400 per patient.

Just saying....

But trying to convince the average gun owning american, that guns are dangerous and should be regulated, despite ALL the research, figure, statistics, and information that is constantly and consistently published, is like trying to convince the average american that they didn't actually win ww2, they only believe what they want to believe, and you are banging your head against a wall trying to convince them otherwise.

What if's are rarely logical or viable.

"What if" we didn't spend any money on the military, couldn't we use that to cure cancer?

"What if" we didn't give any money as foreign aid, couldn't that be used to prevent suicide?

Basically, all you've done is try to move the goalposts away from the fact that you have no logical and reasoned argument for banning guns. Worse, none of your favored statistics prove that banning guns will prevent crime.

What you've done is bullshit YOURSELF into believing a lie and a fantasy.

 

[HisArpy]

SWIMMING POOLS!!

GO FUCK YOURSELF

 

[PastMaster]

What if's are rarely logical or viable.

"What if" we didn't spend any money on the military, couldn't we use that to cure cancer?

"What if" we didn't give any money as foreign aid, couldn't that be used to prevent suicide?

Basically, all you've done is try to move the goalposts away from the fact that you have no logical and reasoned argument for banning guns. Worse, none of your favored statistics prove that banning guns will prevent crime.

What you've done is bullshit YOURSELF into believing a lie and a fantasy.

There are so many logical and reasoned arguments for banning guns. 200 school shootings this year alone in the US. IS a logical and reasoned argument for gun control. There are more statistics than you care to mention that show that EVERY country in the world, that has gun control has much less gun crime per capita than the US.

You have just got your head SO far up your own ass that you refuse to listen to them. All you care about is that you get to keep your toys. There is no reasoning with someone who won't listen to reason.

As Mark Twain said, Never argue with and idiot, they will bring you down to their level, and then beat you with experience.

 

[HisArpy]

There are so many logical and reasoned arguments for banning guns. 200 school shootings this year alone in the US. IS a logical and reasoned argument for gun control. There are more statistics than you care to mention that show that EVERY country in the world, that has gun control has much less gun crime per capita than the US.

You have just got your head SO far up your own ass that you refuse to listen to them. All you care about is that you get to keep your toys. There is no reasoning with someone who won't listen to reason.

As Mark Twain said, Never argue with and idiot, they will bring you down to their level, and then beat you with experience.

The unfortunate part is that it's obvious that you actually believe this bullshit.

Here's a truth for you:

We are aware of the problem of handgun violence in this country, and we take seriously the concerns raised by the many amici who believe that prohibition of handgun ownership is a solution. The Constitution leaves the District of Columbia a variety of tools for combating that problem, including some measures regulating handguns, see supra, at 54–55, and n. 26. But the enshrinement of constitutional rights necessarily takes certain policy choices off the table. These include the absolute prohibition of handguns held and used for self-defense in the home. Undoubtedly some think that the Second Amendment is outmoded in a society where our standing army is the pride of our Nation, where well-trained police forces provide personal security, and where gun violence is a serious problem. That is perhaps debatable, but what is not debatable is that it is not the role of this Court to pronounce the Second Amendment extinct.

District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008)​

​

Unless and until you can change that FACT, your argument about statistics is as worthless as the data source you use for those statistics.

 

[PastMaster]

We are aware of the problem of handgun violence in this country, and we take seriously the concerns raised by the many amici who believe that prohibition of handgun ownership is a solution. The Constitution leaves the District of Columbia a variety of tools for combating that problem, including some measures regulating handguns, see supra, at 54–55, and n. 26. But the enshrinement of constitutional rights necessarily takes certain policy choices off the table. These include the absolute prohibition of handguns held and used for self-defense in the home. Undoubtedly some think that the Second Amendment is outmoded in a society where our standing army is the pride of our Nation, where well-trained police forces provide personal security, and where gun violence is a serious problem. That is perhaps debatable, but what is not debatable is that it is not the role of this Court to pronounce the Second Amendment extinct.

District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008)​

That's not a truth - its a legal opinion. And an opinion of the court that basically says that they don't have the right to pronounce the second amendment extinct.
It also specifically DOESN'T say that gun control wouldn't be effective, All it does say is that the 2nd Amendment forbids such control in its current format.

Sadly - your argument lacks any substance. You can capitalize the word FACT as many times as you like, but your facts are spurious.

Like I said - you refuse to admit that anything other than opinions that echo yours have any value - so there's no point in talking to you.

 

[Sean Renaud]

And yet somehow cancer deaths outnumber gun deaths by about 300%.

That's not cherry picking, it's a FACT. That you insist on being a bullshit artist trying to promote the lies fed to you by those who will control and own your ass if they ever get their way doesn't change that FACT.

BTW, the statistics you cite include suicides as "violence" and which wouldn't be stopped by banning and seizing guns. Trying to say otherwise is yet another lie on your part.

You do know that just because you're using facts doesn't mean you aren't cherry picking, though this right here is a teachable moment about what misinformation looks like.

No saying the suicides would go down by banning and seizing guns going down is pretty easy to support. You just like to lie.

Hisarpy
NO ONE. NOT ONE FUCKING SOUL on the planet will legitimately trade a diagnosis that they now have cancer merely for access to health care. Because no one will trade being healthy and lacking health care for them dying but with health care.

I apologize, I didn't read this properly the first time. Without access to healthcare you won't be diagnosed with cancer. People will be healthier with access to healthcare than the realistic outcome of your policy. Being dead but at least you didn't see it coming.

 

[Buffalogurl]

https://www.rd.com/article/gun-violence-statistics/



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In your cherry picking, you failed to highlight Columbia, Venezuela, Juarez Mexico and at least one eastern Slavic states. Oh and Juarez has been deemed the most violent city on the planet.... all of these mentioned shit holes have extreme anti gun gun laws.......

 

[Fuzzy1975]

In your cherry picking, you failed to highlight Columbia, Venezuela, Juarez Mexico and at least one eastern Slavic states. Oh and Juarez has been deemed the most violent city on the planet.... all of these mentioned shit holes have extreme anti gun gun laws.......

Of course they do.Can you guess why?

When comparing gun violence that the US experiences, you need to compare the US, against similar countries. Not places that have political instability, and or out right civil or drug wars.

You'd think you could figure that out for yourself, but, here we are.

 

[adrina]

In your cherry picking, you failed to highlight Columbia, Venezuela, Juarez Mexico and at least one eastern Slavic states. Oh and Juarez has been deemed the most violent city on the planet.... all of these mentioned shit holes have extreme anti gun gun laws.......

And apparently you can't read. It says right on it in comparison to high income countries. Unless you think America should be compared with shit holes...

 

[Buffalogurl]

Of course they do.Can you guess why?

When comparing gun violence that the US experiences, you need to compare the US, against similar countries. Not places that have political instability, and or out right civil or drug wars.

You'd think you could figure that out for yourself, but, here we are.

Oh no, no, gun violence is gun violence..... your just cherry picking.....
Put this to ponder..... if Ukraine was blessed with the bill of rights and in particular the 2nd amendment, how far, how well would the Russians have fared in the on going war? Especially in the on set of the war?

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Oh no, no, gun violence is gun violence..... your just cherry picking.....

So what exactly did I cherry pick? Do post.

Put this to ponder..... if Ukraine was blessed with the bill of rights and in particular the 2nd amendment, how far, how well would the Russians have fared in the on going war?

I'd say about as far as they got. Do you really think Putin would care. Now if Ukraine had kept the nukes after the break up of the USSR, then Putin might have had second thoughts.

Especially in the on set of the war?

Read my post above. What makes you think an armed populace is a deterrent to one country invading another? Are you so obtuse to give any thoughts to the talking points you constantly regurgitate?

 

[adrina]

So what exactly did I cherry pick? Do post.

I'd say about as far as they got. Do you really think Putin would care. Now if Ukraine had kept the nukes after the break up of the USSR, then Putin might have had second thoughts.

Read my post above. What makes you think an armed populace is a deterrent to one country invading another? Are you so obtuse to give any thoughts to the talking points you constantly regurgitate?

Yeah she's one of those. Abortion is not okay but having children killed by guns is just fine and dandy.

 

[phrodeau]

I will post it here too...

You know that escaped prisoner in Pennsylvania? Well now he is armed. Cause guns make us safer.

The murderous gunman is back in custody, alive and well, of course.