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yup but that has been a focus all along, they were stressing the shift from intercourse to oral as a way to prevent so many teen moms and dads
Does Anybody Besides Me Think This Is Kind of Appalling?
- Thread starter SlickTony
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SeaCat
Hey, my Halo is smoking
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Sorry guy, I just can't help shaking my head at how shocked you are. Didn't you ever play Doctor or spin the bottle? Or other games? didn't you have those in your school who everyone knew put out? I know I did and I grew up in the middle of no-where.
Hell we had the swimming hole where we all went swimming. None of us planned on going there, we just ind of got there on hot days. Because of that most of us didn't have bathing suits with us. Most of the time those that decided to play a little harder than the others didn't bother going into the bushes, they just played right there. No big deal.
As for the girls not having orgasm, that's kind of normal as well. Too bad though. I was always the strange one who tried to give as good as I got. (I always did like to get my face down between the legs.) For some strange reason I was always popular with the girls,a lthough not quite as popular with their parents.
All in all I don't find this as strange as if it had been about teen abstinance.
Cat
Hell we had the swimming hole where we all went swimming. None of us planned on going there, we just ind of got there on hot days. Because of that most of us didn't have bathing suits with us. Most of the time those that decided to play a little harder than the others didn't bother going into the bushes, they just played right there. No big deal.
As for the girls not having orgasm, that's kind of normal as well. Too bad though. I was always the strange one who tried to give as good as I got. (I always did like to get my face down between the legs.) For some strange reason I was always popular with the girls,a lthough not quite as popular with their parents.
All in all I don't find this as strange as if it had been about teen abstinance.
Cat
hiddenself
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That statement is patently incorrect. For many STDs, transmission rates seem to be far higher for (unprotected) intercourse than oral-genital contact.mrssublime said:
For example, for HIV, see:
Rothenberg RB et al, Oral Transmission of HIV. AIDS 1998; 12:2095-105
del Romero J et al Evaluating the Risk of HIV Transmission Through Unprotected Orogential Sex. AIDS 2002; 16:1296-97
http://www.thebody.com/cdc/oral.html
angela146
Literotica Guru
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I've mentioned this on other threads but I think it is worth repeating. Boys and girls are maturing faster *physically* than they did in the past by about 6 months per decade.
I was nine years old when I had my first period and was only about a year ahead of most of the girls in my age group. That was almost exactly twenty years ago.
Hence, we are probably getting to the point where 9 or 10 is the norm.
Kids today are having to deal with hormones at a much younger age.
Eighth grade isn't what it used to be.
I was nine years old when I had my first period and was only about a year ahead of most of the girls in my age group. That was almost exactly twenty years ago.
Hence, we are probably getting to the point where 9 or 10 is the norm.
Kids today are having to deal with hormones at a much younger age.
Eighth grade isn't what it used to be.
Lucifer_Carroll
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Maybe I'm the only one who remembers an old HBO program called Middle School Confessions where they interviewed all these middle school girls who talked about how they've given head to multiple guys and what not and also how the parties that feature drinking happen at younger and younger ages.
Also, there was that middle school kid who ran that prostitution ring out of a few of the girls in his school.
And I know at least in my time in high school and apparently among the kids in high school today, if you didn't get fucked by high school something must have been wrong with you.
Not to mention a younger brother of a friend of mine who goes to a high school in california where the school was so worried about the reports of students fucking in the gym during a dance that one of the vps started checking to make sure the girls had on underwear before they entered.
So...shocked, nah. Kids todays are training to be the erotica subjects of tomorrow.
Also, there was that middle school kid who ran that prostitution ring out of a few of the girls in his school.
And I know at least in my time in high school and apparently among the kids in high school today, if you didn't get fucked by high school something must have been wrong with you.
Not to mention a younger brother of a friend of mine who goes to a high school in california where the school was so worried about the reports of students fucking in the gym during a dance that one of the vps started checking to make sure the girls had on underwear before they entered.
So...shocked, nah. Kids todays are training to be the erotica subjects of tomorrow.
Pure
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maybe it should be clarified WHAT is appalling. in my mind, and stated by one tiny voice of dissent near the end of the article, the sexual activity (in whatever form, even blow jobs that are not sex)
_per se_ of young persons (teens and tweens) among themselves is not appalling at all.
the lack of condom use during intercourse is greatly disturbing, of course.
and as some posters remind us, it's shocking to those of us with poor memories, or sheltered pasts.
_per se_ of young persons (teens and tweens) among themselves is not appalling at all.
the lack of condom use during intercourse is greatly disturbing, of course.
and as some posters remind us, it's shocking to those of us with poor memories, or sheltered pasts.
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That's a bit humourous, I mean the girls not wearing knickers; they are the very flimsiest barrier to having sexLucifer_Carroll said:
.In my 'sock hop' days at our Catholic church gymnasium the nuns roamed the room and checked any couples dancing too closely. There were always a few teens thrown out of the dance, so of course they just went to fuck in a car. When the film Dirty Dancing came out I had to educate my husband then on the term (he was younger than me). It's what we called the dancing too closely, i.e., foreplay.
dirty dancer, Perdita
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Why NYT asking us to be a member to view the articles while collecting our personal information? Why are they building data base for Internet news readers?SlickTony said:
The Guardian doesn't ask us to become a member (and the Guardian dones't lie as often as NYT does).
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They are selling your e-mail address to spammers.Pure said:
Pure
Fiel a Verdad
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Chilled said,
They are selling your e-mail address to spammers.
that's what hotmail and disposable email addys are for.
but since I was there, here's a piece for those not registered:
excerpts, ny times
Friends, Friends With Benefits and the Benefits of the Local Mall
By BENOIT DENIZET-LEWIS
Published: May 30, 2004
Jesse wants to meet at Hooters. ''It's 40 minutes from where I live,'' he says, ''but trust me, it's worth the drive.'' Jesse is 15. Surprisingly, there is no age requirement to dine at Hooters. When I call the restaurant to make sure I'm not aiding and abetting teen delinquency, the woman who picks up seems annoyed I would even ask. ''No, we're a family restaurant,'' she says. So, amid the bronzed, scantily clad waitresses and a boisterous bachelor party, I find Jesse, a high-school sophomore with broad shoulders and messy brown hair peeking out from underneath his baseball cap. Jesse is there with four of his close friends, whom he has arranged for me to meet. Among them is Caity, a thin, 14-year-old freshman with long blond hair and braces, who says that she is a virgin but that she occasionally ''hooks up'' with guys. Caity doesn't make clear what she means by ''hooking up.''
The term itself is vague -- covering everything from kissing to intercourse -- though it is sometimes a euphemism for oral sex, performed by a girl on a boy. Sitting next to Caity is her best friend, Kate, also 14, whom everyone affectionately refers to as the ''prude'' of the group. Outgoing and attractive, she's had a boyfriend for a couple of months, but they haven't even kissed yet. In her New England exurban world, where, I was told, oral sex is common by eighth or ninth grade, and where hookups may skip kissing altogether, Kate's predicament strikes her friends, and even herself, as bizarre. ''It's retarded,'' she says, burying her head in Caity's shoulder. ''Even my mom thinks it's weird.''
Just a few weeks ago, Caity and Kate met a cute boy at the mall. ''Me and Kate walked into this store,'' Caity says, ''and this boy saw the shirt Kate was wearing that says, 'Kiss Me, I'm an Amoeba.'
So he was, like, 'That's an awesome shirt.'
And she was, like, 'Want me to make you one?'
So he went and got Sharpies, and she went and got T-shirts, we met back there and then he said to me, 'You want my screen name?' So he wrote it on my arm. He just got his license, so he came up, and we hooked up.''
I ask Caity if that's it, or if her hookup might lead to something more. ''We might date,'' she tells me. ''I don't know. It's just that guys can get so annoying when you start dating them.''
[...]
It's unclear just how many teenagers choose hookups or friends with benefits over dating. Many, in fact, go back and forth, and if the distinction between hooking up and dating can seem slippery, that's because one sometimes does lead to the other. But just as often, hooking up is nothing more than what it's advertised to be: a no-strings sexual encounter.
Recent studies show that it's not uncommon for high-school students to have sex with someone they aren't dating. A 2001 survey conducted by Bowling Green State University in Ohio found that of the 55 percent of local 11th graders who engaged in intercourse, 60 percent said they'd had sex with a partner who was no more than a friend.
That number would perhaps be higher if the study asked about oral sex. While the teen intercourse rate has declined -- from 54 percent in 1991 to 47 percent in 2003 -- this may be partly because teenagers have simply replaced intercourse with oral sex. To a generation raised on MTV, AIDS, Britney Spears, Internet porn, Monica Lewinsky and ''Sex and the City,'' oral sex is definitely not sex (it's just ''oral''), and hooking up is definitely not a big deal.
[...]
The teenagers I spoke to talk about hookups as matter-of-factly as they might discuss what's on the cafeteria lunch menu -- and they look at you in a funny way if you go on for too long about the ''emotional'' components of sex. But coupled with this apparent disconnection is remarkable frankness about sex, even among friends of the opposite gender.
Many teenagers spend a lot of time hanging out in mixed-gender groups (at the mall, at one another's houses), and when they can't hang out in person, they hang out online, asking the questions they might not dare to in real life. While this means that some friendships become sexually charged and lead to ''friends with benefits'' (one senior from Illinois told me that most of her friends have hooked up with one another), a good number remain platonic.
On Valentine's Day, I was invited to spend the evening with 12 junior and senior friends in an upper-middle-class suburb of Chicago. They were hanging out, eating pizza and watching TV. Not one had a Valentine, and most said they wouldn't have it any other way.
Several pointed out that having close friends of the opposite sex makes romantic relationships less essential. Besides, if you feel like something more, there's no need to feign interest in dinner and a movie. You can just hook up or call one of your friends with benefits. ''It would be so weird if a guy came up to me and said, 'Irene, I'd like to take you out on a date,''' said Irene, a tall, outgoing senior. ''I'd probably laugh at him. It would be sweet, but it would be so weird!''
Irene and her friends are not nerds. They are attractive and well liked, and most have had at least one romantic relationship. If that experience taught them anything, it's that high school is no place for romantic relationships. They're complicated, messy and invariably painful.
Hooking up, when done ''right,'' is exciting, sexually validating and efficient. ''I mean, sometimes you'll go out with a group of friends and meet someone cool, and maybe you'll hang out and hook up, but that's about it,'' said Irene's friend Marie (who asked me to use her middle name). ''There's a few people I know who date, but most of us are like, 'There's no one good to date, we don't need to date, so why date?' ''
Once Upon a Time, Before the Internet . . . The last time American teenagers seemed this uninterested in monogamous, long-term relationships was the 1930's and early 1940's, when high-school popularity was largely equated with social (but not sexual) promiscuity: the ''cool kids'' had lots of dates with lots of different people,
[end excerpts]
They are selling your e-mail address to spammers.
that's what hotmail and disposable email addys are for.
but since I was there, here's a piece for those not registered:
excerpts, ny times
Friends, Friends With Benefits and the Benefits of the Local Mall
By BENOIT DENIZET-LEWIS
Published: May 30, 2004
Jesse wants to meet at Hooters. ''It's 40 minutes from where I live,'' he says, ''but trust me, it's worth the drive.'' Jesse is 15. Surprisingly, there is no age requirement to dine at Hooters. When I call the restaurant to make sure I'm not aiding and abetting teen delinquency, the woman who picks up seems annoyed I would even ask. ''No, we're a family restaurant,'' she says. So, amid the bronzed, scantily clad waitresses and a boisterous bachelor party, I find Jesse, a high-school sophomore with broad shoulders and messy brown hair peeking out from underneath his baseball cap. Jesse is there with four of his close friends, whom he has arranged for me to meet. Among them is Caity, a thin, 14-year-old freshman with long blond hair and braces, who says that she is a virgin but that she occasionally ''hooks up'' with guys. Caity doesn't make clear what she means by ''hooking up.''
The term itself is vague -- covering everything from kissing to intercourse -- though it is sometimes a euphemism for oral sex, performed by a girl on a boy. Sitting next to Caity is her best friend, Kate, also 14, whom everyone affectionately refers to as the ''prude'' of the group. Outgoing and attractive, she's had a boyfriend for a couple of months, but they haven't even kissed yet. In her New England exurban world, where, I was told, oral sex is common by eighth or ninth grade, and where hookups may skip kissing altogether, Kate's predicament strikes her friends, and even herself, as bizarre. ''It's retarded,'' she says, burying her head in Caity's shoulder. ''Even my mom thinks it's weird.''
Just a few weeks ago, Caity and Kate met a cute boy at the mall. ''Me and Kate walked into this store,'' Caity says, ''and this boy saw the shirt Kate was wearing that says, 'Kiss Me, I'm an Amoeba.'
So he was, like, 'That's an awesome shirt.'
And she was, like, 'Want me to make you one?'
So he went and got Sharpies, and she went and got T-shirts, we met back there and then he said to me, 'You want my screen name?' So he wrote it on my arm. He just got his license, so he came up, and we hooked up.''
I ask Caity if that's it, or if her hookup might lead to something more. ''We might date,'' she tells me. ''I don't know. It's just that guys can get so annoying when you start dating them.''
[...]
It's unclear just how many teenagers choose hookups or friends with benefits over dating. Many, in fact, go back and forth, and if the distinction between hooking up and dating can seem slippery, that's because one sometimes does lead to the other. But just as often, hooking up is nothing more than what it's advertised to be: a no-strings sexual encounter.
Recent studies show that it's not uncommon for high-school students to have sex with someone they aren't dating. A 2001 survey conducted by Bowling Green State University in Ohio found that of the 55 percent of local 11th graders who engaged in intercourse, 60 percent said they'd had sex with a partner who was no more than a friend.
That number would perhaps be higher if the study asked about oral sex. While the teen intercourse rate has declined -- from 54 percent in 1991 to 47 percent in 2003 -- this may be partly because teenagers have simply replaced intercourse with oral sex. To a generation raised on MTV, AIDS, Britney Spears, Internet porn, Monica Lewinsky and ''Sex and the City,'' oral sex is definitely not sex (it's just ''oral''), and hooking up is definitely not a big deal.
[...]
The teenagers I spoke to talk about hookups as matter-of-factly as they might discuss what's on the cafeteria lunch menu -- and they look at you in a funny way if you go on for too long about the ''emotional'' components of sex. But coupled with this apparent disconnection is remarkable frankness about sex, even among friends of the opposite gender.
Many teenagers spend a lot of time hanging out in mixed-gender groups (at the mall, at one another's houses), and when they can't hang out in person, they hang out online, asking the questions they might not dare to in real life. While this means that some friendships become sexually charged and lead to ''friends with benefits'' (one senior from Illinois told me that most of her friends have hooked up with one another), a good number remain platonic.
On Valentine's Day, I was invited to spend the evening with 12 junior and senior friends in an upper-middle-class suburb of Chicago. They were hanging out, eating pizza and watching TV. Not one had a Valentine, and most said they wouldn't have it any other way.
Several pointed out that having close friends of the opposite sex makes romantic relationships less essential. Besides, if you feel like something more, there's no need to feign interest in dinner and a movie. You can just hook up or call one of your friends with benefits. ''It would be so weird if a guy came up to me and said, 'Irene, I'd like to take you out on a date,''' said Irene, a tall, outgoing senior. ''I'd probably laugh at him. It would be sweet, but it would be so weird!''
Irene and her friends are not nerds. They are attractive and well liked, and most have had at least one romantic relationship. If that experience taught them anything, it's that high school is no place for romantic relationships. They're complicated, messy and invariably painful.
Hooking up, when done ''right,'' is exciting, sexually validating and efficient. ''I mean, sometimes you'll go out with a group of friends and meet someone cool, and maybe you'll hang out and hook up, but that's about it,'' said Irene's friend Marie (who asked me to use her middle name). ''There's a few people I know who date, but most of us are like, 'There's no one good to date, we don't need to date, so why date?' ''
Once Upon a Time, Before the Internet . . . The last time American teenagers seemed this uninterested in monogamous, long-term relationships was the 1930's and early 1940's, when high-school popularity was largely equated with social (but not sexual) promiscuity: the ''cool kids'' had lots of dates with lots of different people,
[end excerpts]
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