Happy Pride Month!

[eric_erosfan]

they're actually saying to be left alone but you don't know any trans people. what you might know are straight allies, straight people with fetishes who label themselves as queer, liberal women. Politicizing trans has done far more to hurt them the same way its doing for the gay community. There has always been an entire world for trans that exists. Bars,clubs and shops that are separate from the gay community. Trans bars don't even want gay drag performers performing in them.

The kids being forced to learn about trans, homosexuality and kink don't have much of a say.

I think there are a lot of young people who think more about gender today than 30 years ago. I met a young Trans woman recently who is friends with my niece. If she had not been Trans, I think she would have been a very, very effeminate gay man. So why not just be an effeminate gay man? I have no idea. I guess there was a strong gender component to her identity.

I think we all know gays and lesbians who take on the dominant or submissive role in a relationship. Is that not also acting in an traditional gender role? Dominant=male, submissive=female?

 

[glamorilla]

I think there are a lot of young people who think more about gender today than 30 years ago. I met a young Trans woman recently who is friends with my niece. If she had not been Trans, I think she would have been a very, very effeminate gay man. So why not just be an effeminate gay man? I have no idea. I guess there was a strong gender component to her identity.

I think we all know gays and lesbians who take on the dominant or submissive role in a relationship. Is that not also acting in an traditional gender role? Dominant=male, submissive=female?

Your nieces "friend" was groomed by shitty adults.

 

[eric_erosfan]

Your nieces "friend" was groomed by shitty adults.

Nope. She didn't transition until college.

Sorry that destroys your belief system.

 

[glamorilla]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2068780488018235513

 

[glamorilla]

 

[eric_erosfan]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2068780488018235513

So when the moderators ban your alts but leave your original account alone is there a good reason for that?

 

[glamorilla]

So when the moderators ban your alts but leave your original account alone is there a good reason for that?

what alts are those?

 

[njlauren]

I think there are a lot of young people who think more about gender today than 30 years ago. I met a young Trans woman recently who is friends with my niece. If she had not been Trans, I think she would have been a very, very effeminate gay man. So why not just be an effeminate gay man? I have no idea. I guess there was a strong gender component to her identity.

I think we all know gays and lesbians who take on the dominant or submissive role in a relationship. Is that not also acting in an traditional gender role? Dominant=male, submissive=female?

You make a lot of assumptions here that are common and aren't true. First of all, you said that the trans girl could have been an very effeminate gay man, you are putting together sexual identity with gender identity. There are a lot of trans women who are into women, which obviously negates that. It is true that some trans women start out id'ing as gay men but then transition, but the reason they transition is they may be into men, but not as a man. There are more than a few gay men who claim that, who say trans women are gay men who are shamed of being gay and want to be seen as straight, but that while there are a few people like that (usually from places outside the US where being gay is so shameful), it is rare. The reality is it is a lot, lot easier to be a gay male in the world than trans, especially these days with the usual suspects finding another victim class they can have hysteria about and claim it is grooming, it doesn't exist, it isn't real, it is a perversion (sound familiar? Go back 40, 50years ago, and that was the war cry of the extreme right and especially the bible thumping losers, that being gay was a choice, it was 'taught' to kids so gay teachers should be banned from schools, it as caused because gay men didn't have good father figures, the whole thing). The right claimed being gay was against biology because nature made us to procreate, and gay people can't procreate.

Sexual identity and gender identity have something in common, both are likely inate, a function of brain structure that in turn is likely to come from pre natal development. You can't make a kid trans, any more than you can make a kid gay. What the numbnuts are really saying isn't that you can be made gay, they are saying you can force people to be afraid and force them to hide. So called conversion therapy, that once against the shithead supreme court is allowing, proves that. For all the claims of conversion therapy being valid, after study of the data shows that less than 5% of the people who went through it 5 years or more down the road are living as straight, dating women (or men for gay women). And empirical evidence indicates within that 5% that their desires didn't change, and many of the so called "Converted" were found out to be having sex with same sex partners even though married or in straight relationships. BTW the 5% rate of 'success' in a drug trial would be considered a failure, no different than a placebo.

And there is serious proof you cannot change someone's gender identity. There was a famous case from a while ago, where an infant boy due to a botched operation had the penis destroyed. The doctors counseled the parents and in consult with an expert on gender and gender identity, John Money, who said they could condition the child into accepting they were a girl, decided to raise the child that way. The kid was raised as a girl, they were socialized as a girl from its earliest moments, they had counseling and therapy to help them, to everyone she was a girl. Yet the kid was miserable, they never felt comfortable with themselves, felt they weren't there. The person finally in their 20's decided to transition to living as a male. Unfortunately the years of suffering took its toll, and they later commited suicide.

Too, with intersex kids (those who display mixed secondary sexual organs and the like), many times when they are born doctors tell the parents that they should make a decision on what they wish to the child to be, and that surgically they can remove 'the parts that don't belong". Kids are then raised as whatever the parents decide (which is either based on which sets of organs are more formed, or if ambiguous, as a boy if the kid is xy and a girl if xx). Something like half of intersex kids like this express they don't feel right and later on transition despite being raised as a boy or girl when xx/xy. These days the trend with intersex kids is to wait until they actually can say what they feel they are to make a decision, you can't do that when they are an infant.


Gender identity is not learned, it isn't creaed, it isn't a construct, it is something deeply inate in us. For most people, bio sex=gender identity, but a significant number of people that isn't true.

BTW, with sexual roles, the idea that one partner in a gay relationship is the 'man' and the other 'the woman', with submissive/dominant roles, is way, way, way out of date, it isn't that simple. Not to mention that male=dominant, female=submissive is very much heavily influenced by the world around , women who are dominant personality types are very much derided in society, while men who are submissive are made fun of and treated badly.

 

[njlauren]

View attachment 2635142

Truth. or worse, say you love someone, then vote for someone because they say they will give you a 20 dollar a week tax break.

 

[njlauren]

That is exactly how bigots viewed gays 30 years ago. They didn't show up at parades dressed in Dockers and Polo shirts.

And gender dysphoria makes as much sense to me as two guys fucking, so to many of us, you are exactly the same. And I support you being your authentic self Glam.

This is old hat in the gay community, this concept that it wasn't just being gay that drew haters, but it was 'them' , flamboyant gay men, butch gay women, leather people, etc. They used to call them pearl clutchers or corporate gays, who sold the image of apple pie, the white picket fence and the american dream, 'we are just normal folk'. In the early days after stonewall, this was common, the divide was huge. Lesbians often wanted nothing to do with gay men,gay men wanted nothing to do with lesbians. Both looked sideways at trans people, despite the fact that many of the people at Stonewall were gender different people, they were often the targets of the cops who raided the places. Back then NYC law made it illegal to be dressed as a member of the opposite sex (thanks to the Catholic Church's power in NYC, now thankfully long gone) in public (it was repealed later that year). They kind of threw the first rock and were prominent in the aftermath...and then were pushed aside to be blunt.

The warfare in the gay community about representation was ongoing, there was a lot of talk that the gay community (what we would call LG in shorthand) about the need to distance themselves from the things I just talked about. I have to laugh at those today who say "LGB without the T", Bi people were routinely hated upon by both gay men and gay women, they claimed bi people were people who were gay who couldn't commit.

A big battle brewed when the first attempts at same sex marriage reform was happening, back in the late 80's into the 90's. There was the same old thing, that if we just got rid of 'them' (trans, leather people, ya know, the 'freaks') everything would be great, people would accept same sex marriage. It came to a head at the 1994 pride march in NYC, "Stonewall 25", where with bitter irony Heritage of Pride, then controlled by the corporate gay types, banned trans people and gender queer people, from marching in the parade under their own banners, which given the history of Stonewall really was pathetic. They also did things like attempting to keep drag queens and leather people and the dykes on bikes (Sirens Lesbian MC) and the like out, their vision of a parade was John and Jane in their brooks brothers power suits and pearls (kind of like in the remake of the Stepford Wives where they have a gay couple where one of them is a corporate queen to the nth degree). It was a mess. Didn't matter, because guess what, the haters hated anyway, and Slick Willie signed DOMA.

It is an old trick of the haters to seperate members of a despised minority, turn them on each other. Put it this way, the only reason the GOP hasn't been as vicious with gay rights (though they are of course doing what they can to roll them back; if you are openly gay in the military, kiss your career good bye) is because they know it will alienate too many independent voters, and if they try to overturn same sex marriage they know it will expose them for being the cruel bastards they are. Plus it also would basically take away any shreds of the idea that scotus is independent of the gop, it would require several gop judges who were in the majority on Obergfell , to switch their vote and it would be blatently obvious why they did, especially since none of the doomsday scenarios the religious reich and the gop hatemongers predicted would happen, did in fact happen. Take it from me, they hate the LGB or LG as much as they hate the T; trans panic/trans hysteria is just another in a long line of social issues they can use to inflame the morons, but it wasn't long ago it was the T and L panic/hysteria that was being attacked

And again, this is nothing new. When the Nazis came to power in the early 30s, there were upper class German Jews, who felt they were integrated into German society and accepted (sound familiar?), who blamed Nazi anti semitism on the (mostly) lower class Jews who were socialists or trade unionists, who had been protesting the disasterous economy, pushing for workers rights, the upper class types I am talking about said those jews doing this were why anti semitism was rising. Not to mention there was a common trope that Bolshevism was a "jewish ideology" which the upper class Jews in a sense were agreeing with. History tells us of course that the hatred was of Jews as a group, and that the holocaust didn't discriminate between rich and poor, capitalist or socialist or trade unionist, they hated Jews.

Being trans and being gay are not the same thing (though obviously there are trans people who identify as gay when they transition), but the point is that the idea of the rainbow in the first place was to say all have the right to live in dignity, to live in peace with who they are. A straight friend of mine, asking seriously and without ill will, said why didn't the rainbow include straight people? I pointed out of course that trans people could be straight or gay or bi, but I also said that straight people already had the rights that the people of the rainbow flag were fighting for and had the dominant position in society, which they likely always will given numbers. I also made the point that when you are talking about fighting for rights it rarely is just about one group, civil rights legislation generally lays out a general principal that no matter who you are, you have full rights, and it stops infringement on the rights of everyone, doesn't allow for carve outs.

 

[eric_erosfan]

This is old hat in the gay community, this concept that it wasn't just being gay that drew haters, but it was 'them' , flamboyant gay men, butch gay women, leather people, etc. They used to call them pearl clutchers or corporate gays, who sold the image of apple pie, the white picket fence and the american dream, 'we are just normal folk'. In the early days after stonewall, this was common, the divide was huge. Lesbians often wanted nothing to do with gay men,gay men wanted nothing to do with lesbians. Both looked sideways at trans people, despite the fact that many of the people at Stonewall were gender different people, they were often the targets of the cops who raided the places. Back then NYC law made it illegal to be dressed as a member of the opposite sex (thanks to the Catholic Church's power in NYC, now thankfully long gone) in public (it was repealed later that year). They kind of threw the first rock and were prominent in the aftermath...and then were pushed aside to be blunt.

The warfare in the gay community about representation was ongoing, there was a lot of talk that the gay community (what we would call LG in shorthand) about the need to distance themselves from the things I just talked about. I have to laugh at those today who say "LGB without the T", Bi people were routinely hated upon by both gay men and gay women, they claimed bi people were people who were gay who couldn't commit.

A big battle brewed when the first attempts at same sex marriage reform was happening, back in the late 80's into the 90's. There was the same old thing, that if we just got rid of 'them' (trans, leather people, ya know, the 'freaks') everything would be great, people would accept same sex marriage. It came to a head at the 1994 pride march in NYC, "Stonewall 25", where with bitter irony Heritage of Pride, then controlled by the corporate gay types, banned trans people and gender queer people, from marching in the parade under their own banners, which given the history of Stonewall really was pathetic. They also did things like attempting to keep drag queens and leather people and the dykes on bikes (Sirens Lesbian MC) and the like out, their vision of a parade was John and Jane in their brooks brothers power suits and pearls (kind of like in the remake of the Stepford Wives where they have a gay couple where one of them is a corporate queen to the nth degree). It was a mess. Didn't matter, because guess what, the haters hated anyway, and Slick Willie signed DOMA.

It is an old trick of the haters to seperate members of a despised minority, turn them on each other. Put it this way, the only reason the GOP hasn't been as vicious with gay rights (though they are of course doing what they can to roll them back; if you are openly gay in the military, kiss your career good bye) is because they know it will alienate too many independent voters, and if they try to overturn same sex marriage they know it will expose them for being the cruel bastards they are. Plus it also would basically take away any shreds of the idea that scotus is independent of the gop, it would require several gop judges who were in the majority on Obergfell , to switch their vote and it would be blatently obvious why they did, especially since none of the doomsday scenarios the religious reich and the gop hatemongers predicted would happen, did in fact happen. Take it from me, they hate the LGB or LG as much as they hate the T; trans panic/trans hysteria is just another in a long line of social issues they can use to inflame the morons, but it wasn't long ago it was the T and L panic/hysteria that was being attacked

And again, this is nothing new. When the Nazis came to power in the early 30s, there were upper class German Jews, who felt they were integrated into German society and accepted (sound familiar?), who blamed Nazi anti semitism on the (mostly) lower class Jews who were socialists or trade unionists, who had been protesting the disasterous economy, pushing for workers rights, the upper class types I am talking about said those jews doing this were why anti semitism was rising. Not to mention there was a common trope that Bolshevism was a "jewish ideology" which the upper class Jews in a sense were agreeing with. History tells us of course that the hatred was of Jews as a group, and that the holocaust didn't discriminate between rich and poor, capitalist or socialist or trade unionist, they hated Jews.

Being trans and being gay are not the same thing (though obviously there are trans people who identify as gay when they transition), but the point is that the idea of the rainbow in the first place was to say all have the right to live in dignity, to live in peace with who they are. A straight friend of mine, asking seriously and without ill will, said why didn't the rainbow include straight people? I pointed out of course that trans people could be straight or gay or bi, but I also said that straight people already had the rights that the people of the rainbow flag were fighting for and had the dominant position in society, which they likely always will given numbers. I also made the point that when you are talking about fighting for rights it rarely is just about one group, civil rights legislation generally lays out a general principal that no matter who you are, you have full rights, and it stops infringement on the rights of everyone, doesn't allow for carve outs.

These two long posts were the most interesting posts I have ever read here. I have been educated quite well in 8 minutes. Thanks.

 

[njlauren]

These two long posts were the most interesting posts I have ever read here. I have been educated quite well in 8 minutes. Thanks.

You are welcome. I am that big on a lot of 'queer history' out there, because it often is so riddled with theories and academic tongue twisters and the like. On the other hand history teaches a lot, it gives understanding to what we are seeing, and sometimes even people directly tied to something don't know it.

It is the same way that most people have not been exposed to trans people or really have an understanding what it is about or where it comes from. It doesn't help that within the trans community there has been this incredible blurring of what it means to be trans, or to be honest,things that even I have questions about or problems, like trans women in women's sports and trans women being in spaces like locker rooms and going fully nude(talking pre op trans folks), there are questions and issues there. It has to be confusing as hell to people not in the middle of it, and of course the loudmouths who exploit it for the own gain, political or otherwise.

 

[Sign54]

Honestly, I think Mae Martin is funny and kind of hot.

 

[glamorilla]

You are welcome. I am that big on a lot of 'queer history' out there, because it often is so riddled with theories and academic tongue twisters and the like. On the other hand history teaches a lot, it gives understanding to what we are seeing, and sometimes even people directly tied to something don't know it.

It is the same way that most people have not been exposed to trans people or really have an understanding what it is about or where it comes from. It doesn't help that within the trans community there has been this incredible blurring of what it means to be trans, or to be honest,things that even I have questions about or problems, like trans women in women's sports and trans women being in spaces like locker rooms and going fully nude(talking pre op trans folks), there are questions and issues there. It has to be confusing as hell to people not in the middle of it, and of course the loudmouths who exploit it for the own gain, political or otherwise.

It might not sound like it but I've always been a big supporter of trans people. I don't think most people have a hard time grasping that trans people exist. If you look its always been there. You make a good point in those people who know nothing about trans are not being exposed to it in a good way. you pointed out the issues in women's sports and bathrooms (locker rooms) but there are also issues in how its being presented to school children and high schoolers.

This isn't organic. It's being done on purpose.

I'm curious if you know anything about genderfucks in the trans community during the 40 to 90's?

I believe they would refer to themselves as genderqueer today.

 

[eric_erosfan]

It might not sound like it but I've always been a big supporter of trans people. I don't think most people have a hard time grasping that trans people exist. If you look its always been there. You make a good point in those people who know nothing about trans are not being exposed to it in a good way. you pointed out the issues in women's sports and bathrooms (locker rooms) but there are also issues in how its being presented to school children and high schoolers.

This isn't organic. It's being done on purpose.

I'm curious if you know anything about genderfucks in the trans community during the 40 to 90's?

I believe they would refer to themselves as genderqueer today.

How is it being presented besides teaching kids that different kinds of people exist and to not throw rocks at gay people?

 

[Typo Fu Master]

How is it being presented besides teaching kids that different kinds of people exist and to not throw rocks at gay people?

Is a man in drag twerking in front of a 6 year old acceptable?

 

[eric_erosfan]

Is a man in drag twerking in front of a 6 year old acceptable?

Lol. Is that really what you think is happening in schools? Exactly how old are you?

 

[ll74]

Is a man in drag twerking in front of a 6 year old acceptable?

Is a woman twerking in front of a 6 yr old acceptable?

Do you believe children are only exposed to twerking because of drag queens? There's more sex on an 8pm network show.

 

[Typo Fu Master]

Lol. Is that really what you think is happening in schools? Exactly how old are you?

It was at a pride event.

Is a woman twerking in front of a 6 yr old acceptable?

Do you believe children are only exposed to twerking because of drag queens? There's more sex on an 8pm network show.

No.

No. If it's happening at home, it's the parent's problem.

 

[ll74]

No.

No. If it's happening at home, it's the parent's problem.

No matter where it happens, it's the parents problem. If a parent chooses to bring their kids to events that may be inappropriate to you, then they do.

But conservatives needing big gubment to save these kids' souls from the evil drag queens ...lol

 

[eric_erosfan]

It was at a pride event.

No.

No. If it's happening at home, it's the parent's problem.

So the government forced parents to bring their kids to a pride event to see drag queens?

Is the government in the room with you now?

 

[glamorilla]

https://www.washingtontimes.com/new...ents-report-feeling-pressured-kiss-sex-peers/

https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/c...-and-lgbtq-books-in-school-libraries/2817649/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_Queer:_A_Memoir

https://www.the-sun.com/news/3286258/actor-bare-bottomed-fake-penis-monkey-kids-event/

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/su...opt-kids-lgbtq-books-elementary-sc-rcna208040

https://youtu.be/XUeqmOXvnjQ?si=AiQvfiOIvXvvLFw0

 

[glamorilla]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2069149036704374888

 

[glamorilla]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2068029376667554074

 

[ll74]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2069149036704374888

How many of the same posts do you need to make in order to feel heard?