How to make sense of the differences in the Bible

[WriterDom]

Re: Re: Guys! Guys! Guys!

Very true, its a shame that so many think that christians are perfect or that christians are meant to be perfect, we are all humand with flesh and blood.

So David committed murder, and Jesus stopped the stoning of the adulterer by saying something like "he who has not sinned cast the first stone"

But people like Todd and dubya get a gleam in their eye when they talk about the death penalty

Damn, I'm starting to sound like a liberal. Who spiked my coffee?

 

[Todd]

Re: Re: Re: Guys! Guys! Guys!

So David committed murder, and Jesus stopped the stoning of the adulterer by saying something like "he who has not sinned cast the first stone"

But people like Todd and dubya get a gleam in their eye when they talk about the death penalty

Damn, I'm starting to sound like a liberal. Who spiked my coffee?

I don't get a gleam in my eye when death is invovled either by law or by criminal but until there is some reform in the legal system and the prison, I still think is the best solution for the evil hardene serial killer/murder.

First, we looked at david but to re quote:

"This shows that David is an exceptional case in the Old Testament, not typical at all. "

as for the woman taken in adultery:

John Chapter 8
1 ¶ Jesus went unto the mount of Olives.
2 And early in the morning he came again into the temple, and all the people came unto him; and he sat down, and taught them.
3 And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,
4 They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.
5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?
6 This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.
7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.
10 When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

The word Taken - katalambanw in the Greek means:

AV-take 3, apprehend 3, comprehend 2, come upon 1, attain 1, find 1, overtake 1, obtain 1; 15

1) to lay hold of
1a) to lay hold of so as to make one’s own, to obtain, attain to, to make one’s own, to take into one’s self, appropriate
1b) to seize upon, take possession of
1b1) of evils overtaking one, of the last day overtaking the wicked with destruction, of a demon about to torment one
1b2) in a good sense, of Christ by his holy power and influence laying hold of the human mind and will, in order to prompt and govern it
1c) to detect, catch
1d) to lay hold of with the mind
1d1) to understand, perceive, learn, comprehend

This seems to be indicative to me that she was caught in the very act of adultery/sex, now how would this happen?

Would the guys just happen to been walking by the house, her some erotic moaning, looked in the window and saw to people humping like dogs, recognized one as being married and ran in ad siezed her.

or, might it have been something like this:

The pharisees recognized Jesus as a threat on thier monopoly of the religion market, figured they would try and trip him up, get the services of a prostitute and as soon as she conscented and they began they siezed her, possibly a gangbang occured, and brought her to test him.

The second being more likely closer to a semblance of the incident, the law would call for both adulters to be put to death, but notice no mention is mad of the male participant is made. Quite possibly Jesus being God knew exactly what was going on, knew that one if not all the men that presented the women were the participating male/males, bent down on the ground scribbled out the law, and they all realized that if she was put to death so were they to be hence the walking away in shame.

8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last:

Did Jesus after wards condone her actions, I don't think so the words he used in the great are exclaimatroy or command type, much like an order

go, and sin no more.

 

[Todd]

Is a porn board full of wiccans and witches the place to be discussing the Bible? *shrugs* Just wondering .... Not sure how many catholics are here.

I thought that this was the general board

 

[ranajja]

Re: Re: Re: Guys! Guys! Guys!

So David committed murder, and Jesus stopped the stoning of the adulterer by saying something like "he who has not sinned cast the first stone"

But people like Todd and dubya get a gleam in their eye when they talk about the death penalty

Don't be so sure. Just because I'm a Christian doesn't mean I agree with the death penalty.

And hey, Todd--what's brought all this on? Why Bible 101? Seriously, where did all this come from? Is this your work, or are you in class, or what?

I mean, I can think of easier ways to run up your posts *wink*

And yeah, you're right, this is a general board.

 

[Todd]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Guys! Guys! Guys!

Don't be so sure. Just because I'm a Christian doesn't mean I agree with the death penalty.

And hey, Todd--what's brought all this on? Why Bible 101? Seriously, where did all this come from? Is this your work, or are you in class, or what?

I mean, I can think of easier ways to run up your posts *wink*

And yeah, you're right, this is a general board.

What brought it all on? People not seeming to understand the differences in the ninle and blaming it on contradictions instead of taking the time to understand the bible, so yes i thought I would do a little Bible 101, partial this is one of my tem paper for college senior year, but it has some additional information added since then.

Sorry

 

[Laurel]

Re: Re: Re: Guys! Guys! Guys!

So David committed murder, and Jesus stopped the stoning of the adulterer by saying something like "he who has not sinned cast the first stone"

But people like Todd and dubya get a gleam in their eye when they talk about the death penalty

Damn, I'm starting to sound like a liberal. Who spiked my coffee?

I did it! I thought it would help...

Wonderful discussion, btw...Todd - A link would've worked just as well.

Just picking on you a little, Toddles - don't get angry...

Where were we? Oh yes - God and love and imperfection...Carry on, scholars...

 

[Todd]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Guys! Guys! Guys!

I did it! I thought it would help...

Wonderful discussion, btw...Todd - A link would've worked just as well.

Just picking on you a little, Toddles - don't get angry...

Where were we? Oh yes - God and love and imperfection...Carry on, scholars...

Kinda hard to link to a file on my floppy 3 1/4 hard disk

And there is no way it would of fit as one post and mulitposting makes it load faster than one huge post. Sorry Laurel Love not intentional post padding

 

[ranajja]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Guys! Guys! Guys!

Sorry

Don't be. I think it's cool.

 

[Laurel]

Me too. Picking on you is a sign of my great affection for you.

 

[Todd]

Me too. Picking on you is a sign of my great affection for you.

Don't show me to much affection I don't wnat that big burly Manu dude beating me to a pulp

 

[Todd]

Well Where are all the anti biblers out there I know your hiding, I was and am waiting for you to tear each post apart word for word, line upon line, paragraph upon paragragh

 

[ChaoticLil]

Is a porn board full of wiccans and witches the place to be discussing the Bible? *shrugs* Just wondering .... Not sure how many catholics are here.

Not only that, but does he really expect anyone to read his long winded dissertation? I'm just looking to see how many pages he wrote.

You know, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but personally this is a little on the ridiculous side. But.....whatever floats his boat. I usually don't even read his posts, but this one got the best of my curiousity

 

[ranajja]

But.....whatever floats his boat.

Exactly!

Everyone should be passionate about something--

 

[Todd]

Exactly!

Everyone should be passionate about something--

even this passionate?

 

[Todd]

Thought I would bring this up seeing as people are once again quoting the bible with out placing it in context, just like a good televaglistic atheist does on TV.

 

[Dixon Carter Lee]

Name ONE televangelistic atheist on TV.

 

[Todd]

Name ONE televangelistic atheist on TV.

Jimmy Swagart, Jim Baker, Oral Roberts, Benny Hinn

 

[Dixon Carter Lee]

I'm sorry...are you saying those men are "Atheists"? Did you mean "Theist"? Or are you just, you know, insane?

 

[Todd]

I'm sorry...are you saying those men are "Atheists"? Did you mean "Theist"? Or are you just, you know, insane?

Thier only God is Money fame and women, hence that would make them an Athiest

 

[Dixon Carter Lee]

So, you're going with "insane" then?

 

[Todd]

bump for the current me

 

[ExLimey]

Anyone have Cliff's Notes for this thread?

 

[Todd-'o'-Vision]

Anyone have Cliff's Notes for this thread?

sory no cliffs notes

 

[phrodeau]

As mentioned in the last chapter, salvation was only decreed to those saved in the Old Testament because the necessary atonement and redemption to take the sins away had not yet been made (Heb. 10:4). Only the "lamb of God," Jesus Christ, who came in the "fullness of time" (Gal. 4:4) could make an acceptable atonement and provide "eternal redemption" to forever remove the penalty and guilt of sin from any believer. The hundreds of thousands of bloody animal sacrifices offered to God in the Old Testament could not do this, they could only temporarily cover the sins until Christ's expiatory sacrifice took them away. God decreed salvation to people in the Old Testament and remitted their sins solely on the basis of what He knew Christ would later do on the cross (Rom. 3:25).

Christ said Himself He came to die "for (because of) the remission of sins" in the past (Matt. 26:28). Without the cross God's decree of salvation would be of no lasting effect; God had to ultimately purchase eternal redemption. Thus the whole religious system of Judaism as revealed in the Old Testament could eternally save no one. It was for the most part a great object lesson to show man he was a sinner (Rom. 3:20), sin required payment (death) (Lev. 1-15), and a substitute provided by God could die in the sinner's place (Ex. 12). By the time Jesus was born, God had spent 4000 years trying to get these basic and essential doctrines through man's stubborn head, insisting man cannot save himself and only God can provide escape from the everlasting penalty of sin and supply eternal salvation.

Hebrews 10:6-8 says God took no pleasure in the animal sacrifices He required; they could not effectually deal with sin and neither could they satisfy God's justice and holiness. Only another man could pay for man's sin, and for this reason God prepared a body for the Word to become flesh. The eternal Word was "made of a woman, made under the law, to redeem them that were under the law..." (Gal. 4:4-5) and came "in the likeness of sinful flesh" (Rom. 8:3) so He could permanently redeem those born of Adam who will receive Him. Not only did God become a man to redeem mankind, He also came to earth as a man (not just in a man's body, but born fully a man) because He wanted to express and reveal Himself to man. This is why Christ is referred to as "the Word" (John 1:1); He is God's means of communicating Himself. God wanted man to know what kind of a person He is.

The animal sacrifices in the Old Testament were only a shadow of Christ's redemptive work (Heb. 10:1). And if God took no pleasure in the death of the animal sacrifices, how much less the death of His Son? His Son is infinity more valuable than any man, group of men, or animal, yet He gave His Son anyway. Contrary to today's popular self-esteem—self-worth "theology," man is by no means worth the suffering, agony, and separation from His Father Christ endured to redeem him, but God paid it nonetheless. Why? Simply because His LOVE and GRACE compelled Him to. God by His nature loved rebellious man immensely and motivated by this love devised a redemption plan to rescue him from his sins. Concerning salvation man can take credit for nothing. Individually or collectively man is not worth the price; it is all of God. God loves us not because of who we are, but because of who HE is! The self-esteem nuts who think otherwise are blinded by their bloated egos.

All of God's moral attributes were seen at the cross. His mercy was seen in allowing sinful man to live; His grace was seen which favored man with an opportunity to be redeemed; His justice and holiness were satisfied by Christ's propitiatory death; His righteousness was seen in Christ's righteous life and death; etc., but all of this was motivated by His unequaled love. God could have let man fall into Hell and pay for his sins himself throughout eternity and all of His attributes would have been satisfied, except for Mercy, Grace and Love. With the cross they ALL are satisfied. What a great God is our God! A God who gave Himself to redeem His enemies (Rom. 5:10)! Praise His name!

Every person ever saved in any dispensation is redeemed by Christ's death and shed blood. Though people in the various dispensations are saved differently concerning what is required of them to receive salvation, the basis of all salvation regardless of time or place is the blood of Christ. Without the blood no matter what one believed or did to be saved he would remain "without hope and without God" and be left to pay for his sins himself. In this chapter we will not emphasize the salvation doctrines of this present Church Age because they should be well know to the reader if he has been a Christian long (see the author's book on the Eight Major Doctrines of Salvation entitled More Than Forgiven for a concise study of these doctrines). Rather we are mainly going to examine the transition from "Law" to "Grace" and from "Grace" to the future dispensations, making every effort to rightly divide the Scriptures along the way.

I'll dig through the gravy and get right to the meat.

The single most essential element of Christian belief is in believing in and accepting human sacrifice. Jesus Christ was a human being. He was killed. His death atones for the sins of Christians.

The rite of Holy Communion is symbolic cannibalism. A wafer is recognized as the body of a human being, and passed around to be eaten. It's washed down with juice that is recognized as human blood.

Does the current Todd care to discuss?

 

[phrodeau]

bump