Non consensual BDSM stories

[shewantsmore]

I have just read a story from the BDSM category that is a kind of modernized story of O where a modern strong woman submits herself to a secret BDSM societey. It is very well written, but ultimately the female hero is abused by someone who has a sexual harassment history. And as if we would not bei after #metoo, the abuser is protected by this society and the victim has to take all the blame as is thrown out. Some may find this kind of non-consensual elements in BDSM appealing for me it has completely destroyed the story. (https://www.literotica.com/s/pt-01-rudiments)

Am I the only one who is appaled by abuse in stories and particular BDSM? How do others feel about such stories?

Im now going to read it myself, to see what its all about

 

[Usually_Lurking]

So my questions boils down to: What do others think of BDSM stories, where SSC/RACK is not adhered to?
Do you read them or do you seek them or do you skip them? (I hate them)

I read them, leaning towards seeking them rather than skipping them. I think BDSM in real life is often something we do while pursuing a fantasy, and we adhere to SSC/RACK in order to bridge the gap and allow ourselves to approach that fantasy while ensuring the real life safety of all involved. But that doesn't mean that the fantasy is about a safe situation. NC play, which is common in BDSM play whether we care to overlap them or not, is very much about acting out an unsafe fantasy. Likewise, true slavery is illegal for good reason, but collaring plays with that fantasy of ownership.

It is therefore not shocking to me at all that stories in the BDSM sphere are not written in line with SSC/RACK practices. If the characters are all imaginary and the sequence of events is entirely within the control of the author, then we can dispense with the safety net because none of this is real. The story can be exactly as 'safe' or 'unsafe' as we like, because it's a story. NC can be about true NC. Collaring can be about true ownership. Here is an opportunity to indulge the fantasy to its fullest extent.

Which is not to say that you should like it. I can understand why many would find it distasteful, because most BDSM stories are inherently about transgressing societal norms. I think we all draw our line somewhere. There are certainly many BDSM stories I don't care to read because I find them savage or disgusting. Other people would read the stories I enjoy (or write) and call them savage or disgusting. BDSM as a category is like that. The best we can do as authors is pay close attention to correctly tagging our works and including clear warnings at the beginning. I think that readers in this category should likewise inspect the tags and warnings to avoid a nasty surprise.

 

[RainyDayPen]

I read them, leaning towards seeking them rather than skipping them. I think BDSM in real life is often something we do while pursuing a fantasy, and we adhere to SSC/RACK in order to bridge the gap and allow ourselves to approach that fantasy while ensuring the real life safety of all involved. But that doesn't mean that the fantasy is about a safe situation. NC play, which is common in BDSM play whether we care to overlap them or not, is very much about acting out an unsafe fantasy. Likewise, true slavery is illegal for good reason, but collaring plays with that fantasy of ownership.

It is therefore not shocking to me at all that stories in the BDSM sphere are not written in line with SSC/RACK practices. If the characters are all imaginary and the sequence of events is entirely within the control of the author, then we can dispense with the safety net because none of this is real. The story can be exactly as 'safe' or 'unsafe' as we like, because it's a story. NC can be about true NC. Collaring can be about true ownership. Here is an opportunity to indulge the fantasy to its fullest extent.

Which is not to say that you should like it. I can understand why many would find it distasteful, because most BDSM stories are inherently about transgressing societal norms. I think we all draw our line somewhere. There are certainly many BDSM stories I don't care to read because I find them savage or disgusting. Other people would read the stories I enjoy (or write) and call them savage or disgusting. BDSM as a category is like that. The best we can do as authors is pay close attention to correctly tagging our works and including clear warnings at the beginning. I think that readers in this category should likewise inspect the tags and warnings to avoid a nasty surprise.

I couldn't agree more with all of this. As well, I have noticed in my fantasy scenarios my dommes have a fantastical supernatural sense of when their sub has hit his or her limit. No safewords would truly be needed in one of my stories (where a contract was signed) because the domme in that story is completely attuned. In real life obviously that's too risky, even with my partner who I've been with for a decade. We still need a safeword just in case. And every single scenario we play out together in the bedroom is CNC stuff.

Anyway your whole post was spot on. So well said.

 

[countdowntolov3]

Basically the story violated my understanding of SSC/RACK standards. The doms in the story acted in a way, that any person would have to have a self-destructive personality to submit to them.

Okay. I have to ask you something. And I hope you'll appreciate that I'm coming from a place of curiosity (and a little bit of confusion.) I do tend to agree with the, "BDSM fiction doesn't have to play by these rules," crowd here. But I'm not trying to "win" any argument to that end. I'm just befuddled. And I think maybe you're going to have a really interesting answer?

You say that you don't like discovering SSC violations in your BDSM stories. I think it's even fair to say that your position is: authors writing in the BDSM category have a duty to uphold these tenants in their fiction. Yet, in one of your two BDSM stories, "Whore For a Day" the submissive is made to pick up her takeout order with cum all over her face. That's not SCC, right? The public didn't consent to being part of her sex game. So, what's up with that? In your mind, where is the line? And why?

 

[Stimtheone]

I did not look if someone else said it already, but consent is a CRUCIAL part of BDSM. Kinda like flour with pastry, water with soup, or sulfuric acid for every indian recipe. If it's non-consensual, it's not BDSM. I will not have people call the rape and abuse of others BDSM.

If your understanding of it is exclusively from porn.... and you want to write about it... go read what it's actually about.

Now, if you said non-sexual BDSM.... hehe... we could certainly make a philosophical essay.

 

[RainyDayPen]

I did not look if someone else said it already, but consent is a CRUCIAL part of BDSM. Kinda like flour with pastry, water with soup, or sulfuric acid for every indian recipe. If it's non-consensual, it's not BDSM. I will not have people call the rape and abuse of others BDSM.

If your understanding of it is exclusively from porn.... and you want to write about it... go read what it's actually about.

Now, if you said non-sexual BDSM.... hehe... we could certainly make a philosophical essay.

In real life that would be abuse and not BDSM. But stories are places where our imagination can explore things we would never do or even necessarily want if completely real.

It's like a movie. As long as the actors are kept safe at all times then the fantasy scenarios are fine. A lot happens in movies that we wouldn't want in real life in order to create drama. In BDSM stories it's the same, except to create arousal.

When you are tied up, or being spanked or whipped do you really just stay there without any imagination at all? Your brain says that you're tied to a chair, and there's no fantasy playing out in your head at all? It's just enough to be tied and feel the rope and your have no roleplay whatsoever? That's bizarre to me.

I lay over my husbands lap and we can pretend I've been a bad student for my professor. I don't just lay there and think so plainly like my husband is slapping me safely and consensually. What a turn off I'm sorry. What a failure of imagination.

This is to say nothing of stories where no real humans are in any danger at all.

 

[CraftyGiGi76]

This thread took a different turn than I expected. Maybe, because English is my second language, the use of some words was not accurate. I found it hard to put in words, what disturbed me.

Basically the story violated my understanding of SSC/RACK standards. The doms in the story acted in a way, that any person would have to have a self-destructive personality to submit to them.

And to me that just adds to the cliché, that BDSM is a kind of personality disorder. (like 50sog)

Writing such a story is fine with me, when I can see it coming (and thus avoid the story)

For 3/4 the story was fine and then it took a turn, where I thought, "oups the author apparently has a totally different understanding of BDSM than I have have."

So my questions boils down to: What do others think of BDSM stories, where SSC/RACK is not adhered to?
Do you read them or do you seek them or do you skip them? (I hate them)

I don't seek them out or read them if I know there's a trigger for the NC. I'm an abuse survivor and it's just too much for me. I have limits for what is triggering if that makes sense. It's one thing to role play with someone you completely trust. It's a whole other thing when you don't know what's going to happen at any given moment and are forced to do something you don't want to. That's just me though. I know some people have fantasies they want to live out....I've done that in the past...I knew what was going to happen, we had rules set, trust was fully in place and I knew that everything was going to be ok. It was actually very therapeutic for both of us. But to read about it, is still a huge trigger for me. Hopefully that answers some of the questions.

 

[Andreas_Kreuz]

There just straight up needs to be a NC BDSM category.

I think consistent tagging would do the job as well. BDSM story search would greatly benefit if it always had tags like femdom, maledom, switch. And tags if a certain theme is there like: Pain, Humiliation, Exhibitionism, CNC, Blood, TPE, 247, RAC, Torture, Slavery

 

[CurvyMrs]

I am a bdsm submissive and I take part in such scenes in the fet/bdsm community at clubs and safe places. This is literature. This is fantasy. No one gets harmed through reading and writing. It is when people use excuses that the lines get blurred. No book was ever responsible for a humans behaviours. If it offends you then you absolutely are right to not read it. But for me I like the edgy, I need the dark places of roughness and risk. I’m ok just here

 

[SimonDoom]

I think part of the reason there's so much heat on this topic at Literotica is that it's not really clear whether the BDSM category is meant to be "stories depicting BDSM" or "stories to fuel BDSM fantasies".

Definitely. Again, it's useful to explore why categories exist in the first place. The point is to connect readers--all of the readers--with stories in the most helpful way possible. The Site's interest in having a BDSM category is to appeal to ALL readers who fancy themselves fans of the category, not just those who actually practice BDSM and are familiar with its "rules." Category parameters should be interpreted loosely and broadly, not strictly. That concept should apply to all categories, not just BDSM.

 

[Cagivagurl]

I have just read a story from the BDSM category that is a kind of modernized story of O where a modern strong woman submits herself to a secret BDSM societey. It is very well written, but ultimately the female hero is abused by someone who has a sexual harassment history. And as if we would not bei after #metoo, the abuser is protected by this society and the victim has to take all the blame as is thrown out. Some may find this kind of non-consensual elements in BDSM appealing for me it has completely destroyed the story. (https://www.literotica.com/s/pt-01-rudiments)

Am I the only one who is appaled by abuse in stories and particular BDSM? How do others feel about such stories?

Non con is disgusting in all it's perversions.
Anybody physically abused is not sexually appealing to me.
I find it's acceptance repugnant at best.

Cagivagurl

 

[Andreas_Kreuz]

I find it's acceptance repugnant at best.

So I have written an alternative ending. which you find here: https://literotica.com/s/ricochet-1 I would be interested in comments on that. I guess @Cagivagurl might find that more satisfying. How do others relate to it?

 

[Toffer_Guy]

Non con is disgusting in all it's perversions.
Anybody physically abused is not sexually appealing to me.
I find it's acceptance repugnant at best.

Cagivagurl

While I do agree real life rape and sexual assault is disgusting, and the law should be harsher against it. You really don’t have the place to kink shame others for their fetishes and fantasies. Looking through your list of published stories, I’m certain there are people who’d shame your fiction lesbian and transgender/crossdressing sex, calling it repugnant. I respect that the concept doesn‘t appeal to you. That’s a valid position. It‘s wrong for your fantasies to be judged, and for you to judge other people’s fictional fantasies.
There are things that turn me off in porn and other erotica. Anything drawing blood, snuff, pee, scat, and adults talking either like a child or to one just turns me right off. I just leave it to those who want that. Just as long as they know where to draw the line between fantasy and reality.

Society has always glorified violence, but that doesn't make people violent. Just look at how many movies have the hero going on violent murder sprees to revenge wrongdoings. Hell, Avengers:End Game had Thor chop off Thanos’ arm and head, and people take kids to see those. Those don’t create real world violence. Just like violent video games don‘t. It’s fiction.

In psychology, we studied things like CNC fantasies and how they don't directly relate to real assault. It would surprise people to learn how many women have CNC fantasies. The theme is filled in many trashy romance novels for a reason. Society puts a lot of shame on sexuality, especially on the idea of women enjoying sex. In the CNC fantasy, women will imagine they could do the wildest things in their imagination. Removed from shame, because in the fantasy they didn’t have a choice. It’s how they rationalize it. What they’re really just imagining is rough sex without judgment - including their own. It's not as if any of these women really want to be raped. As my psychology teacher put on every test on the subject. Rape isn’t about sex. It’s about control.

 

[forgotmyantidepressants]

While I do agree real life rape and sexual assault is disgusting, and the law should be harsher against it. You really don’t have the place to kink shame others for their fetishes and fantasies. Looking through your list of published stories, I’m certain there are people who’d shame your fiction lesbian and transgender/crossdressing sex, calling it repugnant. I respect that the concept doesn‘t appeal to you. That’s a valid position. It‘s wrong for your fantasies to be judged, and for you to judge other people’s fictional fantasies.
There are things that turn me off in porn and other erotica. Anything drawing blood, snuff, pee, scat, and adults talking either like a child or to one just turns me right off. I just leave it to those who want that. Just as long as they know where to draw the line between fantasy and reality.

Society has always glorified violence, but that doesn't make people violent. Just look at how many movies have the hero going on violent murder sprees to revenge wrongdoings. Hell, Avengers:End Game had Thor chop off Thanos’ arm and head, and people take kids to see those. Those don’t create real world violence. Just like violent video games don‘t. It’s fiction.

In psychology, we studied things like CNC fantasies and how they don't directly relate to real assault. It would surprise people to learn how many women have CNC fantasies. The theme is filled in many trashy romance novels for a reason. Society puts a lot of shame on sexuality, especially on the idea of women enjoying sex. In the CNC fantasy, women will imagine they could do the wildest things in their imagination. Removed from shame, because in the fantasy they didn’t have a choice. It’s how they rationalize it. What they’re really just imagining is rough sex without judgment - including their own. It's not as if any of these women really want to be raped. As my psychology teacher put on every test on the subject. Rape isn’t about sex. It’s about control.

Thank you for saying this. I am a woman who enjoys CNC and I'm not ashamed to say that I enjoy rough sex. I completely understand that CNC turns most people off, but reading CNC erotica really helped me explore and come to terms with my sexuality. If CNC is not for you, don't read it. But don't shame people who do.

 

[HST666]

I'm not talking about separating a story from reality. One point is using blatant stereotypes.... like for blacks: the 'big dicked nigger', the 'ghetto rat drug dealer' or 'pimp'. One story might denigrate another may move those same characteristics to a pedestal And in that case of course the white men become 'little cocked boi's' or some such.
[Material prohibited per our forum guidelines.]

And I am an avid fan of letting erotic fantasies loose. Or even put yourself as a writer into that mindset and see where it takes you. I'm talking the extreme. Where it can push the boundaries into danger.

Reading this now, I am reminded that my general distaste for stories that focus on IR (and AV Porn as well) is that they tend to be full of negative or arguably negative stereotypes. Much of it comes across as a bit racist.

 

[Toffer_Guy]

Thank you for saying this. I am a woman who enjoys CNC and I'm not ashamed to say that I enjoy rough sex. I completely understand that CNC turns most people off, but reading CNC erotica really helped me explore and come to terms with my sexuality. If CNC is not for you, don't read it. But don't shame people who do.

Happy to hear my words helped you. I just can’t stand hypocritical bullies. Thinking they can shame people for one kink while indulging their own. It’s understandable that people have things they aren’t into. There are things I don’t enjoy either. Just leave it to those who do. It’s adult fiction. It’s more concerning if such graphic erotic themes are in fiction for minors.

The original post I was replying to. That person apparently tried sending me a large DM, but removed any ability for me to reply. Just deleted without reading it. A person who wants to only talk at and not listen. So odd seeing people who write erotic fiction being so judgmental.

Nice to hear how you explore your interests in a safe, healthy manner. I enjoy the fantasy of CNC sometimes, but in the way everyone is enjoying themselves at some point. Basically just rough sex. I even just posted my first story on Lit that is about a happily married woman describing her rough sex fantasies as she masturbates. Link in my signature.

I put a lot of effort to approach it in a way women readers who enjoy the fantasy could enjoy. Would love to hear input as I work on chapter two.

 

[forgotmyantidepressants]

Happy to hear my words helped you. I just can’t stand hypocritical bullies. Thinking they can shame people for one kink while indulging their own. It’s understandable that people have things they aren’t into. There are things I don’t enjoy either. Just leave it to those who do. It’s adult fiction. It’s more concerning if such graphic erotic themes are in fiction for minors.

The original post I was replying to. That person apparently tried sending me a large DM, but removed any ability for me to reply. Just deleted without reading it. A person who wants to only talk at and not listen. So odd seeing people who write erotic fiction being so judgmental.

Nice to hear how you explore your interests in a safe, healthy manner. I enjoy the fantasy of CNC sometimes, but in the way everyone is enjoying themselves at some point. Basically just rough sex. I even just posted my first story on Lit that is about a happily married woman describing her rough sex fantasies as she masturbates. Link in my signature.

I put a lot of effort to approach it in a way women readers who enjoy the fantasy could enjoy. Would love to hear input as I work on chapter two.

I will definitely check it out later

 

[WeShallUnclench]

There just straight up needs to be a NC BDSM category.

The NC/R category seems to be frequented by folks who want rape-play fantasies. Usually with a female victim.

Wait, something I'd like to check - is N/R on Literotica a place for "problematic" femdom as well?
Or is it - de facto - really mostly male rape fantasies with female victims? Because that could be kinda crucial for some posting decisions I'll have to make.
I was just told that picking the right categories and knowing your audience is kind of a big deal here.

The trouble is, if BDSM stories must be about wholesome consent, and N/R is for male fantasies of abuse (up to and including rape) against women, that's a bit of a pickle for stories on the, let's say, "mean femdom" side of the equation...

 

[joy_of_cooking]

Wait, something I'd like to check - is N/R on Literotica a place for "problematic" femdom as well?

The trouble is, if BDSM stories must be about wholesome consent, and N/R is for male fantasies of abuse (up to and including rape) against women, that's a bit of a pickle for stories on the, let's say, "mean femdom" side of the equation...

I have a recent datum point here. I accidentally posted a noncon femdom story Snowed In with a Predator to NC/R where it was 3.3 after 8 votes. I reposted the same text as Fetish. There, it was 5.0 after 8 votes and has now settled down to 4.58 after 19 votes.

 

[vagrantx]

Wait, something I'd like to check - is N/R on Literotica a place for "problematic" femdom as well?
Or is it - de facto - really mostly male rape fantasies with female victims? Because that could be kinda crucial for some posting decisions I'll have to make.
I was just told that picking the right categories and knowing your audience is kind of a big deal here.

The trouble is, if BDSM stories must be about wholesome consent, and N/R is for male fantasies of abuse (up to and including rape) against women, that's a bit of a pickle for stories on the, let's say, "mean femdom" side of the equation...

I'm new, but my stories so far are exclusively f/f true-noncon femdom stuff, in the NC/R category. I do include some warnings before the stories, about their severity (severe), and haven't had any complaints regarding the subject matter so far. In fact, reception has been overwhelmingly positive! Then again my kinks are very niche, even in the nc/r category.

I'm not sure if f/f noncon just flies below the radar? Even if it is unquestionably abuse, the lack of dick-goes-in/dick-goes-out and a higher focus on mental power dynamics might play a role in peoples perception.

Either way, if you're planning on doing some f/f noncon, then don't be scared of the nc/r category. People seem friendly enough.

 

[WeShallUnclench]

Either way, if you're planning on doing some f/f noncon, then don't be scared of the nc/r category. People seem friendly enough.

I was gonna ask "What about F/m" in nc/r , but of course you're speaking from your personal experience, of what you're writing.

So I'll just throw that question out to the rest of the thread, if someone can say something about it

 

[WeShallUnclench]

I have a recent datum point here. I accidentally posted a noncon femdom story Snowed In with a Predator to NC/R where it was 3.3 after 8 votes. I reposted the same text as Fetish. There, it was 5.0 after 8 votes and has now settled down to 4.58 after 19 votes.

Huh. Interesting, but also shows how tricky the categories are.

Not sure what conclusions to draw from it that the audience accepts nc/r femdom as a fetish rather than nc/r "proper"

Anyway, gonna check out your story for inspiration, maybe things become clearer

 

[AG31]

I was just told that picking the right categories and knowing your audience is kind of a big deal here.

Given the amount of hand-wringing going here on the part of authors trying to figure out where to put a story, I think a reader would be nuts to stick to just one category when looking for something that grabs their attention. I regularly peruse BDSM, Fetish and NC/R.

 

[MediocreAuthor]

I have a recent datum point here. I accidentally posted a noncon femdom story Snowed In with a Predator to NC/R where it was 3.3 after 8 votes. I reposted the same text as Fetish. There, it was 5.0 after 8 votes and has now settled down to 4.58 after 19 votes.

I don't think that's entirely fair. Your femdom story was a triumphant tale where a woman dodges rape. It was excellent, but there was no fully nonconsensual sex in it.

That said, I write femdom and maledom stories which I would classify as noncon, and yes, there is a very clear bias towards for maledom and against femdom.

To be perfectly fair, I think that more men fantasize about control, and more women fantasize about relinquishing control. I'm an outlier who loves both, but a quick glance at my story scores will show you that maledom generally scores higher than femdom.

 

[WeShallUnclench]

I don't think that's entirely fair. Your femdom story was a triumphant tale where a woman dodges rape. It was excellent, but there was no fully nonconsensual sex in it.

That said, I write femdom and maledom stories which I would classify as noncon, and yes, there is a very clear bias towards for maledom and against femdom.

To be perfectly fair, I think that more men fantasize about control, and more women fantasize about relinquishing control. I'm an outlier who loves both, but a quick glance at my story scores will show you that maledom generally scores higher than femdom.

VERY instructive if a bit disappointing. Also increases my suspicion that nc/r is not the category for me

My only worry then is though that those kinds of stories might get "punished" (relatively speaking) no matter where you put them. Maybe I'll just pick 'fetish' and hope for the best? I'll check out @joy_of_cooking 's story first though