Quality Dominant/Submissive Relationships

[Nezhul]

great summary!

 

[LI Kerwell]

100%. You just forgot the part about how that’s all a lot harder than it sounds.

Wise words though.

Thoughts on D/s borrowed and revamped a bit...

A D/s relationship is just that…a relationship. Some people who practice D/s get off on having a bunch of rules and routines, but no matter what the format, the same basic ‘vanilla’ rules apply.

Dick pics or telling a potential sub that they must call you "Master" or "Sir" probably won't get you very far.

Kindness and the benefit of the doubt will go a long way. Just like in any other relationship.

Sex is fabulous, but sex alone isn’t a relationship.

Communicate, communicate, communicate. Say what you mean, and mean what you say.

Don’t stay with someone who makes you feel badly about yourself.

Consent is given freely without coercion. (And there should never be a ‘but’ or an ‘except’ after this one.)

Don’t say it’s okay if it’s not.

Bad days will happen. Don’t threaten to leave every time things are difficult.

Remember that sometimes you have to place harmony above your desire to be right.

When all else fails default to love.

Calling yourself a Dom, sub, Master, slave, or pet doesn’t change the basics of how relationships work. You are still two people who need to work out all of the usual stuff with each other.

Take her on a real date. Open her door. Compliment her on something other than how she looks. Her being submissive doesn’t mean basic chivalry goes out the window.

Don’t expect him to read your mind. If you want something communicate. Don’t assume that sex is the only thing he cares about.

Learn to love yourself so you can love and be loved fully. The bondage, ropes, kneeling, and rules come later. They are the structure that holds the relationship. If you have those things but don’t have anything to fill the space inside then the structure collapses.

 

[Nezhul]

100%. You just forgot the part about how that’s all a lot harder than it sounds.

Wise words though.

also how you shouldn't try to do everything all at once. Pick a thing and do it. Then add one more thing to it.
A lot of people new to fetish are so overwhelmed with their desires that they want everything all at once.

 

[GaleaFiguro]

There is a lot of people who say subs that "top from the bottom" are "bad", yet I am one of these "subs" in past and would like to clarify why we top from the bottom and the type of man who likely will be our partners in what is still what I deem a quality functional BDSM relationship.

I am a dominant. Topping from the bottom is how I realized this, actually. Subs who top from the bottom are not submissives, at all, IMO. The dominant is actually the submissive.

Why did I identify as a submissive and assume dominant control with my partner?

- I felt that as a woman that the submissive role was likely what was expected and the role I had been conditioned to accept.

- My partner in this relationship needed to learn to be the dominant in many areas of life and become a leader but was inexperienced in this realm.

- My partner had a high pain threshold, when I was given consent to bind and whip him, he went to sub drop in 1 minute flat having a very bad ab reaction.

- I, on the other hand, intensely enjoyed the act of inflicting pain on someone a little too much and I became frightened that I would harm someone in this role.

(Also my enjoyment doing this as the dominant was not arrousing to me, sexually. This disturbed me, also.)

I provided him with what I call "the illusion of power", in this space his self esteem was able to flourish, he became more confident in himself, he realized his potential, over time he became more capable of being the dominant on his own.

I hoped that he could assume the leadership/dominant role in our relationship, at some point. I would need a switch/equal partner who can assume either, in reality, but during a time of true vulnerability (and any time I explicitly tried to give him control or my "true" submission in my life or in bed), our relationship would become volatile. He would have a nervous breakdown and lash out causing me to leave for my safety.

He would become overwhelmed with the responsibility of leadership, dominance and unable to mentally handle it. Unable to fully assume that role, we would return back to the power dynamic from before, things would be okay. Then I would give him control hoping he could lead/dom but the same thing would happen. Eventually it was going to have to end permanently.

He enjoyed satisfying and pleasing me, I allowed him to do so. He had low self esteem, grew up with a family of strong women who would manipulate and exploit him. He needed to learn to take charge. We had become well read on BDSM resources, the relationship was highly therapeutic for us both.

He, unfortunately, had never been in a dominant role and needed to for his sake and guiding him thru this was therapeutic and empowering for him. I had hoped he would become a good leader/dom or equal...but...eh.

Would I hold some guys hand thru it again? Probably not.
I am exploring embracing the control/dominance aspect and beginning to accept that I wasn't a sub in the first place but don't mind being one if needed. Would prefer future partners to have experience in that realm or at the least, lead the relationship and not buckle from the pressure when they are in control.

 

[BubblyBookworm]

There is a lot of people who say subs that "top from the bottom" are "bad", yet I am one of these "subs" in past and would like to clarify why we top from the bottom and the type of man who likely will be our partners in what is still what I deem a quality functional BDSM relationship.

I am a dominant. Topping from the bottom is how I realized this, actually. Subs who top from the bottom are not submissives, at all, IMO. The dominant is actually the submissive.

Why did I identify as a submissive and assume dominant control with my partner?

- I felt that as a woman that the submissive role was likely what was expected and the role I had been conditioned to accept.

- My partner in this relationship needed to learn to be the dominant in many areas of life and become a leader but was inexperienced in this realm.

- My partner had a high pain threshold, when I was given consent to bind and whip him, he went to sub drop in 1 minute flat having a very bad ab reaction.

- I, on the other hand, intensely enjoyed the act of inflicting pain on someone a little too much and I became frightened that I would harm someone in this role.

(Also my enjoyment doing this as the dominant was not arrousing to me, sexually. This disturbed me, also.)

I provided him with what I call "the illusion of power", in this space his self esteem was able to flourish, he became more confident in himself, he realized his potential, over time he became more capable of being the dominant on his own.

I hoped that he could assume the leadership/dominant role in our relationship, at some point. I would need a switch/equal partner who can assume either, in reality, but during a time of true vulnerability (and any time I explicitly tried to give him control or my "true" submission in my life or in bed), our relationship would become volatile. He would have a nervous breakdown and lash out causing me to leave for my safety.

He would become overwhelmed with the responsibility of leadership, dominance and unable to mentally handle it. Unable to fully assume that role, we would return back to the power dynamic from before, things would be okay. Then I would give him control hoping he could lead/dom but the same thing would happen. Eventually it was going to have to end permanently.

He enjoyed satisfying and pleasing me, I allowed him to do so. He had low self esteem, grew up with a family of strong women who would manipulate and exploit him. He needed to learn to take charge. We had become well read on BDSM resources, the relationship was highly therapeutic for us both.

He, unfortunately, had never been in a dominant role and needed to for his sake and guiding him thru this was therapeutic and empowering for him. I had hoped he would become a good leader/dom or equal...but...eh.

Would I hold some guys hand thru it again? Probably not.
I am exploring embracing the control/dominance aspect and beginning to accept that I wasn't a sub in the first place but don't mind being one if needed. Would prefer future partners to have experience in that realm or at the least, lead the relationship and not buckle from the pressure when they are in control.

You all have provided wonderful insight and information!!

 

[GaleaFiguro]

Are you talking about online or in person or doesn't it matter for this conversation?

When you say "fictional" - do you mean more of a cliche version of bdsm? Because what you describe - issuing edicts/orders via messaging - is truthful for some folks. When I first started exploring bdsm, it was all online. I experienced that type of communication: "twist your nipples five times to the right, slut" and I loved it. Now, not so much but at the time it worked. I learned a lot about what I liked, didn't like, testing limits, etc.

Never trust any individual who makes demands of you and assumes dominance. Dominant role should be earned. Power exchange is a crucial aspect in BDSM were control is relinquished by the submissive.

Most dominants, professionals I personally know, never approached me, not once, in a domineering way. I was not a client and they they carried themselves in public with others were kind, and respectful. Their maturity spoke volumes. Any dominant will establish his credibility and why he is legitimate and earn your trust.

A dom who is inexperienced will make demands before establishing trust because they think that is how BDSM works.

For me, a D/s relationrship is about possession and rough sex. I super dig that stuff. Not always but sometimes.

I learned a valuable lesson here about topping from the bottom. Some D types like bratty s types. That's not the lesson - what I learned from others here is that often times topping from the bottom is confused for a submissive voicing what he / she needs or desires.

I address this further down in my comment about why I top from the bottom. Most of it is because I am not actually a sub.

"Bratty" subs are providing an opportunity for a power struggle and power exchange. I can't stress how much a power exchange is the defining element of Domination and Submission. You actually must dominate someome to be dominant. It's never assumed.

In my past relationships if I was tied unsafely, when I had provided the necessary resources to prevent this from happening I would escape on purpose because he was putting me in danger and being incompetent. If he half assed? Consider me teaching him a lesson over it. This is very dominant behavior many dominants find annoying, I think their lack of education on BDSM is annoying.

Red Flags:

Often the ones who are assuming power, not earning.

Often the ones who are not strong enough to be challenged and maintain their position.

Often the ones who are inexperienced will start assuming they are entitled to respect and compliance. Power struggles and power exchange frightens them.

Compliance and Tolerance of being bossed around and punished is not submission.

An effective D/s relationship is just an effective relationship. Whatever works for the people involved = effective.

Exactly this. I only demand a dominant display competency. I find assuming it a red flag.

 

[Farawyn]

There is a lot of people who say subs that "top from the bottom" are "bad", yet I am one of these "subs" in past and would like to clarify why we top from the bottom and the type of man who likely will be our partners in what is still what I deem a quality functional BDSM relationship.

I am a dominant. Topping from the bottom is how I realized this, actually. Subs who top from the bottom are not submissives, at all, IMO. The dominant is actually the submissive.

Why did I identify as a submissive and assume dominant control with my partner?

- I felt that as a woman that the submissive role was likely what was expected and the role I had been conditioned to accept.

- My partner in this relationship needed to learn to be the dominant in many areas of life and become a leader but was inexperienced in this realm.

- My partner had a high pain threshold, when I was given consent to bind and whip him, he went to sub drop in 1 minute flat having a very bad ab reaction.

- I, on the other hand, intensely enjoyed the act of inflicting pain on someone a little too much and I became frightened that I would harm someone in this role.

(Also my enjoyment doing this as the dominant was not arrousing to me, sexually. This disturbed me, also.)

I provided him with what I call "the illusion of power", in this space his self esteem was able to flourish, he became more confident in himself, he realized his potential, over time he became more capable of being the dominant on his own.

I hoped that he could assume the leadership/dominant role in our relationship, at some point. I would need a switch/equal partner who can assume either, in reality, but during a time of true vulnerability (and any time I explicitly tried to give him control or my "true" submission in my life or in bed), our relationship would become volatile. He would have a nervous breakdown and lash out causing me to leave for my safety.

He would become overwhelmed with the responsibility of leadership, dominance and unable to mentally handle it. Unable to fully assume that role, we would return back to the power dynamic from before, things would be okay. Then I would give him control hoping he could lead/dom but the same thing would happen. Eventually it was going to have to end permanently.

He enjoyed satisfying and pleasing me, I allowed him to do so. He had low self esteem, grew up with a family of strong women who would manipulate and exploit him. He needed to learn to take charge. We had become well read on BDSM resources, the relationship was highly therapeutic for us both.

He, unfortunately, had never been in a dominant role and needed to for his sake and guiding him thru this was therapeutic and empowering for him. I had hoped he would become a good leader/dom or equal...but...eh.

Would I hold some guys hand thru it again? Probably not.
I am exploring embracing the control/dominance aspect and beginning to accept that I wasn't a sub in the first place but don't mind being one if needed. Would prefer future partners to have experience in that realm or at the least, lead the relationship and not buckle from the pressure when they are in control.

Wow. Lots of patience. But it seems you both learned something, so worth it. This is one of the most interesting posts I have read.

 

[BubblyBookworm]

Wow. Lots of patience. But it seems you both learned something, so worth it. This is one of the most interesting posts I have read.

That was a very thorough explanation and good points to ponder. Not everyone may be prepared to lead.

 

[GaleaFiguro]

A sub of someone I know *literally said to me* when I worried for their safety with a dominant who "claims to be autistic", but he isn't autistic at all, he is a psychopath. I told them an inability to read emotional or non verbal cues was a *potential* danger to their safety. This dominant literally told their submissive it was a good thing, because a submissive will manipulate their dominant with their facial expressions while they are in subspace.

I almost fell off my chair.

What this actually is, is an unqualified dominant straight up lying to their sub by refusing a submissive after care
(Scene is over, sub space happens at the end) while they are in a state of complete physical/mental/emotional vulnerability with no mental/physical/emotional capacity to manipulate anyone at all. Where his ONE responsibility is to look after his partner and emotionally comfort them, support them, or provide them with safety and security.

There is a thing called sub drop. Which this submissive likely feels far too familiar with. This is a dangerous place. I pointed her to Emergency BDSM resources. I can't talk sense into this person what's being done to them.

The lack of competency in people who identify with BDSM and use it as an excuse to harm others is far too prevalent. BDSM has rules so everybody is Safe. Sane. Consensual. Needs are met. Nobody falls of the deep end or gets shoved off.

I was horrified when I heard this, today.

What is a quality BDSM relationship? Not this

 

[BubblyBookworm]

A sub of someone I know *literally said to me* when I worried for their safety with a dominant who "claims to be autistic", but he isn't autistic at all, he is a psychopath. I told them an inability to read emotional or non verbal cues was a *potential* danger to their safety. This dominant literally told their submissive it was a good thing, because a a submissive will manipulate their dominant with their facial expressions while they are in subspace.

I almost fell off my chair.

What this actually is, is an unqualified dominant straight up lying to their sub by refusing a submissive after care
(Scene is over, sub space happens at the end) while they are in a state of complete physical/mental/emotional vulnerability with no mental/physical/emotional capacity to manipulate anyone at all. Where his ONE responsibility is to look after his partner and emotionally comfort them, support them, or provide them with safety and security.

There is a thing called sub drop. Which this submissive likely feels far too familiar with. This is a dangerous place. I pointed her to Emergency BDSM resources. I can't talk sense into this person what's being done to them.

The lack of competency in people who identify with BDSM and use it as an excuse to harm others is far too prevalent. BDSM has rules so everybody is Safe. Sane. Consensual. Needs are met. Nobody falls of the deep end or gets shoved off.

I was horrified when I heard this, today.

What is a quality BDSM relationship? Not this

Quite true, it is wonderful you care so much!!

 

[GaleaFiguro]

Quite true, it is wonderful you care so much!!

Point is this, I care because the reason I delved into BDSM was to avoid being assaulted and traumatized. I had a tendency to date men who were contolling, powerful and had a great potential to hurt me. They were vanilla.

Thru BDSM no longer could I be assaulted because Johnny Fucksticks had kinks and repressed issues that he was unacknowledging he let lay festering under the surface that eventually exploded into full out assaults.

I felt safe negotiating the terms and boundaries of my sexual relationships and used this for healing from past trauma. BDSM was empowering to me. I was safer. I was working out baggage.

But for little Suzie Hooha who wants to date a dom because she kinda likes to get slapped around and dominated, and she once read 50 Shades of Grey half way thru that now thinks she knows about BDSM is THE perfect prey animal for the kind of dom that lives for silly sub girls who don't understand there are way things must be done in this context. Your dom has responsibilities to fulfill and he needs to learn how to do his job. If you don't know what those responsibilities are, well, it's probably best you learn.

Putting their life and safety in the hands of an incompetent, lazy moron might be sexually attractive to them. Who knows. I am not turned on by morons. Incompetence is weakness. Laziness isn't assertive. Resources are out there for those who want them.

Just like I mention above: That kind of behavior from a dom is dangerous and unacceptable and abusive. It's not an isolated case.

I came to BDSM as someone tired of incompetence, ready to face skeletons in my closet and do some healing without becoming a victim of some vanilla meathead too scared to talk about what turns him on, turns me on and how to fulfill both our needs. Safely. I'm done with getting hurt.

What satisfies me isn't embarassing anymore. I know more about why I am the way I am instead of feeling guilty or ashamed of it. I read material on safety and the responsibilities of a dominant. I read books on rope bondage on how to tie someone in a secure way where their body is not injured by cut off circulation or too much weight baring down on the wrong place. Things to expect when dealing with partners with trauma how to help them during sub space/drop and the safe word becomes useless here. I mean, this isn't a game. You really are relying someone to render you helpless and not legitimately hurt you intentionally or by accident. By hurt I mean in a non pleasurable non specified way.

He ties you up. Knocks over a candle you lit for ambiance while leaving the room. Now your bedroom is on fire. He isn't there. Even if he was, there is no way to cut the ropes off quickly and get out because he didn't research that when you do rope bondage you always need to keep a knife or scissors to cut you out of the bindings quickly and immediately.

Maybe Johnny Fucksticks impersonates a girl online he doesn't like and gives you her personal information and Johnny Fucksticks wants to convince you to find and assault this girl because he says she fantasizes about it. Nobody told you that making these arrangements should be done face to face. So you actually rape some innocent chick who genuinely doesn't know you or want you....and now you go to jail for a long time.

It happened to my friend. Other people get set up like this and people need to be smart. This shit can happen to people just like you if you aren't careful.

You aren't born knowing these things---you legit need to look it up. I require men I am with to read about it and understand this stuff before I will ever be with them in any kind of dynamic like that. That's why I brought material on the topic and when initiative was not taken, I dipped out. I don't have time and I'm not begging some dude for a damn thing. I'll find a new one.

 

[pizoli18]

Thoughts on D/s borrowed and revamped a bit...

A D/s relationship is just that…a relationship. Some people who practice D/s get off on having a bunch of rules and routines, but no matter what the format, the same basic ‘vanilla’ rules apply.

Dick pics or telling a potential sub that they must call you "Master" or "Sir" probably won't get you very far.

Kindness and the benefit of the doubt will go a long way. Just like in any other relationship.

Sex is fabulous, but sex alone isn’t a relationship.

Communicate, communicate, communicate. Say what you mean, and mean what you say.

Don’t stay with someone who makes you feel badly about yourself.

Consent is given freely without coercion. (And there should never be a ‘but’ or an ‘except’ after this one.)

Don’t say it’s okay if it’s not.

Bad days will happen. Don’t threaten to leave every time things are difficult.

Remember that sometimes you have to place harmony above your desire to be right.

When all else fails default to love.

Calling yourself a Dom, sub, Master, slave, or pet doesn’t change the basics of how relationships work. You are still two people who need to work out all of the usual stuff with each other.

Take her on a real date. Open her door. Compliment her on something other than how she looks. Her being submissive doesn’t mean basic chivalry goes out the window.

Don’t expect him to read your mind. If you want something communicate. Don’t assume that sex is the only thing he cares about.

Learn to love yourself so you can love and be loved fully. The bondage, ropes, kneeling, and rules come later. They are the structure that holds the relationship. If you have those things but don’t have anything to fill the space inside then the structure collapses.

I so agree with this post !!

 

[yukonnights]

Have to agree here. Not all "relationships" are about Love (It can be all about sex, and all parties can walk away happy). I once had a friend with benefits. Neither of us wanted anything from the relationship but sex. We had been friends for years but we were not really compatible for a "relationship". As long as both (or maybe more ) parties are up front and honest about what they want from the relationship it can work out fine.

I think I understand what you're getting at, but I don't really believe the example of a "friend with benefits" fits the bill. Not all love is the same, but I love my friends...I care for my friends...I connect emotionally with my friends...I have relationships with my friends???

In order to truly experience BDSM void of relationship would require a visit to a stranger. Making this into an ongoing arrangement with this "stranger", while possible, would probably not appeal to the vast majority of people precisely because there is no love involved...no connection...no relationship.

But that may be just me...if there's no love (at whatever level) I'd pass. It's the love that makes us stronger and happier.

 

[GaleaFiguro]

I think I understand what you're getting at, but I don't really believe the example of a "friend with benefits" fits the bill. Not all love is the same, but I love my friends...I care for my friends...I connect emotionally with my friends...I have relationships with my friends???

In order to truly experience BDSM void of relationship would require a visit to a stranger. Making this into an ongoing arrangement with this "stranger", while possible, would probably not appeal to the vast majority of people precisely because there is no love involved...no connection...no relationship.

But that may be just me...if there's no love (at whatever level) I'd pass. It's the love that makes us stronger and happier.

I fully agree, I never wanted to go to public events and as a monogamous person if I have this kind of relationship I plan to keep it regardless of being casual or not. I entered into my relationship that lasted 5 years on the conditions of no strings.

My intentions were not to catch feels, I could tell he wanted more and I felt unable to provide it. Love just happened.

There is a certain bond you can develop with someone that can become irreplacable. Regardless of your intention. There is a great deal of trust and intimacy involved. Love sometimes can be unavoidable. At least, in my case.

 

[BubblyBookworm]

Thoughts on D/s borrowed and revamped a bit...

A D/s relationship is just that…a relationship. Some people who practice D/s get off on having a bunch of rules and routines, but no matter what the format, the same basic ‘vanilla’ rules apply.

Dick pics or telling a potential sub that they must call you "Master" or "Sir" probably won't get you very far.

Kindness and the benefit of the doubt will go a long way. Just like in any other relationship.

Sex is fabulous, but sex alone isn’t a relationship.

Communicate, communicate, communicate. Say what you mean, and mean what you say.

Don’t stay with someone who makes you feel badly about yourself.

Consent is given freely without coercion. (And there should never be a ‘but’ or an ‘except’ after this one.)

Don’t say it’s okay if it’s not.

Bad days will happen. Don’t threaten to leave every time things are difficult.

Remember that sometimes you have to place harmony above your desire to be right.

When all else fails default to love.

Calling yourself a Dom, sub, Master, slave, or pet doesn’t change the basics of how relationships work. You are still two people who need to work out all of the usual stuff with each other.

Take her on a real date. Open her door. Compliment her on something other than how she looks. Her being submissive doesn’t mean basic chivalry goes out the window.

Don’t expect him to read your mind. If you want something communicate. Don’t assume that sex is the only thing he cares about.

Learn to love yourself so you can love and be loved fully. The bondage, ropes, kneeling, and rules come later. They are the structure that holds the relationship. If you have those things but don’t have anything to fill the space inside then the structure collapses.

Relationships are complex, no matter the type or the people involved!