Scottish independence poll.

[Scotsman69]

It's now less than a fortnight to go before the referendum on Scottish independence.

I invite Litsters so show how they intend to vote, or how they would vote if they were eligible to do so.

Please note that this vote is public, so if you cheat about your eligibility to vote, all will be able to tell. Sorry to have to say this, but the 'no' campaign has been playing rather dirty recently as every opinion poll shows the 'no' vote slipping.

 

[JudasIscariot]

How do you feel scotsman69?

What is the general feeling of the Scottish people you know?

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Scots cant exist without English cock to suck. Scots are a barnacle on the English cock.

 

[Fata Morgana]

Scots cant exist without English cock to suck. Scots are a barnacle on the English cock.

You know nothing Jon Snow.

 

[Scotsman69]

I'm for yes.

I worked very hard for the current devolution settlement for decades. I was wrong. It still allows Westminster to rule us, and Scotland has never voted Tory in recent history, so we usually have a government which in no way represents Scottish political views.

The polls have moved from maybe 35% for independence a few years ago, to a knife-edge now. Most folk I know will vote yes. And it is likely the nation will vote yes on 18 Sept. The 'no' politicians claim that Scotland will suffer from independence (unlike every country in history which has gained the right to democratically govern itself).

The 'no' camp, largely English-dominated political parties, claims constantly that England subsidises Scotland heavily, which is an outright lie. And if it were not a lie, why the fuck do they wish to continue a Union in which they subsidise us?

How do you feel scotsman69?

What is the general feeling of the Scottish people you know?

 

[JudasIscariot]

I worked very hard for the current devolution settlement for decades. I was wrong. It still allows Westminster to rule us, and Scotland has never voted Tory in recent history, so we usually have a government which in no way represents Scottish political views.

The polls have moved from maybe 35% for independence a few years ago, to a knife-edge now. Most folk I know will vote yes. And it is likely the nation will vote yes on 18 Sept. The 'no' politicians claim that Scotland will suffer from independence (unlike every country in history which has gained the right to democratically govern itself).

The 'no' camp, largely English-dominated political parties, claims constantly that England subsidises Scotland heavily, which is an outright lie. And if it were not a lie, why the fuck do they wish to continue a Union in which they subsidise us?

Fair enough. You know more than Scotland than I. In that case if I voted it would be for independence.

 

[Scotsman69]

So vote

in my wee poll, laddie!

Fair enough. You know more than Scotland than I. In that case if I voted it would be for independence.

 

[Scotsman69]

Every stupid comment like this

makes it more likely that Scotland will vote YES to independence.

Thank you for your help, JBJ.

Scots cant exist without English cock to suck. Scots are a barnacle on the English cock.

 

[SDLRob]

The big issue for me, as a English bloke living down south, is that both sides have managed to twist things in this debate and the truths that really matter have been lost.

I often hear people say they're voting to lose Trident.... Problem is that Trident would stay in Scotland until 2019, so you wouldn't be losing it for a while yet.

NATO membership? Yeah... The Projected GDP numbers the SNP use have been revised down (not that they'll admit it) and there's no chance (without losing a lot of the things Salmond promised like Free Uni places and a handful of the social security promises) that they can meet the financial requirements to join NATO.

There's also the big thing about shipbuilding. Right now, there's the order for the three OPVs for the Royal Navy. If Scotland goes independent, then the upcoming Type 26 order won't be given to the Clyde (to keep with the law that states no Warship for the RN can be built outside of the UK (and no, the supply ships being built in Korea aren't technically 'Warships', so they don't count))... After that, the SNP cannot garrentee ANY contracts being placed in an independent Scotland... Which would result in hundreds of job losses.

Keep the pound? Just because you stick a (for example) Ferrari badge on a Lotus, it doesn't mean the Lotus is now a Ferrari...

And finally, joining the EU? Not if Spain have anything to do with it... Not when it gives Catalonia a stronger position for their own independence drive.

 

[domroger]

I would vote yes because it would mean no Gordon Brown or Alistair Darling fucking up the economy .

 

[Arianthe]

Got a link to the eligibility criteria?

 

[Scotsman69]

Trident isn't anywhere near the whole story

though, speaking as someone in Glasgow, 30 or so miles from the largest nuclear target in Europe, it's more than important to me and my family.

When Scotland votes YES, the most likely impact on Trident is that it won't be replaced and relocated; it will be scrapped. Why? (a) Because an RUK exchequer deprived of Scottish tax revenue will be less able and willing to fund it; and

(b) NOWHERE in the RUK will want to host the deathtrap which has been imposed on Scotland, in one way or another, for over fifty years now. Can you see Boris wanting it on the Thames? Can you see the Cornish, the Devonians, or Cumbrians wanting it in their back yards? Or the western Welsh? If any government tried to relocate Trident's successor, there would be the biggest NIMBY campaign ever seen in these islands.

So Scottish independence will do the RUK a huge favour by ridding it of an expensive and dangerous white elephant, the use of which is ultimately controlled by the White House. Independent deterrent? Don't you believe it. UK Trident is just an arm of US foreign policy they don't have to pay for in any way, but ultimately control.

So that's one reason almost every English politician and party (with the honourable exception of the Greens) are opposed to Scotland having the right of every nation to rule itself.

The other main one is of course MONEY. The 'no' campaign, led by Cameron, screams from the rooftops (at least in Scotland), that Scotland's public expenditure is heavily subsidised by RUK (mainly English) taxpayers. They brandish cooked books to 'prove' their case.

So the generous English Tories want to continue 'subsidising' wee Scotland ad infinitum, out of the goodness of their hearts? That's why they want to keep us in the Union?

Of course, that's nonsense, and goes against every Tory instinct. The reality is that Scotland is a net contributor to the UK exchequer. And is likely to continue to be so, unless we vote to control our own affairs.

And if the oil and gas are running out, as the Tories claim, why are energy multinationals continuing to pour billions into exploration of Scottish waters, especially west of Shetland? They are no more stupid than the Tories, albeit a bit more honest. They know which side their bread's buttered on.

A YES vote for Scotland will in many ways be good for the RUK too. The only thing it won't be good for is US foreign policy (Trident).

Oh, and the Catalonian referendum comes long before Scotland will successfully apply for EU membership. Right about the same time the RUK votes to leave it, likely under a Tory/UKIP coalition.

Will the EU want Scotland to continue as a member? You bet your boots they will.

The big issue for me, as a English bloke living down south, is that both sides have managed to twist things in this debate and the truths that really matter have been lost.

I often hear people say they're voting to lose Trident.... Problem is that Trident would stay in Scotland until 2019, so you wouldn't be losing it for a while yet.

NATO membership? Yeah... The Projected GDP numbers the SNP use have been revised down (not that they'll admit it) and there's no chance (without losing a lot of the things Salmond promised like Free Uni places and a handful of the social security promises) that they can meet the financial requirements to join NATO.

There's also the big thing about shipbuilding. Right now, there's the order for the three OPVs for the Royal Navy. If Scotland goes independent, then the upcoming Type 26 order won't be given to the Clyde (to keep with the law that states no Warship for the RN can be built outside of the UK (and no, the supply ships being built in Korea aren't technically 'Warships', so they don't count))... After that, the SNP cannot garrentee ANY contracts being placed in an independent Scotland... Which would result in hundreds of job losses.

Keep the pound? Just because you stick a (for example) Ferrari badge on a Lotus, it doesn't mean the Lotus is now a Ferrari...

And finally, joining the EU? Not if Spain have anything to do with it... Not when it gives Catalonia a stronger position for their own independence drive.

 

[JohnnySavage]

I spent some time at Holy Loch. A miserable place to be for someone of my skill set, but many US Submariners married the local gals. I rotated between there and Sardinia, Italy and Italy was a whole lot better.

 

[sufisaint]

All the Scots with the balls to be free left for America two hundred years ago...all that's left in Scotland now is a buch of disarmed sheep collecting off the dole...

 

[JohnnySavage]

All the Scots with the balls to be free left for America two hundred years ago...all that left in Scotland now is a buch of disarmed sheep collecting of the dole...

The material side of the JohnnySavage family tree are Scots-Irish that settled into Appalachia in the 1740s.

 

[Scotsman69]

The eligibility criteria are

essentially, that you are normally resident in Scotland (doesn't matter what nationality you consider you are), that you are over 16 (UK voting age is 18: we prefer to give the vote to those whose lives will be most affected by the decision), and that you're registered to vote in Scotland.

All the signs are that the referendum vote will see the largest % turnout of voters anywhere in the UK for over half a century. Good for democracy then?

Got a link to the eligibility criteria?

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

All the Scots with the balls to be free left for America two hundred years ago...all that's left in Scotland now is a buch of disarmed sheep collecting off the dole...

Aint it the truth.

 

[Scotsman69]

Some of you US folk

cannot see the world in any way other than from a US perspective.

Hence such abject silliness as this post.

Such statements always add to the YES vote here.

All the Scots with the balls to be free left for America two hundred years ago...all that's left in Scotland now is a buch of disarmed sheep collecting off the dole...

 

[ishtat]

As an Englishman, I am indifferent whether Scotland wishes to visit penury on itself through independence.It would however save English taxpayers a deal of money. Scotland would find that independence would be vassalage with no pound, no credit rating, and insufficient funds to meet its liabilities.

I suspect however that Scotland will only be independent when the English are given a vote. Then a landslide would occur.

 

[Arianthe]

cannot see the world in any way other than from a US perspective.

Hence such abject silliness as this post.

Such statements always add to the YES vote here.

essentially, that you are normally resident in Scotland (doesn't matter what nationality you consider you are), that you are over 16 (UK voting age is 18: we prefer to give the vote to those whose lives will be most affected by the decision), and that you're registered to vote in Scotland.

All the signs are that the referendum vote will see the largest % turnout of voters anywhere in the UK for over half a century. Good for democracy then?

Some of the US folk can't see past the nearest county line.

I'm Scottish born, but ineligible to vote. If I were eligible, I would vote yes. The Scottish population and economy are large enough to function independently.

 

[SDLRob]

So you're one of those then? You're one of the lot that's so against a party that you're blind to what's happening in reality around you.

There are plenty of places that would host Trident if you guys leave. IIRC, Gibraltar is the site that a sub is sent to if it's having reactor issues, so they'd be suitable with a little modification. Then again, there's other places that would be able to build a suitable base by 2019 for the subs.

would you be willing to sacrifice the hundreds of jobs in the Shipbuilding industry if you go solo? Because that's what will happen if you do. The three OPVs being build on the Clyde will be the last order placed up there. How would you be able to handle the increased need for jobs from this?

 

[Alliecat1970]

I vote yes, liberty or death. Purely an uninformed and emotional response, but given the brutal history of English domination in Scotland, get out from under the English thumb.

 

[Brollyanna]

Some very creative work for the YES campaign.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dbW_AT64m8E&feature=youtu.be

 

[Scotsman69]

1. Scottish Yards can build more than warships. That they now build warships is a decision of the current owner of most, Bae Systems. No doubt Bae Systems will consider selling its Scottish yards in the even of a yes vote. But no English yards are capable of replacing what Scottish yards do now. And in the unlikely event that Bae Systems sells the Clyde yards, they would be bought by companies who understand Scotland's flexible technological ability.

2. Gibraltar is in the wrong location. Scotland controls the eastern N Atlantic. That's why the US forced the Tories to allow them to base Polaris here in the sixties. And part of why (English NIMBYism apart) Trident is in Scotland now.

3. You appear to be one of those who believes Scotland is incapable of governing itself. Most Swedes thought that of Norway over a century ago. More recently, many Czechs thought the Slovaks couldn't manage their own affairs without the 'help' of Big Brother. Both were wrong. So are you.

4.The Financial Times and many others rather better informed than you appear to be, have consistently said that Scotland is more than capable of governing itself. As wealthy nation. I'll take the judgement of the Financial Times over yours any day.

So you're one of those then? You're one of the lot that's so against a party that you're blind to what's happening in reality around you.

There are plenty of places that would host Trident if you guys leave. IIRC, Gibraltar is the site that a sub is sent to if it's having reactor issues, so they'd be suitable with a little modification. Then again, there's other places that would be able to build a suitable base by 2019 for the subs.

would you be willing to sacrifice the hundreds of jobs in the Shipbuilding industry if you go solo? Because that's what will happen if you do. The three OPVs being build on the Clyde will be the last order placed up there. How would you be able to handle the increased need for jobs from this?

 

[domroger]

I vote yes, liberty or death. Purely an uninformed and emotional response, but given the brutal history of English domination in Scotland, get out from under the English thumb.

FYI the Scots asked to join the union ,no brutality involved .