Tattoos - A hidden cost!

[Athalia]

I was having my hair done a few months ago, and overheard two young mothers talking about whether one of their daughters should be getting a tattoo. The daughter had just turned ... one year old. And these women were absolutely serious.

I was gobsmacked.

 

[Kitty]

I simply said I was going to get one and every person around just facepalmed. So I figure if I want a tattoo I can just get a fake one lol if people love body art and things then why not a temp tat. It still has the allure. Like henna hand paintings, sooo sexy and no need to get it forever, really.

 

[Kitty]

I was having my hair done a few months ago, and overheard two young mothers talking about whether one of their daughters should be getting a tattoo. The daughter had just turned ... one year old. And these women were absolutely serious.

I was gobsmacked.

Okay...wait...

 

[lovecraft68]

MY last tattoo took eight hours and was done by a very attractive woman.


Eight hours of pain inflicted by a hot woman, it was indulging two habits at once. I wanted a cigarette afterwards and I don't smoke.

At the time I said it would be my last one. I don't know who I was kidding.


Debating the next one....forearm or lower leg....

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Explain to me your attraction to tats. I can quite understand something smallish and artistic, especially when linked with a partner, but full limb body art, however artistic, seems a tad OTT to me.

 

[lovecraft68]

Explain to me your attraction to tats. I can quite understand something smallish and artistic, especially when linked with a partner, but full limb body art, however artistic, seems a tad OTT to me.

The key to your question is "to me" we all have a "to me" I love tattoos on myself and women, but piercings? In certain spots yes, but all over the face....meh, but that is "to me" meaning feel free to do it.

The tats now are vastly different then years ago. The colors are vibrant and gorgeous and the art itself so much batter.

People will like them or not.. and its to each their own and we are all free to express the opinion of yay/nay

My annoyance comes from the archaic idea that people with them are trouble makers (if men) and sluts (if women) and it is beyond idiotic to talk about no one will ever be hired or have a respectable career because of them

My daughter is becoming a DCYF officer. The social worker she is working with not only has a lot of tats, but a few piercings and she works for the state and appears in court on a regular basis.

She is intelligent and damn good at her job which was why she was hired.

Only prejudiced ignorant fools hire based on things like that.

You know....the people 60's and up who base what's right and wrong on what their daddy's shoved down their throats and their daddy's before them

You know the good old days where women were bare foot and pregnant, gays were in the closet (and beaten when they came out) and blacks and minorities knew their place

And we have the honor having both Pilot and Cold diesel right here to prove that. At a combined age 140 and with all the knowledge their daddy's told them they could have.

And if the comeback is "you don't know us" the answer is yes I do, its me you don't know and we're all better off for that. I wouldn't want anyone pissing in their depends.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

My old man had tats: A bull with TEXAS, a USMC emblem, and a naked lady. I thought they were tacky and trashy. I never wanted tats because theyre great for identification purposes. Then I saw some women with prison tats made with BIC pens, fuggin lovely. I have, on occasion, seen some tats that are excellent and look divine, but 99% of tats eat shit and scream BAD TASTE!

My son got some tats after he retired from the military, he also smoked some pot and got some other shit outta his system. It cost him a cop job he was perfect for but the sheriff saw the tats and killed the hire. He looked like biker shit. 44 is too old to play Easy Rider.

 

[desertslave]

You have to remember, the stuff you're into at 18 or 21 - is not the same stuff you're into @ 30 or 40. A tattoo is for life, you should be damned sure it's what you want to see every day until you die.

I'm 54. I have scars on both knees and my left shoulder from joint replacement surgeries (the consequences of being a tomboy). I REALLY want to get tats on them, partly as a cover-up and partly because it suits my sense of humor. I'd like to get one knee laced up like a corset, and the other with a mostly-closed zipper and a few gears showing through the open part (just a trifle steampunk). I'd like to have pretty bows tying my shoulder closed, but have a hand or something reaching out (subtle and double-take worthy).

For better or worse, it's not in our budget, but I can dream. I may grow older, but I refuse to grow up! (I did a happy dance in an electronics store yesterday because I found a Lego USB drive!)

 

[Handley_Page]

I'm 54. I have scars on both knees and my left shoulder from joint replacement surgeries (the consequences of being a tomboy). I REALLY want to get tats on them, partly as a cover-up and partly because it suits my sense of humor. I'd like to get one knee laced up like a corset, and the other with a mostly-closed zipper and a few gears showing through the open part (just a trifle steampunk). I'd like to have pretty bows tying my shoulder closed, but have a hand or something reaching out (subtle and double-take worthy).

For better or worse, it's not in our budget, but I can dream. I may grow older, but I refuse to grow up! (I did a happy dance in an electronics store yesterday because I found a Lego USB drive!)

Love it!

 

[SamSternberg]

It appears the dinosaurs are upset because the world and society has evolved and they have not.

Guess I can't blame them for being so miserable. It must suck for them to know they're facing extinction.

Good riddance to them and their prejudices.

I don't think they are dinosaurs, a lot of that is the media that's in denial.

I think maybe the latter end of the boomer generation are 'post-modern' man all about the carin' sharin', if it feels good do it crowd.

Yet all these generation x, y and z I keep seeing in Europe are the complete opposite of this. They are nationalist, a lot are anti-middle-eastern (I'm not just talking arabs either) anti-American and 'sexist', anti-homo plus other things that would get you frothing at the mouth.

In the US, once you leave the Coastal areas it's a lot more old-school for the young and old people. So those 'White People' aren't going away.

Me?

I just ride high and laugh at both sides whining at each other.
Tats on a woman can look nice, but only if done decently and tastefully.
On a man there's more of a pass as tats are traditionally more masculine anyways, IF they are done right.

 

[SamSternberg]

Tatoos still fade after the years go by and need to be re-inked, but the methods and quality has improved. Yet it still divides people because of some wanting total tattoo man/woman and others wanting to keep it real and low-key I guess.

 

[Bramblethorn]

The key to your question is "to me" we all have a "to me" I love tattoos on myself and women, but piercings? In certain spots yes, but all over the face....meh, but that is "to me" meaning feel free to do it.

The tats now are vastly different then years ago. The colors are vibrant and gorgeous and the art itself so much batter.

People will like them or not.. and its to each their own and we are all free to express the opinion of yay/nay

Yep. And when I see a tattoo I don't like, I remind myself that the wearer probably chose it to please themselves, not me. I've never been tattooed but I'm planning to get a small one in the next month or so; I don't expect most people to have any clue what the design means, and that's fine. It's personal to me.

My annoyance comes from the archaic idea that people with them are trouble makers (if men) and sluts (if women) and it is beyond idiotic to talk about no one will ever be hired or have a respectable career because of them

Speaking of which, here's another professional guy with tattoos, chief scientist for the European Space Agency's Rosetta mission.

He was criticised for his choice of shirts on TV (for which he's since apologised) but the tatts don't seem to have been an obstacle to professional success. I can imagine it might be harder for a woman to get away with the same level of tattooing, though.

 

[Rozalin_0123]

My annoyance comes from the archaic idea that people with them are trouble makers (if men) and sluts (if women) and it is beyond idiotic to talk about no one will ever be hired or have a respectable career because of them

The foolishness isn't limited to just tattoos. I remember being labeled a devil worshipping slut because I wore mostly black clothing in High School, not one tattoo or piercing. People sure love to label things

 

[stickygirl]

The foolishness isn't limited to just tattoos. I remember being labeled a devil worshipping slut because I wore mostly black clothing in High School, not one tattoo or piercing. People sure love to label things

Amen to that

 

[colddiesel]

My annoyance comes from the archaic idea that people with them are trouble makers (if men) and sluts (if women) and it is beyond idiotic to talk about no one will ever be hired or have a respectable career because of them
.

Your statement here LC is incorrect. If you Google Tattoos and Criminality, you will get in excess of 20,000 hits. There is a great deal of research which strongly supports the fact that there is a strong correlation between Tattoos and criminal behavior. I will examine one or two examples:

" The conclusion seems warranted that psychopathy or social or emotional maladjustment is significantly higher among tattooed than non tattooed men"... "The high incidence of lawbreaking among these (tattooed) men seems to indicate that they are socially unbalanced." (Richard S Post - Relationship of Tatoos to Personality Disorders 1970)

US army doctors examining potential recruits in 1941 found that of the recruits rejected for their sociopathic behavior, the number having tattoos was double the statistical average for the cohort as a whole.

Since R Post in 1970 the research work has been refined. There are many articles reporting work that indicates that small tattoos especially those which are decorative and limited in number are not an idicator of psychopathy, however, the same more recent research strengthens the argument that people who obtain large or repeated tattoos show greatly increased psychopathy or social deviancy.
There are of course individual exceptions to the rule but the general argument stacks up.

It is noteworthy that in percentage terms the largest incidence of tattoos are to be found in two environments, the first is in the jail population and the second is in the biker and street gangs. This result holds up in US, Russia, UK, Australia, France, and many other countries. These factors in my opinion make it difficult for heavily tattooed people to get work in many fields.

Now my own view of tattoos. Basically I don't so much dislike them as think they are an indication of stupidity - because they are a self inflicted limit of a persons employment potential. Since leaving the army 40 years ago I have been a self employed job placement professional:

If my firm is looking for skilled tradesmen, employers are generally unconcerned about tattoos, however facial tattoos are an absolute no no; they render an individual virtually unemployable. And some employers don't like neck or hand tattoos.

As the position increases in status, or exposure to clients, the tolerance of (especially visible) tattoos, becomes rapidly less. In most managerial positions and the professions it is hardly tolerated - (Elfin has already covered that issue)

The word for Tattoos in a number of Latin Languages is Stigma That may be abhorrent to you but when applying for work it is a fact of life.

Elfin has replied to you with regard to your suggestions of homophobia and sexism and she has done so quite sufficiently, though it was funny that you expressed your critique of myself and Pilot in Ageist terms.

Incidentally at 140 you are probably selling me and Pilot a bit short. He only has to be 72 for us to hit 150!

Finally, I was a bit slow replying because I was in hospital for a couple of days having some stents put in. At least I can be an irritant for a bit longer. Unlike your mother my Cardiologist had no Tattoos, neither did any of the nurses - But the guy in charge of Toilet cleaning was well inked.

 

[Handley_Page]

The attractive young lady in my local bakers shows a discrete bit of tattoo work under her throat. I asked her if it had hurt. Her answer had me laughing:
"No," she said, "I was drunk."

 

[DeYaKen]

The attractive young lady in my local bakers shows a discrete bit of tattoo work under her throat. I asked her if it had hurt. Her answer had me laughing:
"No," she said, "I was drunk."

That say's a lot.

If I had a beautiful body I would think that it didn't need decoration. I do not have a beautiful body so I don't want anything to draw attention to it. Don't see where tats fit in.

I do know that we (in the UK) spend several million pounds of taxpayers money every year removing tattoos that some idiot thought looked cool or sexy at the time. Now, of course, it is giving them a complex and their doctor says it needs to come off to preserve their mental health.

Pity no one checked their mental health before they paid to have it put on.

 

[Rozalin_0123]

I must be the only person on the planet who understands why people get tattoos yet have none of my own.

 

[Bramblethorn]

" The conclusion seems warranted that psychopathy or social or emotional maladjustment is significantly higher among tattooed than non tattooed men"... "The high incidence of lawbreaking among these (tattooed) men seems to indicate that they are socially unbalanced." (Richard S Post - Relationship of Tatoos to Personality Disorders 1970)

Here's the article, for anybody who wants to read it.

Per the intro, it's a reprint of a 1965 graduate paper; Post's qualifications were in "police administration" rather than psychiatry or psychology. It's basically a summary of other people's publications from the 1950s and earlier, and it really shows its age:

Investigations conducted in a Massachusetts State Hospital into sex-symbolism, revealed that all persons evaluated indicated that tattooing represented the sexual act to them.

...the theory has been forwarded that many tattoo artists are homosexuals, latent or overt, who have chosen this occupation because it puts them in almost constant proximity to the male body, which they can feel, stroke, and fondle without arousing suspicion.

So, yeah, keep in mind that a big part of their definition of "maladjustment" was stuff like homosexuality. And given that the work cited is two generations out of date, it would be foolish to assume that the sort of people who get tatts today are the same sort of people who were getting them back then.

But setting those objections aside, this is a good illustration of the difference between "statistically significant" and "important"/"useful".

The Lander/Kohn work cited there indicates that 20% of tattooed men draftees were rejected for "neuro-psychiatric reasons" and the numbers given imply that about 10% of non-tattooed men were rejected for the same reasons.

Even assuming those "neuro-psychiatric reasons" were valid by modern standards, and that the same rates apply today... so what? It's not a strong enough correlation to be useful. If you use tattoos as a proxy for mental health, you're going to end up rejecting the 80% of tattooed men who don't have psychiatric problems while accepting the 10% of non-tattooed men who do. Since that's unlikely to be an acceptable outcome, you need to do psychiatric testing instead... at which point tattoos become irrelevant, because you now have a better source of info.

Fun fact: in the USA/UK, people born in January are more than 3x as likely to make the cut for high-level sports teams as those born in December. (See Relative Age Effect for explanation of why.) But a coach would be considered incompetent if he rejected players based on their birthdate without looking at their performance.

I do know that we (in the UK) spend several million pounds of taxpayers money every year removing tattoos that some idiot thought looked cool or sexy at the time. Now, of course, it is giving them a complex and their doctor says it needs to come off to preserve their mental health.

I found this post which gives a figure of about £200k over 4 years, i.e. about £50k a year. It mentions that about one-third of NHS trusts didn't give info, so the total figure would be a bit higher - I'd believe £100k, but "several million pounds" seems unlikely.

In a country of 60 million people, £100k/year works out at about 0.2 pence per person. Compared to the amount spent on self-inflicted illness caused by smoking and drinking, that seems pretty tiny.

Noting that not all tattoos are in fact chosen by the wearer; abusers have been known to tattoo their victims as a mark of ownership. Seems reasonable to cover that sort of thing, at least.

I must be the only person on the planet who understands why people get tattoos yet have none of my own.

Me also, although I'll probably be moving out of that category once I get through my "is this really a good idea?" cooling-off period.

 

[lovecraft68]

Just a quick thought.....

A place for writers and readers to socialize and discuss the craft of writing.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Just a quick thought.....

A place for writers and readers to socialize and discuss the craft of writing.

Now, now, LC. Don't do an sr pout.

AH has always been eclectic and hosted a bundle of random but interesting/fun threads.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Now, now, LC. Don't do an sr pout.

AH has always been eclectic and hosted a bundle of random but interesting/fun threads.

Before you say, LC, I admit the Britannicus thread is great and surely meets your lofty ideals for this forum.

 

[stickygirl]

I'm not sure the thread was posted here anyway - it's GB fodder. However, it's been nice seeing the grown-ups play nicely together. How-To is like GB Junior League

 

[DeYaKen]

Lies, damn lies and statistics

[


I found this post which gives a figure of about £200k over 4 years, i.e. about £50k a year. It mentions that about one-third of NHS trusts didn't give info, so the total figure would be a bit higher - I'd believe £100k, but "several million pounds" seems unlikely.

In a country of 60 million people, £100k/year works out at about 0.2 pence per person. Compared to the amount spent on self-inflicted illness caused by smoking and drinking, that seems pretty tiny.

Noting that not all tattoos are in fact chosen by the wearer; abusers have been known to tattoo their victims as a mark of ownership. Seems reasonable to cover that sort of thing, at least.


Me also, although I'll probably be moving out of that category once I get through my "is this really a good idea?" cooling-off period.

It is the misuse of figures like this that gives Statistics a bad name. You take the amount spent by THREE NHS TRUSTS, for those not familiar with the UK system THAT AMOUNTS TO THREE HOSPITALS, and divide the amount spent by THE WHOLE POPULATION OF THE UK and say that is how much was spent on Tattoo removal per head. It may come as a surprise to you but we really do have hundreds if not thousands of hospitals in the UK.

In 2007 the NHS revealed that it had spent £5M on tattoo removal in one year alone and that figure would only rise. (check out the BBC news feeds you will find them more reliable and more accurate than "The Sun" "The Daily Mirror, and private blogs)

With regard to self inflicted illness of smokers (another group I fail to understand) it has to be offset against the huge amount of revenue the country gets from taxing tobacco. In the UK 90% of the cost of a packet of cigarettes goes to the taxman. A 20 a day smoker contributes in excess of £2,000 a year to the treasury. The person having a tattoo pays next to nothing. However if the government are reading this it may give them ideas.

Now to the abuse point. Most Branding is done by amateurs often with a needle and ink, in much the same way as prison tattoos. This means that it goes too deep for normal laser removal and would need a skin graft. That comes under the heading of plastic surgery so it is not counted in the figures. In other words it is a complete RED HERRING.

I would suggest that you learn a little more about a system before trying to quote figures, it only makes you look silly.

 

[sr71plt]

Just a quick thought.....

A place for writers and readers to socialize and discuss the craft of writing.

And maybe some interested in writing a story that includes tattoos as a story element. You can make this about you, LC. Tell us (again) about your tattoos.

And then maybe Roz can gush over you for a couple of posts.