amicus
Literotica Guru
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2003
- Posts
- 14,812
Ironic that being apparently unable to successfully attack a modern view of the free market place, that you fall back on age old ‘myths’ about sweat shops, greedy capitalist and European land owners.
Charles Dickens and a handful of ‘Victorian England’ yellow journalists have left a legacy adapted by the left as an anti business, anti capitalist mantra that few will take the time to even question.
Left me offer two small anecdotes just as an introduction to what I hope will become a rational discussion of the ‘sweat shop myth’ and those nasty capitalists and greedy landowners that apparently ruled the world in the dim dark past.
As a boy, under age fourteen, during the summer, I would stand at a pick up point at 5:30 am, along with dozens of other would be workers and wait for a truck, an open bedded truck, to pick us up and take us to the job site.
The pay was one dollar an hour, the work day including travel was about fourteen hours and they only picked up so many workers, as many as they needed. Strangely enough there were always more workers available than jobs.
At age fifteen, I was hired by the Oregon State Forestry service as a fire fighter, room and board and $50.00 a week. That job was even worse as fire-fighting in a timber situation was often an 18 hour day, with snatches of sleep, food and water, when and if.
Even in the 90’s (1990’s unlike Shanglan, I didn’t spend much time in Victorian England) I worked for a company that sent us out on field jobs, 12 hour shifts, 7 days a week, again a two hour travel time to the job, making it 14 hours and we were not paid for the travel.
I do not doubt that some terrible conditions existed in Victorian England, is the clothing manufacturing business, in the mines and the factories.
Earning a livelihood in a pre industrial and industrial society was not an easy task. With the advent of machinery, steam power, efficiency shot up over the cottage industries of hand labor.
Does it surprise me that the vast influx of workers from the countryside overwhelmed the capacity of a city to provide for them? Does it surprise me that the use of coal and peat to fire steam engines caused toxic pollution? Does it surprise me that in such close quarters, disease was rampant?
This tired old tirade of those who continue to rail against the industrial revolution just to support a basically ‘socialist, agrarian agenda’, is silly.
There was a ‘peasant revolution’; how wonderful you can twist it to be a ‘labor agenda’ justifying guilds and modern day union corruption.
A population decimated by disease and then poverty, surely undergoes terrific stress and people do whatever it takes to survive. One also has to consider, in context, the nature of a class/feudal society wherein peasants had no options to express opposition to the Lords and Ladies of blue blood.
Thus your attempt for forage through history to find doubtful examples of the failure of the free market place and the evils of capitalism, did not go unnoticed and I imagine just a few will see through your feeble attempt to redirect the discussion.
The basic issue about population, the ‘Population Bomb’ Malthusian concept book, is having and will have repercussions throughout the first half of the 21st century.
While it was duly noted that liberal welfare policy provides incentives for single parent moms to bear more children, you did not note that it also eviscerated and emasculated the necessity of the male breadwinner and acted to destroy not only the family, but the morality of the ‘mom’ as she could not ‘legally’ have a live in partner and thus had to sneak around the law.
As I purported earlier, I do not expect even one card carrying liberal to face up to and admit the failure of 50 years of left wing political and economic experiments. However, I intend to make it as difficult as possible for you to wriggle out of that indictment.
Seattle Zack, yes, a white male with a large family, although I have said both before, but anyway, Bite me!
Amicus…
Charles Dickens and a handful of ‘Victorian England’ yellow journalists have left a legacy adapted by the left as an anti business, anti capitalist mantra that few will take the time to even question.
Left me offer two small anecdotes just as an introduction to what I hope will become a rational discussion of the ‘sweat shop myth’ and those nasty capitalists and greedy landowners that apparently ruled the world in the dim dark past.
As a boy, under age fourteen, during the summer, I would stand at a pick up point at 5:30 am, along with dozens of other would be workers and wait for a truck, an open bedded truck, to pick us up and take us to the job site.
The pay was one dollar an hour, the work day including travel was about fourteen hours and they only picked up so many workers, as many as they needed. Strangely enough there were always more workers available than jobs.
At age fifteen, I was hired by the Oregon State Forestry service as a fire fighter, room and board and $50.00 a week. That job was even worse as fire-fighting in a timber situation was often an 18 hour day, with snatches of sleep, food and water, when and if.
Even in the 90’s (1990’s unlike Shanglan, I didn’t spend much time in Victorian England) I worked for a company that sent us out on field jobs, 12 hour shifts, 7 days a week, again a two hour travel time to the job, making it 14 hours and we were not paid for the travel.
I do not doubt that some terrible conditions existed in Victorian England, is the clothing manufacturing business, in the mines and the factories.
Earning a livelihood in a pre industrial and industrial society was not an easy task. With the advent of machinery, steam power, efficiency shot up over the cottage industries of hand labor.
Does it surprise me that the vast influx of workers from the countryside overwhelmed the capacity of a city to provide for them? Does it surprise me that the use of coal and peat to fire steam engines caused toxic pollution? Does it surprise me that in such close quarters, disease was rampant?
This tired old tirade of those who continue to rail against the industrial revolution just to support a basically ‘socialist, agrarian agenda’, is silly.
There was a ‘peasant revolution’; how wonderful you can twist it to be a ‘labor agenda’ justifying guilds and modern day union corruption.
A population decimated by disease and then poverty, surely undergoes terrific stress and people do whatever it takes to survive. One also has to consider, in context, the nature of a class/feudal society wherein peasants had no options to express opposition to the Lords and Ladies of blue blood.
Thus your attempt for forage through history to find doubtful examples of the failure of the free market place and the evils of capitalism, did not go unnoticed and I imagine just a few will see through your feeble attempt to redirect the discussion.
The basic issue about population, the ‘Population Bomb’ Malthusian concept book, is having and will have repercussions throughout the first half of the 21st century.
While it was duly noted that liberal welfare policy provides incentives for single parent moms to bear more children, you did not note that it also eviscerated and emasculated the necessity of the male breadwinner and acted to destroy not only the family, but the morality of the ‘mom’ as she could not ‘legally’ have a live in partner and thus had to sneak around the law.
As I purported earlier, I do not expect even one card carrying liberal to face up to and admit the failure of 50 years of left wing political and economic experiments. However, I intend to make it as difficult as possible for you to wriggle out of that indictment.
Seattle Zack, yes, a white male with a large family, although I have said both before, but anyway, Bite me!
Amicus…
