Why do Bible thumpers

[His_kitty]

Re: Ah, religion

Why do believers condemn/go into fits over non-believers?

Which brings up the interesting flipside, why do [some] non-believers condemn believers?

Why do [some] non-believers attack a believers intelligence, because they happen to believe in God?



Playing Devils advocate here .........

 

[brokenbrainwave]

Re: Re: Ah, religion

Which brings up the interesting flipside, why do [some] non-believers condemn believers?

Why do [some] non-believers attack a believers intelligence, because they happen to believe in God?



Playing Devils advocate here .........

well put, bottom line no matter what one personally believes, most people seem bred with the inclination they must push it down your throat. As the campus liberal@a southern Christian college back in the late 80's-early 90's I grew to have a disdain for "bible thumpers". Now a little older and arguably wiser, I have realised I was a guilty as they in trying to "enlighten" the dimmed masses with my pro everything diatribes.

 

[perks]

what was the question? I fell asleep.

 

[brokenbrainwave]

what was the question? I fell asleep.

who's sexier, Oswald or Dora the Explorer was the question

 

[Velius]

Re: Re: Ah, religion

Which brings up the interesting flipside, why do [some] non-believers condemn believers?

Why do [some] non-believers attack a believers intelligence, because they happen to believe in God?



Playing Devils advocate here .........

I don't attack their intelligence, just their extreme prejudice against anyone that doesn't do exactly as they do (some religions that is...).

 

[His_kitty]

Re: Re: Re: Ah, religion

I don't attack their intelligence, just their extreme prejudice against anyone that doesn't do exactly as they do (some religions that is...).

My only thought was that it seemed as though people who believed in God were being stereotyped as unbending, prejudiced, self righteous, zealot's. While there are some like that, there are a good many who are not.

 

[Shy Tall Guy]

automatically assume a person is Satan or being provoked by Satan when you bring up contradictions in the Bible...or even more so..try to tell them something that could make them think a little more?

Not all do. Some may call me a "Bible Thumper", although I rarely thump one, but I have been known to stand up for my Christian beliefs.

I do not believe that people are provoked by Satan when they talk about contradictions in the Bible. For one thing, any knowledgeable Christian knows there are a number of contradictions there. I have a book in my library called "Bible Difficulties" that addresses some of those contradictions.

I doubt anyone seriously considers that you are literally Satan. Some may believe that you are "provoked" by Satan, but that would depend on how you talk about those contradictions. I have met non-Christians who express genuine intellectual interest in these contradictions (as I have myself), and non-Christians who simply use them as so much cannon fodder in a war of words without even really knowing what they are talking about, or having any interest in a real answer. The latter I would say are maybe inspired by "Satan", or more likely just by their own need to sow doubt and confusion in Christians whom they view as their enemies, as ignorant and superstitious people who are beneath them. I quickly tire of talking to such people for obvious reasons.

Of course, there is the Christian equivalent; people who are so insecure in their faith that they take the easy way out by pointing your way and uttering "infidel!".

By the way, i'm now known as the spawn of Satan's loins.

By whom?

 

[Todd-'o'-Vision]

automatically assume a person is Satan or being provoked by Satan when you bring up contradictions in the Bible...or even more so..try to tell them something that could make them think a little more?

By the way, i'm now known as the spawn of Satan's loins.

skitch

Sorry but I have never called a person in satan or provoked by satan for bringing thier out of context, partial verses, and unstudied contradictions in the bible.

Maybe its the old ex-atheist in me, i dunno.

 

[Todd-'o'-Vision]

if people like born agains are bible thumpers then does that make me, a strict atheist, a "on the origins of man" thumper?


eww that joke stank...

you can be a thumpin on my virgin man origins any time you like Chaste Girl

 

[Todd-'o'-Vision]

Why single out Christianity? It's no worse than any other I can think of and not as bad as some strains of Islam which teach treachery and murder as virtues. Look what it's done for the Arabs' civilization.

What religion doesn't have as it's primary purpose the control and direction of the minds of the followers?

Cause christianity is the worlds scape goat, it will be amongst the first to go in faith genocide.

 

[Weird Harold]

automatically assume a person is Satan or being provoked by Satan when you bring up contradictions in the Bible...

Uhm, The Devil makes them do it?


sorry couldn't resist

 

[Guest]

 

[Velius]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Ah, religion

My only thought was that it seemed as though people who believed in God were being stereotyped as unbending, prejudiced, self righteous, zealot's. While there are some like that, there are a good many who are not.

Yes there are a good many that aren't that way, and I don't mind them. It's the freakish cult zealots that get to me.

 

[Chantal Marchon]

I think it has to do with a brain washing indoctrination that some religions don't even know they use. It is either of God, By God or of satan. There is no in between. This indoctrination has over the past few centuries allowed for control of the people following certain religions. They did not want to die and go to hell and almost everything was punishable as a sin.

It started with the Catholic church slightly before the time of the inquisition when kings and emperors didn't dare sneeze with out asking the local priest for a blessing from god.

It continued through the time of the inquisition where it was about politics and power.

The idea that it was either of god or satan was further heightened in this country by the Puritan faith who took things to extremes- banishing and ostracising people who questioned the church.

It has led to a whole culture of people who follow blindly and believe anything that there church tells them because to question the word of the church is to question god. To question god causes pain and mental anguish.

In short it is about power.

 

[Velius]

I think it has to do with a brain washing indoctrination that some religions don't even know they use. It is either of God, By God or of satan. There is no in between. This indoctrination has over the past few centuries allowed for control of the people following certain religions. They did not want to die and go to hell and almost everything was punishable as a sin.

It started with the Catholic church slightly before the time of the inquisition when kings and emperors didn't dare sneeze with out asking the local priest for a blessing from god.

It continued through the time of the inquisition where it was about politics and power.

The idea that it was either of god or satan was further heightened in this country by the Puritan faith who took things to extremes- banishing and ostracising people who questioned the church.

It has led to a whole culture of people who follow blindly and believe anything that there church tells them because to question the word of the church is to question god. To question god causes pain and mental anguish.

In short it is about power.

Exactly why I made spiteful comments about prejudice and such in my earlier posts. Exactly why I don't like freakish cult zealot Christian peoples.

 

[JazzManJim]

Here's the logic behind it.

There's an all-powerful all-present God who has given humans a set of instruction on how to live their life, what they must do to get into Heaven, and what happens to the people who don't make it there.

these people believe with all their hearts and souls that this God exists and that He is a real and present influence on their lives, and that one day they will have to face the decisions they've made here on Earth.

Now, having found out from this God just what happens to people who don't get into Heaven, and just how terrible it's going to be, they've decided, because they are, at heart, good folks, that it would be a very, very bad thing for someone to go there. They don't want to see that. They don't want anyone to have to suffer that much for that long when there's something that they can do about it.

So they implore. They beg. They cajole. They plead. They nag. After all, they figure, this person may get mad at me now, but it's a damned sight better than having to face God in the end and answer to Him why I didn't do everythign in my power to help prevent this persons eternal suffering.

The one thing they forget in their enthusiasm, is that imploring isn't the best way to go about it. They forget that cojoling can cause someone to stop listening. They forget that being reasonable can help someone be more willing to hear what you have to say, even if it is the same thing you've been telling them for years.

IN their enthusiasm and, yeah, fear for your immortal soul, they forget that sometimes tact and an indirect approach can work. That's not a terrible fault. That's even understandable.

 

[Unclebill]

Originally posted by *goddess*emi*
It must be a bitch to have to delete God or references to God from expletives when you're angry. Since you don't believe in a Deity, I assume you would just automatically erase all references from your vocabulary. Wouldn't you?

Just asking


emi

Personally, I don't bother. Too much effort involved for no value returned. It doesn't mean anything significant; carries about the same significance as does Hell or hell or shit; just another expletive.

Originally posted by JazzManJim
Why is it that when people encounter a person with a strong religious faith, they feel the unerring need to "make them think a little more"?

Perhaps it's just the motivation to have them think "a little".

Originally posted by Todd-'o'-Vision
Cause christianity is the worlds scape goat, it will be amongst the first to go in faith genocide.

Pardon my error; I thought that was the Jews.

 

[OpposingBalance]

*thump thump thump*

 

[skitch]

You would think that me, being a Southern Baptist, from the Bible Belt of America even, that I might be a little reserved in calling others "Bible thumpers" and whatnot. I guess from my first post it would seem that i was saying all people of their certain faiths are 'thumpers.' but the reality is I don't see why someone having faith in their religion gives them the authority to be closed minded. I do my best to not be when a person comes along to teach me something new and different *to quote a topic on the boards*....hell, having to take religion and western civilization courses in college HAS to make a person think outside the box.

So the short and shitty side of it is...My class was having a discussion about religion. Being in the Bible Belt, as i've said, the class is made up of MOSTLY Christians. I just happened to bring up the fact that the translated word for "virgin" *as in the virgin mary* can be translated 2 ways...either as a woman who hasn't had sex or a woman who is simply petitte *sp* followed by a few contradictions in the Bible. From that point on, I've been viewed as this person who is totally Satanic or something of that nature. Now i've taken the time to visit almost every type of religious service that America has to offer...taken the time to listen to what everyone said and basically to just absorb all the knowledge about it i can. Why do I become the devil *sarcasm* for simply pointing out things that are already there, but that they refuse to see?

I can understand the scaring technique..."sure you can say 'no', but, you'll go to hell if you don't accept Him." but coming from someone who's been there...I also remember the feeling of, "and now that i've given you the choice, your blood won't be on my hands." So is it the desire to actually help someone...or the fact that people are basically continuing to look out for no. 1?


skitch

 

[MechaBlade]

Here we go...

Why single out Christianity? It's no worse than any other I can think of and not as bad as some strains of Islam which teach treachery and murder as virtues. Look what it's done for the Arabs' civilization.

What religion doesn't have as it's primary purpose the control and direction of the minds of the followers?

True. People single out Christianity because it is the most popular religion where they live (most of us). Most religions are much worse.

It must be a bitch to have to delete God or references to God from expletives when you're angry. Since you don't believe in a Deity, I assume you would just automatically erase all references from your vocabulary. Wouldn't you?

Nope. Goddammit! Oh my God! Just said it twice there. Why? Because I can. When Christians do it, they're are saying the "Lord's name in vain," and therefore, being bad Christians. But no one cares if I do it. Funny how if so many Xians didn't do it, then I wouldn't have gotten conditioned to say it.

No one says "Goddammit!" actually expecting god to damn it to hell. Same goes for me when I exclaim "Holy Mother of Corn!" or "Fuck You!" It doesn't mean shit.

Everyone believes in something, without proof or sound reasoning. Maybe you believe in love, or your family, or maybe your political philosophy... doesn't matter. Whatever you believe in that others can challenge.


....Sure, religious people run to their scriptures to explain all. Just as atheists do, except their scriptures are different. And their absolution is different. But it's all essentially the same thing, really. Beliefs. Show me someone who says there's no proof of a god, and I'll show you someone with no proof that there isn't one, either.

....And who's to say holy books hold no significance?

I don't believe in anything. Obviously everyone believes that some things are likely to happen or be. I believe that it is not likely an alien will beam me up as I type and probe and kill me. But it's possible. My beliefs are based on fact, science, and observation, instead of what someone wrote thousands of years ago. And my beliefs are tested, instead of accepted without thought.

Atheist scriptures are different. They are based on science and thought. There may be a few atheists that are atheists because of their parents, but most of us think about religion and come to a conclusion. Ockham's razor says there is no god. Logic. However, there's no way to prove there is no god. Although I am an atheist (believe there is no god), I understand this (possibility of god existing). I can prove to you there is no all-powerful, benevolent god if you want.

The holy books hold little to no historical significance, much like other written texts such as Beowulf and Beloved.

Which brings up the interesting flipside, why do [some] non-believers condemn believers?

Why do [some] non-believers attack a believers intelligence, because they happen to believe in God?

A lot of non-believers were belivers once. Now they know the truth, or a portion of it. And they are angry at the religious for ruining the first part of their lives, making them believe in things that don't exist. They feel the urge to attack those who have caused this misery, and make them see the truth, improving the lives of believers. Plus, most believers believe because they haven't thought about their religion a lot. Religion's popularity comes from inheritance, not converts.

I used to be like those non-believers. Then I matured. Some people need religion. I leave them alone.

who's sexier, Oswald or Dora the Explorer was the question

Dora.

Perhaps it's just the motivation to have them think "a little".

Lol. Nice.

 

[Chantal Marchon]

Some of the other topics have made me want to explain something else---

taking the name of God in vain- God is a job title. For the most part most people do not know the actual name of god or the correct pronounciation. It is a jewish word and is seldom mentioned. For most, simply God is enough- because they only worship one.

The reason why the jewish and christian god told them in the 10 commandements not to take his name in vain does not mean to not say it as a swear word.

As in any religion those with a close connection with their spirtual beings of guidance can summon those beings simply by saying their names. So saying god's name in vain basically means- "Don't call me if you don't have something important to say. Cause then I show up and its nothing and you are wasting my time and ticking me off."

 

[RawHumor]

As in any religion those with a close connection with their spirtual beings of guidance can summon those beings simply by saying their names. So saying god's name in vain basically means- "Don't call me if you don't have something important to say. Cause then I show up and its nothing and you are wasting my time and ticking me off."

Ummm... not quite.

I believe what He meant was more along the lines of these:

Don't kill someone in My name when you're doing it out of your own hatred.
Don't use My name to curse someone when I have nothing to do with your conversation.
Don't summon My name for power in a manner that is unflattering to Me.

 

[Velius]

Some of the other topics have made me want to explain something else---

taking the name of God in vain- God is a job title. For the most part most people do not know the actual name of god or the correct pronounciation. It is a jewish word and is seldom mentioned. For most, simply God is enough- because they only worship one.

The reason why the jewish and christian god told them in the 10 commandements not to take his name in vain does not mean to not say it as a swear word.

As in any religion those with a close connection with their spirtual beings of guidance can summon those beings simply by saying their names. So saying god's name in vain basically means- "Don't call me if you don't have something important to say. Cause then I show up and its nothing and you are wasting my time and ticking me off."

I have seen the word. Of course it is, in all probability, made up completely (considering most of the Christian religion is just bastardized beliefs from pagans, it is more than likely). Good point though, I know if I was a deity I wouldn't want a bunch of fuckhead people calling me while I was jerking off or whatnot.

 

[Chantal Marchon]

Ummm... not quite.

I believe what He meant was more along the lines of these:

Don't kill someone in My name when you're doing it out of your own hatred.
Don't use My name to curse someone when I have nothing to do with your conversation.
Don't summon My name for power in a manner that is unflattering to Me.

That would be another way to put it- but in effect the person doing those things is still summoning god without a good reason.

 

[Velius]

LOL If not killing in his name is something he meant by that, then he sure failed to get the point across to his followers. Pathetic.