Does/should motivation for a partner's kink matter?

[CutieMouse]

*****

 

[DeservingBitch]

So you are right, in a sense - I lack faith. When someone is 25, of course they'll be OK when things turn shitty. Few mistakes we ever make at 25ish adversely affect the rest of our lives. At my age and station in life it is a whole different story. Who, before the age 30-35, ever really thinks about risk, consequence, implications, disappointment, starting over, or anything else that is life? No, they are too busy living, learning, discovering, trying and trying again. At 42 I am discovering myself in a way I should have done 15-20 yrs ago when I had absolutely nothing to lose.

I'll go with other on this and call bullshit.

I'm 30 (well, in a couple months I will be). I have much more faith in myself now than I did 5, 10, 15 years ago. I'm much more ready to take risks, to take a leap of faith now than I was 5, 10, 15 years ago. Why? Because i got fucked over, I made mistakes, I've experienced pain, I've hurt others, others have hurt me. But I'm still here to talk about it. I survived. And while a year ago I was crying for most of my waking time for over 2 months and wanted to give it all up, I'm now here, and pretty damn happy about my life. Basically, it's because I've taken risks and sometimes got hurt that I've learned to trust myself that eventually, I'll be OK. To trust and have faith in myself that I'm smart enough, resilient enough, and strong enough to survive and make it better.

 

[Homburg]

As an aside, "Risk Averse" is just bizspeak for "Cowardice".

I like really gut-level awful self-truths to be called by their proper names.

 

[half_full]

First of all, if you wanted answers pertaining to relationships, you should have made that clear in the OP. I just reread it, and it certainly reads as you were asking for opinions on mainly activities that occur with in a relationship, not on the broader topic of the relationship itself

Actually, I was not looking for answers specific to relationships. I asked the question I wanted. Whatever answers I got, I could deduce from that what applied to me and what didn't. I was looking for a broad set of opinions on the various personality characteristics of people who engage in certain BDSM related activities. It's been something I've been curious about for many months now. This thread somehow derailed and became more focused on my own internal struggles.

You'll find that the majority of people who are into BDSM and over 40, most likely found out about or finally accepted their inclinations in their 30's and 40's.

Yes, I have noticed this as a pattern at least in the online community. However, there is a difference between the people that discover and pursue their inclination at this age, and the people who were always a little more self aware and spent their 20-30s refining who they are, perfecting their kink, and seeking that perfect match. I am in that first group but I was posing the question to people in the second.

You are making a mighty judgment there. Most of the people into BDSM at a young age who are serious about it do realize just how much it could affect/effect them adversely in the future. There are several regulars I can think of off hand (having only been here a few months) that are young and single, and are being very picky about who they get into a relationship with.

It wasn't a judgement, it was a statement of personal observation of 20+ years experience. I have known a small few people in my life under 25 (under 30 for that matter) who really have their shit together. And I'm not just talking about relationships here - career, finances, family - everything. It's normal. I wasn't making any judgements.

But I will try to give you an honest answer here.
It's pretty much the same as with choosing a vanilla partner.
When looking to go into a D/s relationship, it's still just a relationship. You need to do all the 'normal' looking into the person as before. If their motivation for kink is because of misogyny, that would very likely become apparent just by getting to know them and being a very good observer. You don't go from strangers to an M/s contract where the slave's only choice is leaving the relationship in a few days. I think you can get my point there.

Yes, I do get the point and all the obvious 'Relationships 101' shit, I got it. I didn't come to this forum looking for advice on 'how' to find the right person or get involved in the lifestyle. I have my own plan for that. But as realtionships go, I recognize some of the extra precautions that one must take when contemplating a BDSM principled relationship, and not because I think whips, floggers, ropes, and candle wax are dangerous, but because of the unequal power dynamic. I came here thinking that people experienced in the lifestyle could provide insite that would be a shortcut to the 'you just have to get to know someone' learning curve. I can provide that kind of advice to people seeking vanilla relationships.

I understand your question better now. Because of the obvious inequality it's much easier for the people you don't want to get involved with to find someone who will take the crap.

Bingo. You nailed it. I know vanilla crap when I smell it. Don't trust myself enough yet to recognize the other. I think it's because I haven't quite defined what the other crap is yet. For example, if a misogynistic vanilla man beats his wife because she 'misbehaves', it's abuse because the intent is to do harm and there is no consent. It's a no brainer. A misogynistic Dom (and let's make him only slightly misogynistic - he's capable of loving women but has a God complex), punishes his sub 'because he can', 'because he likes it', 'because she deserves it,' and for other reasons that I've been told are perfectly acceptable in this lifestyle. Intent could be any number of things but there is consent. So what really is the difference between these two guys? Probably control, which is important, but not enough to make my point. The thing is, when I think about the kind of man I'm attracted to, the kind of man who inspires me, the only kind of man who could ever dominate me, he is extraordinarily intelligent, successful and good at what he does, strong physical presence, confident bordering on arrogant, unapologetic, self aware, commanding, demanding, protective. To earn my respect, I must be able to see him as someone superior to me (not that I want to be considered inferior, if that makes any sense) and, he must be capable of instilling a healthy amount of fear. Domination for me begins in the mind. Now, how am I to be able tell the difference between the guy I just described, whom half my brain deeply desires, and the slightly misogynistic Dom, whom the other half of my brain says this is someone to avoid? And does it really matter? Are they really the same guy but I'm just in denial? You see my dilema? Until I get some kind of reconcilliation between the two halves of my brain, I don't think I'm ready to enter this lifestyle. I'd be the one to get caught up in somebody else's crap net.
BTW, I would not have this problem if I were seeking a vanilla relationship. We could still do the kinky sex and have some power dynamic in the bedroom. But, my criteria for partners would be different, it would be safer, and there would be less risk. I haven't ruled out yet that in the end it may be the best option for me.

 

[Netzach]

A misogynistic Dom (and let's make him only slightly misogynistic - he's capable of loving women but has a God complex), punishes his sub 'because he can', 'because he likes it', 'because she deserves it,' and for other reasons that I've been told are perfectly acceptable in this lifestyle. Intent could be any number of things but there is consent. So what really is the difference between these two guys? Probably control, which is important, but not enough to make my point. The thing is, when I think about the kind of man I'm attracted to, the kind of man who inspires me, the only kind of man who could ever dominate me, he is extraordinarily intelligent, successful and good at what he does, strong physical presence, confident bordering on arrogant, unapologetic, self aware, commanding, demanding, protective. To earn my respect, I must be able to see him as someone superior to me (not that I want to be considered inferior, if that makes any sense) and, he must be capable of instilling a healthy amount of fear. Domination for me begins in the mind. Now, how am I to be able tell the difference between the guy I just described, whom half my brain deeply desires, and the slightly misogynistic Dom, whom the other half of my brain says this is someone to avoid? And does it really matter? Are they really the same guy but I'm just in denial? You see my dilema? Until I get some kind of reconcilliation between the two halves of my brain, I don't think I'm ready to enter this lifestyle. I'd be the one to get caught up in somebody else's crap net.
BTW, I would not have this problem if I were seeking a vanilla relationship. We could still do the kinky sex and have some power dynamic in the bedroom. But, my criteria for partners would be different, it would be safer, and there would be less risk. I haven't ruled out yet that in the end it may be the best option for me.

Do you really think you would not be able to tell from getting to know someone well enough to want to spend lots of time with him, if his main motive is misogyny? I'm not really sifting through MDoms, but I do think that people announce themselves pretty well.
They're pretty easy to smell.

It's also possible that someone punish his sub "because she deserves it" but not because she's a woman per se - or not in large degree because of that.


Some of them will out and tell you "this is a large part of the thrill for me", but personally I find that one of RR's more endearing traits and proof of a nice healthy degree of self-knowledge which wimpier PC types can't handle - I'd go for someone like that if I were in the market, but that's me and an exercise in imagination. In actuality the only person to elicit a submissive response from me is someone from whom I have nothing to fear at all, so the question is completely different.

I agree with CM, it's not the motive, it's what you do with it. I mean if you really want to reduce people to motives it's eat fuck and win nine times in ten, obviously we can't all run around and do whatever it takes to do that constantly no matter who we are. Obviously someone could have dark and deranged reasons for enjoying what they enjoy without it necessarily spelling danger for you at all, or perfectly benign intentions and they injure you.

As for the increased risk of entering this kind of relationship because there's an unequal power dynamic - if you are entering a negotiation at that much of a disadvantage with someone who likes it that way, then you are not doing your part to keep yourself safe by not leaping into submission, you are not keeping your head on, you are not scrutinizing. People have the power you let them have and letting someone have more of it than a vanilla potential date just because you are sitting down for coffee -- suffice it to say I think the onus is on both people. I think you're also underestimating, as a lot of people do, the degrees to which perfectly vanilla people fuck one another up every day.

The longer I've dealt with kinked people, the more keenly aware of the dangers in "normal" life I've become.

 

[DeservingBitch]

I know vanilla crap when I smell it. Don't trust myself enough yet to recognize the other. I think it's because I haven't quite defined what the other crap is yet.

And how did you get to recognize the smell of vanilla crap? I'll assume not very differently then anyone else: by encountering some on your walk trough life, and probably walking on some and maybe even ruining your favorite shoes when it happened.

Well, at the risk of repeating what everybody else already suggested before: the only way for you to learn to recognize this other crap (I'm not convinced there's a significant difference here - but that's what my other post is about) is to see it, smell it, and yes, maybe even walk into it.

The good news here? While crap stinks and it really sucks to ruin your shoes by walking in it, most people survive the experience.

 

[_kiana_]

A misogynistic Dom (and let's make him only slightly misogynistic - he's capable of loving women but has a God complex), punishes his sub 'because he can', 'because he likes it', 'because she deserves it,' and for other reasons that I've been told are perfectly acceptable in this lifestyle.

Honest question - what do you mean when you say "punish"? There are lots of thoughts out there on it, but to (making an assumption here) most who have D/s as part of their everyday life, punishments usually only happen when the submissive has done something wrong, disobeyed an order, etc. And most times the submissive would know this. If a sub is truly getting punished, made to feel like s/he's done something to disappoint their PYL, and doesn't know what they did wrong? How can they possibly fix the mistake? How can they make sure it doesn't happen again? That would be poor use of control on the PYL.

If you mean beat the pyl, hurt him/her but not have the emotional downfall of punishment that can be completely different. That sort of "because I can" is just the PYL wanting to enjoy him/herself. And that happens to be by hurting their partner physically.

I'd hope that by the time two people have implemented a punishment dynamic into their lives, they would know the difference between honest punishment for correction, and the sort of slap-and-tickle fun 'punishment'.

If "because I can" comes up early on in a relationship, I'd personally call it a red flag. Until a pyl gets to know the style of the PYL, gains trust and faith in him/her, hiding reasons or not giving good reasons behind actions only builds mistrust and other negative feelings/emotions. So it'd be in the interest of the PYL not to play that kind of game early if they want to keep the relationship going.

it's abuse because the intent is to do harm and there is no consent.

A lot of people use the phrase, "hurt not harm" when it comes to a BDSM or D/s life. The difference between hurt and harm is individual to everyone (as is everything really) but harm usually means serious physical injury that requires medical attention, or mental anguish that lasts longer than an individual scene/play session. A long lasting negative effect. The line for abuse in BDSM is very gray. There's been a thread recently on it...should be in the first few pages of posts.


So many questions, not enough answers or time, huh? Most of us (all?) are still working things out for ourselves too.

I would like to take the time to thank you for starting this thread. It's had it's crap at times but has been very thought provoking and interesting.

 

[half_full]

I'll go with other on this and call bullshit.

I'm 30 (well, in a couple months I will be). I have much more faith in myself now than I did 5, 10, 15 years ago. I'm much more ready to take risks, to take a leap of faith now than I was 5, 10, 15 years ago. Why? Because i got fucked over, I made mistakes, I've experienced pain, I've hurt others, others have hurt me. But I'm still here to talk about it. I survived. And while a year ago I was crying for most of my waking time for over 2 months and wanted to give it all up, I'm now here, and pretty damn happy about my life. Basically, it's because I've taken risks and sometimes got hurt that I've learned to trust myself that eventually, I'll be OK. To trust and have faith in myself that I'm smart enough, resilient enough, and strong enough to survive and make it better.

Woa...I think we are talking apples and oranges here. I also have more faith in my ability to make better decisions because I have learned patience and the value of due-dilligence and knowledge. I don't take unnecessary risks and then have faith that everything will turn out OK. I quit doing that in my 20s. This is something that naturally comes with age for the vast majority of people. And there is a difference between taking risks and calculated risk. The first we do when we are young and don't know any better; the second is something we learn through experience to do. The resilliance and strength that you are talking about is emotional (I assume). That is not at all what I was saying. The relationship mistakes we make earlier in life aren't as likely to have long-lasting effects on our assets, finances, careers, personal well-being, as those we make later when we have more to lose. That has nothing to do with whether we are emotionally strong enough to overcome pain and loss. Ask anyone over 35 who actually has something to lose, and they'll tell you it's not bullshit.

 

[DeservingBitch]

Woa...I think we are talking apples and oranges here. I also have more faith in my ability to make better decisions because I have learned patience and the value of due-dilligence and knowledge. I don't take unnecessary risks and then have faith that everything will turn out OK. I quit doing that in my 20s. This is something that naturally comes with age for the vast majority of people. And there is a difference between taking risks and calculated risk. The first we do when we are young and don't know any better; the second is something we learn through experience to do. The resilliance and strength that you are talking about is emotional (I assume). That is not at all what I was saying. The relationship mistakes we make earlier in life aren't as likely to have long-lasting effects on our assets, finances, careers, personal well-being, as those we make later when we have more to lose. That has nothing to do with whether we are emotionally strong enough to overcome pain and loss. Ask anyone over 35 who actually has something to lose, and they'll tell you it's not bullshit.

This is quite offensive, and rather than responding back (i actually wouldn't even know where to begin), i'm just going to ask you a question: if those are your priorities, what do all this has to do with entering (or not) into a BDSM relationship? In the world I live in, a lot of vanilla people are being screwed over, lose their assets, have to give up or change careers, lose their children and what not because of some choices they made. What is it that you have more to lose in considering a D/s partner than a vanilla one?

 

[half_full]

I think just about everyone who is serious about a long term relationship incorporating BDSM prefers due-dilligence and knowledge of faith...

No, I disagree. If this were true, more relationships would last longer. That is why I personally prefer not to engage in sex right away when I meet someone. This is not a prudish stance but a practical one. For many people, especially women, sex is not just an act of biology, but is intrinsically tied to other emotions and feelings, such as connection, longing, desire, self worth, fullfillment, and love. Having sex too early in a relationship can often mean that we either fail to recognize or outright ignore red flags about a person. We become emotionally invested before the due-dilligence. I would imagine that this could be especially troublesome in BDSM based relationships, because from what I've heard, the sex can be very good.

Everyone has something to lose. The question is - do you live stuck in the fear or the wonder of what might be around the corner?At 32 (with 5 kids - youngest a newborn, no degree, 10 years of being a SAHM mom, etc) I left my marriage. At 33 I rearranged custody so their father was primary parent and relocated to attempt to go back to school/start a new career (while entering a complicated power based long distance relationship). At 34 I was unemployed and scrambling to make my small business work. At 35 I'm shifting directions yet again, exploring other avenues of creative and professional happiness, learning from mistakes made with regards to D/s dating**, and starting my first (hopefully successful) M/s relationship.

Just waking up in the morning is messy. I'm on "starting over" version 4.0 or something like that at this point, and I refuse to let fear of things being "messy" get in the way of being happy. Everyone always has something to lose, but everyone also always has something to gain.

Some people have more to lose than others. If you start with nothing and things turn shitty, then you've lost nothing. This is true no matter what your age. Although I feel bad for the circumstances of your life, I admire you for your courage and tenacity, but you must recognize that you and I are in two different stations in life. I will not take unnecessary risks and chance losing all that I have spent a lifetime to build and acquire for the sake of immediate gratification. Why would I do that when I can take a slower more measured approach and achieve hapiness with less risk? You seem to be stuck on this idea that I am somehow paralyzed and unwilling to make decisions for myself. I am making plenty of decisions, that are right for me in the moment, and include engaging in conversation with you via this forum.

I think several people focused on physical aspects of "dangerous" situations because physical safety is often a primary concern and you kept harping on *sadists* - who tend to do the floggy, whippy, knife type things. Suggestions to put yourself in non-physical, perfectly safe situations (munches/coffee/lecture series) were met with resistance. At this point I have no 'effing clue what's holding you back other than you, and (so far) you've found reasons to dismiss anyone's suggestions that might help you feel more at ease; hopefully you won't go the next 40+ years recognizing there isnt' anything wrong with you, but too hung up to do anything about it.

It doesn't seem to matter how many times or how many ways I address these statements of yours, you always come back to them. Has it ever occurred to you that asking people questions, reading their answers, telling them what I think, having them challenge me, asking better questions, re-evaluting what I think, is exactly what I need right now? This little exercise has been immensely helpful.

Netz is right - you do your best to make good decisions and you take risks. Do a search from my posts back in June/July... where I fell hard for a guy who said all the right things, had all the right answers, vetted beautifully, and wanted to live happily ever after with me. I spent 2 weeks with him at his place in the Dominican, did full bore 24/7 D/s, came home believing him when he said he'd move me down there in a few months (to the point that I left personal items there at his suggestion)... and he fell off the planet within 5 weeks of my return flight home. I baked him cookies, played hostess (of the non-sexual kind) for his friends, met his business partner, spoke to his father on the phone, served him sexually 6-10 times a day, and accepted a relationship in which I took "no" out of my vocabulary because on paper, on the phone, in person he looked like a good guy. Unfortunately he wasn't the man of his word that he claimed to be. So, lesson learned - you can do everything right and still get burned. Next! (BTW, so far "next" is a rather amazing gentleman...)

I did follow this story over the summer. And this is exactly why I choose to take a much slower and measured approach to such things. I am very sorry this happend to you but it would not have happened to me.

 

[Mazuri]

I am very sorry this happend to you but it would not have happened to me.

I'm sorry, I'm going to cry bullshit on this one. Unless you plan to keep all your relationships at the current level (meaning research only, no actual person to person talking, meeting, etc), no matter what you do or how much you plan, plot or delve into someone's motives, this could STILL happen to you and very easily. Why? People are different in the getting to know you/dating/first blush of relationship phase than they are 6 months or a year into the relationship. People also change, sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse, and there's generally no way of knowing which it will be before it happens.

To say you'll NEVER get hurt by a relationship, or NEVER get fooled by someone you're attracted to is both horribly naive of you and insulting to CutieMouse.

You will not get to a place where you will be 100% happy with someone's motives, desires, wants, and needs unless you learn how to create the guy from thin air. You will always have some risk of failure, that he'll hurt you, that he'll con you into something you don't want to do...that's called LIFE.

 

[CutieMouse]

*****

 

[Homburg]

Some people have more to lose than others. If you start with nothing and things turn shitty, then you've lost nothing.

What the fuck? When you start with nothing, and take chances, you might have nothing to lose, but you also have jack for back-up plans. When the aforementioned single mom with three kids working at Walmart takes a chance with a man, she takes her life and her kids' lives in her hands. If her life is disrupted, she is out on the streets. Unless you utterly lose your fucking mind and give whatever Dom is perfect enough for you Power of Attorney or somesuch, you will still have career, money, employability, savings, investments, etc that I assume you have from your posts.

You won't be on the streets. Catch the clue. You might have "more to lose", but other people stand to land in far uglier places than you can imagine if they stumble.

Your perspective is utterly fucked up.

I did follow this story over the summer. And this is exactly why I choose to take a much slower and measured approach to such things. I am very sorry this happend to you but it would not have happened to me.

Of course it won't happen to you. You're too much of a coward to take any chances. I would say more, but I am honestly at a loss as to how to properly address how affronted I am at this comment.

You are not even half the woman, or human being, that CutieMouse is.

 

[Netzach]

You can't get buried like an egyptian anymore or a viking.

News flash.

I'm richer than you will ever ever be.

I think you also know that, don't you? Showing up to church all those years and then polo shirting your life away in the pursuit of a pile of stuff that just doesn't make you happy but scared shitless to do what might.

You've happily commented on the station of everyone here and followed our posts for a good long time, so you know how much respect I have for people who fuck up their one, their only, their singular go-around because they can't pick what they want and risk anything.

And if you think a pile of stuff and a status is that big a risk talking to a single mother of five you really need head-ass removal. You think you're better than everyone else. That your vulnerability is wait wait, MORE vulnerable, we don't get it, your fragility so much MORE fragile, your hurt so much more hurtable - so please, you ask us, how can I avoid making any mistakes doing what y'all are so stupidly doing and getting hurt? That is the sum total of this dialogue.

Yes, it would not have happened to you. That'a abundantly clear isn't it?

I don't think that makes you look better, rather more pathetic. You can't even imagine having a cup of coffee in a room full of people like us, WTF, and keep saying it's not your style. Not your style? I'm beginning to sense massive bullshit, because meetings are probably also not your style then, and as we know you might have to sit through one or two to be a corporate raider. Or does the problem remain that we are scary, weird, laughable people, and you just happen to want to do what we do only no one can ever know?

I bet you vote GOP too. Bah. I'm out.

 

[DeservingBitch]

The way privilege makes people stupid never ceases to amaze me.

Have fun in your privileged, cocooned boring life. Mind the freaks.


I'm out too.

 

[nh23]

What the fuck? When you start with nothing, and take chances, you might have nothing to lose, but you also have jack for back-up plans. When the aforementioned single mom with three kids working at Walmart takes a chance with a man, she takes her life and her kids' lives in her hands. If her life is disrupted, she is out on the streets. Unless you utterly lose your fucking mind and give whatever Dom is perfect enough for you Power of Attorney or somesuch, you will still have career, money, employability, savings, investments, etc that I assume you have from your posts.

You won't be on the streets. Catch the clue. You might have "more to lose", but other people stand to land in far uglier places than you can imagine if they stumble.

Your perspective is utterly fucked up.



Of course it won't happen to you. You're too much of a coward to take any chances. I would say more, but I am honestly at a loss as to how to properly address how affronted I am at this comment.

You are not even half the woman, or human being, that CM is.

*applauds*

 

[nh23]

You can't get buried like an egyptian anymore or a viking.

News flash.

I'm richer than you will ever ever be. So's CM.

I think you also know that, don't you? Showing up to church all those years and then polo shirting your life away in the pursuit of a pile of stuff that just doesn't make you happy but scared shitless to do what might.

You've happily commented on the station of everyone here and followed our posts for a good long time, so you know how much respect I have for people who fuck up their one, their only, their singular go-around because they can't pick what they want and risk anything.

And if you think a pile of stuff and a status is that big a risk talking to a single mother of five you really need head-ass removal. You think you're better than everyone else. That your vulnerability is wait wait, MORE vulnerable, we don't get it, your fragility so much MORE fragile, your hurt so much more hurtable - so please, you ask us, how can I avoid making any mistakes doing what y'all are so stupidly doing and getting hurt? That is the sum total of this dialogue.

Yes, it would not have happened to you. That'a abundantly clear isn't it?

I don't think that makes you look better, rather more pathetic. You can't even imagine having a cup of coffee in a room full of people like us, WTF, and keep saying it's not your style. Not your style? I'm beginning to sense massive bullshit, because meetings are probably also not your style then, and as we know you might have to sit through one or two to be a corporate raider. Or does the problem remain that we are scary, weird, laughable people, and you just happen to want to do what we do only no one can ever know?

I bet you vote GOP too. Bah. I'm out.

I think I'm in love with you Netzach..lol

 

[BiBunny]

I think I'm in love with you Netzach..lol

I've always been in love with Netzach. Sometimes I wonder if she and I were separated at birth....

And, to the OP, I said you were full of shit to begin with. You've demonstrated that time and again. Monica, Netz, nh--these are women I respect because they're not afraid to go for what they want, not in a "damn the torpedos; full speed ahead" kind of way, but in the way intelligent people do things, and they don't feel the need to look down their noses at The Plebians, either.

Perhaps you've had things handed to you your whole life. I haven't. For that reason, even at the age of 23, I've got more to lose than your average person. And if you want to swap tales of relationship woe, I can hold my own with damn near anybody here. I resent your belief that because I'm in my 20s that I can't possibly have had any meaningful life experiences.

There are two types of people in this world: those who go for what it takes to make them happy because they deserve it and aren't afraid to do whatever it takes, and those who sit on their asses and bitch and moan because all their wildest dreams can't fall neatly into their laps from On High. I know what kind of person I want to be, and if I have to go through pain to get there, so be it. Your posts sit you squarely in the group of people I never want to be in.

I'm done, too.

 

[DeservingBitch]

Actually, it just occured to me why none of what was said/suggested to you so far resonated with you.

It's because yours is the kind of shit that I (and I'm betting most people on this board) actively try to avoid and stay away from.

You wanted to know what crap smells? Here's an example.

Abusive asshole: Arrogant, self-centered, full-of-themselve, insecure, and insensitive person who has no qualms about exploitating other people's labor (intellectual, emotional, or otherwise) AND spit in their face while doing so, most often to make themselves feel better about themselves by putting down others. Like *you* just did very blatantly to CutieMouse, and less so blatantly to others throughout this thread.

But thanks for reminding me that while it sucks to be poor and not know how I'm going to pay my next rent, at least privilege hasn't blinded me from having my priorities straight.

 

[half_full]

To say you'll NEVER get hurt by a relationship, or NEVER get fooled by someone you're attracted to is both horribly naive of you and insulting to CutieMouse.

This is not at all what I said. I have been hurt in relationships and their is no guarantee that it won't happen again. I try to be smart about things and have learned not only from my mistakes but from those of others. I only said that what happened to CM, and we were talking about that particular incident, would not have happened to me. I, personally, would never have agreed to relocate and move in with someone after an initial meeting. That's it. I was not making any judgements about her decision, I was only commenting about my own actions.

 

[half_full]

Oh I get it... you're Important (capital "I") so taking risks in life is somehow different and harder and more life-changing than it is for someone like me... right.

As for your comments regarding the Dominican Disaster™ (I do have a sense of humor, even when things don't work out)... just... wow. I'm done with this thread. Good luck.

No, I am no more important than anyone else. But I also have an obligation to myself and others who depend on me to make the best decisions for myself. What might not be risk to you, could very well be risky to me. And the reverse is also true. This statement applies to everyone in this forum. That is life. I don't know why you should find that so insulting.

 

[half_full]

What the fuck? When you start with nothing, and take chances, you might have nothing to lose, but you also have jack for back-up plans. When the aforementioned single mom with three kids working at Walmart takes a chance with a man, she takes her life and her kids' lives in her hands. If her life is disrupted, she is out on the streets. Unless you utterly lose your fucking mind and give whatever Dom is perfect enough for you Power of Attorney or somesuch, you will still have career, money, employability, savings, investments, etc that I assume you have from your posts.

You won't be on the streets. Catch the clue. You might have "more to lose", but other people stand to land in far uglier places than you can imagine if they stumble.

Your perspective is utterly fucked up.



Of course it won't happen to you. You're too much of a coward to take any chances. I would say more, but I am honestly at a loss as to how to properly address how affronted I am at this comment.

You are not even half the woman, or human being, that Monica is.

Why do you assume that the only thing I have to lose is money? Let me clue you in on something. I, too, am a single parent. I don't like to discuss all of the details of my personal life in a forum like this, but dammit, I will never catch a break with some of you people. I have two children from my marriage which ended when I was 26. The father has never been involved since. The oldest was a year and I was pregnant with the second when my husband left. I lost my job, was homeless, had no family to help or support me. I went on public assistance for almost 4 years while I raised my kids and put myself through college. I started a successful technology consulting firm, sold it, and rapidly climbed the corporate ladder to provide a home, stability, financial security, and a future for my kids. All of this was at great personal sacrifice to me. I did not want different men coming in and out of their lives. Building a career took alot of my time, and any time I spent dating and finding my own hapiness meant taking my time away from my children. It was a personal decision I made for myself. I didn't always make the right choices, but I did the best I could. Now that they are both scheduled to start college in Jan, I finally have the freedom to pursue my own hapiness. I know exactly what I'm talking about when I say if you start with nothing you have nothing to lose. I have lived it every day. If that means wearing a coward label, I will wear it proudly.

And for the record, I never made any judgements about how CM chose to live her life or questioned the decisions she made. I have never made any judgements about anyone's choices in this forum. It amazes me how many of you are so quick to pass judgement on me and mine.