Frustrated!

[Eilan]

people, discussion forums have the ignore feature for a reason.

There you go with the logic again.

 

[triple_g]

people, discussion forums have the ignore feature for a reason.
ed

Good point Silver. Funny how the posts get longer when folks get defensive. I welcome discussion and disagreement is no problem. I can even live with the snotty comments like "MY husband doesn't need validation..." in an attempt to denigrate me, or "need for bragging/validation" and "childish to whine"...

What I find frustrating is how this thread disintegrated into a bitch-fest about something I never did. I know, I know, people have a tendency to read only what they wanted to read. But they've wasted so much energy setting up a strawman argument (he wants to post without her permission!!) in order to chide me as if that's what I said. Eilan in particular, evidently can't read. She's too busy yapping on her soap box to actually pay attention to what others are saying. There's nothing thoughtful about leaping from assumption to assumption, building a case out of one's own self-righteousness. Especially when it's entirely based on a false premise.

 

[midwestyankee]

What I find frustrating is how this thread disintegrated into a bitch-fest about something I never did. I know, I know, people have a tendency to read only what they wanted to read. But they've wasted so much energy setting up a strawman argument (he wants to post without her permission!!) in order to chide me as if that's what I said. Eilan in particular, evidently can't read. She's too busy yapping on her soap box to actually pay attention to what others are saying. There's nothing thoughtful about leaping from assumption to assumption, building a case out of one's own self-righteousness. Especially when it's entirely based on a false premise.

Hmm...so let's see what your original post was all about, shall we? I've quoted it here, with a few salient points made bold for ease of discussion.

Hola, everyone. As u can see i'm a nubee. I've lurked about and finally post.

I have a large folder of incredibly sexy pics of my wife but I can't post them. I'm not saying that to tease you... I'm frustrated too. She simply won't agree to it and I can't bring myself to post her (even with face hidden) without her approval. I've come close, finger hovering over the "post" button, but I just can't. But all those incredible shots and nobody to share them with! Argh!

I'd love to have you see her (and us together) and comment...
... what you think of her
... what you'd do to her in graphic detail

<sigh> I guess this is just a bitch session for me. Sorry about that. I suppose if anyone has a similar situation it might help to not feel alone in my predicament!

I've followed this thread since you first opened it and I have to say that your reacton to the responses you've gotten has puzzled me somewhat. It seems to me that the central points of your post are the ones that I have emphasized: first, that you're frustrated at not being able to post the pictures of your wife since you don't have her permission and second, that you were hoping you would draw responses from others in a similar situation. Do I have this right?

Assuming that I (and others like me) have taken your original intent correctly, then anyone who might respond would fall into two categories: those who wish to comment on your post - which is their right on a public bulletin board - and those who might convey their sympathy because they, too, suffer from the same frustration. Apparently among the 247 views that this thread has attracted, only a few people posted to say that they were in a similar boat. You had the grace to acknowledge those posts, which is a good thing. Civility is highly valued in the How To Cafe.

Now, as for Eilan's posts, my take is that she raised a compelling question: why is this situation so powerful in your life that you would take the time to start a Lit thread on it? It's a fair question, but you did not answer it. In fact, she approved of your decision to not post the pictures and was otherwise completely civil in her initial post on this thread. A few others chimed in as well, indicating that they felt that your desire to post nude and salacious pictures of your wife without her permission was reprehensible. It is, and I think you know that or you not have hesitated to post the pics.

What puzzled me is how you interpreted the view that betraying your wife's trust was reprehensible to mean that people here disapproved of the fact that you might get your rocks off if other men were lusting after your wife while looking at pictures of her. You won't find many people in this forum who disapprove of any consensual sexual practice so long as it is done in a safe and respectful manner. Note the key word "consensual," as that is essential to moral adult behavior.

While you may not have intended to convey the idea that you were likely to post these pictures without your wife's consent, the fact that you took the time and effort to start a thread on the subject gave rise to the reasonable perception that you might post them regardless of her wishes. While you may not have meant to equate a respect for others with prudishness, that's what comes across in your subsequent posts about Eilan and others taking out their soap box.

Eilan was right about one thing: it's a litle puzzling that this would be such a major force in your life right now that you would engage in a public discussion of it and then try to defend your actions by attacking others who raise legitimate questions as if they had no right to do so.

I wonder too: why is this such a big deal if you truly agree that it would be a betrayal of your wife to post the pictures without her permission?

 

[Mary Hall]

There`s a rule against posting pics without permission, i suggest the thread starter reads the rules before posts.

 

[LadyJeanne]

I wonder too: why is this such a big deal if you truly agree that it would be a betrayal of your wife to post the pictures without her permission?

I'm thinking he was expecting people to commiserate with him, agree that it was awful that his wife wouldn't give him permission to post her pictures, and maybe even talk him into doing so. I say that last part because of the way he phrased this:

She simply won't agree to it and I can't bring myself to post her (even with face hidden) without her approval. I've come close, finger hovering over the "post" button, but I just can't.

When someone says they can't bring themselves to do something, they are often looking for encouragement to do it.

"I want to tell her about my fantasy, but I just can't bring myself to do it. Even though I have nothing to be embarrassed about, but I just can't."

"I should tell him he has bad breath, but I just can't bring myself to do it. I've come close, especially when he asks why I don't want to kiss him, but I just can't."

"I want to get a tattoo, but I just can't bring myself to do it. I've come close, almost walking into the tattoo place, but I just can't."​

Perhaps that's not what tripleg meant, but it sure sounds like he was hoping someone would talk him into doing it.

"Go ahead, she'll never know."
"What's the big deal? If her face isn't in the pictures, what's the harm?"
"Yeah, dude, post the pictures! When she sees how hot everybody thinks she is, she'll get turned on."​

Am I the only one who thinks that's his real motivation for starting this thread?


Tripleg, no one cares if you get off on other men telling you how they would fuck your wife. No one even cares if you were hoping people would tell you how much they would love to see the pictures and understand your frustration. But if you were hoping we'd tell you it's not a big deal to post her pictures without her permission, I'm not surprised you don't like the responses you're getting.

 

[triple_g]

Hmm...so let's see what your original post was all about, shall we? I've quoted it here, with a few salient points made bold for ease of discussion.

first, that you're frustrated at not being able to post the pictures of your wife since you don't have her permission and second, that you were hoping you would draw responses from others in a similar situation. Do I have this right?

Now, as for Eilan's posts, my take is that she raised a compelling question: why is this situation so powerful in your life that you would take the time to start a Lit thread on it? It's a fair question, but you did not answer it.

Eilan was right about one thing: it's a litle puzzling that this would be such a major force in your life right now that you would engage in a public discussion of it and then try to defend your actions by attacking others who raise legitimate questions as if they had no right to do so.

I wonder too: why is this such a big deal if you truly agree that it would be a betrayal of your wife to post the pictures without her permission?

1. You have accurately captured the essense of my original post, yes.

2. My objection is the creation of an illogical premise. I want to post my wife's pics. My wife doesn't want me to. I don't post them. That makes me morally reprehensible? Is it morally reprehensible to want a car you can't afford? No, you simply want what you can't have - which is a fundamental condition of the human race. I don't see the big deal.

3. I simply wanted to discuss with like-minded folks. I'm genuinely surprised that anyone would take issue with (a) what turns me on; or (b) that no matter how much I'd like to follow my dick, I won't go against my wife's wishes.

4. The question about it being a "major force in my life..." itself is patronizing. People take time out of their day to post all sorts of meaningless flotsam. What freaking difference does it make?

 

[triple_g]

There`s a rule against posting pics without permission, i suggest the thread starter reads the rules before posts.

Gee-zus Christ, you people can't fucking read! Are you completely stupid or only today?

 

[Mary Hall]

You were bitching you couldn`t post them, why bother making a thread about it?

 

[jaded_lily]

Gee-zus Christ, you people can't fucking read! Are you completely stupid or only today?

Calm down there, you got the responses to your question, no need for name calling



Mary lay off a bit, he did not post any pics, he was merely asking a question and got responses......




*hides* don't shoot me.

 

[Mary Hall]

We don`t care he`s frustrated about not posting pics, hence no need for the thread.

 

[jaded_lily]

We don`t care he`s frustrated about not posting pics, hence no need for the thread.

Just something he's gonna have to discuss further with his wife.



Btw, have I told you I'm in love with your av?

 

[midwestyankee]

1. You have accurately captured the essense of my original post, yes.

2. My objection is the creation of an illogical premise. I want to post my wife's pics. My wife doesn't want me to. I don't post them. That makes me morally reprehensible? Is it morally reprehensible to want a car you can't afford? No, you simply want what you can't have - which is a fundamental condition of the human race. I don't see the big deal.

3. I simply wanted to discuss with like-minded folks. I'm genuinely surprised that anyone would take issue with (a) what turns me on; or (b) that no matter how much I'd like to follow my dick, I won't go against my wife's wishes.

4. The question about it being a "major force in my life..." itself is patronizing. People take time out of their day to post all sorts of meaningless flotsam. What freaking difference does it make?

1. Good.

2. There was no illogical premise. You stated very clearly that you had a desire that was reprehensible and that you had nearly acted on that desire more than once. To draw the inference that you were seeking validation of that desire, particularly since you also stated that you were hoping to hear from others with a similar frustration, was not at all unreasonable. Please understand that those of us who have been here for a while have seen hundreds of threads like this started by people who are doing little more than seeking affirmation for an action that they think is wrong but want to try anyway. Your thread had all the appearances of being one of these. Then, when you got into a tiff with Eilan over her queries about your motivation, you reinforced the inferences some had drawn.

3. No one took issue with your interest in posting the pics, only with the notion of posting them without her permission. Further, no one took issue with the fact that you did not post the pictures; in fact most of the posters commended you for your discretion.

4. My statement may have been a little strong but it was not patronizing. I gather from this point that your post was little more than a bit of entertainment for you. Well, fine. Now you know that people in the How To community take their forum seriously. When you want help with a serious question, you will be sure to get it here.

 

[triple_g]

I'm thinking he was expecting people to commiserate with him, agree that it was awful that his wife wouldn't give him permission to post her pictures, and maybe even talk him into doing so. I say that last part because of the way he phrased this:


When someone says they can't bring themselves to do something, they are often looking for encouragement to do it.

"I want to tell her about my fantasy, but I just can't bring myself to do it. Even though I have nothing to be embarrassed about, but I just can't."

"I should tell him he has bad breath, but I just can't bring myself to do it. I've come close, especially when he asks why I don't want to kiss him, but I just can't."

"I want to get a tattoo, but I just can't bring myself to do it. I've come close, almost walking into the tattoo place, but I just can't."​

Perhaps that's not what tripleg meant, but it sure sounds like he was hoping someone would talk him into doing it.

"Go ahead, she'll never know."
"What's the big deal? If her face isn't in the pictures, what's the harm?"
"Yeah, dude, post the pictures! When she sees how hot everybody thinks she is, she'll get turned on."​

Am I the only one who thinks that's his real motivation for starting this thread?


Tripleg, no one cares if you get off on other men telling you how they would fuck your wife. No one even cares if you were hoping people would tell you how much they would love to see the pictures and understand your frustration. But if you were hoping we'd tell you it's not a big deal to post her pictures without her permission, I'm not surprised you don't like the responses you're getting.

Believe it or not, that's the first explanation that makes any sense! (why all the flack.) Thanks.

For the record... oh never mind. It doesn't matter now.

 

[Eilan]

Sheesh. I go away for the day and THIS is what I come back to?

First of all, I haven't said anything that's all that different from what the others are saying, so unless you have issues with my cuntitude, I'm not really sure why you've decided to latch onto me as a target for your hostilities.

Funny how the posts get longer when folks get defensive. I welcome discussion and disagreement is no problem.

de·fen·sive: Constantly protecting oneself from criticism, exposure of one's shortcomings, or other real or perceived threats to the ego.

Are you referring to this definition of defensive? The only person who's posted in this thread who fits this definition is you. The rest of us have no reason to be defensive.

How or why, exactly, is this situation "painful"? Is it life-or-relationship-altering? You never answered these questions, and they aren't unreasonable questions. It was at this point that you started to get defensive.

I'm genuinely curious about the why's behind wanting to post a SO's sexy pics, particularly the frustration about not having permission to do so. My husband doesn't share your desires, so I can't look to him for insight; therefore I brought my questions to the board for anyone (yourself included) to answer.

What's wrong with asking people questions (of any nature) that gets them to look deeper into themselves? If you truly welcome discussion and/or disagreement, you'll try to answer these questions.

Eilan in particular, evidently can't read.

My heart bleeds. *sob* This is truly uncalled for. At no point in any of my responses did I launch into a personal attack on you. Have you ever studied argument? The sentence that I've quoted is a logical fallacy, a gap or flaw in logic which is to be avoided when one is trying to construct an argument. Your little attack on my apparent lack of reading comprehension skills is what's known as an ad hominem--that's Latin for "to the man." It's an attack on a person instead of the issues that he or she espouses (think political ad). Your attack of my reading ability fails to advance your own point(s). It's much easier to say, "Eilan can't read," than to expound on your own POV in order to help Eilan (and others) understand.

We obviously disagree, and I welcome the opportunity for further discussion. If you disagree with what I'm saying, I'd appreciate it if you'd go back to my (previous) long post in this thread and analyze my words, point-by-point, to help me understand where I might be wrong. Perhaps I can clarify some things for you as well.

She's too busy yapping on her soap box to actually pay attention to what others are saying. There's nothing thoughtful about leaping from assumption to assumption, building a case out of one's own self-righteousness. Especially when it's entirely based on a false premise.

I believe that you're taking issue with this: "So what you're saying is that posting pics of your wife without her permission turns you on?" I KNOW that's not what you're actually saying, mmmkay, because--believe it or not--I'm not stupid and I CAN read. I am aware that you haven't posted the pics (not here, anyway). What I was trying to say at that point was that your not posting the pics at Lit had already been established; therefore, there was really no need to beat this dead horse of a thread any further. Unless, of course, you want to take a stab at those questions that I've already asked twice.

I don't care if you fuck your sister in the ass while a chimp rubs peanut butter on your balls. The only soap box I'm on is about respecting one's partner's wishes, regardless of the sexual behavior involved.

 

[Quoll]

Sheesh. I go away for the day and THIS is what I come back to?

First of all, I haven't said anything that's all that different from what the others are saying, so unless you have issues with my cuntitude, I'm not really sure why you've decided to latch onto me as a target for your hostilities.

de·fen·sive: Constantly protecting oneself from criticism, exposure of one's shortcomings, or other real or perceived threats to the ego.

Are you referring to this definition of defensive? The only person who's posted in this thread who fits this definition is you. The rest of us have no reason to be defensive.

How or why, exactly, is this situation "painful"? Is it life-or-relationship-altering? You never answered these questions, and they aren't unreasonable questions. It was at this point that you started to get defensive.

I'm genuinely curious about the why's behind wanting to post a SO's sexy pics, particularly the frustration about not having permission to do so. My husband doesn't share your desires, so I can't look to him for insight; therefore I brought my questions to the board for anyone (yourself included) to answer.

What's wrong with asking people questions (of any nature) that gets them to look deeper into themselves? If you truly welcome discussion and/or disagreement, you'll try to answer these questions.

My heart bleeds. *sob* This is truly uncalled for. At no point in any of my responses did I launch into a personal attack on you. Have you ever studied argument? The sentence that I've quoted is a logical fallacy, a gap or flaw in logic which is to be avoided when one is trying to construct an argument. Your little attack on my apparent lack of reading comprehension skills is what's known as an ad hominem--that's Latin for "to the man." It's an attack on a person instead of the issues that he or she espouses (think political ad). Your attack of my reading ability fails to advance your own point(s). It's much easier to say, "Eilan can't read," than to expound on your own POV in order to help Eilan (and others) understand.

We obviously disagree, and I welcome the opportunity for further discussion. If you disagree with what I'm saying, I'd appreciate it if you'd go back to my (previous) long post in this thread and analyze my words, point-by-point, to help me understand where I might be wrong. Perhaps I can clarify some things for you as well.

I believe that you're taking issue with this: "So what you're saying is that posting pics of your wife without her permission turns you on?" I KNOW that's not what you're actually saying, mmmkay, because--believe it or not--I'm not stupid and I CAN read. I am aware that you haven't posted the pics (not here, anyway). What I was trying to say at that point was that your not posting the pics at Lit had already been established; therefore, there was really no need to beat this dead horse of a thread any further. Unless, of course, you want to take a stab at those questions that I've already asked twice.

I don't care if you fuck your sister in the ass while a chimp rubs peanut butter on your balls. The only soap box I'm on is about respecting one's partner's wishes, regardless of the sexual behavior involved.

Crunchy or smooth?

 

[Eilan]

Crunchy or smooth?

Hey, I'm all about choices.

 

[midwestyankee]

Crunchy or smooth?

Hey, I'm all about choices.

I vote for crunchy as it stands up better to rhetorical analysis. (Go, Eilan! One more ad hominem and I would have melted at your feet )

 

[Mary Hall]

For the record... oh never mind. It doesn't matter now.

Thank god