I refuse to dumb down my poetry

[Maria2394]

Re: Re: if this is off topic, forgive me, but...

I've always loved your yoru narratives

oh, PS, Boo says I blurt, so I guess I shoudl have thanked you for what kinda sems like a compliment now that I look closer..one question, why does the typo, yoru make me think of a Yeti?

 

[Tathagata]

Re: Re: Re: if this is off topic, forgive me, but...

YOU TAth, are SUCH a bad bad monkey

dont you know its bad luck to pick on a HS dropouts inability to type??? I think I will go crawl in my poetry closet and cry for 11 minutes


hehe

( I'll meet you in there)

 

[Maria2394]

Re: Re: Re: Re: if this is off topic, forgive me, but...

( I'll meet you in there)

should I take the stuffed monkey I have that squeals when I um, , ohh, you know when

he hasnt squealed in a verrrryy long time

 

[Tathagata]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: if this is off topic, forgive me, but...

should I take the stuffed monkey I have that squeals when I um, , ohh, you know when

he hasnt squealed in a verrrryy long time

That makes two of us

 

[Reltne]

Actually I was referring to you and " dumb and confused" jointly.

And you are entitled to your opinion as is everyone..I think you should have perhaps " pm'ed" the part about hoping it was a phase she was going through because, frankly, that's a pretty high handed thing to say to someone who you think has more talent then " 99% of the people on this board".
I don't think it is high handed to offer an honest opinion, when in your own words I am entitled to one. Are the "best" to be above criticism? Do you want me to comment on just those whose talents are not as well developed?

It seems to me that not only is she allowed to have a bad poem ( if that's what you want to call it ) she would also know what's shes doing better than you or I would.
I never said "bad poem". I just said, and I repeat, Poetry People is not one of Wicked Eve's better/best poems (IMHO). Furthermore, if a poet does not want public comments it is easy to leave the "Public Comment Board" box unchecked on the submissions page. It seems to me that Eve appreciates comments that are more than ass kiss-ups.

me personally if I had anything that negative to say I wouldn't embarrass someone I profess to respect so much in public.
I repeat, I do not think that I said anything negative. I just made an honest comment, and I do not think I embarrassed Wicked Eve. If she thinks I did than she can tell me herself. She is a full grown and talented woman, and she is quite capable of standing up and defending herself when she feels the need to do so. (If I were her, I'd be more embarrassed by your words than by mine.)


That's all
but that's me...Mister Vegas
if we were in germany I'd make your bunk
O.K., you lost me here. I have no idea of your reference at all.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

Here is a very constructed poem:

Roses are red.
Violets are pink.
I am a poet,
sweet lord how I stink.

It's got a meter and rhyme scheme, deliberate reading rhythm, and a set of very deliberate figures (allusion, anticlimax, fourth wall, antithesis...), all applied to achieve a certain reader reaction.

Do you think those who complained about "constructed" poems would complain about this? Or do they really mean, "complicated"?

No, these are usually people that complain about stories and poems being edited because "it kills the spontaneity", and writing should come from the heart, not the brain. I kid you not! There are tons of people complaining about that!

Obviously, I wasn't referring to Reltne's post. The word he used simply reminded me of one of the real problems of Lit, as opposed to having many "vague" poems.

 

[WickedEve]

Reltne, not embarrassed and I did appreciate the comment. I took what you said and what others said and tried to make some sense of it all. I wish I had someone (the last word on anything and everything) who'd come along and stamp each poem "good" or "bad". lol

 

[Tathagata]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't think it is high handed to offer an honest opinion, when in your own words I am entitled to one. Are the "best" to be above criticism? Do you want me to comment on just those whose talents are not as well developed?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



~ I must disagree.
I find this too contrived to be up to your normal standard. You have better skills than 99% of the poets on this forum, but (IMHO) you have recently gotten away from your natural way of writing. I hope these concoctions are merely a temporary phase you are going through, and that you stop "constructing" and just write as only you can.~ [/quote]

Had you stopped at "I find this too contrived " it could be construed as contructive criticism.

" gotten away from your natural way of writing" and " I hope these concoctions are merely a temporary phase you are going through, and that you stop "constructing"

Concoctions?
You ever had anyone call one of your poems a concoction?
It has a very negative connotation ie a Bad poem








quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I never said "bad poem". I just said, and I repeat, Poetry People is not one of Wicked Eve's better/best poems (IMHO).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



see above




quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Furthermore, if a poet does not want public comments it is easy to leave the "Public Comment Board" box unchecked on the submissions page. It seems to me that Eve appreciates comments that are more than ass kiss-ups.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



and then of course there is the third option where you can say nothing at all.

it just strikes me as absurd to go to someone's poem and say.." I hope this isn't how you are going to write from now on"

How is that constructive?


and let's not start on the ass kissing thing
The people who complain about that most are the people who feel their asses aren't being kissed enough





quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I repeat, I do not think that I said anything negative. I just made an honest comment, and I do not think I embarrassed Wicked Eve. If she thinks I did than she can tell me herself. She is a full grown and talented woman, and she is quite capable of standing up and defending herself when she feels the need to do so. (If I were her, I'd be more embarrassed by your words than by mine.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




I agree she's an adult and is entitled to change her poetry style and try something new without having someone call it a " concoction" and tell her to go back to " her other style"

The fact that you don't think that's " negative" also amuses the fuck out of me.

we all try very hard here to be gracious and polite and to tolerate everyone's opinions and ignorance's and quirks.

I will tell you this..had you left that feedback for me..I'd have asked you who the hell you thought you were to decide how and what i'd write?

I would have pm'ed it..to be polite

We obviously disagree on this and that's how it will be
I felt the need to say something because of all the other crap that's been going on around here.
anything that makes someone like Eve start doubting herself is not a good thing.
I'm sure it wasn't your intention..but I wanted to make a point
Some people take comments to heart...more than you or I do.
which is why if I don't like something I will either say nothing...or PM it and ASK about the poem..and perhaps once it's explained to me I might like it..or I might say nicely that " it doesn't work "for me"

You can respond if you'd like but for me...I am done
I give you the benefit of the last word and then, I hope, we can drop it.



quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That's all
but that's me...Mister Vegas
if we were in germany I'd make your bunk
O.K., you lost me here. I have no idea of your reference at all.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Stripes...John Candy

 

[Reltne]

Agree to Disagree

You can respond if you'd like but for me...I am done
I give you the benefit of the last word and then, I hope, we can drop it.
It is dropped. - We agree to disagree.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That's all
but that's me...Mister Vegas
if we were in germany I'd make your bunk
O.K., you lost me here. I have no idea of your reference at all.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stripes...John Candy

Still means nothing. If it is a movie I never saw it, and all I know about John Candy was that he was a big fat comedian (I think).

 

[WickedEve]

Originally posted by Tathagata ...anything that makes someone like Eve start doubting herself is not a good thing.
I'm sure it wasn't your intention..but I wanted to make a point
Some people take comments to heart...more than you or I do...

I do take everything to heart. I sincerely believe Reltne was trying to help and that he knows more about poetry than I do. In all honesty, I think the majority of you here know more about poetry than I do. Not only think, I know it. I read your posts and I don't know half of what you people know. I can't write the things you write. I'm very aware of limitations and I try very hard to listen to what everyone tells me so I can learn. But then I get frustrated when I come up short and displease people. This is my problem and it's who I am.

 

[Liar]

No, these are usually people that complain about stories and poems being edited because "it kills the spontaneity", and writing should come from the heart, not the brain. I kid you not! There are tons of people complaining about that!

Aha. Those.

Well, I have never understood why heart and brain should contradict. A poem comes from the heart, yes. But at least in my case that's not enough. If it doen't pass through the brain on the way out, it will read like complete crap. And I don't mean crap in the sense of unpoetic and trite. I mean crap like totally incomprehensible gibberish.

You know, it's like with dreams. They make perfect sense when you dream them, but when you wake up and somtimes are able to remember what you just dreamt, it's just a bizarre mess, impossible to retell without simplifying and fosusing in post production. That's what my constructing brain does.

 

[annaswirls]

I rethought my post about 5 minutes down the road. You should workshop those at LBJ, I do not know what I was thinking. I couldn't workshop my experiments there, but that is me, my experiments are horrid.

 

[annaswirls]

Re: if this is off topic, forgive me, but...

the way it appears to me, is that Eve is growing, trying new things, as with her Neopetal series, which I totally enjoyed, didnt understand all of it, but I still read them, makesmy mind feel like I am on a carousel.
I just want to share a FB email I got when I wrote A willow Bending


this is only a paraphrase after the first line..

Dear Maria,
You are not 2rivers or Annaswirls,
your use of disjointed phrases and imagery does your work a disservice. You shoudl stick with yoru narratives which is what you do best...

um, Maria, do you think that we should tell them now....

eh hem

see I do not think of this as an insult to you, I think it might have been more of a stab at anna and 2r-- or neither. I think it is good to experiment, but if I do, I think it might be helpful to know if it wasn't working.

Variety is the Spice of Life.
within a person and among people.

I also think that attacking reviewers is just going to make even fewer people comfortable to speak their minds.

 

[Maria2394]

Oh NO, again

Dear dear Anna banana,
I most certainly did NOT take that part of the note as insult. You have no earthly idea how much I learned from 2rivers and from you and especially oxalis, loved and adored him, his poetry, his out looks on life.

what hurt was that I took the FB to mean, hey, you are trying to be someone you are not, nor do you have even the remotest chance of ever writing as well as anna or him ( 2rivers)... I wasnt even trying to sound like you guys, the poem just came out that way.

In all fairness, I did respond to that note and told him I wote that poem about a dream, he said, ohhh, well then....


anyway, my point was, who are we as poets if we are constricted to only one style? and never even trying anything else? if we are to be stagnant, there is no purpose for poetry at all....


ps, all I ever want ed was my own voice to be heard!! if it comes out sounding like one of the wonderful people here, then why would I be upset?? just means I am seeing things differently now, and that is progress, not something baaaddd....

 

[Maria2394]

umm, ps, I wasnt attacking anyone...have no desire to run off any reviewers, I did it long enough to know it is basically a thankless job, one of which I did enjoy, until it bit me in the ass


mentioned one that "sucked" didnt mention someones poem, didnt mention someone s friends poem, mentioned a rhyme poem, didnt mention a rhyme poem, I kiss asses, Im think Im perfect, etc, etc, etc, it just wasnt worth it anymore

 

[annaswirls]

Re: Oh NO, again

Dear dear Anna banana,
I most certainly did NOT take that part of the note as insult. You have no earthly idea how much I learned from 2rivers and from you and especially oxalis, loved and adored him, his poetry, his out looks on life.

what hurt was that I took the FB to mean, hey, you are trying to be someone you are not, nor do you have even the remotest chance of ever writing as well as anna or him ( 2rivers)... I wasnt even trying to sound like you guys, the poem just came out that way.

In all fairness, I did respond to that note and told him I wote that poem about a dream, he said, ohhh, well then....


anyway, my point was, who are we as poets if we are constricted to only one style? and never even trying anything else? if we are to be stagnant, there is no purpose for poetry at all....


ps, all I ever want ed was my own voice to be heard!! if it comes out sounding like one of the wonderful people here, then why would I be upset?? just means I am seeing things differently now, and that is progress, not something baaaddd....

oh darlin' Maria, I know you wouldn't take it as an insult and that is why I said it, to keep things in perspective.... because I know people prefer your writing to mine and to sp etc.s just like some people prefer jazz to classical or 80's to 90's or whatever.

It was not a nice comment for them to send either way. It does not make sense to compare individuals works. If I tried to rhyme, it would be better for someone to tell me, oh anna, how nice you tried something new.... but you might want to stick with (whatever it is the hell I do do )

it is a matter of delivery and that delivery sucked.


You know I agree with experimentation and imitation-- you remember when I (and another poet and others and others) did exercizes trying to write like dh, and you remember how much fun that was? I was cracking up writing it, sending it to you as I wrote it?? It would never be as good as his, but it is in these experiments that we find out who we are and who we are not.

stretch it girl, why not. what is the worst that could happen? you might learn something

god I have a migraine. not from this, from chocolate birthday cake and driving in the snow.




okay I think I will go READ POETRY

eh hem,

~J

 

[Maria2394]

annaswirls wrote---


It does not make sense to compare individuals works. ~~~~


You said it all in those few words, I am enept at social situations, back to the poetry closet for me, will you send seattle to visit? I misss her sooo bad

 

[WickedEve]

When did this become the Maria and Anna thread, you poetry bitches? We were talking about me!

 

[sandspike]

A lot going on here.......

I haven't read all this crap because I think a lot of it is as mindless
as my beach poetry. I do know the last two times I picked up
a book it was to figure out what Eve was writing about. In both
cases I thought the effort was worth it. No one should sink to
please except for oral sex. Eve write what you love and let
us dumbasses try and keep up. I now have 90 posts.

 

[Maria2394]

Eve called me a poetry bitch !!!


woman, you couldn't "dumb down" your work if you tried

 

[WickedEve]

Eve called me a poetry bitch !!!


woman, you couldn't "dumb down" your work if you tried

A woman after my own heart.

Call me a bitch. It just makes me giggle.

 

[Angeline]

Re: Re: Oh NO, again

oh darlin' Maria, I know you wouldn't take it as an insult and that is why I said it, to keep things in perspective.... because I know people prefer your writing to mine and to sp etc.s just like some people prefer jazz to classical or 80's to 90's or whatever.

It was not a nice comment for them to send either way. It does not make sense to compare individuals works. If I tried to rhyme, it would be better for someone to tell me, oh anna, how nice you tried something new.... but you might want to stick with (whatever it is the hell I do do )

it is a matter of delivery and that delivery sucked.


You know I agree with experimentation and imitation-- you remember when I (and another poet and others and others) did exercizes trying to write like dh, and you remember how much fun that was? I was cracking up writing it, sending it to you as I wrote it?? It would never be as good as his, but it is in these experiments that we find out who we are and who we are not.

stretch it girl, why not. what is the worst that could happen? you might learn something

god I have a migraine. not from this, from chocolate birthday cake and driving in the snow.




okay I think I will go READ POETRY

eh hem,

~J

I prefer jazz.

 

[champagne1982]

100 - well constucted, funny
I think you are a genius, and annaswirls too, of course eve
I did have to google "tuxedo" and "hair coil" I didn't know they made them for there. It slid in under my one google per ten lines thing.

silly! i was looking for a rhyme for "oil" .. and well, tux's are what grooms wear... although, to a sushi bar may have been a little bit of a stretch.

 

[ishtat]

Explaining v Justifying

I think that Wickedeve's explanation for "Dumb & Confused" was helpful .D & C's comment was the kind of thing that I might have said when I first started reading this site 3/4 months ago. If you haven't read any poetry for a long time (like me 30 years) it takes a lot of reading of a lot of poetry to begin to get ones brain into gear. So, from time to time a poet may be asked to explain something; but that should not be seen as justification. Wickedeve doesn't need to justify anything .She will however I think be asked for guidance more often than most simply because she pushes boundaries others prefer not to approach.

 

[annaswirls]

No, these are usually people that complain about stories and poems being edited because "it kills the spontaneity", and writing should come from the heart, not the brain. I kid you not! There are tons of people complaining about that!

As one of those people who think that poetry can be over edited until it loses all flavor-- I just wanted to say,

Hello! My name is Anna, I find it interesting that you are so surprised that we exist, by the ton even!

There are also people who think that art is not art unless it is a portrait or landscape that you can match up with a photograph.

It takes heart and brain to write a poem. I think it is easier and more effective if the heart comes in the writing, as it is more difficult to use the heart when editing, and both are necessary