I'm curious.....

[TQM]

No, I'm shaking my head that you're being so stupid about wasting you and our time.

Again, it's your rather dumb issue.

Fini

Great - you're stewing but claiming I'm stewing. Any wonder why I don't fully buy into your picture?

If you think the issue is dumb - which is your right - why keep at it?

Obvious answer is that it bugs you (yes, you're the one clearly hot under the collar here) that I don't take your word as final. So - the rules of engagement are clear - the person who first gets down to name-calling loses.

No - I'm not going to engage in name-calling back. Your minor-league approach simply isn't capable of baiting me. I suggest you need time away from the computer. Get yourself a cup of coffee (decaf) and breath in the air a bit. Try to relax. Move on.

 

[RoyceConnors]

Children, please stop arguing, grown ups are trying to have a conversation. You've gone completely off the subject with your ranting.

 

[PennLady]

I infer the middle vote disappeared solely from what the comments are and what they say their votes are - and I combine this with a little mathematics.

While I'm sure - over the several hundred votes there are a few 3's, etc., by and large, the #of votes per score curve instead of taking on a bell shape would instead resemble a U.

I would not be so quick to infer that the middle votes -- 3s -- disappear. In fact, given what others who have been on the site longer have observed, and from what I've read (which is merely anecdotal, I realize), people tend to vote 1, 4, or 5.

1s come from trolls mostly, I'd bet, but sometimes people really dislike a story so much that they give it a one. However, I've read a number of posts where people have said that they don't vote lower than a 4, if they vote. Some say that they're impressed that someone simply finished a story, or that they enjoyed it despite flaws, or what have you. But they don't give it a 3; they say that if they can't give it a 4 or better, then they don't vote.

As sr said, the not voting in itself is a vote of a kind or at least a statement, but we'll never know quite what it means.

Again, going to posters like Darkniciad, who have been here a long time and have taken the time to analyze scores and sweeps and things, the votes that appear to get removed are 1s and even 5s, not 3s.

ISure - it's true the vast majority don't vote. You have to make assumptions as to why they don't vote. But that doesn't mean there isn't something of interest to be found in the words and scores of those who did vote.

No, you don't have to make assumptions. There are too many people for the assumptions to mean anything. Maybe someone doesn't like the competitive aspect of voting and won't do it. Maybe someone only votes 5s for amazing stories.

None of that negates your last sentence, though; there can be something of interest and often is, in the votes and comments you see.

Not voting suggests only that the average score might biased if taken as a representation of the overall thought on the story.

 

[TQM]

I would not be so quick to infer that the middle votes -- 3s -- disappear. In fact, given what others who have been on the site longer have observed, and from what I've read (which is merely anecdotal, I realize), people tend to vote 1, 4, or 5.

1s come from trolls mostly, I'd bet, but sometimes people really dislike a story so much that they give it a one. However, I've read a number of posts where people have said that they don't vote lower than a 4, if they vote. Some say that they're impressed that someone simply finished a story, or that they enjoyed it despite flaws, or what have you. But they don't give it a 3; they say that if they can't give it a 4 or better, then they don't vote.

As sr said, the not voting in itself is a vote of a kind or at least a statement, but we'll never know quite what it means.

Again, going to posters like Darkniciad, who have been here a long time and have taken the time to analyze scores and sweeps and things, the votes that appear to get removed are 1s and even 5s, not 3s.



No, you don't have to make assumptions. There are too many people for the assumptions to mean anything. Maybe someone doesn't like the competitive aspect of voting and won't do it. Maybe someone only votes 5s for amazing stories.

None of that negates your last sentence, though; there can be something of interest and often is, in the votes and comments you see.

Not voting suggests only that the average score might biased if taken as a representation of the overall thought on the story.

1. It doesn't matter if 1 votes come from "trolls" or "haters" or genuine critics who rightly hate my story. Labelling 'em gets you nowhere, by itself.

2. You give me assumptions as to why people don't vote, and then tell me you don't need assumptions. I was arguing this too doesn't matter. All that matters is the data you collect, and the care you take to interpret it.

 

[PennLady]

1. It doesn't matter if 1 votes come from "trolls" or "haters" or genuine critics who rightly hate my story. Labelling 'em gets you nowhere, by itself.

2. You give me assumptions as to why people don't vote, and then tell me you don't need assumptions. I was arguing this too doesn't matter. All that matters is the data you collect, and the care you take to interpret it.

I didn't give you assumptions. I told you what I've read that people have said about why they don't vote, or why they vote a certain way. That's anecdotal but not an assumption.

I also suggested reasons that people may not vote, but my point was exactly that there are too many assumptions one could make, and those were examples.

 

[TQM]

I didn't give you assumptions. I told you what I've read that people have said about why they don't vote, or why they vote a certain way. That's anecdotal but not an assumption.

I also suggested reasons that people may not vote, but my point was exactly that there are too many assumptions one could make, and those were examples.

With the utmost respect:

1) Taking anecdotal evidence to come to a conclusion is a straightforward type of assumption. The assumption assumes the anecdotal reference is relevant to get you to the conclusion.

2) you say 1's come from tolls mostly you bet - you're probably right, but you're making several assumption with the claim

3) you claim to come to conclusions by having read a number of posts. This kind of inductive argument assumes the number of posts you've read are representative of the total. This may be right too - but it is still a form of assumption.

4) You produce a theory about why people give 1's, 4,'s, and 5's as votes but not 3's. This is also a fine argument but based on inductive assumptions.

5) Telling me "There are too many people for the assumptions to mean anything. Maybe someone doesn't like the competitive aspect of voting and won't do it. Maybe someone only votes 5s for amazing stories." This sentence of yours is basically a nice bunch of perfectly acceptable quite probably right assumptions.

I think you think assumptions are things lacking in evidence. To the contrary, a good assumption is one where there is supporting evidence (anecdotal or statistical or whatever), and no or little evidence to the contrary.

(full disclosure: I've taught logic at 3 universities)

 

[PennLady]

Well you win, then. Basically I think I'm saying that there are so many people who read on this site for so many reasons that trying to analyze the scores too much just gets you nowhere.

OTOH, I know I am not a stats or logic person, so I'll stop now.

 

[TQM]

Well you win, then. Basically I think I'm saying that there are so many people who read on this site for so many reasons that trying to analyze the scores too much just gets you nowhere.

OTOH, I know I am not a stats or logic person, so I'll stop now.

I get that - but voting diversity is actually a good thing for statistical inference, not a bad thing. The conclusions I suspect really aren't particularly overreaching.

In any event, a lot of reasoning is nothing more than a kind of story telling. And when looking at the responses, I like having a good story to tell.

 

[StrangeLife]

...but voting diversity is actually a good thing for statistical inference, not a bad thing. The conclusions I suspect really aren't particularly overreaching...

There are basically two mutually exclusive options here:


A - The voting-system is flawed.

B - I totally suck as a writer.


So please stop working so hard to prove that the voting system is fair, will ya?

 

[neci]

you made a smile or a goblet. draw it out and fill it in.

 

[neci]

not all horses wear shoes.

 

[TQM]

There are basically two mutually exclusive options here:


A - The voting-system is flawed.

B - I totally suck as a writer.


So please stop working so hard to prove that the voting system is fair, will ya?

Sadly, they aren't mutually exclusive. One doesn't preclude the other.

 

[ShelbyNaughtyGirl]

LW readers just mean!

Haha! Not all of them but plenty! I tried to tell the haters what the story is about but they just want to hate. Oh well! At least I know what to expect now. I did get a few friendly warnings

 

[jupiter4686]

This really is one of those how deep is the ocean questions. Impossible to answer. And if someone does give you an answer, you don't really have anything real or useful to work with.

If you're really asking, I don't get any of it. I have a suspcion others don't either (in spite of what they think.)

 

[gordo12]

I do like your stories and have been waiting for the next chapter of "Under estimating the risks"