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Is 'Free Verse'

BooMerengue said:
Her teeth hung over her lips
cheeks wide as womens hips
a lute she bore upon her back
her neck long and not great (lol)
her hair in a cluttered heap
she was broad in the shoulders
with breasts hanging like a whores
T'was shaped like a barrell
and to tell the foulness of the Lady
there is no tongue would tell it right

she sat on a horse who had seen better days
the gold and jewels she wore
were an unfitting sight
She was so foul a creature

Is that close? Doesn't matter- I had fun!
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Wow, you speake.....
 
BooMerengue said:
Hey Ange!! *waves

Never read ol Chaucer- some say I should but ugh...

Hows you?
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Not bad. How are you?

I'm hanging around being a football widow. :cool:

I have the prologue to the Canterbury Tales memorized in middle English thanks to my senior English teacher, Mr. Alito, uncle of the Supreme Court nominee. Small world, huh? I even saw an article about him (Samuel Alito) that quoted my high school Latin teacher who I thought was surely dead by now.

BTW, I shared this info with Tath, who I also told months ago that I knew this guy in Conan O'Brian's band because he dated one of my college roomates. Tath said "What are you like Forrest Gump?" :D

You should read The Miller's Tale. It's very funny.
 
Angeline said:
Not bad. How are you?

I'm hanging around being a football widow. :cool:

I have the prologue to the Canterbury Tales memorized in middle English thanks to my senior English teacher, Mr. Alito, uncle of the Supreme Court nominee. Small world, huh? I even saw an article about him (Samuel Alito) that quoted my high school Latin teacher who I thought was surely dead by now.

BTW, I shared this info with Tath, who I also told months ago that I knew this guy in Conan O'Brian's band because he dated one of my college roomates. Tath said "What are you like Forrest Gump?" :D

You should read The Miller's Tale. It's very funny.
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When life returns to normal I just might try that. TY.

Have to be careful w/ the I knows... lol Mom had to call Senator Joe Byden once for some sort of business- I don't remember what. When she reached him she went all girlish (which was a sight to behold- she WAS a Southerner after all!) and said "Hello, dear. This is Evelyn so and so- do you remember?" After a pause a very charming voice said "Mrs H? This is Joe Byden..... Jr! You must mean my Dad!

We teased her a long time about that one!

Tell the football bum I said Hi. I'm watching Phantom... it's very good so far. Have to be careful- I always sob at Music Of The Night. If you see tear blobs on my posts don't be alarmed.
 
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wildsweetone said:
some free verse poets find rhyme to be too restricting, some simply aren't interested in form poetry.

.
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Or perhaps some free verse poets are incapable of working within structure. Or don't have the ability or fortitude to try. Can you envision a rocket scientist stating that the laws of physics are too restrictive? Or an engineer deciding to ignore the laws of quantum mechanics when designing a bridge? Or a dietician unilaterally deciding that calories don't count? Or a senator ignoring a PAC? Give me a break. :confused:
 
Trolly said:
Or perhaps some free verse poets are incapable of working within structure. Or don't have the ability or fortitude to try. Can you envision a rocket scientist stating that the laws of physics are too restrictive? Or an engineer deciding to ignore the laws of quantum mechanics when designing a bridge? Or a dietician unilaterally deciding that calories don't count? Or a senator ignoring a PAC? Give me a break. :confused:
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Very poor analogies.
 
Trolly said:
Or perhaps some free verse poets are incapable of working within structure. Or don't have the ability or fortitude to try. Can you envision a rocket scientist stating that the laws of physics are too restrictive? Or an engineer deciding to ignore the laws of quantum mechanics when designing a bridge? Or a dietician unilaterally deciding that calories don't count? Or a senator ignoring a PAC? Give me a break. :confused:
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um yes, you are confused

"rocket scientists" did have to state that the traditional Newtonian laws of physics were too restrictive as they do not hold up and well, sorry but quantum mechanics can pretty much be ignored in designing a bridge.

Actually the analogies are pretty bad here Trolly. BUT I love the idea of form being like Newtonian Physics and Free Verse falling into the realm of quantum mechanics. That I can get a feel for.
 
From Under the Bridge

annaswirls said:
um yes, you are confused

"rocket scientists" did have to state that the traditional Newtonian laws of physics were too restrictive as they do not hold up and well, sorry but quantum mechanics can pretty much be ignored in designing a bridge.

Actually the analogies are pretty bad here Trolly. BUT I love the idea of form being like Newtonian Physics and Free Verse falling into the realm of quantum mechanics. That I can get a feel for.
Click to expand...

Holy Mackrel. Some free-form poets with intellect. My bad. Underestimated. Hmm. What else might I be wrong about? . . . ;)
 
annaswirls said:
um yes, you are confused

"rocket scientists" did have to state that the traditional Newtonian laws of physics were too restrictive as they do not hold up and well, sorry but quantum mechanics can pretty much be ignored in designing a bridge.

Actually the analogies are pretty bad here Trolly. BUT I love the idea of form being like Newtonian Physics and Free Verse falling into the realm of quantum mechanics. That I can get a feel for.
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AH . . . Anna, reality may lie in the realm of string theory and quantum mechanics, but most of us still dwell in the world of Newtonian mechanics and even a pre-Copernican universe. For example, do you still talk of a 'sunset'? It doesn't you know, rather the earth revolves and thus the horizon comes up and over takes it.

As I once wrote in a poem titled Sundowner . . .
"Have not you ever seen
the sea turn red wine plum
and all the splashing colors run
when with a flash of green
the spinning earth does come
and swallows up the liquid sun."​
 
Rybka said:
AH . . . Anna, reality may lie in the realm of string theory and quantum mechanics, but most of us still dwell in the world of Newtonian mechanics and even a pre-Copernican universe. For example, do you still talk of a 'sunset'? It doesn't you know, rather the earth revolves and thus the horizon comes up and over takes it.
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"Sunset" is actually a concept that is Einsteinian. All motion is relative. It is perfectly consistent to posit that we are still and the motion we perceive (sun, moon, planets, the solar system drifting through space) are around us. Just changes how you calculate things a bit.
 
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Trolly said:
Holy Mackrel. Some free-form poets with intellect. My bad. Underestimated. Hmm. What else might I be wrong about? . . . ;)
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Well... that perhaps Mackrel ain't holy.

Now mackerel--then we could talk, bud.

And stop gnawing on that compression member! It holds up the bridge!
 
Tzara said:
"Sunset" is actually a concept that is Einsteinian. All motion is relative. It is perfectly consistent to posit that we are still and the motion we perceive (sun, moon, planets, the solar system drifting through space) are around us. Just changes how you calculate things a bit.
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If that were true than why did we change our scientific view and our way of calculating things? Perhaps Occam's razor slashed again . . . and maybe society could use a shave? ;)
 
Rybka said:
If that were true than why did we change our scientific view and our way of calculating things? Perhaps Occam's razor slashed again . . . and maybe society could use a shave? ;)
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Society always needs a shave. It's beard grows in fast and gray.

Traditional philosophy of science would say that we change our scientific view when another, more accurate, view makes the predominant view untenable. I think that is what anna was saying about "rocket scientists." Kuhn, to the extent that I understand him, kind of agrees with that, but certainly doesn't require the "more accurate" view component. I think he felt that new views are something like more "useful" for explaining things (and generating further research). Fuller thinks Kuhn is full of crap. So who wins?

Dunno. My understanding--and I am certainly not a physicist--is that Relativity allows you to fix any reference point and let the others proceed relative to you. Lets you predict certain observable things that Newtonian mechanics don't.

My family is mostly engineers. So we use what is most effective, to the degree of accuracy that we need. Designing a bridge? As anna says--Newton works great. Designing the big rings at Fermilab and CERN? Better think relativistically.

I'm still using Aristotle's poetics, for the most part. Jamison, Cixous, and Foucault don't help me much.

So call me dim, some.
 
Trolly said:
Or perhaps some free verse poets are incapable of working within structure. Or don't have the ability or fortitude to try.
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Perhaps some are.

Stucture should support the content.
Content should not be forced into a struture that will not hold it.
Keep in mind, every better "free verse" pays attention to structure and creates one for the content. You just may not be seeing it.
 
Actually, most of our percieved reality is ruled by Newtonian laws, most definately agreed here. I was speaking of a metaphor thrice removed in the comparison.

:)

Rybka said:
AH . . . Anna, reality may lie in the realm of string theory and quantum mechanics, but most of us still dwell in the world of Newtonian mechanics and even a pre-Copernican universe. For example, do you still talk of a 'sunset'? It doesn't you know, rather the earth revolves and thus the horizon comes up and over takes it.

As I once wrote in a poem titled Sundowner . . .
"Have not you ever seen
the sea turn red wine plum
and all the splashing colors run
when with a flash of green
the spinning earth does come
and swallows up the liquid sun."​
Click to expand...
 
To write free verse well, you must have more descipline than in form.

A classroom of 8th graders without a teacher, without formal rule-- think of the discipline needed to continue to work and learn.

An accapella singer without the assistance of instruments to help her stay on key, on track.

The abstract painter attempting to convey an image by its presence and not the shape that everyone else can see, measure, trace with fingers.


I agree often times free verse is an easy way out, but as 1201 said, there is form to free verse, and to quote a redwhiteandblue blooded countrywestern chap I do not know beyond the bumperstickers of the good ol' boys in town

"Free Verse isn't Free"

oh my, if I have bumper stickers made up, any y'all gonna order one?

I am copyrighting it here, so don't go tryin' to steal it.
 
annaswirls said:
To write free verse well, you must have more descipline than in form.

A classroom of 8th graders without a teacher, without formal rule-- think of the discipline needed to continue to work and learn.

An accapella singer without the assistance of instruments to help her stay on key, on track.

The abstract painter attempting to convey an image by its presence and not the shape that everyone else can see, measure, trace with fingers.


I agree often times free verse is an easy way out, but as 1201 said, there is form to free verse, and to quote a redwhiteandblue blooded countrywestern chap I do not know beyond the bumperstickers of the good ol' boys in town

"Free Verse isn't Free"

oh my, if I have bumper stickers made up, any y'all gonna order one?

I am copyrighting it here, so don't go tryin' to steal it.
Click to expand...

Writing good poetry takes discipline. Names like "form" and "free verse" are arbitrary. We both love Wallace Stevens' blackbird poem, right? If that were a form, 'number poetry," would it be any less good? No. Good writing is just good, no matter what name or classification you assign to it. :)
 
Trolly said:
Holy Mackrel. Some free-form poets with intellect. My bad. Underestimated. Hmm. What else might I be wrong about? . . . ;)
Click to expand...


ah sweetheart, admitting is the first step :)
 
Angeline said:
Writing good poetry takes discipline. Names like "form" and "free verse" are arbitrary. We both love Wallace Stevens' blackbird poem, right? If that were a form, 'number poetry," would it be any less good? No. Good writing is just good, no matter what name or classification you assign to it. :)
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absotively positootely!
 
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