Looking for insight on the lifestyle

[Richard49]

I understand that definitions are important to you, Richard, and I invite you to join me in a discussion of the term "gentleman", as applied to a dominant male. I notice that you describe yourself as "The Gentleman Dom", so I assume the term has particular meaning for you.

no i did not give myself that describtion
again history is important
it was given to me by a number of submissives and Doms that are no longer here
and I have not bothered to remove it

 

[jadefirefly]

I want to thank you dixie for posting about the Deviants Dictionary
It actually proves my point

<snip>

I would be willingto beat the mid to late 90s
when there was a large # of people that came to the internet

also the embalm can be correct if you look at the D/s as a seperate term that "can" be reflected in the BDSM community.

<snip>

I am and have been suggesting that we use terms to losly
that because we do
for whatever reason we do
we end up hurting people
if I am looking for a submissive
and end up with sensualiatist or a bottom
and I end up with such because people have been mislead by terms/titles/beings than we both get hurt ... also we now have vlecro collars because people are presenting themsleves as D/s when in fact they are either sensulist or top/bottoms .....

Words have power
when they are applied to a persons being they have even more power
and when they are misused either delpertly or out of ignorence
they (words) have even more power to hurt

Firstly, do you have the foggiest idea just how cocky, arrogant, and stuck up you sound? And I am NOT speaking in the confidence-arrogance that most Dom's have. You are seriously coming across as the kind of person who'd say "I don't care what you've heard, I know what I'm talking about, so listen to me or else."

Who the fuck died and made you the BDSM god?

Yes, words DO have power. And they are OUR words, to apply to OURSELVES, as we please. If YOU wind up with a sensualist when you wanted a submissive, that is YOUR problem, and probably due to your inability to properly communicate exactly what you want and to properly listen to the person you're with, to understand exactly what he/she/it is.

Do NOT go blaming the community at large, and singling out people who just happen to disagree with you, for your own problems in finding or indentifying the people you want to play with. Do NOT go insulting the community at large, simply because "you don't want to be referred to as having a lifestyle."

And yes, that IS supposed to sound whiny.

For gods sake, grow up! Your av, if it is not you, at least gives the impression of being adult, intelligent, and mature. Your words are a far cry from it.

You do not control what the community does, says, thinks, or calls itself. If you don't like what someone else calls themselves, then you do not have to associate with them. But you have absolutely no fucking right to tell anyone that they are WRONG.

That is just as arrogant as telling someone else what their sexual orientation is. It isn't yours, so keep your fucking nose out of it.

If you choose to give the OP information regarding YOUR views, do so. But do not expect that you can insult community members, both specifically and in vague, sweeping terms, and not offend someone. I cannot begin to tell you how presumptuous that is.

When I first came to this board, I had a great deal of respect for you, Richard. What remained a few days ago has totally dissipated by this point.

 

[Kajira Callista]

did everyone forget to take their meds this morning? *puts on the cute nurse outfit*

 

[FurryFury]

did everyone forget to take their meds this morning? *puts on the cute nurse outfit*

Aww! You're adorable KC! You hate conflict don't you? Me too.

Yet sometimes I do see a need to speak out. When someone else does it first, I say yay and good going!

I love you JadeFireFly and Alice!

Fury

 

[shy slave]

Aww! You're adorable KC! You hate conflict don't you? Me too.

Yet sometimes I do see a need to speak out. When someone else does it first, I say yay and good going!

I love you JadeFireFly and Alice!

Fury

What she said

 

[Kajira Callista]

I also think...or shall i say know, that often when you are upset with a person your emotions at the moment can be mirrored in how you read their posts.

 

[shy slave]

I alo think...or shall i say know, that often when you are upset with a person your emotions at the moment can be mirrored in how you read their posts.

Thats very true KC.

Thank you for reminding us of that

 

[AngelicAssassin]

I did not think of you as disrespectful
I just hear that term applies and it is not correct
period

"We" have been overwhlemed by sensulalists and cyber being
who have adulteriated the language and especially the langauage
of who we are

I am a Dom. dominate is a verb...for many of us not a nice one.
I do not want to be compared to a top or bottom or sensulaist
and especially do not want to be placed in the same "community" because "WE"
might behave sometimes in simlar ways. I am what I am...it is not what I do.

I think many have never owned or at lest read a dictionary.

to use the arguement that my bdsm is not your bdsm is to ignor
1) 100s of years of people being what they are
2) the language of the "community" that has existed for .... well at lest the 4 plus decades I have been awear
3) to say that there is some damn big umbralla that encompases ALL kinky sex when in fact D/s is about being not doing

The term/word lifestyle is elatively new to the "community" and has been pressed on us by people who
1) do not know any better
2) those that do not care
3) those that like piegon holes
4) those that want legitmacy to there behavores

Richard, please!

As for the BDSM "parts" list, more than one source agrees with Geoff, and i don't think they fall into any of your four categories.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BDSM

http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?p=dict&String=exact&Acronym=BDSM

 

[Kajira Callista]

OK so i suppose i am the only one who gets what richard is saying.
He is saying pretty much what everyone else said to him.
This is how he sees it...this is how it is for HIM and his disappointment comes when he thinks another sees it the same and they in fact do not.
It is obvious that this subject upsets him or angers him. He is entitled to that.
I too have felt the same way and I'm sure most here have. Maybe i am more pliable then he or maybe just more willing to except a difference that i never knew existed. When you are trained (and i do think he said he was) to know something one way, it isn't so easy to know it a completely different way.
I have said before...D/s is separate from bdsm in the world i come from. BDSM as you know it was an abbreviation created to cover a wide range of things online. No matter what ONLINE ( key word there) def. you post, it will stay in my heart and head just as it is.

 

[jadefirefly]

OK so i suppose i am the only one who gets what richard is saying.
He is saying pretty much what everyone else said to him.
This is how he sees it...this is how it is for HIM and his disappointment comes when he thinks another sees it the same and they in fact do not.
It is obvious that this subject upsets him or angers him. He is entitled to that.
I too have felt the same way and I'm sure most here have. Maybe i am more pliable then he or maybe just more willing to except a difference that i never knew existed. When you are trained (and i do think he said he was) to know something one way, it isn't so easy to know it a completely different way.
I have said before...D/s is separate from bdsm in the world i come from. BDSM as you know it was an abbreviation created to cover a wide range of things online. No matter what ONLINE ( key word there) def. you post, it will stay in my heart and head just as it is.

Respectfully, KC, what I and others are seeing is not just that he sees it that way, for him. What we are seeing is, he sees it that way, and those who see otherwise -- i.e. Geoff, as evidenced by Richard's insults -- are wrong. Oh, and like to mislead people.

He has the right to be annoyed when people make assumptions about him, but that right is severely diminished, in my eyes, when he does not accord the same respect to others. And frankly, I don't think I'm the only one who gets offended when the implication is made that our way of defining ourselves is wrong, unless it agrees with his.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Respectfully, KC, what I and others are seeing is not just that he sees it that way, for him. What we are seeing is, he sees it that way, and those who see otherwise -- i.e. Geoff, as evidenced by Richard's insults -- are wrong. Oh, and like to mislead people.

He has the right to be annoyed when people make assumptions about him, but that right is severely diminished, in my eyes, when he does not accord the same respect to others. And frankly, I don't think I'm the only one who gets offended when the implication is made that our way of defining ourselves is wrong, unless it agrees with his.

Coming back from a gorgeous dinner and reading what has been taking place, I have to agree with KC here, and also add it is easy to make a quick (and often inaccurate) judgement of someone here when relatively new to the forum and having little history of that person or their life, where they have come from, their journey, and where they are today and why. Richard probably has one of the longest experiences/history of anyone on the forum of any of the roles and choices we discuss here, and for that has won a certain degree of respect over the years and contributed much. Like all of us, he has an opinion, he expresses it, and sometimes finds he is possibly not in the best of mindsets at times when he reads certain statements that trigger his responses. I for one can identify as I have been there and likely will be again as I am not one to go think about a post, compose it later, think some more, then post....I often post on the fly without the luxury to think or revise what I have said, or how, and often lose patience when I see things that trigger my own responses.

I particularly can identify with the need to maintain some level of recognition in terminology, despite some views in internet world to throw all labels out and/or interpret them to what you want them to mean for you personally and expect others to understand. I can never relate to people who tell others they don't need to define themselves as submissive or Dominant etc., as it doesn't matter as long as they know what they mean and if they want to be dominant in behaviour and yet identify themselves as a submissive it it OK. How then is anyone supposed to know what means what, and funnily enough, it is often people who hold this belief in labels being personally defined who get upset when someone misunderstands them, or responds to them in a manner which would reflect the more traditional role description. As I have said before, just because one might prefer the sound of the word 'orange', doesn't mean if they go into a butcher and ask for an orange expecting a steak that they will get what they wanted.

Catalina

 

[jadefirefly]

As I have said before, just because one might prefer the sound of the word 'orange', doesn't mean if they go into a butcher and ask for an orange expecting a steak that they will get what they wanted.

Catalina

Well, I had a reply to this, but at the end of it I decided it wasn't really worth the effort. If I'm on the wrong side, apparently, of a bunch of people who all want proper, exact, and specific labels on everyone, so be it -- but for crissakes, at least agree on what those are, so the rest of us who are apparently not involved enough in the community to know what's going on with the rest of the educated folks can get an idea of what's going on.

It is continually frustrating and annoying when the younger people here who've been involved here for less time are treated as if we're doing things "wrong". I suppose I ought to go study for my test, I didn't realise we were being graded.

 

[Marquis]

That's how it starts....next thing you know, you are " bdsm curious but married to the most loving, wonderful, sweet vanilla man in the world"...and the slippery slope slides from there.

Slides right into "I am a closet submissive married to the most vanilla man you could possibly imagine."

 

[catalina_francisco]

Well, I had a reply to this, but at the end of it I decided it wasn't really worth the effort. If I'm on the wrong side, apparently, of a bunch of people who all want proper, exact, and specific labels on everyone, so be it -- but for crissakes, at least agree on what those are, so the rest of us who are apparently not involved enough in the community to know what's going on with the rest of the educated folks can get an idea of what's going on.

It is continually frustrating and annoying when the younger people here who've been involved here for less time are treated as if we're doing things "wrong". I suppose I ought to go study for my test, I didn't realise we were being graded.

I think you have taken this way too personally which is not the way it was meant, nor does it appear have you understood what has been said...and I am not aware I or anyone selected anyone specifically as doing anything 'wrong', or offered a 'grading', and most especially I for one did not mention anything, judgement or otherwise based on age just as I am sure you did not want to be interpreted as having something against older aged or more experienced people on the board. I am guilty though of mentioning that some people such as Richard do have a much longer experience and history in such matters than either you or I put together I suspect, and though I may not always agree with, I do respect as it has been such people I have learned a lot from whether I shared their particular views or kinks or not.

Catalina

 

[Netzach]

Sorry.

Dog don't hunt.

I was trained and mentored by people of a generation and people trained and mentored of a generation.

Most of them live life and posit a very live and let live attitude about these things. They are bound to bring ME up short when I roll my eyes at anyone else in the community for any reason.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Sorry.

Dog don't hunt.

I was trained and mentored by people of a generation and people trained and mentored of a generation.

Most of them live life and posit a very live and let live attitude about these things. They are bound to bring ME up short when I roll my eyes at anyone else in the community for any reason.

LOL, well in real life I never roll my eyes at anyone or anything, and in truth I do not associate the icon here with sarcasm or eye rolling as it has a cute, quirky mouth so alternate between using that and the so called 'confused' icon when I want one portraying a shrug which unfortunately doesn't exist here.

Catalina

 

[ImmortaleAmante]

I am very aware that so many on here see definitions differently, the way the define ourselves and live our lives is a subject close to our hearts and souls and so it is understandable that a discussion on the subject can become intensely heated.

Yet there is right on both sides, and you can voice a difference of opinion without it becoming an attack on others. I find all the definitions used fascinating and the way we apply them to ourselves. They are a personal matter and can help us to seek others who are like minded, each new generation and each new phase in the development of this lifestyle, scene, life choice or whatever you wish to call it will bring changes both to the definitions and labels and the discussions.

I have always found it in some ways amusing how BDSM, D/s is veiwed by many outsiders as deviant and yet it can be more restrictive and traditional, even more judgemental, especially when it comes to definitions than what is refered to as a vanilla lifestyle, sexual orientation etc. I understand there are arguments that can be made for why it is neccessary, i do not care one way or another. How you choose to define yourself and what you do is up to you and i would certainly never dare to tell another they are wrong. Just as i would not expect another to say that my choices and the way i define myself is wrong.

 

[VanessaCarolyn]

Oh my, what have I started?

 

[Richard49]

Oh my, what have I started?

your education?

you have two schools here in this thread
1) those like me that think there is a proper use of titles/words
that see the misuse as a sure way for people to be hurt
2) another school that sees no need or at lest little need for a shared language and see me as a SOB ... (they are right I am a SOB)

now as the writer you have the "right" and information to choce which direction you will go ... best of luck...

 

[jadefirefly]

Oh my, what have I started?

Nothing that doesn't exist everywhere else, it's just been concentrated on one thread today. Don't worry about it, it isn't your fault.

 

[RJMasters]

Practicing to be more concise with my responses...so here it goes:

Anger, shame and saddness.

That sums it up real nicely for me.

 

[VanessaCarolyn]

your education?

you have two schools here in this thread
1) those like me that think there is a proper use of titles/words
that see the misuse as a sure way for people to be hurt
2) another school that sees no need or at lest little need for a shared language and see me as a SOB ... (they are right I am a SOB)

now as the writer you have the "right" and information to choce which direction you will go ... best of luck...

I'm trapped by my father here - he coordinated and conducted Sexual Harrassment Awareness training for the Postal Service during my "formative years" --so I find myself always trying to shoehorn myself into political correctness but usually my message doesn't come out the way it should.

Richard49 - If you could take a willing, unexperienced sub and mold them, what traits would you look for? what skills would you teach? Is it possible/plausible that a Dom/me would even want to start with such a blank slate?

 

[FurryFury]

Let me sum up my own thoughts here.

One, I don't believe insulting someone else and telling them they are "wrong" is a great thing to do. If one doesn't treat others with respect I tend to lose respect for them.

Two, trying to set rules for what terms are okay to use and what aren't then blaming one's own disappointments on the fact that not everyone uses them, doesn't seem constructive to me.

Three, I don't see necessarily see this issue or any other as having to be divisive with some on this side and some on the other side.

Four, I don't have any problem with defining and using terms myself. I do realize other may use those terms differently however.

There are a lot of people I respect who have voice opinions on this thread on both "sides." I tend to automatically respect everyone until they give me a reason (usually persistent ones)not to.

For some time now I've felt targeted by one person on this board in a negative way. I could be wrong but as a result, I've tended to avoid that person who still seems to throw occasional barbs. I tend to get more upset however when people I respect are upbraided and disrespected for no reason. That, to me, is just rude.

Fury

 

[Kajira Callista]

I'm trapped by my father here - he coordinated and conducted Sexual Harrassment Awareness training for the Postal Service during my "formative years" --so I find myself always trying to shoehorn myself into political correctness but usually my message doesn't come out the way it should.

Richard49 - If you could take a willing, unexperienced sub and mold them, what traits would you look for? what skills would you teach? Is it possible/plausible that a Dom/me would even want to start with such a blank slate?

thats what they all want...but then again, im told im jaded lol.
that was a joke guys
all subs new or unexperienced, should be a blank slate when starting a relationship like this IMHO. Not blank minded or a robot but a blank slate.

 

[VanessaCarolyn]

Actually, that may be a good question for all the Dom(me)s out there:

If you could take an unexperienced sub and mold them, what traits would you look for? what skills would you teach? Is it possible/plausible that a Dom(me) would even want to start with such a blank slate?