On the flip-side

[BiBunny]

Not being inside your head, Gigi, I could only, at best, make wild assed guesses about WHY you are feeling the way you are.

But I can say this:

In my experience, sadistic bottoms are not unusual.

Neither are masochistic Doms.

Service Tops can have a great deal of fun unleashing their inner sadists all the while performing to a script mostly devised by the bottom...

*shrugs* Why isn't so important to me any more, I'm more concerned on keeping focussed on "What is, right now."

What the Evil One said.

 

[Netzach]

It has been posed that my natural submissive character has been suppressing my dominant nature. That these natural tendencies are coming forward in dreams and desires because my true nature is to be sexually top heavy rather than bottom. Also posed is that even though I have extreme emotionally submissive needs and desires, that sexually I am chopping myself off at the knees by being sexually submissive.


anyone?

I doubt that, and I'm not that binary about it. I will say that maybe you are *limiting* yourself overmuch if you aren't going to at least see how this facet of your personality feels. You may ditch on it, you may keep it around, it may come and go.

I would, though, interrogate it a bit. Definitely. Be close in touch with why you're doing what you're doing.

 

[Homburg]

Read my above post, please sir.

To a degree, he did. I am not afraid so much of how I feel, more that I am concerned about what will happen if I enact them. That is what I want to address most. I am sorry if I was not clear.

I did read it. Rather nice. Some hawt there

Personally, I see nothing wrong with it. I've done all sorts of aggressive and violent things to get the rage out. Managed to hurt no one (aside from myself when partaking in certain dangerous physical activities). Walk in with your eyes open, be careful, and, as Netz said, be conscious of why you are doing it.

 

[YourCaptor]

I’m a sadist, and I think this is perfectly fine to be so.

However I don’t think you are expressing the motives of a sadist.

You should never hurt somebody in order to deal with you own issues.

You need to ask yourself what you think hurting somebody else will do for you. Sure you have the urge, I get the urge to hurt people but I know that that’s not a sadist tendency but a sort of emotional release.

If you are doing it to numb yourself of what you are feeling now it is most definitely wrong and you should find a professional to help you organize your post break up mind.

Now don’t get me wrong, you are not wrong for feeling this, but don’t be rash to label it.

If you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.

 

[cherokee_dove]

See, I've been thinking of it like this as well: Since our inner daemons are generally worked out in our dreams, I know this has to be on some basic level a primal instinct crawling to the surface; brought on by loss and my inner self mutilating feelings of failure. While I acknowledge and have even physically entertained the idea of being dominant, in some way, in the past I have never given it great thought due to my overwhelming call and desire to serve. (insert the emotional sub vs. sexual dom theory here) So again, the question remains, if this is part of who I am on a primal level and has always been there, why did it take "THIS" particular failure to draw it out?

As EG said, wasnt there; so just throwing an idea out as to why it took "THIS" particular failure to draw it out. It regards what you said about the "emotional sub vs sexual Dom theory".

Maybe this particular ending had enough emotional pain in it, for you; that the "emotional sub" side of you decided to just shut down for awhile. And because it did (if that is the case), then your own "angry" emotions to yourself because of the failure built up unconsciously to bring forth the "sexual Dom" side, as a way to get the aggressions and anger out.

But like i said, its just an idea to run thru to see if that might be why.

 

[Homburg]

I’m a sadist, and I think this is perfectly fine to be so.

However I don’t think you are expressing the motives of a sadist.

You should never hurt somebody in order to deal with you own issues.

You need to ask yourself what you think hurting somebody else will do for you. Sure you have the urge, I get the urge to hurt people but I know that that’s not a sadist tendency but a sort of emotional release.

If you are doing it to numb yourself of what you are feeling now it is most definitely wrong and you should find a professional to help you organize your post break up mind.

Now don’t get me wrong, you are not wrong for feeling this, but don’t be rash to label it.

If you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.

I get the words you're saying, but the way you're putting them together is... I dunno.

You should never hurt somebody in order to deal with you own issues

Do what? Sadism is an issue. Period. By default. As a sadist, you get your jollies off of hurting people. That's an issue on its' own. Hell, it's a whole damned volume.

And emotional release implies the existence of an issue. Face it.

Frankly, I hurt people for the simplest reason of all - I want to. But some days, yeah, some days there's a little something extra there. There's some curry powder in the emotional stew. Some days I hurt others because I need to.

Personally, when I look in the mirror, I want to see my real face, not the face I think I should see.

 

[Netzach]

You should never hurt somebody in order to deal with you own issues.

Oh man, everyone I know is playing this game wrong then.

I've never heard people saying "you should never get hurt to deal with your own issues" we're constantly patting subs/bottoms on the back for having "breakthroughs" and "self discovery" at the other end of the flogger.


Just don't be an asshole - I think that's more the caveat. I don't think you're in danger of doing that if you're asking these questions.

I do think playing immediately post breakup as a way of dealing may not be *the* best idea, but if this is still nagging at you as you heal from this, go for it.

 

[YourCaptor]

Oh man, everyone I know is playing this game wrong then.

I've never heard people saying "you should never get hurt to deal with your own issues" we're constantly patting subs/bottoms on the back for having "breakthroughs" and "self discovery" at the other end of the flogger.


Just don't be an asshole - I think that's more the caveat. I don't think you're in danger of doing that if you're asking these questions.

I do think playing immediately post breakup as a way of dealing may not be *the* best idea, but if this is still nagging at you as you heal from this, go for it.

I get the words you're saying, but the way you're putting them together is... I dunno.



Do what? Sadism is an issue. Period. By default. As a sadist, you get your jollies off of hurting people. That's an issue on its' own. Hell, it's a whole damned volume.

And emotional release implies the existence of an issue. Face it.

Frankly, I hurt people for the simplest reason of all - I want to. But some days, yeah, some days there's a little something extra there. There's some curry powder in the emotional stew. Some days I hurt others because I need to.

Personally, when I look in the mirror, I want to see my real face, not the face I think I should see.

I don’t think a true sadist hurts people to deal with issues, they simply enjoy it. Just as a smile will make people feel better, or how sex feels good, hurting somebody makes the sadist feel good. There aren’t any issues dealt with through sadism, no venting anything or trying to put ones own pain on someone else, its just a pleasure. Yes the vast majority of people will not enjoy hurting others, in fact most will probably be repulsed by it. That doest change the fact that the sadist happens to like it.

 

[Homburg]

I don’t think a true sadist hurts people to deal with issues, they simply enjoy it. Just as a smile will make people feel better, or how sex feels good, hurting somebody makes the sadist feel good. There aren’t any issues dealt with through sadism, no venting anything or trying to put ones own pain on someone else, its just a pleasure. Yes the vast majority of people will not enjoy hurting others, in fact most will probably be repulsed by it. That doest change the fact that the sadist happens to like it.

YC, you enjoy sex. Ever had sex with someone that you didn't like? Or sex with someone you did care for, but was pissed at? And we're just talking sex.

Also, have you ever gone to martial arts class in a bad mood and blew that mood out on a willing sparring partner? I sure have, though it was the other way around. I was always the guy people turned to for getting their bad moods out.

Anything that is pleasurable and has an emotional release component can be used to exorcise one's demons. And sadism is better about it than most.

Seriously, dude, look at it critically. Maybe you can say that every time you've swung your hand it was done with a smile on your face and pure love in your heart. If you can, well, either your a domly Dalai Lama, or you can probably count the number of spankings you've given on your fingers still.

And, no, this is not a comment on experience or lack thereof. It's a comment on the realities of sadism. Some days you feel want, others days it's need. You're a young guy. You legitimately may not have hit that yet.

--

And be careful with that "true" shit. It's a fuck-all loaded term. A true sadist doesn't give a toss about consent or willingness, and will often seek the opposite. A true sadist doesn't want a masochist, he wants a normal person to inflict pain on and doesn't care about anything else. I am not a clinical sadist, and neither are you, so belay that "true" business, okay?

 

[YourCaptor]

YC, you enjoy sex. Ever had sex with someone that you didn't like? Or sex with someone you did care for, but was pissed at? And we're just talking sex.

Also, have you ever gone to martial arts class in a bad mood and blew that mood out on a willing sparring partner? I sure have, though it was the other way around. I was always the guy people turned to for getting their bad moods out.

Anything that is pleasurable and has an emotional release component can be used to exorcise one's demons. And sadism is better about it than most.

Seriously, dude, look at it critically. Maybe you can say that every time you've swung your hand it was done with a smile on your face and pure love in your heart. If you can, well, either your a domly Dalai Lama, or you can probably count the number of spankings you've given on your fingers still.

And, no, this is not a comment on experience or lack thereof. It's a comment on the realities of sadism. Some days you feel want, others days it's need. You're a young guy. You legitimately may not have hit that yet.

Well, I think we have to identify exactly what is meant by inner demons.

Just like sex and martial arts, sadism can be used as a channel to take out your anger, however that is abuse.

Yes their may be times when you are stressed and you turn to sadism, but you could have also turned to video games, a jog, or even meditation.

In SweetGigis case I would definitely recommend figuring out if her desires will only lead to short term relief, or if she really wants this as a life style.

And be careful with that "true" shit. It's a fuck-all loaded term. A true sadist doesn't give a toss about consent or willingness, and will often seek the opposite. A true sadist doesn't want a masochist, he wants a normal person to inflict pain on and doesn't care about anything else. I am not a clinical sadist, and neither are you, so belay that "true" business, okay?

By “true sadist” I meant

Sadist - someone who obtains pleasure from inflicting pain on others

They do not have to be a criminal, a psychopath, nor do they have to be obsessed. A true sadist could be suppressing their urges all their life, never acting on them once.

 

[Homburg]

Well, I think we have to identify exactly what is meant by inner demons.

Just like sex and martial arts, sadism can be used as a channel to take out your anger, however that is abuse.

Yes their may be times when you are stressed and you turn to sadism, but you could have also turned to video games, a jog, or even meditation.

In SweetGigis case I would definitely recommend figuring out if her desires will only lead to short term relief, or if she really wants this as a life style.

No, I don't think the need to define inner demons is material. I think you just need to experience more and get a less romantic view of hurting people.

As to abuse, you have a strange idea of what abuse is.

By “true sadist” I meant

Sadist - someone who obtains pleasure from inflicting pain on others

They do not have to be a criminal, a psychopath, nor do they have to be obsessed. A true sadist could be suppressing their urges all their life, never acting on them once.

Do yourself a favour -ditch the word "true" in association with identifiers like sadist, dominant, masochist, submissive, etc. Do a search for true plus any of those words and it won't be long before you see an argument.

The bottom line is neither you, nor anyone else, owns sadism, or any other identifier, so neither nor anyone else can say what is true and what isn't.

And, frankly, by your own definition, someone that gets their sado on while angry is still a sadist.

 

[Essene]

I doubt that, and I'm not that binary about it. I will say that maybe you are *limiting* yourself overmuch if you aren't going to at least see how this facet of your personality feels. You may ditch on it, you may keep it around, it may come and go.

I would, though, interrogate it a bit. Definitely. Be close in touch with why you're doing what you're doing.

I agree with Netzach.

Good luck Gigi.

 

[YourCaptor]

No, I don't think the need to define inner demons is material. I think you just need to experience more and get a less romantic view of hurting people.

As to abuse, you have a strange idea of what abuse is.

I happen to think, from a sadist point of view, hurting someone is extremely romantic. Obviously it is not a rational act, why would you cause someone pain, especially if you are like me and the people you hurt are those that you love. But then when I do it, its like nothing else matters, just me and her, their are few better way I can think of to reaffirm ones love.

Damn, now I want take someone in my arms and hit a pressure point.

However, the day I lay an angry hand on anyone I love is the day I get myself a therapist. I don’t mess around with abuse, seen it do way too much harm, so I don’t get anywhere near it.

Do yourself a favour -ditch the word "true" in association with identifiers like sadist, dominant, masochist, submissive, etc. Do a search for true plus any of those words and it won't be long before you see an argument.

The bottom line is neither you, nor anyone else, owns sadism, or any other identifier, so neither nor anyone else can say what is true and what isn't.

And, frankly, by your own definition, someone that gets their sado on while angry is still a sadist.

Ok, granted, but what word would you use in place of true?

English isn’t my first language, so maybe that it?

When I say “true” it is not mean to identify a specific type of sadist, but the most basic core requirement for a sadist. I guess I just associate the word true with that because on of the definitions of true is “being or reflecting the essential or genuine character of something”

 

[Homburg]

I happen to think, from a sadist point of view, hurting someone is extremely romantic. Obviously it is not a rational act, why would you cause someone pain, especially if you are like me and the people you hurt are those that you love. But then when I do it, its like nothing else matters, just me and her, their are few better way I can think of to reaffirm ones love.

Damn, now I want take someone in my arms and hit a pressure point.

Sure, but it is not all wine and bruises. It's hurting people. It's a messy, nasty business. Fun though.

However, the day I lay an angry hand on anyone I love is the day I get myself a therapist. I don’t mess around with abuse, seen it do way too much harm, so I don’t get anywhere near it.

See, there's a fine line there. Are you angry with that person specifically? It might be abusive. Are you just angry, might not be. It revolves around how much control you have, and how much they are willing to accept and why.

Ok, granted, but what word would you use in place of true?

English isn’t my first language, so maybe that it?

Honestly I keep forgetting that. Your english is bloody good.

When I say “true” it is not mean to identify a specific type of sadist, but the most basic core requirement for a sadist. I guess I just associate the word true with that because on of the definitions of true is “being or reflecting the essential or genuine character of something”

Tough question. I tend to work along the lines of over-explaining it. "My personal opinion of a saidst does not include such behaviour". That sort of windy crap. It's just that "true" is so commonly a hot-button that it's safer to just avoid the frikken term unless you are very careful with your usage.

 

[YourCaptor]

See, there's a fine line there. Are you angry with that person specifically? It might be abusive. Are you just angry, might not be. It revolves around how much control you have, and how much they are willing to accept and why.

Ok, to each their own.

That however is just anger, the whole sadist thing gets lost in that. If you beat somebody out of anger you don’t feel better because you’re a sadist, you feel better because you got some kind of emotional vengeance.

Far more of us are vengeful then are sadistic.

I suppose you could argue that the pleasure one gets out of revenge is sadistic, but sadistic pleasure is more simple then that. It’s similar to the difference between someone who is happy because a painful time has made their character stronger, and someone who is in pain and is happy because they enjoy pain.

 

[onyxvixen]

If motivation is put aside here, the ethics here are relatively simple.

1) That the bottom knows you are going to do this for personal reasons and is OK with that.
2) Hard limits are agreed and adhered to.
3) Safewords are agreed and respected. Traffic lights are generally better with new partners than a 'stop everything' safeword as you can negotiate along the way without needing a time out.

Within that structure of consent, with a willing and experienced bottom you really can do pretty much what you like. If it's too much for them, the onus is upon the bottom to communicate that.

It won't be abuse either. It'll be something they want that they have consented to. Your motivation doesn't really enter into that.

Yes, some people go jogging instead. Others engage in BDSM play that is SSC and a release for them at the same time. Is that wrong or bad? Not if both parties are still smiling at the end of the scene.

I agree with Netz though, that you might want to put some distance between you and this break up and see if the urge is still there before you decide to run with it.

 

[SweetGigi]

Your Captor,

I am sure you have researched the history and the etymology of the term Sadism. If not, you should know Donatien Alphonse François de Sade, more commonly known as the Marquis de Sade, is for whom this term is named chiefly because of his abuses, tortures, and crimes against humanity preformed on women and men in the late 1700s (for personal gain and at the blatant disregard of human life), as well as his graphic literary works.

If you have not had the chance to read his works, I strongly suggest that as a Sadist you should. There are many in this world who believe Sade was undeniably insane and clearly abusive to all whom he came into contact. Yet the vast majority of modern Sadism, as well as the term's definition, are based in his works, both fictional and literal. Sade is the father of Sadism... the truest Sadist of them all. While it is not up to me to state whether this man was truly insane or 'abusive', it is rational to deduce that his work and efforts paved the way for today's more 'healthy' forms of Sadism. If to be a 'true' Sadist is to not be 'insane' or 'abusive' then I think you need to reevaluate your definition. It is my personal belief that to be a clinically diagnosed Sadist is unhealthy, but to use Sadistic acts to help you- as a tool just as subs/slaves/bottoms alike use pain and control as therapy- is not unhealthy. To disregard one's personal boundaries, limits and thresholds for your own personal gain and amusement is the basis of Sade's sexual works and belief. I think we can all agree this is not what I want or plan to do in any way, nor is it the goal of any Sadist I know.

Please do not disregard the words or insights of the others on this board by throwing around terms like 'true' 'genuine' or 'real'. We each have our own 'definition' of what we do and how we do it and it is for no one else to label as such. This lifestyle lends us terms and a vocabulary to colour what we do, but there is no way these labels can ink in the lines of absolutes for us. Please use the folks here who have decades of experience as a resource for furthering your own knowledge base. Some of these women and men have been at this for longer than I've been alive and just because I don't agree with some of their ways doesn't mean I can't learn from them. It is amazing how much my definitions and thoughts on the lifestyle have changed in the last 7, almost 8, years. What used to mean one thing to me as a budding bottom all those years ago means something completely different now. Even in the past 6 months my thoughts and feelings on S/m have changed so drastically, I am 180* from where I used to be. Just remember we are all still learning no matter where we are on the path... and to use the tools given to us is the best means of learning and growing.

Thank you for your input and insight on my dilemma. Your personal perspective gave me time to remind myself of personal limits and feelings and base-line where these dreams might be coming from. I still don't know what to do or what I will do in the future, but I hope that in time and with much thought, I will find the answers I seek.

 

[Homburg]

Ok, to each their own.

That however is just anger, the whole sadist thing gets lost in that. If you beat somebody out of anger you don’t feel better because you’re a sadist, you feel better because you got some kind of emotional vengeance.

Far more of us are vengeful then are sadistic.

I suppose you could argue that the pleasure one gets out of revenge is sadistic, but sadistic pleasure is more simple then that. It’s similar to the difference between someone who is happy because a painful time has made their character stronger, and someone who is in pain and is happy because they enjoy pain.

When I'm angry, I'm still a sadist. When I'm sad, I'm still a sadist. Whe I'm happy, I'm still a sadist. My emotional state does not inform my sadism.

And I'm pretty sure that I am in a better position to decide if emotional vengeance is _my_ motivator. Please do not presume to speak for why I enjoy hurting people.

Onyxvixen and Sweetgigi have eloquently covered the other points I would've made.

Oh, and I have to say that I envy you, man. I did not have the resouces you have when I was your age, nor did I have the concepts. I knew that I enjoyed violence a bit much and simply thought it was an unhealthy pathos.

 

[faeriefire]

It has been posed that my natural submissive character has been suppressing my dominant nature. That these natural tendencies are coming forward in dreams and desires because my true nature is to be sexually top heavy rather than bottom. Also posed is that even though I have extreme emotionally submissive needs and desires, that sexually I am chopping myself off at the knees by being sexually submissive. anyone?

See, I've been thinking of it like this as well: Since our inner daemons are generally worked out in our dreams, I know this has to be on some basic level a primal instinct crawling to the surface; brought on by loss and my inner self mutilating feelings of failure. While I acknowledge and have even physically entertained the idea of being dominant, in some way, in the past I have never given it great thought due to my overwhelming call and desire to serve. (insert the emotional sub vs. sexual dom theory here) So again, the question remains, if this is part of who I am on a primal level and has always been there, why did it take "THIS" particular failure to draw it out?

Homburg and YourCaptor should definately spar...the ripostes are already flying...just imagine what would happen if they actually used their martial art skills sadism X2 in every step lol.

For SG, from your posts is seems like you already know what you need and the next step is to know it's ok or worthwhile to pursue. Is knowing 'why now' going to change what you are feeling, or is it more a desire to understand the source of dreams and thoughts being out of control? Perhaps the answer 'why now' is your mind saying you are ready for this step. Maybe having some years of experience and feeling comfortable as a sub this is another move forward. Or maybe not. Without knowing you it's hard to say. Up above you mentioned submissive character vs. dominant nature. Character and nature in this context seem synonymous to me, but maybe that's just another definition thing like the 'real' debate. Perhaps the PYL/pyl sides of you are just different layer that have coexisted peacefully for many years. This doesn't sound like something you just thought up or that has appeal just because it's new. It sounds more like something that was within you and your breakup peeled back another onion layer exposing it. So finally the worthwhile bit...do you think the desire will fade away if you ignore it? Or do you think it's something that will recede after hurting one maso? Or something that will stay with you and you'll continue to explore for many years to come. Maybe the answer will help you decide whether to pursue a S/m course or desist. Good luck in sorting it all out. With just beginning to explore D/s myself I sorta understand how confusing all the questions, thoughts, dreams, etc. can get. Hopefully you'll be able to make sense of it soon. Take care and happy hunting.

 

[Homburg]

Homburg and YourCaptor should definately spar...the ripostes are already flying...just imagine what would happen if they actually used their martial art skills sadism X2 in every step lol.

It'd be fun. He'd have a big edge in youth and current practice. It's been years since I was actively involved. These days I just practice boxing and some kicking when the mood hits. Eeevery once in a while a friend will get froggy and decide sparring is needed. It would be fun though =)

 

[YourCaptor]

Your Captor,

I am sure you have researched the history and the etymology of the term Sadism. If not, you should know Donatien Alphonse François de Sade, more commonly known as the Marquis de Sade, is for whom this term is named chiefly because of his abuses, tortures, and crimes against humanity preformed on women and men in the late 1700s (for personal gain and at the blatant disregard of human life), as well as his graphic literary works.

If you have not had the chance to read his works, I strongly suggest that as a Sadist you should. There are many in this world who believe Sade was undeniably insane and clearly abusive to all whom he came into contact. Yet the vast majority of modern Sadism, as well as the term's definition, are based in his works, both fictional and literal. Sade is the father of Sadism... the truest Sadist of them all. While it is not up to me to state whether this man was truly insane or 'abusive', it is rational to deduce that his work and efforts paved the way for today's more 'healthy' forms of Sadism. If to be a 'true' Sadist is to not be 'insane' or 'abusive' then I think you need to reevaluate your definition. It is my personal belief that to be a clinically diagnosed Sadist is unhealthy, but to use Sadistic acts to help you- as a tool just as subs/slaves/bottoms alike use pain and control as therapy- is not unhealthy. To disregard one's personal boundaries, limits and thresholds for your own personal gain and amusement is the basis of Sade's sexual works and belief. I think we can all agree this is not what I want or plan to do in any way, nor is it the goal of any Sadist I know.

Please do not disregard the words or insights of the others on this board by throwing around terms like 'true' 'genuine' or 'real'. We each have our own 'definition' of what we do and how we do it and it is for no one else to label as such. This lifestyle lends us terms and a vocabulary to colour what we do, but there is no way these labels can ink in the lines of absolutes for us. Please use the folks here who have decades of experience as a resource for furthering your own knowledge base. Some of these women and men have been at this for longer than I've been alive and just because I don't agree with some of their ways doesn't mean I can't learn from them. It is amazing how much my definitions and thoughts on the lifestyle have changed in the last 7, almost 8, years. What used to mean one thing to me as a budding bottom all those years ago means something completely different now. Even in the past 6 months my thoughts and feelings on S/m have changed so drastically, I am 180* from where I used to be. Just remember we are all still learning no matter where we are on the path... and to use the tools given to us is the best means of learning and growing.

Thank you for your input and insight on my dilemma. Your personal perspective gave me time to remind myself of personal limits and feelings and base-line where these dreams might be coming from. I still don't know what to do or what I will do in the future, but I hope that in time and with much thought, I will find the answers I seek.

You asked if this was a healthy direction to go into. I say no.

Of course you can do it, if everyone’s consenting, and if you have an experienced partner then really anyone could do it.

However I don’t believe it will solve your problems, from what you have said, it seems like if you do go out and hurt someone you will feel better, but it won’t last. You need to dig deeper and find out what’s going on in your head.

I don’t want you turning to a risky behavior in order to temporarily numb yourself of what you are going through.

Simply your view of this as a solution, or a relief is worry enough.

For example compare it to a different risky behavior, something many people turn to, binge drinking.

If someone tells me that since their break up they have had an urge to drink, and then ask me if they should do it. I am most definitely going to say no.

You can abuse sadistic tendencies, trust me on that.

 

[nh23]

I get the words you're saying, but the way you're putting them together is... I dunno.



Do what? Sadism is an issue. Period. By default. As a sadist, you get your jollies off of hurting people. That's an issue on its' own. Hell, it's a whole damned volume.

And emotional release implies the existence of an issue. Face it.

Frankly, I hurt people for the simplest reason of all - I want to. But some days, yeah, some days there's a little something extra there. There's some curry powder in the emotional stew. Some days I hurt others because I need to.

Personally, when I look in the mirror, I want to see my real face, not the face I think I should see.

I know this is a serious discussion and all..but *fans self* that's hot...

 

[Sir_Winston54]

SG, I came to this thread late, and after reading all the way through it a couple of times, I have come to the conclusion that I have nothing new to add, but perhaps could just highlight what I see as the most important parts of your question(s), and what I consider some of the best, most logical and most insightful responses to your questions. You tapped into a wealth of knowledge and experience here, and were well-rewarded for your efforts.

Since things came to a close with Jim I have had this overwhelming and constant desire to locate someone to 'hurt'. Not just a random someone, but particularly someone who wants to be hurt and who possibly requires it. I completely understand the concept of transference, however even though I've experienced break-ups like this in the past, I've never wanted to seek someone out to hurt before. This desire is so strong I've even had several dreams about it- each more vivid and inflicting than the next. My question is this: while I know this is a 'normal' reaction, I am more concerned with if it is healthy and how to purge this desire in a healthy fashion. Any and all suggestions are welcome.

None of the above apply. This is a unknown and foreign sadist tendency I am feeling brought out by the loss of this particular relationship. Nothing to do with beating or mauling the crap out of someone random or specific even, but rather just feeling someone suffer at my hands for the sheer enjoyment of it on both ends. To know someone is writhing in pain I created and they are eating it up as much as I am. To feel the wetness form between my legs and the shortness of breath that comes with each crack of delicious pain. This isn't merely infliction, this is satisfaction. I woke this morning in a pool of sweat and come from the dreams these desires (among other things) created last night. I feel this is an outlet I'm not gonna be able to ignore. I just don't know how to release it in a healthy and proactive way without damaging myself or someone else or if I even should.

This is going to be all sorts of radical, but might I suggest ... finding someone who wants to be hurt. And, then, y'know, hurting that person.

Crazy, I know.

But seriously, you're asking a board populated by people who hurt and get hurt for recreational reasons. I'm pretty sure that most folks here would consider it healthy so long as it was SSC/RACK.

Just my opinion:

It may be that this break-up has triggered inner feelings, since you stated this urge to hurt someone is foreign and sadistic (Taking it that you are not a sadistic one by nature). The hurt you are feeling has most likely unlocked a hidden desire within you to deliver this hurt onto someone else, not that you are angry with them, you just want to make them feel pain.
As long as the person you choose to be your victim is well aware of your intentions, and are agreeable with same, it might very well be to both of your advantages. You may find this is a one time need for you, and by fulfilling this could quite possibly satisfy the desire, but on the other hand, you may also find that this new desire of yours is something that intrigues you, and that you want to pursue it even more. The only way you are going to answer your question is to fulfill this need, then make your decision.
As far as being healthy?...I think it is always healthy to follow desires and needs, whether they be for one encounter or many. Unless you do you will never know what potential you have or your inner being.
Just make sure you victim is aggreeable, 100%. You don't want an abuse charge against you, and by all means, make sure you understand fully your own limitations, and become knowledgable in the acts you wish to deliver to your victim. Hurting someone is one thing, injuring is somewhere you don't want to go...
Again, just my opinion

I'm also of the mindset that it's totally ethical and fine to find someone who likes this kind of thing done to them, so long as you make it clear that you are in this mindset and in this particular place and there's an element of them being your stress relief.

I don't think it would be hard to find a fairly nice, experienced masochist who finds that prospect very erotic and who can take responsibility enough for their OWN body to teach you a thing or two about how not to screw it up but have fun with it.

See, I've been thinking of it like this as well: Since our inner daemons are generally worked out in our dreams, I know this has to be on some basic level a primal instinct crawling to the surface; brought on by loss and my inner self mutilating feelings of failure. While I acknowledge and have even physically entertained the idea of being dominant, in some way, in the past I have never given it great thought due to my overwhelming call and desire to serve. (insert the emotional sub vs. sexual dom theory here) So again, the question remains, if this is part of who I am on a primal level and has always been there, why did it take "THIS" particular failure to draw it out?

I am sorry I over looked this reply.


"Please explain your vivid dreams in more detail."

*giggles* any particular reason why? (if you want, PM me and I'll do so.)

I don't think I am wack-o any more than any other budding kinkster is. If having urges like this, or any other deviant idea or thought for that matter, made us 'wack-o, then every single person on this site needs to be put away. I am an extremely analytical person and I never enter into anything without first purging any worry or fear that comes with a new concept.

I doubt that, and I'm not that binary about it. I will say that maybe you are *limiting* yourself overmuch if you aren't going to at least see how this facet of your personality feels. You may ditch on it, you may keep it around, it may come and go.

I would, though, interrogate it a bit. Definitely. Be close in touch with why you're doing what you're doing.

If motivation is put aside here, the ethics here are relatively simple.

1) That the bottom knows you are going to do this for personal reasons and is OK with that.
2) Hard limits are agreed and adhered to.
3) Safewords are agreed and respected. Traffic lights are generally better with new partners than a 'stop everything' safeword as you can negotiate along the way without needing a time out.

Within that structure of consent, with a willing and experienced bottom you really can do pretty much what you like. If it's too much for them, the onus is upon the bottom to communicate that.

It won't be abuse either. It'll be something they want that they have consented to. Your motivation doesn't really enter into that.

Yes, some people go jogging instead. Others engage in BDSM play that is SSC and a release for them at the same time. Is that wrong or bad? Not if both parties are still smiling at the end of the scene.

I agree with Netz though, that you might want to put some distance between you and this break up and see if the urge is still there before you decide to run with it.

Homburg and YourCaptor should definately spar...the ripostes are already flying...just imagine what would happen if they actually used their martial art skills sadism X2 in every step lol.

For SG, from your posts is seems like you already know what you need and the next step is to know it's ok or worthwhile to pursue. Is knowing 'why now' going to change what you are feeling, or is it more a desire to understand the source of dreams and thoughts being out of control? Perhaps the answer 'why now' is your mind saying you are ready for this step. Maybe having some years of experience and feeling comfortable as a sub this is another move forward. Or maybe not. Without knowing you it's hard to say. Up above you mentioned submissive character vs. dominant nature. Character and nature in this context seem synonymous to me, but maybe that's just another definition thing like the 'real' debate. Perhaps the PYL/pyl sides of you are just different layer that have coexisted peacefully for many years. This doesn't sound like something you just thought up or that has appeal just because it's new. It sounds more like something that was within you and your breakup peeled back another onion layer exposing it. So finally the worthwhile bit...do you think the desire will fade away if you ignore it? Or do you think it's something that will recede after hurting one maso? Or something that will stay with you and you'll continue to explore for many years to come. Maybe the answer will help you decide whether to pursue a S/m course or desist. Good luck in sorting it all out. With just beginning to explore D/s myself I sorta understand how confusing all the questions, thoughts, dreams, etc. can get. Hopefully you'll be able to make sense of it soon. Take care and happy hunting.

 

[SweetGigi]

You asked if this was a healthy direction to go into. I say no.

Your opinion has been duly noted and logged. I appreciate you thoughts and consider then well. Just remember to not think of yourself as the end all be all resource. You input is valuable, but not all I consider.

However I don’t believe it will solve your problems, from what you have said, it seems like if you do go out and hurt someone you will feel better, but it won’t last. You need to dig deeper and find out what’s going on in your head.

If it is truly a part of me that has been dormant inside, which I am coming to conclude it is, just one encounter will not satiate my needs regardless of what drug it to the forefront. I have no intentions, nor have I ever had intentions, of just finding some poor sap and whipping or caning him to tears and blood at this very second in time for my own lustful needs. I know I need to investigate things further and deeper before I dig deeper into the rabbit hole. You are giving me less credit than I deserve here.

Simply your view of this as a solution, or a relief is worry enough.

I have never view these feelings as a solution. Please don't put words in my mouth. I merely want to explore a new horizon that happens to coincide with my break up. AGAIN, I have no intentions (nor have I ever) to just wail on someone until I am fully and completely aware and keenly prepared for the aftermath. I am not jumping straight from the frying pan into the fire here... I am testing the flames first.

For example compare it to a different risky behavior, something many people turn to, binge drinking.

If someone tells me that since their break up they have had an urge to drink, and then ask me if they should do it. I am most definitely going to say no.

I think you are wrong for comparing my situation to binge drinking. For one, I am not entering into this as a means to 'drown' my pain. As I have stated clearly several times, I am evaluating things- look at all of this from every angle. I do not intend to mask my emotions with these acts, and for it to be assumed that I am tells me you are not listening nor paying attention here. The simple fact that I am self aware enough to come here and ask for opinions and advice is, in and of itself, a sign that I don't want to just mask or run away from things. I am clearly and evidently trying to get to the heart of the matter and want to do this in a calculated fashion. To compare an abusive and detrimental act (binge drinking) to what I am doing here is insulting. Whether you intended to or not, you have cut me to the core by not giving me enough credit to know my own limits.


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SG, I came to this thread late, and after reading all the way through it a couple of times, I have come to the conclusion that I have nothing new to add, but perhaps could just highlight what I see as the most important parts of your question(s), and what I consider some of the best, most logical and most insightful responses to your questions. You tapped into a wealth of knowledge and experience here, and were well-rewarded for your efforts.

I really like that you have done this. It reassures me that I am pulling from it exactly what I need to be and gives me hope that I am going about this the right way. Thank you.

 

[sexycaz22]

Although I have not commented on the thread, I have lurked and read some posts etc, all were very useful.

I just wanted to say all the best of luck, SG, with what you decide to do.

And yes, SW's post is very useful, I am glad he is back, gracing us with his wise words!