Plausibility?

[elfin_odalisque]

Unfortunately, getting Elfin to make sense is usually a losing battle.

Only because you have an aversion to common sense, modesty or politeness.

 

[sr71plt]

Only because you have an aversion to common sense, modesty or politeness.

Naw, I think it has more to do with you being loonytunes.

 

[lazyhobo]

Only because you have an aversion to common sense, modesty or politeness.

We have to be polite and modest for you to make sense?

 

[Dennis_St_John]

Writing

Writing, like masturbation is mostly a solitary occupation. And, like masturbation, writing is something anyone can do. Writing well is another matter. 'The first word of the first line in any story is the most difficult.' When I first read that I thought to myself, that's BS, and yet, I have lost count of the number of times have I sat there looking at a blank sheet of paper, or computer screen, the whole story laid out in my head, yet cannot think of that first word. Many have said that you need a 'hook' to grab the reader in the first line and suggest you jump right into the action. Again, easier said than done. At what point do you start the 'action' is it the moment someone starts fucking someone else, or is it that first eye contact that send a delicate shiver up someone's back. To me, if you are going to tell the whole story, not just a page full of the 'good bits' so to speak, the story has to have a beginning… well a beginning, middle and end, but as said, the 'hook at the start is the most important part. The difficulty I think, is deciding what that 'hook' is, keeping in mind the adage of starting the story with a 'bang'. To me, there is a fine line between 'hook' and 'bang'. Many stories on here start with the 'bang' with no introduction at all. This leaves me wanting as there is no lead in, no character development, and nothing to engage my interest in what is happening. I much prefer a hook rather than a bang, as it gives me time to engage me as a readers as well as a writer in the first few line, or at least the first paragraph, and hopefully, if my skill as a writer is sufficient I can induce the reader to carry on reading. In the end, each writing must decide on the beginning, as the story is his own, told the way he wants to tell it, and yet I suggest that any new or would be writer just look at the first few line of any good fiction book to see how the author began to spin his tale. This is a good indication of how it should be done.

 

[oggbashan]

Writing, like masturbation is mostly a solitary occupation. And, like masturbation, writing is something anyone can do.

Writing well is another matter.

'The first word of the first line in any story is the most difficult.'

When I first read that I thought to myself, that's BS, and yet, I have lost count of the number of times have I sat there looking at a blank sheet of paper, or computer screen, the whole story laid out in my head, yet cannot think of that first word.

Many have said that you need a 'hook' to grab the reader in the first line and suggest you jump right into the action. Again, easier said than done. At what point do you start the 'action' is it the moment someone starts fucking someone else, or is it that first eye contact that send a delicate shiver up someone's back.

To me, if you are going to tell the whole story, not just a page full of the 'good bits' so to speak, the story has to have a beginning… well a beginning, middle and end, but as said, the 'hook at the start is the most important part. The difficulty I think, is deciding what that 'hook' is, keeping in mind the adage of starting the story with a 'bang'.

To me, there is a fine line between 'hook' and 'bang'. Many stories on here start with the 'bang' with no introduction at all. This leaves me wanting as there is no lead in, no character development, and nothing to engage my interest in what is happening.

I much prefer a hook rather than a bang, as it gives me time to engage me as a readers as well as a writer in the first few line, or at least the first paragraph, and hopefully, if my skill as a writer is sufficient I can induce the reader to carry on reading.

In the end, each writing must decide on the beginning, as the story is his own, told the way he wants to tell it, and yet I suggest that any new or would be writer just look at the first few line of any good fiction book to see how the author began to spin his tale. This is a good indication of how it should be done.

If you are going to write a post that long, please break it up. I have edited the quote to suggest how.

While long paragraphs can work in books, they don't work so well on a screen. If I found a story written like your post, I'd back click.

Unless I'd written it myself - see Breathless Stargazing.

 

[lazyhobo]

If you are going to write a post that long, please break it up. I have edited the quote to suggest how.

While long paragraphs can work in books, they don't work so well on a screen. If I found a story written like your post, I'd back click.

Unless I'd written it myself - see Breathless Stargazing.

If someone wants to be lazy and not break up his writing, that's his choice. This is not a story, nor is it for yours or anyone's entertainment. If you don't like the layout, just tl;dr it and move on.

 

[sr71plt]

I would think that if someone took the time to write a post, they'd like people to take the time to read it--and would appreciate knowing that a lot of folks aren't going to read a solid block of writing on the screen that can easily be broken up more.

 

[lazyhobo]

I would think that if someone took the time to write a post, they'd like people to take the time to read it--and would appreciate knowing that a lot of folks aren't going to read a solid block of writing on the screen that can easily be broken up more.

I agree with you here, But we can think this as much as we want, doesn't make it any more true. Just because Some / Most writers will do that, doesn't mean they all do. Lets be honest, a lot of people are lazy and as far as forum posts go, as long as its understandable not everyone puts in the extra effort to check it and make it more appealing to the eye.

 

[Dennis_St_John]

In future I will endeavor to conform to the iron bound rules of the forum of not posting anything longer than short concise sentences.

I for one do not want to cause anyone eye strain or information overload.

However I am a little curious, that after taking the time to read what I did post, the only response my thoughts on the subject of writing and plausibility evoked was a criticism of the way it was posted.

I had assumed, maybe wrongly, that this forum was a learning tool, where writers and would-be writers could learn more about the craft of writing.

Being taken to task for failing to break up a long paragraph into sufficiently short bites appears to be more important than other writers thoughts about story content, structure and openings.

I profoundly apologies for failing to observe all the subtle nuances of forum posting and shall endeavor to follow the sacred rule more closely in the future.

 

[sr71plt]

Well, this is a bit of a snotty response. The likely reason that you didn't get comments on the content of what you posted is that, as Ogg was trying to point out, not too many folks read such dense paragraphing. A simple "thanks" to Ogg for helping you reach readers would have been better than an overboard response of paragraphing each sentence and being sarcastic (and a bit dense--and I'm not just referring to your text). But then maybe you just don't want people to read your posts. I certainly won't go back to read it.

 

[lazyhobo]

In future I will endeavor to conform to the iron bound rules of the forum of not posting anything longer than short concise sentences.

I for one do not want to cause anyone eye strain or information overload.

However I am a little curious, that after taking the time to read what I did post, the only response my thoughts on the subject of writing and plausibility evoked was a criticism of the way it was posted.

I had assumed, maybe wrongly, that this forum was a learning tool, where writers and would-be writers could learn more about the craft of writing.

Being taken to task for failing to break up a long paragraph into sufficiently short bites appears to be more important than other writers thoughts about story content, structure and openings.

I profoundly apologies for failing to observe all the subtle nuances of forum posting and shall endeavor to follow the sacred rule more closely in the future.

One line I always used to say was "Don't say sorry, just don't do it again."

Well, this is a bit of a snotty response. The likely reason that you didn't get comments on the content of what you posted is that, as Ogg was trying to point out, not too many folks read such dense paragraphing. A simple "thanks" to Ogg for helping you reach readers would have been better than an overboard response of paragraphing each sentence and being sarcastic (and a bit dense--and I'm not just referring to your text). But then maybe you just don't want people to read your posts. I certainly won't go back to read it.

*Shrugs* He could say thank you, but its not like he went back and edited it. He replied in what seems like as you said a snotty response where I'm struggling to find sincerity in the sarcastic way it came across to me.

 

[sr71plt]

Neither thanks nor sorry were really required. But belligerent scarcasm just wiped any semblance of good will here.

Maybe he'll go out the door and come back in without the chip on his shoulder and sarcasm on his lips. Then again, maybe not.

 

[_Lynn_]

In future I will endeavor to conform to the iron bound rules of the forum of not posting anything longer than short concise sentences.

I for one do not want to cause anyone eye strain or information overload.

However I am a little curious, that after taking the time to read what I did post, the only response my thoughts on the subject of writing and plausibility evoked was a criticism of the way it was posted.

I had assumed, maybe wrongly, that this forum was a learning tool, where writers and would-be writers could learn more about the craft of writing.

Being taken to task for failing to break up a long paragraph into sufficiently short bites appears to be more important than other writers thoughts about story content, structure and openings.

I profoundly apologies for failing to observe all the subtle nuances of forum posting and shall endeavor to follow the sacred rule more closely in the future.

Knowing the importance of breaking up a long paragraph is a helpful tool for a would-be writer. The information pertains to stories as well as forum posts. Readers often click out of a story that has walls of text.

 

[Dennis_St_John]

[…'Knowing the importance of breaking up a long paragraph is a helpful tool for a would-be writer. The information pertains to stories as well as forum posts. Readers often click out of a story that has walls of text.'…]

Mistress Lynn, thank you for your clarification on the point of long paragraphs. It is well taken and I agree. Had I know beforehand that posting my thoughts on the subject of writing the way I did would provoke such a reaction I would have avoided that mistake. laziness, as one reviewer pointed out, had nothing to do with it.

Maybe in one way, for a novice writer seeing the wrong way to do something is a better learning tool than just telling them. Case in point.

Having worked for a long time to try and perfect my writing skills, I still fall into obvious traps, usually after the fact as I did here. I will try to avoid that in the future.

As to my 'snotty' response, I believe it got the point across, that a simply, …you need to break up long paragraphs… and some commentary or other about the content of the posting would have sufficed.

Thank you again Mistress Lynn

 

[_Lynn_]

[…'Knowing the importance of breaking up a long paragraph is a helpful tool for a would-be writer. The information pertains to stories as well as forum posts. Readers often click out of a story that has walls of text.'…]

Mistress Lynn, thank you for your clarification on the point of long paragraphs. It is well taken and I agree. Had I know beforehand that posting my thoughts on the subject of writing the way I did would provoke such a reaction I would have avoided that mistake. laziness, as one reviewer pointed out, had nothing to do with it.

Maybe in one way, for a novice writer seeing the wrong way to do something is a better learning tool than just telling them. Case in point.

Having worked for a long time to try and perfect my writing skills, I still fall into obvious traps, usually after the fact as I did here. I will try to avoid that in the future.

As to my 'snotty' response, I believe it got the point across, that a simply, …you need to break up long paragraphs… and some commentary or other about the content of the posting would have sufficed.

Thank you again Mistress Lynn

No matter how much we learn, there's more to learn. Keep at it.

 

[oggbashan]

... and some commentary or other about the content of the posting would have sufficed.

...

The content?

You put your views on the subject of how you saw the first line of a story and what your preferences are. That didn't really call for a response from anyone else.

While I might agree with you that stories should have a beginning, a middle and an end, and that starting with something that encourages the reader to go further into the story is desirable, I can't agree that all stories need to follow your preferences.

My view is that anything goes as long as it works. There are examples in Literature of almost any structure for a story. Perhaps the most extreme is Lawrence Sterne's Tristram Shandy which has survived for generations without a beginning or an end.

Some thrillers and detective stories start with the end - the atrocity or murder and the plot works back to how that happened.

Some stories still work when the audience knows and expects what will happen before the story starts e.g. the traditional Western when you know that the good guy will win the gunfight and the girl. That idea of foreknowledge goes back as far as classical Greek tragedy. The audience knew how the story would end even before the play started.

To sum up: Your view of what you expect and would like in a story is your personal preference. That preference might be the norm, but many stories do not fit that form and can still work well.

 

[Dennis_St_John]

[…My view is that anything goes as long as it works. There are examples in Literature of almost any structure for a story. Perhaps the most extreme is Lawrence Sterne's Tristram Shandy which has survived for generations without a beginning or an end…]

A very good point oggbashan, and for the exceptional writer this could work. James Joyce 'Ulysses' being another example of out of the box writing. Any writing owns his own work and can write it any way he or she pleases, but would you recommend a novice writer to go that way? Any work has to be readable, in that like you say, a reader has certain expectation on what to expect from a story, even erotica.

From my perspective it's always about the story, or plot. What story are you trying to tell and is it interesting enough for me to read. If I pick up a book, such as JJ, Ulysses' and I can't make head or tail of the first, or maybe even the second page I don't bother reading any further. I'm sure there are many fine examples of what might be called 'experimental' writing that wow's the critics, but is it really readable?

Recently I was told that due to the current/modern writing criterion, some of the great works of fiction couldn't be published in today's market. Many think this is mainly due to the publishing industry as a whole. Here, (Literotic) however, we are not subject to what marketable story the publisher/editor is looking for, and therefore can experiment on different formats, yet in the end, the story has to make some sort of sense.

Even the circular 'Pulp Fiction' made a crazy sense in the end, yet at times, you felt the author had started the story in the middle. Even Gorge Lucas knew he'd started the 'Star Wars' sager in the wrong place and had to go back and write Chapter 1.

Story telling is always about ideas and spinning a tale that will engage the reader, and therein is the key element. No matter how you start, or the structure you use, can you spin your tale in such a way as to draw the reader in, engage them emotionally and make them feel like a silent participant? If you can, you have achieved your goal.

 

[sr71plt]

a simply, …you need to break up long paragraphs… and some commentary or other about the content of the posting would have sufficed.

That's pretty much what you were given. Ogg is one of the mildest-mannered posters on the forum.

 

[lazyhobo]

[…My view is that anything goes as long as it works. There are examples in Literature of almost any structure for a story. Perhaps the most extreme is Lawrence Sterne's Tristram Shandy which has survived for generations without a beginning or an end…]

A very good point oggbashan, and for the exceptional writer this could work. James Joyce 'Ulysses' being another example of out of the box writing. Any writing owns his own work and can write it any way he or she pleases, but would you recommend a novice writer to go that way? Any work has to be readable, in that like you say, a reader has certain expectation on what to expect from a story, even erotica.

From my perspective it's always about the story, or plot. What story are you trying to tell and is it interesting enough for me to read. If I pick up a book, such as JJ, Ulysses' and I can't make head or tail of the first, or maybe even the second page I don't bother reading any further. I'm sure there are many fine examples of what might be called 'experimental' writing that wow's the critics, but is it really readable?

Recently I was told that due to the current/modern writing criterion, some of the great works of fiction couldn't be published in today's market. Many think this is mainly due to the publishing industry as a whole. Here, (Literotic) however, we are not subject to what marketable story the publisher/editor is looking for, and therefore can experiment on different formats, yet in the end, the story has to make some sort of sense.

Even the circular 'Pulp Fiction' made a crazy sense in the end, yet at times, you felt the author had started the story in the middle. Even Gorge Lucas knew he'd started the 'Star Wars' sager in the wrong place and had to go back and write Chapter 1.

Story telling is always about ideas and spinning a tale that will engage the reader, and therein is the key element. No matter how you start, or the structure you use, can you spin your tale in such a way as to draw the reader in, engage them emotionally and make them feel like a silent participant? If you can, you have achieved your goal.

Or you could write about a single lit pages worth of hot and sexy words that people can jack off too!

 

[oggbashan]

Or you could write about a single lit pages worth of hot and sexy words that people can jack off too!

And that is a very popular way to write stories for Literotica.

Plot? Who needs a plot as long as there's mind-blowing sex?

Many high rated 'stories' on Literotica are not stories but sexual scenarios.

 

[LaRascasse]

And that is a very popular way to write stories for Literotica.

Plot? Who needs a plot as long as there's mind-blowing sex?

Many high rated 'stories' on Literotica are not stories but sexual scenarios.

Au contraire.

The best erotica is the one with real characters and a real plot. Walking pussies and thick penises only go so far. Beyond that you need a little something called "story" to keep the reader interested.

 

[lazyhobo]

Au contraire.

The best erotica is the one with real characters and a real plot. Walking pussies and thick penises only go so far. Beyond that you need a little something called "story" to keep the reader interested.

Untrue, there is no true "Best Erotica". How good an Erotic story is, is dependent on Who's reading it and How he's feeling it when he reads it.

IE. Me? I always need a detailed story to fully enjoy it. Someone else? they might agree, but if they want a quick jerk off, then a short walking pussies story is exactly what they are after.

 

[oggbashan]

Au contraire.

The best erotica is the one with real characters and a real plot. Walking pussies and thick penises only go so far. Beyond that you need a little something called "story" to keep the reader interested.

The highest rated stories and most voted statistics suggest that your preference isn't shared by the majority of readers.

There are enough to make well written stories with plots into contenders for high ratings, but the easy way to score is to write about walking pussies.

 

[lazyhobo]

Au contraire.

The best erotica is the one with real characters and a real plot. Walking pussies and thick penises only go so far. Beyond that you need a little something called "story" to keep the reader interested.

If we add in to the fact, that quite the number of authors that do story and plot based erotica, tend to try their best at making each chapter as stand alone as possible, even with the story between them, so people can read any and all for the jacking off purposes.

 

[sr71plt]

Untrue, there is no true "Best Erotica". How good an Erotic story is, is dependent on Who's reading it and How he's feeling it when he reads it.

Bingo.

That's why it's so irritating when people post here what others should/must either write or read for it to be "real/acceptable" erotica.