Poetry Bootcamp

[HomerPindar]

As it's been a few days since I've seen some activity here I was wondering, are folks hard at work on sonnets? Or are they ready for another form? Now, certainly this great idea for a thread has not reached it's end, so that can't possibly be the option here. Which is it, folks? Another form, or more time on sonnets, and if it be the later they by all means feel free to post some sonnets or drafts there of. I, for one, only bite upon request...



HomerPindar

 

[KillerMuffin]

Here's my stab at the sonnet. It looks more like a tragedy. *sighs*

Such an innocent refrain; so fervant and mild,
An expression of joy, of feelings warm and true.
The touch of a hand and the sweet breath of a child,
Betray the fearful need of "Daddy, I love you."
While the sun dances his way across a bright sky,
The insidious tension is frimly bridled.
She seeks to leash him; to contain his hidden side;
If she can just please him, his darkness won't be riled.
Dark still comes, heedless of her tightly clenched teeth.
His face is a mask; stark shadows in the low light.
A rough hand on soft skin, cries of no Daddy, please,
Her whimpers misunderstood through the endless night.
Years down the road, the forgotten fear is still new,
From the silenced child's cries, "Why? Daddy, I loved you."

 

[REDWAVE]

Family values

A powerful poem about a sexually abused child, KM. The one phrase which really strikes a false note, though (for me, at least), is "his darkness won't be riled." It sounds totally stilted and artificial, and I'm not even sure it makes sense. A person can be "riled," but how do you rile darkness? Fix that line, and you've got a winner.

 

[ShamelessFlirt]

Re: Family values

A powerful poem about a sexually abused child, KM. The one phrase which really strikes a false note, though (for me, at least), is "his darkness won't be riled." It sounds totally stilted and artificial, and I'm not even sure it makes sense. A person can be "riled," but how do you rile darkness? Fix that line, and you've got a winner.

How about she loves her daddy, and if she makes him happy, his darkness won't come out, or be riled (as in irritated). The prior line sets it up, "She seeks to leash him; to contain his hidden side; "

Makes sense to me Muff

 

[perks]

As it's been a few days since I've seen some activity here I was wondering, are folks hard at work on sonnets? Or are they ready for another form? Now, certainly this great idea for a thread has not reached it's end, so that can't possibly be the option here. Which is it, folks? Another form, or more time on sonnets, and if it be the later they by all means feel free to post some sonnets or drafts there of. I, for one, only bite upon request...



HomerPindar

not yet, not yet please.......I'm struggling.

perks

 

[KillerMuffin]

Thanks guys. I wrote this as a sonnet and sonnet = love in my fevered little sick mind. I wrote it at 4 in the morning the other day after a bad dream. I probably would have had a mash of lines rather than a structured poem if I hadn't learned about a sonnet so recently. I have to agree that the "darkness riled" line is weak. There was another one, the one with teeth, that I though was a little weak as well. I wished I could come up with something better, but darkness had the menace without the violence.

Perky baby, take your time! No deadlines. We'll wait for you.

 

[perks]

Perky baby, take your time! No deadlines. We'll wait for you.

thanks KM......how did you do it? I have like 5 lines and it's been painful. I hope it gets easier with practice. Do you think you'll write another?

Dark still comes, heedless of her tightly clenched teeth.
His face is a mask; stark shadows in the low light.
A rough hand on soft skin, cries of no Daddy, please,
Her whimpers misunderstood through the endless night.

there is such truth and poignancy in this section of your sonnet. It makes your poem. The imagery and the intensity are clear.

as for the structure?....which did you follow?

 

[KillerMuffin]

It's a 12 syllable line, though I think the meter sucks, if I'm using that word correctly. Anyway, I kinda went with my own, I think. abab caca dcdc bb

 

[perks]

It's a 12 syllable line, though I think the meter sucks, if I'm using that word correctly. Anyway, I kinda went with my own, I think. abab caca dcdc bb

lol....I think my eyes just crossed.
I'm doing 14 lines, 10 syllables each, I wasn't even doing the rhyme thing yet. Damnit, damnit.....I am going to work on it some more.<sobbing>

 

[JUDO]

Sign up sheet?

Saw the thread. Sounded like fun. (Afterall, I've always heard of sonnets and couplets, but never knew about their form before reading UP's post).

Why not? Gave it a whirl.

Five days pass and absolutely no comments on it.

So, since I always blame myself first, I figure one of the following must be present:

1) I came in the wrong door.
2) the work is hideous and everyone is trying to be polite.
3) My posts and I are invisible (Well...wouldn't be a first time for that.)


- Judo

PS - Muff, I saw the "darkness" as symbolic of his incestual lust. No prob.

 

[perks]

let's see, my guidelines were...14 lines, 10 syllables each line, seduce drill sergeant, with optional handsqueezing.


I search for thee amongst crafty poets
Lost in a maze of image verse and rhyme,
Orchid scents weave me past Summer haiku,
While butterflies flit by on quatrain wings
Teasing green couplets with structured rhythm.
And Lo! amidst a fountain of meter,
A spray of effervescent syllables
Drip together forming Greek choriamb.
My lips are wet with dactyl reflection;
I lick trimeter from my supple lips
Hungry for more of this hot Odyssey.
Thy words cloak my skin in sultry colors
Binding me with their strict rigidity,
Breathless, I cry for release, “Homer...Please!”

 

[Whispersecret]

Judo! I hear ya, and I will respond. No, your work doesn't suck. I meant to get to yours and forgot it was there. Will comment on Perky's too. But the bubble bath calls me.

In the words of the terminator, "I'll be back."

 

[ShamelessFlirt]

... I have to agree that the "darkness riled" line is weak. There was another one, the one with teeth, that I though was a little weak as well. I wished I could come up with something better, but darkness had the menace without the violence.

Are you saying it's weak because it's cliche or because you don't feel it projects the imagry you were going for?

I saw the darkness as a metaphor for daddys dark tendencies. Maybe a bit confusing when you say "dark still comes" in the next line but I thought I understood what you meant

I also thought that the "Dark still comes, heedless of her tightly clenched teeth. " conveyed her dismay that not only was night comming, but daddys dark tendencies too. A sense of helplessness, a childs belief that they can will something to go away.

But I wear glasses, and somethines see things. I'll go clean em and look again

 

[HomerPindar]

let's see, my guidelines were...14 lines, 10 syllables each line, seduce drill sergeant, with optional handsqueezing.

I search for thee amongst crafty poets
Lost in a maze of image verse and rhyme,
Orchid scents weave me past Summer haiku,
While butterflies flit by on quatrain wings
Teasing green couplets with structured rhythm.
And Lo! amidst a fountain of meter,
A spray of effervescent syllables
Drip together forming Greek choriamb.
My lips are wet with dactyl reflection;
I lick trimeter from my supple lips
Hungry for more of this hot Odyssey.
Thy words cloak my skin in sultry colors
Binding me with their strict rigidity,
Breathless, I cry for release, “Homer...Please!”

lol, welp, you have the fourteen lines and 10 syllables to a line. congrats, it's a sonnet

And, I dare say, a masterful combination of elements, location with poetic forms with classic greek references (way to flatter the drill sargent ) and as I was only suggesting content it's a very clever suggestion of seduction and all things erotic throughout...

Now, I've held the belief that familiarity with a particular form gives the reader a greater appreciation of said form. So, having written a sonnet, what's your opinion of the sonnet now?

HomerPindar

 

[HomerPindar]

Re: Fun, but difficult

Sorry Judo, it seems I did miss your posting earlier... oops.

Forbidden Window

On night's soft cape my feet glide near to fear
Cold shapes amidst warm light her drapes contain.
Apart the cloth its tale thrust bare so near
My stare becomes a want so close to pain.

Stone's press my breasts as quick my heart does peal
Against the sill as she my love disrobes.
A flick of nails and buttons flesh reveal
A swelling breast devine as finger probes.

A graceful neck extends to Heav'n below
As silk and stays do drift past bottom's pink.
My lust thirsts deep for nectar's peach does glow
But sees me not I fear but look a wink…

Her smile says more than words could ever bear.
I climb to kiss those lips so wet, so fair.

Alright, kudo's for keeping to the ten syllables per line, but, it's not something that worth stilting your line structure for. There's no law saying a sonnet has to have a set number of syllables for each line.. "Apart the cloth its tale thrust bare so near" is terribly awkward I'm afraid. Either rework the awkwardness out in the ten syllables, or ditch the syllable count per line and just go with the message you're trying to tell. Granted, such "loose" conventions won't win you the praise of Shakespearian fans, but then, those stiff shirts will miss out on some good erotica, so bugger 'em.

There are forms where the lines may seem un-readable, but I don't see such forms working with erotica much anyways. With that in mind, don't miss out on delivering the message in order to stick to a set of rules. The idea is to know what the form is, and to know how you are changing it or working within it, not to get stuck in it at the risk of loosing a reader.

Ok, point of fact, it's my idea to know the forms... I'm no more an arbiter of poetic rules than anyone else.

HomerPindar

 

[Ded Poet]

Hope

Here is my humble contribution.

I used the rhyme scheme Rilke used for many of his Sonnets to Orpheus:

ABAB,BCBC,DED,FEF.

I don't know what the technical term for it is...I must confess to feeling pretty awkward working within the sonnet form, but it was fun anyway.


Hope

Woke up today and drove to Willamette
To kiss a woman I have never seen.
As you'd suspect, I met her on the net
(She writes porn for an online magazine).

She sent me pictures, I sent poetry;
We'd meet in chatrooms for our cyber trysts.
My wife found out last month, so now I'm free-
I never dreamt that love would come to this.

The river rushes, laughing, through the hills,
The setting sun's devoured by the sea-
Anticipation's giving me the chills.

I should be worried, but I'm simply not;
I'm sure this was the address she gave me.
I wonder why it's just a vacant lot…

 

[KillerMuffin]

I'm wondering what we thought of the sonnet as a poem, in particular. I noticed that there was a lot of stilted Shakespearean style English involved. Words and phraseology that would be more comfortable in one of those style volumes of poems than in something you would see published by any one of us today.

Do we feel that we need to use more archaic woring for sonnets than for other poems?

Were we comfortable with the sonnet form or did the structure feel to difficult for us to use regularly?

When you began writing your sonnet, what kinds of expectations did you have for it to turn out? Do you think those expectations were caused by the associations with sonnets, like Shakespeare, or were the caused by a lack of familiarity with the form?

When you look back at what you've written, do you think you made it more difficult for yourself than it needed to be with things like language, rhyme, adherence to specific meter, or a stringent form that wasn't necessarily called for?

Lastly, look at the sonnets that have been posted here already and please write a brief thought about its form, its language, and its content and how it meshed or didn't mesh with your expectations of a sonnet.

 

[REDWAVE]

"The Greatest of all Deities"

Here's the one Shakespearean sonnet I've written.

ATHENA

Her pure blood boiling for infinity
Reclined on a divan, or at the beach
She saw through all the vast expanse of empty
The seraphs she sought just beyond her reach

I am bored with the common touch, she thought
I long for some primordial rough bliss
Some consummation that won't come to naught
Isomorphic to shuddering soul kiss

In languid nights that sought oblivion
My mind was suffused with a somber glow
The dirty beast that feeds on carrion
Grows secrets the blase will never know

Yet, though we hurtle stars and choke on dust
I'll cherish flesh until it fades to rust

 

[JUDO]

I.P.

Were we comfortable with the sonnet form or did the structure feel to difficult for us to use regularly?

No, I really didn't have any expectations, but I found an awkwardness. The Iambic Pentameter. Fours, Eights, even Sixes would be easier. Accenting on the upbeat (if this were music) didn't make it any easier. I found myself rejecting all kinds of words that have three syllables (one strong and two weak).

The meter and ten syllables seemed completely awkward in every way to me. It felt unnatural. That's not what it was, though. Whevenver I do something new, it feels the same way-unnatural.

The rhyme, no problem. The subject...words came...

Is there some drill or something someone could suggest to practice the 10 syllables? Perhaps just work on couplets first?


- Judo

PS - Thanks very much for including my sonnet in the discussion. I really appreciate it. I will return the favor soon. Unfortunately, my critique will be entirely from a modernist point-of-view, trying to play in the old form. Could be a lot of "felt weird" type of comments. But then again, when I step into a laytex skirt, it feels weird, too.

 

[perks]

Now, I've held the belief that familiarity with a particular form gives the reader a greater appreciation of said form. So, having written a sonnet, what's your opinion of the sonnet now?

HomerPindar

I had to do a LOT of research to write this poem. I'm not sure I grasp all the different forms of poetry. It seems to me the sonnet is an algebraic equasion made up of factors quite unknown to me. The struggle was a learning process. It caused me great stress, but in the end, I felt like a poet.

I would like to add some more elements to the equasion, but I need some direction.

Still nervous about sonnet writing. It's a beast, but I've never run from dragons.

help me some more please, Homer,

perks

 

[Whispersecret]

Only have time to comment on one...

Such an innocent refrain; so fervant and mild,
An expression of joy, of feelings warm and true.
The touch of a hand and the sweet breath of a child,
Betray the fearful need of "Daddy, I love you."
While the sun dances his way across a bright sky,
The insidious tension is frimly bridled.
She seeks to leash him; to contain his hidden side;
If she can just please him, his darkness won't be riled.
Dark still comes, heedless of her tightly clenched teeth.
His face is a mask; stark shadows in the low light.
A rough hand on soft skin, cries of no Daddy, please,
Her whimpers misunderstood through the endless night.
Years down the road, the forgotten fear is still new,
From the silenced child's cries, "Why? Daddy, I loved you."

I think it's fervent, but I'm too lazy to look it up.

I don't think of the sun as male, but that's just me.

Frimly? *clucks her tongue at Muff* I've read this at least three times and only just caught that.

I fully understood the reference to the dark being his lust.

Not sure why you chose to put "Daddy, I love you." in quotes, but not the second quotation.

How are her whimpers misunderstood?

The rhymes were reaching just a tad. I did it too, though. *Shrugs*

Very powerful and it makes me feel uncomfortable. Nice one, Muff.

 

[Whispersecret]

Re: Fun, but difficult

Judo's
Forbidden Window

On night's soft cape my feet glide near to fear
Cold shapes amidst warm light her drapes contain.
Apart the cloth its tale thrust bare so near
My stare becomes a want so close to pain.

I like "night's soft cape."

"Apart the cloth" -- does that mean "if you part the cloth, you get to see her nekkie?" Seems a little awkward.

Like that fourth line a lot.

Stone's press my breasts as quick my heart does peal
Against the sill as she my love disrobes.
A flick of nails and buttons flesh reveal
A swelling breast devine as finger probes.

I don't understand the first line at all.

I'd have enclosed "my love" with commas.

Flick of nails sounds kind of harsh to me for this soft poem.

It should be "divine," not "devine."

A graceful neck extends to Heav'n below
As silk and stays do drift past bottom's pink.
My lust thirsts deep for nectar's peach does glow
But sees me not I fear but look a wink…


I adore this stanza. So vivid. I suddenly see her as a maid from time past. Beautiful. I'd have punctuated the last line like this:

But sees me not. I fear but look a wink.

Her smile says more than words could ever bear.
I climb to kiss those lips so wet, so fair.

Ah, a bit of a surprise ending. Makes me wonder if she knew he was there all along. Lovely!

 

[Whispersecret]

Perky's sonnet:

I search for thee amongst crafty poets
Lost in a maze of image verse and rhyme,
Orchid scents weave me past Summer haiku,
While butterflies flit by on quatrain wings
Teasing green couplets with structured rhythm.
And Lo! amidst a fountain of meter,
A spray of effervescent syllables
Drip together forming Greek choriamb.
My lips are wet with dactyl reflection;
I lick trimeter from my supple lips
Hungry for more of this hot Odyssey.
Thy words cloak my skin in sultry colors
Binding me with their strict rigidity,
Breathless, I cry for release, “Homer...Please!”

As the punctuation police, it is my duty to point out that it should be "image, verse, and rhyme."

What is choriamb? An herb? I honestly don't know, and looking it up would require getting out of my seat.

I think this is a very nice combination of imagery and poetic terms. Yet, it also clearly seems to be some major ass-kissing! LOL, wink wink!

 

[HomerPindar]

I had to do a LOT of research to write this poem. I'm not sure I grasp all the different forms of poetry. It seems to me the sonnet is an algebraic equasion made up of factors quite unknown to me. The struggle was a learning process. It caused me great stress, but in the end, I felt like a poet.


Well, the end result was a bonus -- I'm single, I don't get to feel a poet when I'm done... lucky poet whoever it might be.

Alright, corny sense of humor is a bonus


I would like to add some more elements to the equasion, but I need some direction.


such as? Understand, you can write a perfectly good sonnet in fourteen lines. (again with that period) As with any form of writing, it is as complex as you would like to make it


Still nervous about sonnet writing. It's a beast, but I've never run from dragons.

help me some more please, Homer,

perks

Well, I'm hardly a dragon...oh, you mean the sonnet form.

What help can I offer so apt a student?

HomerPindar

 

[HomerPindar]

I think this is a very nice combination of imagery and poetic terms. Yet, it also clearly seems to be some major ass-kissing! LOL, wink wink!

Damn Straight! Kissing Ass gets you everywhere...

Well, ok, it makes me smile then.

HomerPindar