Role confusion- frustrated sub

[Kurokami]

I skimmed a bit so apologies if answered already, yadda yadda.


I'd like to jump in with a question of my own.

I see a lot of advice directed at new subs about what the fantasy in their heads is and how that's what reality isn't living up to.

How do I lower the expectations!? Years of extremely intense porn and stories have skewed my perception of what's happening to me. It's like being disappointed because romance novels have made your partner seem like a sniveling child and I understand that, but how do I turn that off, reset the standards?

Try remembering your first time having sex at all, compared to the fantasy built up in your head. Things go better in the mind than they do in reality; I know I had this strange sort of fantasy about what sex would be like before I had it- and then again when I first fucked a guy- but the reality... yeah, it's awkward the first few times, and messy, and doesn't measure up at all to the sex you think everyone else is having. But it is real, and thus subject to improvement.

Like everything else, D/s begins as a series of compromises and adjustments, both with your own mind and the other person/s in the relationship. That can be jarring at first, but over time it gets easier to see that different doesn't mean inferior; your new partner can surprise you if you let him or her. It's not about resetting your standards so much as it is about accepting the idea that things might be different from them.

Don't be disappointed that your partner isn't absolutely perfectly matching the template in your head; instead, try to find the things they do that aren't in your fantasy, but are still enjoyable. And besides, that really intense porn will never surprise you with an interesting motion of the tongue, or a sudden deep thrust from behind, now will it?

 

[eastern sun]

I see a lot of advice directed at new subs about what the fantasy in their heads is and how that's what reality isn't living up to.

How do I lower the expectations!? Years of extremely intense porn and stories have skewed my perception of what's happening to me. It's like being disappointed because romance novels have made your partner seem like a sniveling child and I understand that, but how do I turn that off, reset the standards?

I think this is the dilemma of the species, and not just around sex. We, humans, are able to create abstract images. We use them to both understand what's happening to us, and to guide our actions. Without that ability, we simply wouldn't be human.

But . . . then we get miserable when reality doesn't match the abstract image. Doesn't measure up. We think something is wrong with reality.

But what if nothing is actually wrong.

It's an incredible accomplishment to build a skyscraper off the blueprints. Think of how many challenges arose along the way!

In my opinion, building a satisfying lasting BDSM relationship isn't much easier than building a skyscraper. It's possible. People have proven that it can be done, but you have to put a lot of time and work into it. It takes more than one person over a long period of time to actually get off the ground.

That's one of the biggest differences between fantasy and reality. I can dream it all by myself. But I can't make it happen alone.

I also like Thich Nhat Hahn's advice on this matter (though pervert that I am I'm applying it in a different realm of human behavior than he does) - He advises us to think of these "ideals" we hold onto as a guiding star. We can use the North Star to guide us when we're lost, but we don't ever imagine we're actually going to reach it.

Recognize the reality that you're living in for the reality that it is. Take steps to move in the direction you want to move in. Move towards that star. (Remember - you could always be in one of those porn movies and experience what you're imagining that way. Is that what you want?)

Don't lose sight of the real stuff that needs to be done in order to build something. And if you're being hard on your partner, ask yourself how you measure up to the porn star in his/her head.

 

[Mistress_Sheli]

Is it possible that part of your "Dom"'s enjoyment comes from finding out how well you know yourself sexually, or by seeing what you will choose to do when you are granted permission to tell him what you want? Just a thought

 

[Daxaeha]

...Don't lose sight of the real stuff that needs to be done in order to build something. And if you're being hard on your partner, ask yourself how you measure up to the porn star in his/her head.

What if there is no porn star in his head?

 

[IrisAlthea]

What if there is no porn star in his head?

Rejoice.

I skimmed a bit so apologies if answered already, yadda yadda.


I'd like to jump in with a question of my own.

I see a lot of advice directed at new subs about what the fantasy in their heads is and how that's what reality isn't living up to.

How do I lower the expectations!? Years of extremely intense porn and stories have skewed my perception of what's happening to me. It's like being disappointed because romance novels have made your partner seem like a sniveling child and I understand that, but how do I turn that off, reset the standards?

I think you just have to keep reminding yourself that Prince/Princess Charming, who knows just what you need even when you yourself have no idea, is a myth. That does mean reminding yourself that there is no perfect partner to help you escape from the requirement as an adult to own your own shit, like CM put it.
Just like you have to keep reminding yourself that no time management system can give you more time, no skin care system will stop time and so on.

If you meant to ask how to just do that painlessly once and for all - sorry, I have no idea.

 

[pussysub]

I'm with subwannabe... I think it's a bad fit... and I'm a little surprised at everyone lining up and telling you how to convince yourself yr dom is right for you.

 

[Netzach]

I've had two kinds of great sex in my life, and often both kinds with the same person.

In one you have this great moment of communication and wow oneness omg.

In another you flail on one another's bodies and meet your narcissistic fantasy needs in your own head.

And I think the latter is more common, and less accepted as important.

Hogwash. I think it's totally valid, totally fun, and I wouldn't want to live in a world without it. It's that kind of sex that teaches me about myself, that pushes me to learn things, face things in my own emotional terrain, and ultimately I think I value it as much as the connections I've made to other people. What if I've misinterpreted every single meaningful look and gesture any of my most cherished lovers have ever given me? Does that really matter in the end, or is it what I thought it was?

But I'm pretty entrenched on the introvert scale.

If you're not able to play out the game you need with this person, because you want to play baseball and he likes checkers, I don't think the answer is "more submission!"

Maybe if you have a TON invested, and even then, that never REALLY works indefinitely in my observation. Find someone playing baseball.

 

[Daxaeha]

...Maybe if you have a TON invested, and even then, that never REALLY works indefinitely in my observation. Find someone playing baseball.

From my own experience, I back this up.

 

[IrisAlthea]

I'm with subwannabe... I think it's a bad fit... and I'm a little surprised at everyone lining up and telling you how to convince yourself yr dom is right for you.

I don't think that's what most people are saying. It's more about the fact that even if OP's partner doesn't behave the way she expected, he might still be dominant and that the probably need to discuss their wants and needs a bit more before even deciding if they are compatible.

 

[eastern sun]

I've been assuming that anyone who wants their partner to change is either involved in or considering a long-term relationship.

Why would you want someone to change their behavior if you aren't hoping to stick with them?

 

[Netzach]

Why is it so wrong to want to have your buttons pushed? Why are you not a real submissive if you're not willing to submit to the same dissatisfaction that I feel as a dominant person in a relationship that's more vanilla than I know will make me fulfilled?

I see this thrown out all the time, then you're really NOT submissive if you can't sublimate all your fantasies into whatever pleases your partner 24/7 and I don't define submissives that way, personally. I don't think I have such harsh boundaries on sexual bottom / submissive continuum.

 

[the captians wench]

Why is it so wrong to want to have your buttons pushed? Why are you not a real submissive if you're not willing to submit to the same dissatisfaction that I feel as a dominant person in a relationship that's more vanilla than I know will make me fulfilled?

I see this thrown out all the time, then you're really NOT submissive if you can't sublimate all your fantasies into whatever pleases your partner 24/7 and I don't define submissives that way, personally. I don't think I have such harsh boundaries on sexual bottom / submissive continuum.

This.

And this is exactly why 90% of my partners have asked me what floats my boat. Which has resulted in much more mind blowing sex than with those who know what they do and do only what they do.

 

[eastern sun]

Why is it so wrong to want to have your buttons pushed? Why are you not a real submissive if you're not willing to submit to the same dissatisfaction that I feel as a dominant person in a relationship that's more vanilla than I know will make me fulfilled?

I see this thrown out all the time, then you're really NOT submissive if you can't sublimate all your fantasies into whatever pleases your partner 24/7 and I don't define submissives that way, personally. I don't think I have such harsh boundaries on sexual bottom / submissive continuum.

I don't think the question is whether or not as "a submissive," you must learn to accept sexual frustration as a requirement of a relationship. If you're really frustrated, it might be a great idea to find another relationship.

I do know from my own experience though, that sexual frustration (as well as other forms of both physical and emotional discomfort) can be a significant element of a long-term M/s or D/s relationship. And it has actually helped me to hear that from other slaves in order to frame my experience in less negative terms.

 

[Netzach]

I don't think the question is whether or not as "a submissive," you must learn to accept sexual frustration as a requirement of a relationship. If you're really frustrated, it might be a great idea to find another relationship.

I do know from my own experience though, that sexual frustration (as well as other forms of both physical and emotional discomfort) can be a significant element of a long-term M/s or D/s relationship. And it has actually helped me to hear that from other slaves in order to frame my experience in less negative terms.

Well, yeah, I think a lot of people think they're going to live on Gor the minute their midlife divorce goes through or something, and that's obviously not helpful. Real life is considerably less sexualized than a lot of people might realize, and your partner's expectations may be imposed upon you in ways that are not supposed to be fun and games. But if you're not ever able to be sure if it's an intentional imposition or just one more level you have to compromise on, then I don't think it's necessarily submission to put up with it, versus compromise.

 

[kimuk]

I am very new to D/s and becoming confused. I have been with a Dom for 2 months, but feel as if I am driving the relationship. He always asks what I want. We have discussed limits, so WTF? When I ask what he wants, his reply is to give me pleasure and that he is doing what he wants. Tried to express that hello, I would like to be dominated, did not go well. We are supposed to discuss again this weekend. Any suggestions on how to approach this? Feel like I am continually topping from wished for bottom.U]

2 months is very early on in any "relationship". You'er still at the getting to know you stage. He's exploring. He needs you to be as honest and open as possible. Even examples help, telling him your fantasies, writing them down. He needs to know what you like, how you like it, what you want to explore. It's a bit like traveling to a destination. Enjoy the sights along the way and and arrive happy , trusting and content.

 

[Curious_in_Cali]

Or just maybe he has a more sadistic lean and is enjoying your frenzied frustrations? Being asked to do what you rail against and then watching the writhe while doing it anyways sometimes really does it for some. . This mental writhe sure seems to have captivated the OP. The combo of " I fucking hate this" and "I want more" is usually a tell that at least someone is enjoying the struggle, and when there is chemistry involved, often both do. Maybe consider that he is testing out a theory or that maybe he is paying closer attention to your responses and needs than you realize. Apathy is the opposite of passion, not frustration and tension. Just my 2 cents.

 

[xssve]

Additional information- he has been involved in D/S 15 years. I did check 2 references, but did not ask about this, more concerned with being hurt than not. His responses to me are various: he's not even sure I am submissive (ever wonder why???); his style of dominance is subtle; if I want someone to beat the hell out of me there plenty who will ( not what I want).

You might consider the liability issues here: technically, the difference between consensual BDSM and domestic abuse is a bit of a grey area in courts of law, he might still be vetting you.

Hard to say, but too either require explicit consent, or some patience while I try to figure out if you're a flake or not.

It's a judgment call, and levels of paranoia may differ from dom to dom, just as the outcome of the cases that do go to court vary widely from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, ranging from consent to sex at all implies blanket consent for whatever ensues, to life imprisonment for flashing your tits to a minor.

I think you're safe giving him something to demonstrate blanket consent, that cannot be argued to have been obtained under duress, since he's still liable for anything like permanent bodily damage, etc., which I don't believe you can legally consent to, other than specific instances, cosmetic procedures like piercing, or surgery, for which you normally sign a waiver, but the provider is still liable for malpractice if they fail to follow basic safety precautions.

I'm not big on slave contracts, but I think I'd feel a lot better with some kind of waiver.

I could be wrong, but how well do you actually know each other? It cuts both ways.

 

[eastern sun]

Well, yeah, I think a lot of people think they're going to live on Gor the minute their midlife divorce goes through or something, and that's obviously not helpful. Real life is considerably less sexualized than a lot of people might realize, and your partner's expectations may be imposed upon you in ways that are not supposed to be fun and games. But if you're not ever able to be sure if it's an intentional imposition or just one more level you have to compromise on, then I don't think it's necessarily submission to put up with it, versus compromise.

When I've got a tight hold on my own desires and agendas, submission feels a lot like compromise, especially when the sexual energy is absent.

Because I am a really self-centered individual, I have had to move through compromise - live in compromise - in order to discover submission.

Submission doesn't feel anything like compromise when the sexual energy is coursing through me. And it doesn't feel anything like compromise when I am already in a submissive mindset/posture/way of being.

But in the journey from a more dominant mindset to a submissive one, it sure feels like compromise to me. And sometimes a reluctant compromise that is necessary for the sake of a relationship I want to stay in.

 

[Netzach]

I still maintain that at 2 months in you should be blinded by fireworks and pixie dust and having a fanfuckingtastic time. You have plenty of time to navigate reality together later and see what's worth sticking. You should not be adjusting your rose tint THAT much. It's these early days of passionate intensity that will help you navigate that shitstorm later on. If you remember "wow, I really had to dial it down so he could keep up with me" in five years - well good luck.

 

[eastern sun]

I still maintain that at 2 months in you should be blinded by fireworks and pixie dust and having a fanfuckingtastic time. You have plenty of time to navigate reality together later and see what's worth sticking. You should not be adjusting your rose tint THAT much. It's these early days of passionate intensity that will help you navigate that shitstorm later on. If you remember "wow, I really had to dial it down so he could keep up with me" in five years - well good luck.

Yeah, you're right.

 

[KoPilot]

I don't think the question is whether or not as "a submissive," you must learn to accept sexual frustration as a requirement of a relationship. If you're really frustrated, it might be a great idea to find another relationship.

I do know from my own experience though, that sexual frustration (as well as other forms of both physical and emotional discomfort) can be a significant element of a long-term M/s or D/s relationship. And it has actually helped me to hear that from other slaves in order to frame my experience in less negative terms.

I'm learning that figuring out the relationship you have with frustration is really fucking important. Thanks for putting that into words for this derp.

 

[dicky911]

I am very new to D/s and becoming confused. I have been with a Dom for 2 months, but feel as if I am driving the relationship. He always asks what I want. We have discussed limits, so WTF? When I ask what he wants, his reply is to give me pleasure and that he is doing what he wants. Tried to express that hello, I would like to be dominated, did not go well. We are supposed to discuss again this weekend. Any suggestions on how to approach this? Feel like I am continually topping from wished for bottom.U]

he is not a dom - simple!

 

[SirLeather]

you are not being dom'd

Part of the experience of being submissive is obeying his command without question. Your pleasure comes from not knowing what will be asked of you. My former submissive had an understanding of the basic command structure but didn;t know from session to session what I would make her do. Sometimes it would be my pleasure to give her oral stimulation just because I wanted to experience her orgasm, Other times I would require her to pleasure me, and accept punishment for any lack of performance on her part. In any case I do not ask what she wants, knowing your lover is knowing what she wants at that particular moment.

 

[SirLeather]

you are not being dom'd

Part of the experience of being submissive is obeying his command without question. Your pleasure comes from not knowing what will be asked of you. My former submissive had an understanding of the basic command structure but didn;t know from session to session what I would make her do. Sometimes it would be my pleasure to give her oral stimulation just because I wanted to experience her orgasm, Other times I would require her to pleasure me, and accept punishment for any lack of performance on her part. In any case I did not ask what she wants, knowing your lover is knowing what she wants at that particular moment.

 

[SirLeather]

you are not being dom'd

Part of the experience of being submissive is obeying his command without question. Your pleasure comes from not knowing what will be asked of you. My former submissive had an understanding of the basic command structure but didn;t know from session to session what I would make her do. Sometimes it would be my pleasure to give her oral stimulation just because I wanted to experience her orgasm, Other times I would require her to pleasure me, and accept punishment for any lack of performance on her part. In any case I do not ask what she wants, knowing your lover is knowing what she wants at that particular moment.