Stupid (but sincere) Questions about the USA

[DeepGreenEyes]

Your vernacular is acceptable only so long as you never use "y'all" to address a singular person. It's a plural (or collective) pronoun, and addressing a single person with "y'all" is a hanging offense.

Amen.

Even Hollywood, and well-known authors sometimes make this error, and I am floored each time I encounter it. Have they no editors or proofreaders from south of the Mason-Dixon Line?? Or any reason, even? The word "y'all" arose because of a deficiency in the English language: the lack of a plural form of "you." That's it. Nothing more. Southerners don't substitute the word "y'all" for the word "you" in order to add character and charm to the world. It serves an actual linguistic purpose.

Y'all.

 

[BiBunny]

Amen.

Even Hollywood, and well-known authors sometimes make this error, and I am floored each time I encounter it. Have they no editors or proofreaders from south of the Mason-Dixon Line?? Or any reason, even? The word "y'all" arose because of a deficiency in the English language: the lack of a plural form of "you." That's it. Nothing more. Southerners don't substitute the word "y'all" for the word "you" in order to add character and charm to the world. It serves an actual linguistic purpose.

Y'all.

YES.

If you wouldn't use "you guys" in that particular place in a sentence, you shouldn't use "y'all" there, either, seeing as how they mean THE EXACT SAME FUCKING THING!!!!

Er, sorry. Pet peeve of mine. Now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

 

[Collar_N_Cuffs]

A common language does tend to unite people. In a country as large as the U.S. it's often considered bothersome to see people who don't speak English. Sure, we know it's not an easy language to learn, but if you want to live here, we also would prefer you try to blend in.

...

But, if you want to communicate with merchants, or the government or read some street signs, it helps to know at least enough English to get by. You don't have to be fluent in it, if you can at least be understood. And I think it's cool to talk to someone who only knows broken English and they intermix their native tongue with it. Not only does it show me they are trying, I think it's interesting talking to them. I find it fascinating to meet people who have left their homeland for whatever reason.

...

I've also worked with deaf people. That's another way to communicate. When I was in high school, we had a neighbor who was deaf. So, I was able to learn sign language. Later in life, I worked in one industry where there were strange terms used in the process and they could be confusing, because they had common words, but in an uncommon context.

There was a deaf guy working there and he was really confused at some of the phrases and terms. We ended up creating our own hand signs for some of those terms, to get past the barrier of the English language.

The benefit of that for me is he taught me pretty much every dirty word in sign language. Now I can cuss someone out and they don't even know it.

Remember the restaurant owner in Philly who wouldn't serve anyone that did not order in English? Talk about uniting (or dividing) people.. He was ultimately a hero or a devil, depending on who you talked to.

As to sign language, I think this is an excellent example of a people united by a language. I first grew enamored of it when I was at a show and saw two people speaking sign language across the room from each other. No matter the distance or how loud the band was, they could talk. I found that very cool. I later had a fringe friend who was deaf and was outright fascinated with what I learned about the deaf community, and a little bit shocked as well, truth be told. Definitely a group united by language, or at least the need to use an alt language form.

 

[Endless_Night]

Amen.

Even Hollywood, and well-known authors sometimes make this error, and I am floored each time I encounter it. Have they no editors or proofreaders from south of the Mason-Dixon Line?? Or any reason, even? The word "y'all" arose because of a deficiency in the English language: the lack of a plural form of "you." That's it. Nothing more. Southerners don't substitute the word "y'all" for the word "you" in order to add character and charm to the world. It serves an actual linguistic purpose.

Y'all.

YES.

If you wouldn't use "you guys" in that particular place in a sentence, you shouldn't use "y'all" there, either, seeing as how they mean THE EXACT SAME FUCKING THING!!!!

Er, sorry. Pet peeve of mine. Now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

Is this really a "thing"?

If so I can't believe I've never noticed....

 

[IrisAlthea]

In your father's case, weren't there any medical books in other languages he could read? Medicine isn't only taught in English speaking lands. Were they just the books he had access to?

Professional litterature is cheaper in larger editions. I remeber paying about four times as much for the short, grey little biochemistry text book in Swedish as I did for any of the books in english.
Besides, you will probably need to use English if you want to publish scientific papers yourself and reach a reasonably large audience.

 

[BiBunny]

Is this really a "thing"?

If so I can't believe I've never noticed....

Yeeeep. It's fucking obscene is what it is.

 

[seela]

Yeeeep. It's fucking obscene is what it is.

The y'all = singular and y'alls = plural always makes me chuckle.

From the linguistic point of view it's pretty interesting, though.

I completely understand that in the USA there's no real need to learn another language, if you never even leave the country (then again, how do you know you won't ever leave the country?). I mean from the personal perspective. You might never need it, so why learn it, right?

What's still puzzling to me is that your school system, which I guess then equals state or eventually federation, doesn't see learning foreign languages important. Sure, most of the rest of the world speaks English at least to some degree, so you can do business etc. no problem. But learning a language isn't only about language. It's also about culture and a new way of thinking. Certainly those things are important in business relations, too.

 

[damselfly_]

The y'all = singular and y'alls = plural always makes me chuckle.

From the linguistic point of view it's pretty interesting, though.

I completely understand that in the USA there's no real need to learn another language, if you never even leave the country (then again, how do you know you won't ever leave the country?). I mean from the personal perspective. You might never need it, so why learn it, right?

What's still puzzling to me is that your school system, which I guess then equals state or eventually federation, doesn't see learning foreign languages important. Sure, most of the rest of the world speaks English at least to some degree, so you can do business etc. no problem. But learning a language isn't only about language. It's also about culture and a new way of thinking. Certainly those things are important in business relations, too.

It's certainly not universal, but I was required to take about 6 years of a foreign language in school. I went to a public school (in the US, I understand it has a different meaning in parts of Europe), but I believe like so many other aspects of everything here, it's regional. I agree wholeheartedly with you on the importance of it.

 

[LWulf]

YES.

If you wouldn't use "you guys" in that particular place in a sentence, you shouldn't use "y'all" there, either, seeing as how they mean THE EXACT SAME FUCKING THING!!!!

Er, sorry. Pet peeve of mine. Now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

Actually that's the reason people from Brooklyn created the plural and singular version of "youse guys"...

*blink blink*

No, actually I guess it was just poor 'gramma'.

Hey, at least I know the difference between "a yankee" and a "damn yankee."
The yankee is someone from up north that travels south.
A damn yankee is one that travels south... and STAYS!

<-- damn yankee

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Is this really a "thing"?

If so I can't believe I've never noticed....

Oh, it's a thing.

The y'all = singular and y'alls = plural always makes me chuckle.

From the linguistic point of view it's pretty interesting, though.

This is where it gets slightly more complicated.

Breaking it down:

You (singular): Do you want to get some barbecue, Jim?
Your (singular possessive): What is your favorite barbecue place, Jim?
Y'all (plural): Hey Jake and McLuvin'! Do y'all want to get some barbecue with us?
Y'all's (plural possessive): Uh-oh, Jake and McLuvin'! Y'all's barbecue fell on the floor while you were fighting about grammar!

Actually that's the reason people from Brooklyn created the plural and singular version of "youse guys"...

*blink blink*

Really? I need to know more. "You guys" is clearly a plural form of you. But "youse guys" is also a plural, correct? And adding an apostrophe to either "you guys'" or "youse guys'" makes it plural possessive, right?

Hey Antonio and Matt: you guys' pizza is ready.
Hey Antonio and Matt: youse guys' pizza is ready.

Help me out here...

 

[Loverskitten]

I get "y'all" use it quite often. But explain, "all y'all" please.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

I get "y'all" use it quite often. But explain, "all y'all" please.

One way is to differentiate between a subset of a group and the entire group:

(Standing around in a large group): So Jake and McLuvin': y'all are going with me to get barbecue. Are all [of] y'all going with us?

 

[MeekMe]

I get "y'all" use it quite often. But explain, "all y'all" please.

Not really an explanation, but teachers where I live would say things like: "all y'all need to settle down!"

As in, all students, please calm down and pay attention to the lesson.

Education where I come from was not that awesome. Of course, while I was sitting quietly, other students were bragging about how they made a teacher quit. It was sad, she was really nice and was trying to do a good job. After a particularly bad day she sat at her desk and tried not to cry. The next day she announced she was leaving to go to a better school.

The classroom was full of kids so proud of themselves. A bunch of stuck up little assholes without any clue.

 

[Netzach]

This is more "english speaking" than just US really.
http://www.theguardian.com/education/2014/may/25/mockingbird-mice-and-men-axed-michael-gove-gcse

I read this article and having read The Canterville Ghost" to the kids just a week or so ago and chuckled at "We have really everything in common with America nowadays except, of course, language", it got me thinking.

How much does a common language really unite?
Do you think there is a need to seperate and protect when it comes to literary canon and other language issues?

I'm completely in the Stephen Fry camp on this one. The idea of a proper or pure language untainted by idioms is completely a fantasy, everything we're saying now is the result of centuries of malleability and change. Long live Ur Internets.

 

[Netzach]

Yeeeep. It's fucking obscene is what it is.

I've seen "youse" treated just as stupidly. As in "youse guys" used singular.

 

[Netzach]

Oh, it's a thing.



This is where it gets slightly more complicated.

Breaking it down:

You (singular): Do you want to get some barbecue, Jim?
Your (singular possessive): What is your favorite barbecue place, Jim?
Y'all (plural): Hey Jake and McLuvin'! Do y'all want to get some barbecue with us?
Y'all's (plural possessive): Uh-oh, Jake and McLuvin'! Y'all's barbecue fell on the floor while you were fighting about grammar!



Really? I need to know more. "You guys" is clearly a plural form of you. But "youse guys" is also a plural, correct? And adding an apostrophe to either "you guys'" or "youse guys'" makes it plural possessive, right?

Hey Antonio and Matt: you guys' pizza is ready.
Hey Antonio and Matt: youse guys' pizza is ready.

Help me out here...

Depends on the speaker. Youse is also just plural you at times. I'm telling youse. Are youse going out by Long Island City?

 

[LWulf]

Really? I need to know more.

Help me out here...

Okay, I'll help you out. When you quote someone, first make sure you get the whole quote, contextually of what they are saying.

Actually that's the reason people from Brooklyn created the plural and singular version of "youse guys"...

*blink blink*

No, actually I guess it was just poor 'gramma'.

Second, please don't practice speaking Brooklynese without a permit.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Depends on the speaker. Youse is also just plural you at times. I'm telling youse. Are youse going out by Long Island City?

Okay. So really analogous to y'all. And handily, when pronounced, sounds the same in both plural and plural possessive.

Okay, I'll help you out. When you quote someone, first make sure you get the whole quote, contextually of what they are saying.



Second, please don't practice speaking Brooklynese without a permit.

Please pardon my loutishness. This topic releases a chemical in my brain which paralyzes my humor-centers.

 

[LWulf]

Please pardon my loutishness. This topic releases a chemical in my brain which paralyzes my humor-centers.

"Loutishness"? Lookit you. Think you're tawking to onea them hoity toity types from Manhattan?


Not for nuthin, but ya need to relax.

 

[doowdniw]

Depends on the speaker. Youse is also just plural you at times. I'm telling youse. Are youse going out by Long Island City?

I believe the correct pronunciation would be "Longgisland City".

 

[IrisAlthea]

You (singular): Do you want to get some barbecue, Jim?
Your (singular possessive): What is your favorite barbecue place, Jim?
Y'all (plural): Hey Jake and McLuvin'! Do y'all want to get some barbecue with us?
Y'all's (plural possessive): Uh-oh, Jake and McLuvin'! Y'all's barbecue fell on the floor while you were fighting about grammar!

Hey Antonio and Matt: you guys' pizza is ready.
Hey Antonio and Matt: youse guys' pizza is ready.

Help me out here...

(Standing around in a large group): So Jake and McLuvin': y'all are going with me to get barbecue. Are all [of] y'all going with us?

Great thanks, now I'm hungry and I just ate.

I'm completely in the Stephen Fry camp on this one. The idea of a proper or pure language untainted by idioms is completely a fantasy, everything we're saying now is the result of centuries of malleability and change. Long live Ur Internets.

Stephen Fry, thank you!

I was talking to people about this, trying to mention Stephen Fry but not remembering the name.
I waved my arms a lot and said "you know, that guy" a lot, but kept getting blank stares.

 

[LWulf]

I believe the correct pronunciation would be "Longgisland City".

Actually that would be "Long Guyland City" but pronunciation of "Long Guyland" is more typical of people from Long Island and not Long Island City.

Long Island City is physically on Long Island, but it's actually part of Queens County and (along with Brooklyn) thus one of the five boroughs of NYC. Leaving Nassau and Suffolk counties as "Long Island."

You live IN New York, you live IN Brooklyn, but you live ON Long Island. One of the many peculiarities of the region.

 

[Sir_Winston54]

Actually that would be "Long Guyland City" but pronunciation of "Long Guyland" is more typical of people from Long Island and not Long Island City.

I thought it was "Lawn Guyland," or is that just by natives of Brooklyn?

 

[LWulf]

I never considered that but I guess it could be Lawn Guyland. I was trying to do some emphasis on "Long" but "Long-ugh" seemed to be over emphasizing it.

As to only how natives from Brooklyn say it, I want to knee jerk and say "no way," but it's a bit chicken or the egg. It also depends on what part of Brooklyn you are talking about. I came from East New York and we didn't say Long Island that way.

 

[Sir_Winston54]

It also depends on what part of Brooklyn you are talking about.

Bensonhurst. That's where my best friend of the last 38 years was raised.