The non-consent fantasy

[Netzach]

When we say "NC" do we always mean, really a female rape fantasy?

I enjoy other variants of the NC. NC to homosexual contact is a fave, both male and female, I like to give the straight folk that needed push.

NC to masochism, the person yelling no no no no to the cane or whip or whatever who really might as well be screaming yes, that's also a good turn on.

In fact there's something exceptionally pleasureable in overcoming any type of resistance. Getting a butch into stockings. Getting a femme to wear a dick below her skirt. Fucking with people's sense of self.

There are so many ways to do it

 

[bridgeburner]

Netzach,

If someone grabbed me with any seriousness while I was doing dishes he would be drinking Dawn.

Gawd I have the biggest crush on you! You always make me think or laugh --- often both at once.

Okay, enough gushing.

I don't believe that we are all only our biology nor that biology is some rigid structure of rules that allows for only certain kinds of behavior. I think the trends tend to break down the more sophisticated the animal in question.

Not all creatures long to reproduce, hell, not even all creatures long to fuck which truly boggles my mind. I don't put much stock in the idea of "unnatural", less common, certainly, but the idea of "unnatural" assumes that there is some biologically preordained absolute which is bunk.

Also, as far as pack hierarchy is concerned there are more than two roles and even among wolves they don't divide strictly along gender lines. Is the female of the species less likely to be automatically aggressive? Sure, but that's no reason to assume that a strange bitch won't bite you just for the hell of it.


-B

 

[bridgeburner]

When we say "NC" do we always mean, really a female rape fantasy?

Only from a self-interested point. That's what I like to read and fantasize about, but non-consent is a gender neutral term as I see it. It's a power fantasy --- either exerting or relenting to -- and all sexes exhibit them.

-B

 

[fawnie]

lol

god you're so fun to read sometimes!

funny too, i love the idea of being pushed out of my comfort zone!

nice thread, i'll have to give it some thought then add my 2 cents worth!

 

[Phoenix Stone]

Joe Wordsworth,

Most of my fantasies are like this as well. I don't imagine myself in the place of the woman, she doesn't really speak, she's mainly an object in my fantasies. It may be odder for me to fantasize this way than for you since I'm a chick, but it is what it is.

-B

So BB, twins separated at birth? Yeah, mine are mental movies. I'm not in 'em.

Though I've advanced to occasionally making the amorphous woman in them look something like me. I keep trying to fit this one somehow into my rl sex life in some way, ya see. (Now that I've decided not to let rl attacks make me feel bad about the fantasies -- any more than I let unfun but necessary gyno exams affect sex life.)

Odd thing though, when I've had the rare lucid dream, and decided to have sex during, I just jumped whomever was nearby, myself, rather than say, forcing them to force me. It was something like frottage to orgasm on convenience human, much like early pillow masturbation. Granted, I was in a hurry before dreamed changed or lucidity got forgotten, but still.... Makes me wonder....

(And male on male rape scenes in movies affect me like male on female. Don't know that I've ever seen a realistic female on male rape scene in a movie.)

Btw, I think my first reaction to rl being grabbed while doing dishes might well be an elbow to the midsection, and when taken by surprise, I now have the training to do damage, which makes this whole thing subby thing a little tricky.

 

[bridgeburner]

Phoenix,

I can occasionally put myself into my fantasies from the woman's POV but then it's really from a first person POV looking down watching myself being fucked. That's pretty rare, though, and generally it's only flashes. I'm far more likely to "see" things from the male's POV --- looking down at the female body, watching her get fucked or watching myself fuck her.

This is all pretty odd to me since I don't have any real lesbian leanings. I mean, sure there was that girl I made out with in college, but that's just part of the undergrad requirement, isn't it?

Odd thing though, when I've had the rare lucid dream, and decided to have sex during, I just jumped whomever was nearby, myself, rather than say, forcing them to force me.

I've never had a lucid sex dream but when I do have sex dreams they're usually nothing like my sexual fantasies. Sometimes there's no obvious sex at all.



-B

 

[Phoenix Stone]

Phoenix,

I can occasionally put myself into my fantasies from the woman's POV but then it's really from a first person POV looking down watching myself being fucked. That's pretty rare, though, and generally it's only flashes. I'm far more likely to "see" things from the male's POV --- looking down at the female body, watching her get fucked or watching myself fuck her.

Kinda hard to describe for me, but first it's like watching a movie, then when it gets to the good part, it's sorta POV the guy, I guess, and I usually get a voiceover of the guy describing what he's doing, yet, finally, it's sorta the getting myself into the feeling of being the act itself, rather than the players that finally gets me off.

This is all pretty odd to me since I don't have any real lesbian leanings. I mean, sure there was that girl I made out with in college, but that's just part of the undergrad requirement, isn't it?

Lol. I gave it my best shot once and let someone pick me up, but it wasn't doing anything for me, so I stopped things before they got very far. She was pretty cute and I was pretty drunk, so it should have worked, if it was gonna. (She didn't mind too much, as the guy we were both sleeping with was there to pick up the slack.)

I've never had a lucid sex dream but when I do have sex dreams they're usually nothing like my sexual fantasies. Sometimes there's no obvious sex at all.
-B

Have you had a lucid dream? I've found that the last few times I've been lucid in my sleep (not for a long time, unfortunately) that was just where my mind went. It hasn't been necessary to make it that obvious of sex to cum. More the intent that gets me going.

So how do your sex dreams differ from your fantasies? Mine seem to be almost the opposite. Wish I understood that. (Still, they're pretty cold-blooded and force related. Not romance.)

 

[bridgeburner]

Kinda hard to describe for me, but first it's like watching a movie, then when it gets to the good part, it's sorta POV the guy, I guess, and I usually get a voiceover of the guy describing what he's doing, yet, finally, it's sorta the getting myself into the feeling of being the act itself, rather than the players that finally gets me off.

Yes! I wish we could tape our fantasies and exchange them. I think we have a very similar library! I'm very into all the nasty things the aggressor says -- and it is more of a litany of what he's doing and how it's affecting her and how she'll feel it later etc. I'm also fond of gangs exchanging banter during the act as if she isn't able to speak or participate ---- I hesitate to say "as if she isn't there" or can't hear them since it's the whole point of her being there and hearing it but unable to stop it that makes the talking sexy.

Have you had a lucid dream?

Rarely, but every once in awhile I'm able to direct the action of the dream. Usually it's when I've had a particularly good dream that doesn't finish and I want some particular outcome. I've also tried to counter nightmares by going back into the dream and changing the way things happen. I'm not really very successful at either but I enjoy the attemts.

So how do your sex dreams differ from your fantasies? Mine seem to be almost the opposite. Wish I understood that. (Still, they're pretty cold-blooded and force related. Not romance.)

I've only ever had one sex dream that had much in common with my fantasies. Just one guy rather than a group and it wasn't really rape --- I wasn't comfortable about the sex but I wanted to be there. It left me feeling emotionally lousy because the guy was by turns dismissive and disdainful of me personally. I felt as shitty when I woke up as if someone real had treated me that way, but it was still sexy and I found myself wanting to go back and make him feel differently toward me. NOT productive! lol

Otherwise, it's usually me and some female but it's really detached. I had a nightmare sex dream once when I was very young. I wandered into the downstairs bathroom of this huge old farmhouse we used to live in. The radio was playing and the news said something about the Devil's wife being in town and there she was, naked sitting on the toilet. She was really talll and skinny with this shock of bright orange hair cut into a pouffy bob. She pulled me down and laid down on the bathroom rug and dug her chin into the hollow just under my collarbone and held me pinned there. Not moving. Not saying anything. There was no sound at all. It scared the crap out of me but I recall it being sexually arousing as well although I didn't climax.

Another time I was wandering around a deserted high-rise office building and there was some kind of monster running loose looking for me. I don't remember if the monster turned into a girl or if I just ran into her or what, but it changed from being a scary being chased dream to me laying her out in the hall and eating her out.

Much preferable to the time I dreamt I had sex with my brother. That was tres creepy. He started off as this other guy I knew but flashed through my brother and then a bus driver and some stranger.

Generally there's something totally mundane going on and then all of a sudden someone will expose his or her genitals and come for no apparent reason.


-B

 

[Phoenix Stone]

Yes! I wish we could tape our fantasies and exchange them. I think we have a very similar library! I'm very into all the nasty things the aggressor says -- and it is more of a litany of what he's doing and how it's affecting her and how she'll feel it later etc. I'm also fond of gangs exchanging banter during the act as if she isn't able to speak or participate ---- I hesitate to say "as if she isn't there" or can't hear them since it's the whole point of her being there and hearing it but unable to stop it that makes the talking sexy.



No Kidding! That sounds soooo like mine! There are quite a variety with small diffs but amount to the same thing. Some based on things I've read. Even period piece stories -- you know those stiff ballgowns that could be flipped over the head, or hidden under? Or modern street thugs and the girl in the fountain, whatever. Important part is the 'as if she isn't there' quality. Sometimes she is indignant, others resigned. Others completely seemingly oblivious, or pretending to be. Doesn't matter. It's more about their attitude really.

Rarely, but every once in awhile I'm able to direct the action of the dream. Usually it's when I've had a particularly good dream that doesn't finish and I want some particular outcome. I've also tried to counter nightmares by going back into the dream and changing the way things happen. I'm not really very successful at either but I enjoy the attemts.



Lucid dreams are how I stopped having nightmares. Used to be like going to war every night. They were all nightmares. Only woke up crying or trying to scream about once a week, though. Read a book on lucid dreaming and tried the techniques. What worked for me was repeating 'it's only a dream' over and over as I went to sleep. A few times I woke into a dream where I was saying this, wondered why, tested it, found it true and acted. Learned to go back and embrace dream monsters, or close my eyes and twirl to go to new dream place. Forget therapy. Lucid dreaming and good self-defense classes are worth 8 years of good therapy from a real pro any day.

I've only ever had one sex dream that had much in common with my fantasies. Just one guy rather than a group and it wasn't really rape --- I wasn't comfortable about the sex but I wanted to be there. It left me feeling emotionally lousy because the guy was by turns dismissive and disdainful of me personally. I felt as shitty when I woke up as if someone real had treated me that way, but it was still sexy and I found myself wanting to go back and make him feel differently toward me. NOT productive! lol

So being in the fantasy woman's place didn't work well, sounds like? Or not as 'rl' anyway. Did you ever get to be the disdainful one with a guy?

Otherwise, it's usually me and some female but it's really detached. I had a nightmare sex dream once when I was very young. I wandered into the downstairs bathroom of this huge old farmhouse we used to live in. The radio was playing and the news said something about the Devil's wife being in town and there she was, naked sitting on the toilet. She was really talll and skinny with this shock of bright orange hair cut into a pouffy bob. She pulled me down and laid down on the bathroom rug and dug her chin into the hollow just under my collarbone and held me pinned there. Not moving. Not saying anything. There was no sound at all. It scared the crap out of me but I recall it being sexually arousing as well although I didn't climax.

Another time I was wandering around a deserted high-rise office building and there was some kind of monster running loose looking for me. I don't remember if the monster turned into a girl or if I just ran into her or what, but it changed from being a scary being chased dream to me laying her out in the hall and eating her out.

Much preferable to the time I dreamt I had sex with my brother. That was tres creepy. He started off as this other guy I knew but flashed through my brother and then a bus driver and some stranger.

Generally there's something totally mundane going on and then all of a sudden someone will expose his or her genitals and come for no apparent reason.


-B

Pretty scary stuff. Are the nightmare sex dreams sexy? Or the flasher dreams? I don't count stuff with sex content unless it does something for me. Most disturbing for me was a sibling one, where i got mad at one of my sisters in a dream and jumped her, controlled her, did the mad frottage cum thing. Ick, ick ick. Definitely one of those, 'would only admit online and guess this counts me out of the running for presidency' things. Felt very apologetic to her when I woke. And mad at her for being such a wimp. Cumming seems to be an anger/domination/force thing for me both in my dreams and in my fantasies. Only I guess in my fantasies I remove myself one step, make the people anonymous, and its some guy doing the dirty work instead of me.

sigh. (still wish is was rainbows and waterfalls that made me cum.)

 

[bridgeburner]

Some based on things I've read. Even period piece stories -- you know those stiff ballgowns that could be flipped over the head, or hidden under? Or modern street thugs and the girl in the fountain, whatever. Important part is the 'as if she isn't there' quality. Sometimes she is indignant, others resigned. Others completely seemingly oblivious, or pretending to be. Doesn't matter. It's more about their attitude really.

I actually seek out the old 70's style romance novels that have good rape scenes in them. Pirates, war deserters, slave traders, raiders etc. The books in generally are lousy, but they've got some hot rape scenes. And I don't mean the hero-rapist scenes where the guy is all studly and handsome --- that's a ravishment fantasy. I'm talking about the ones where unwashed illiterate hillbillies make a whore out of the heroine.

God, I'm such a pervert.

So being in the fantasy woman's place didn't work well, sounds like? Or not as 'rl' anyway. Did you ever get to be the disdainful one with a guy?

Oh, no, it worked fine. I came like a freight train. I just woke up and felt emotionally beat to hell --- unloved, unloveable, pathetic, worthless and stupid. I had a dream hangover for days after that.

And it doesn't work for me in real life. I scrupulously (perhaps even obessively) try to avoid situations like that, but I've made some missteps. The only thing I've managed to salvage is a little pride ---- if you don't react or let on that you've been hurt then at least you aren't humiliated on top of everything else.

The drawback is that I have occasionally misjudged and hurt someone's feelings. I don't have fantasies about that --- I hate to hurt people's feelings -- my empathy is too great. The extent of my fantasies in that regard would be giving someone the cold shoulder who had treated me badly in the past. Which is kind of a sour grapes sort of thing, but I'll be immature and petty in my fantasy life if I feel like it. ;->

Are the nightmare sex dreams sexy? Or the flasher dreams?I don't count stuff with sex content unless it does something for me.

My nightmares aren't usually sexy. The two I mentioned are over the course of 30 years. There have been maybe a couple others that were scary and then sexy or some mingling of the two, but it's not common for me. Although, thinking about it my non-flasher sex dreams tend to be a little bit scary. If not outright then at least with a pervasive feeling of jeopardy or malice.

The flasher dreams aren't sexy at all, really. It's like all of a sudden I see somebody coming in dream-world and it's my own orgasm. I dunno, it's like an unexpecte cough or sneeze or something.

Cumming seems to be an anger/domination/force thing for me both in my dreams and in my fantasies. Only I guess in my fantasies I remove myself one step, make the people anonymous, and its some guy doing the dirty work instead of me.

I was talking with a friend about this not too long ago and her response was that I'm obviously a Top with latent lesbian tendencies. I told her that obviously she was talking out her ass. I'm not in the habit of lying to myself about what turns me on. I find women sexy as hell but I don't actually want to have sex with women (well, most women, anyway, I'd fuck Angelina Jolie in a New York minute). The whole Top/bottom thing for me is also pretty clear. I prefer to be the bottom. I will take the dominant role if it's clearly expected of me, but I resent it rather than reveling in it.

Perhaps I'm neither Top nor bottom. Maybe I'm just lazy and distant? ;->


-B

 

[bridgeburner]

sigh. (still wish is was rainbows and waterfalls that made me cum.)

Hell, I wish it was spam and morons that made me come. I'd be blissed out all day long.


-B

 

[Phoenix Stone]

Yes! I wish we could tape our fantasies and exchange them. I think we have a very similar library! I'm very into all the nasty things the aggressor says -- and it is more of a litany of what he's doing and how it's affecting her and how she'll feel it later etc. I'm also fond of gangs exchanging banter during the act as if she isn't able to speak or participate ---- I hesitate to say "as if she isn't there" or can't hear them since it's the whole point of her being there and hearing it but unable to stop it that makes the talking sexy.



No Kidding! That sounds soooo like mine! There are quite a variety with small diffs but amount to the same thing. Some based on things I've read. Even period piece stories -- you know those stiff ballgowns that could be flipped over the head, or hidden under? Or modern street thugs and the girl in the fountain, whatever. Important part is the 'as if she isn't there' quality. Sometimes she is indignant, others resigned. Others completely seemingly oblivious, or pretending to be. Doesn't matter. It's more about their attitude really.

Rarely, but every once in awhile I'm able to direct the action of the dream. Usually it's when I've had a particularly good dream that doesn't finish and I want some particular outcome. I've also tried to counter nightmares by going back into the dream and changing the way things happen. I'm not really very successful at either but I enjoy the attemts.



Lucid dreams are how I stopped having nightmares. Used to be like going to war every night. They were all nightmares. Only woke up crying or trying to scream about once a week, though. Read a book on lucid dreaming and tried the techniques. What worked for me was repeating 'it's only a dream' over and over as I went to sleep. A few times I woke into a dream where I was saying this, wondered why, tested it, found it true and acted. Learned to go back and embrace dream monsters, or close my eyes and twirl to go to new dream place. Forget therapy. Lucid dreaming and good self-defense classes are worth 8 years of good therapy from a real pro any day.

I've only ever had one sex dream that had much in common with my fantasies. Just one guy rather than a group and it wasn't really rape --- I wasn't comfortable about the sex but I wanted to be there. It left me feeling emotionally lousy because the guy was by turns dismissive and disdainful of me personally. I felt as shitty when I woke up as if someone real had treated me that way, but it was still sexy and I found myself wanting to go back and make him feel differently toward me. NOT productive! lol

So being in the fantasy woman's place didn't work well, sounds like? Or not as 'rl' anyway. Did you ever get to be the disdainful one with a guy?

Otherwise, it's usually me and some female but it's really detached. I had a nightmare sex dream once when I was very young. I wandered into the downstairs bathroom of this huge old farmhouse we used to live in. The radio was playing and the news said something about the Devil's wife being in town and there she was, naked sitting on the toilet. She was really talll and skinny with this shock of bright orange hair cut into a pouffy bob. She pulled me down and laid down on the bathroom rug and dug her chin into the hollow just under my collarbone and held me pinned there. Not moving. Not saying anything. There was no sound at all. It scared the crap out of me but I recall it being sexually arousing as well although I didn't climax.

Another time I was wandering around a deserted high-rise office building and there was some kind of monster running loose looking for me. I don't remember if the monster turned into a girl or if I just ran into her or what, but it changed from being a scary being chased dream to me laying her out in the hall and eating her out.

Much preferable to the time I dreamt I had sex with my brother. That was tres creepy. He started off as this other guy I knew but flashed through my brother and then a bus driver and some stranger.

Generally there's something totally mundane going on and then all of a sudden someone will expose his or her genitals and come for no apparent reason.


-B

Pretty scary stuff. Are the nightmare sex dreams sexy? Or the flasher dreams? I don't count stuff with sex content unless it does something for me. Most disturbing for me was a sibling one, where i got mad at one of my sisters in a dream and jumped her, controlled her, did the mad frottage cum thing. Ick, ick ick. Definitely one of those, 'would only admit online and guess this counts me out of the running for presidency' things. Felt very apologetic to her when I woke. And mad at her for being such a wimp. Cumming seems to be an anger/domination/force thing for me both in my dreams and in my fantasies. Only I guess in my fantasies I remove myself one step, make the people anonymous, and its some guy doing the dirty work instead of me.

sigh. (still wish is was rainbows and waterfalls that made me cum.)