M2VIIDS
Experienced
- Joined
- Apr 22, 2011
- Posts
- 50
"Social"/"Legal" - To Lustatopia
Please, feel free to tell me whether or not I'm wrong, but I would like to try to summarize what your biggest argument is. Gay Rights Advocates tend to seem too aggressive and emotional about their argument?
Well, I'd like to point out that many groups have fought rather valiantly for rights, but I must agree. Change is indeed a frightening thing to lots of people. Take the Scopes' Trial for example. Religion VS Science, and Religion won at first. But, it was obvious that due to that trial, the scientific community gained a LOT of support, as the punishment for "violating the most fundamental truth of the bible through the vanity and imagined filth of Darwin" was a mere $100 or so fine. Aggressively trying to work with this kind of thing is necessary, the other side NEEDS to understand that gay marriage is a important issue for them. As I like to say, you learn the most about a person just by pissing them off, when they don't think logically. It's important to be taken seriously.
I do, however, agree that anger and serious like the gay-right's communities' is rather frightening. What kinds of things will they do next? How will this affect the procreational GOAL of marriage!? What if our nation's birth rate drops by 90%?!! We're DOOMED IF THEY CAN GET MARRIED!!!
I would like to talk to you all about things such as topics related to gay rights, and the effects of homophobia and gay rights. I would like to make the assumption that gay suicides also affect married men, and that there are a number of gay, married males who commit suicide due to self-image. This would leave two important repercussions. The first being that these suicidal homosexual males leave behind spouses who must take care of their children, and some of these spouses will suffer from the stress of raising their children on their own. This also means that we've lost a productive member of society, whereas that child could exist anyways with the "out-of-the-way" methods we can use today, and the woman wouldn't have been stressed. Implications of this scenario include things such as a child being exposed to prostitution at an early age, inability to connect with the opposite gender because they don't have a parent of that gender throughout their early life, and because they'll feel isolated from "in-law" parents. This will affect their psychology throughout the rest of their lives.
I would feel extremely content if someone were to go and find out what the effects of my presented scenario on the spouse and the child left behind would be.
According to a Letter from the General Accounting Office to Rep. Henry J Hyde(the resource for the following resource: http://www.religioustolerance.org/mar_bene.htm), approximately 1,400 rights are provided to married couples, including "status as next-of-kin for hospital visits and medical decisions where one partner is too ill to be competent", "immigration and residency for partners from other countries", "inheritance automatically in the absence of a will", "benefits such as annuities, pension plans, Social Security, and Medicare", "bereavement or sick leave to care for a partner or child", "decision-making power with respect to whether a deceased partner will be cremated or not and where to bury him or her", and many, many more. Now, if you were denied those kinds of legal rights, would that not be stressful?
Another resource I found in my free time(http://www.narth.com/docs/gayteens.html), referred to a study done by researchers Remafedi, Farrow, and Deisher, where they "compared gay and bisexual adolescents who had attempted suicide, to a group of those who had not. The two groups totalled 137 males, aged 14 to 21. Of that number, 41 (30%) had made at least one suicide attempt". Other findings in this research experiment were as follows:
""Self-identified gay teenagers are at greater risk than straight teenagers to attempt suicide. Gay activists say this problem is due to social homophobia, and that it will be remedied when society puts its stamp of approval on homosexuality.
Activists have grossly exaggerated the number of gay teenagers who have actually died by suicide (1). Nevertheless there is substantial evidence that such teenagers are at greater risk to attempt suicide, and thus it is important to examine the possible contributing factors
From this study we see that gay teens that attempt suicide tend to be involved to an alarming degree in drug use, early sexual activity, and prostitution--activities which also predominate in the histories of straight teens who attempt suicide.
The researchers say that suicide attempts appear to be related to "'coming out' at a younger age, gender atypicality, low self-esteem, substance abuse, running away, involvement in prostitution, and other psychosocial morbidities." In 44% of cases, subjects attributed the suicide attempts to "'family problems,' including conflict with family members and parents' marital discord, divorce, or alcoholism."
In fact, psychology has long known that homosexuality is associated with dysfunctional family structures. Statistically, gay men tend to report poor childhood relationships with their fathers, while lesbian women tend to report poor childhood relationships with their mothers (Bell, Weinberg and Hammersmith). Thus "society's oppression" seems a simplistic and misleading explanation for suicidal ideation in gay teenagers.
Among the Remafedi study's findings:
Early Self-Identification as Gay: Subjects who had viewed themselves as homosexual or bisexual at an earlier age were more likely to attempt suicide.
Early Sexual Activity: Teens who had attempted suicide were more likely to have had sexual experiences at an early age.
Broken Homes: Only 27% of suicide attempters had parents who were married (vs. 50% of the non-attempters).
Sexual Molestation: 61% of the suicide attempters had been sexually abused (vs. only 29% of the non-attempters).
Illegal Drug Use: 85% of the attempters had used illicit drugs (vs. 63% of non-attempters).
Illegal Activities: 51% of the attempters had been arrested (vs. only 28% of non-attempters).
Prostitution: 29% of the attempters had been involved in prostitution (vs. 17% of non-attempters).
Gender Conflicts: 36.6% of the attempters were classified as feminine (vs. 17.7% of non-attempters).
Effeminate Gay Males are Most at Risk
Homosexually-oriented adolescents classified as "feminine" are at the highest risk for suicide attempts, drug abuse, prostitution, arrest, and, by implication, the deadly health problems associated with unprotected anal sex. The earlier these teens self-identify as homosexual, and the more "out" they are, the greater the risk of negative lifestyle factors, according to the study.
Why is Treatment Not Recommended?
The tragedy is that there is a treatment for effeminate boys, starting at toddler age, who suffer from Gender Identity Disorder of Childhood -- that is, males who report the persistent wish to be a female. Boys who learn to be happy about being boys are far less likely to suffer the scapegoating and peer rejection that isolates them from contact with their own gender and thus prevents normal male bonding experiences.
Most prehomosexual boys are not explicitly effeminate, but nonetheless are experiencing gender-identity conflict, same-sex peer isolation, and a sense of alienation from their fathers. The same is true for girls who are suffering from gender-identity conflict. Treatment is available for these children, but instead psychotherapists often use the politically correct approach to "accept oneself as gay" rather than addressing the root problem of gender alienation.
Parents concerned about prehomosexuality in their children are often told by their pediatricians not to worry, that no treatment is available, and that the child is genetically destined to be homosexual--even though research scientists know that homosexuality is likely due to a combination of temperamental characteristics such as sensitivity or risk avoidance, environmental influences, and learned behavior patterns, and is not simply "inborn" and predetermined like eye color.
The Problem of Sexual Abuse
When an adolescent self-identifies as gay or bisexual, health-care professionals should ask, "Was this child sexually abused?" The Remafedi study reveals that 61% of self-identified gay teens who had attempted suicide had a history of sexual abuse. Sometimes a boy may not recognize an early sexual experience as abuse, but instead see it as confirmation that he is homosexual. Even adults may fail to see the incident as abuse when the abuser is another same-sexed child or adolescent. An experience of same-sex sex often establishes a lifelong sexual habit pattern in a child who is starved for same-sex attention, affection and affirmation.
The gay lobby has demanded that boys with GID be labeled as prehomosexual, and that schools and psychotherapists counsel their parents to accept the condition as normal, desirable, and unchangeable. Parents, however, have a right to know the truth, and to have access to treatment.
Today, schools issue dire warnings on the (comparatively miniscule) dangers of smoking, and tobacco companies have become liable in some cases for damages. Someday, perhaps, parents who have watched a son die of AIDS will decide to sue their pediatrician because when they brought the child for treatment for GID, they were told not to worry, or that nothing could be done. Perhaps the parents of another boy will bring suit against a school system which labeled the child as unchangeably homosexual and turned him over to a gay support group, where he contracted AIDS.
In both cases, proper diagnosis and treatment might have prevented a negative outcome.""
I put up all info from the website(directly or indirectly), for the sake of extra debate. I will brazenly show the flaws in my argument, as to be honest, while I support gay rights, I am not overly-adamant about the social issue. I instead am closer to being one of those who are undecided on the issue. I decided to bold some of the info, to bring important info on both sides(or at least try to). Thank you very much for reading. I hope to hear responses to this statistic, and hope to have provided information for both sides of the argument in my research article.
I sorta feel this is a good place to stop with my arguments, and I'd be wonderful to hear any arguments against my statements.
Please, feel free to tell me whether or not I'm wrong, but I would like to try to summarize what your biggest argument is. Gay Rights Advocates tend to seem too aggressive and emotional about their argument?
Well, I'd like to point out that many groups have fought rather valiantly for rights, but I must agree. Change is indeed a frightening thing to lots of people. Take the Scopes' Trial for example. Religion VS Science, and Religion won at first. But, it was obvious that due to that trial, the scientific community gained a LOT of support, as the punishment for "violating the most fundamental truth of the bible through the vanity and imagined filth of Darwin" was a mere $100 or so fine. Aggressively trying to work with this kind of thing is necessary, the other side NEEDS to understand that gay marriage is a important issue for them. As I like to say, you learn the most about a person just by pissing them off, when they don't think logically. It's important to be taken seriously.
I do, however, agree that anger and serious like the gay-right's communities' is rather frightening. What kinds of things will they do next? How will this affect the procreational GOAL of marriage!? What if our nation's birth rate drops by 90%?!! We're DOOMED IF THEY CAN GET MARRIED!!!
I would like to talk to you all about things such as topics related to gay rights, and the effects of homophobia and gay rights. I would like to make the assumption that gay suicides also affect married men, and that there are a number of gay, married males who commit suicide due to self-image. This would leave two important repercussions. The first being that these suicidal homosexual males leave behind spouses who must take care of their children, and some of these spouses will suffer from the stress of raising their children on their own. This also means that we've lost a productive member of society, whereas that child could exist anyways with the "out-of-the-way" methods we can use today, and the woman wouldn't have been stressed. Implications of this scenario include things such as a child being exposed to prostitution at an early age, inability to connect with the opposite gender because they don't have a parent of that gender throughout their early life, and because they'll feel isolated from "in-law" parents. This will affect their psychology throughout the rest of their lives.
I would feel extremely content if someone were to go and find out what the effects of my presented scenario on the spouse and the child left behind would be.
According to a Letter from the General Accounting Office to Rep. Henry J Hyde(the resource for the following resource: http://www.religioustolerance.org/mar_bene.htm), approximately 1,400 rights are provided to married couples, including "status as next-of-kin for hospital visits and medical decisions where one partner is too ill to be competent", "immigration and residency for partners from other countries", "inheritance automatically in the absence of a will", "benefits such as annuities, pension plans, Social Security, and Medicare", "bereavement or sick leave to care for a partner or child", "decision-making power with respect to whether a deceased partner will be cremated or not and where to bury him or her", and many, many more. Now, if you were denied those kinds of legal rights, would that not be stressful?
Another resource I found in my free time(http://www.narth.com/docs/gayteens.html), referred to a study done by researchers Remafedi, Farrow, and Deisher, where they "compared gay and bisexual adolescents who had attempted suicide, to a group of those who had not. The two groups totalled 137 males, aged 14 to 21. Of that number, 41 (30%) had made at least one suicide attempt". Other findings in this research experiment were as follows:
""Self-identified gay teenagers are at greater risk than straight teenagers to attempt suicide. Gay activists say this problem is due to social homophobia, and that it will be remedied when society puts its stamp of approval on homosexuality.
Activists have grossly exaggerated the number of gay teenagers who have actually died by suicide (1). Nevertheless there is substantial evidence that such teenagers are at greater risk to attempt suicide, and thus it is important to examine the possible contributing factors
From this study we see that gay teens that attempt suicide tend to be involved to an alarming degree in drug use, early sexual activity, and prostitution--activities which also predominate in the histories of straight teens who attempt suicide.
The researchers say that suicide attempts appear to be related to "'coming out' at a younger age, gender atypicality, low self-esteem, substance abuse, running away, involvement in prostitution, and other psychosocial morbidities." In 44% of cases, subjects attributed the suicide attempts to "'family problems,' including conflict with family members and parents' marital discord, divorce, or alcoholism."
In fact, psychology has long known that homosexuality is associated with dysfunctional family structures. Statistically, gay men tend to report poor childhood relationships with their fathers, while lesbian women tend to report poor childhood relationships with their mothers (Bell, Weinberg and Hammersmith). Thus "society's oppression" seems a simplistic and misleading explanation for suicidal ideation in gay teenagers.
Among the Remafedi study's findings:
Early Self-Identification as Gay: Subjects who had viewed themselves as homosexual or bisexual at an earlier age were more likely to attempt suicide.
Early Sexual Activity: Teens who had attempted suicide were more likely to have had sexual experiences at an early age.
Broken Homes: Only 27% of suicide attempters had parents who were married (vs. 50% of the non-attempters).
Sexual Molestation: 61% of the suicide attempters had been sexually abused (vs. only 29% of the non-attempters).
Illegal Drug Use: 85% of the attempters had used illicit drugs (vs. 63% of non-attempters).
Illegal Activities: 51% of the attempters had been arrested (vs. only 28% of non-attempters).
Prostitution: 29% of the attempters had been involved in prostitution (vs. 17% of non-attempters).
Gender Conflicts: 36.6% of the attempters were classified as feminine (vs. 17.7% of non-attempters).
Effeminate Gay Males are Most at Risk
Homosexually-oriented adolescents classified as "feminine" are at the highest risk for suicide attempts, drug abuse, prostitution, arrest, and, by implication, the deadly health problems associated with unprotected anal sex. The earlier these teens self-identify as homosexual, and the more "out" they are, the greater the risk of negative lifestyle factors, according to the study.
Why is Treatment Not Recommended?
The tragedy is that there is a treatment for effeminate boys, starting at toddler age, who suffer from Gender Identity Disorder of Childhood -- that is, males who report the persistent wish to be a female. Boys who learn to be happy about being boys are far less likely to suffer the scapegoating and peer rejection that isolates them from contact with their own gender and thus prevents normal male bonding experiences.
Most prehomosexual boys are not explicitly effeminate, but nonetheless are experiencing gender-identity conflict, same-sex peer isolation, and a sense of alienation from their fathers. The same is true for girls who are suffering from gender-identity conflict. Treatment is available for these children, but instead psychotherapists often use the politically correct approach to "accept oneself as gay" rather than addressing the root problem of gender alienation.
Parents concerned about prehomosexuality in their children are often told by their pediatricians not to worry, that no treatment is available, and that the child is genetically destined to be homosexual--even though research scientists know that homosexuality is likely due to a combination of temperamental characteristics such as sensitivity or risk avoidance, environmental influences, and learned behavior patterns, and is not simply "inborn" and predetermined like eye color.
The Problem of Sexual Abuse
When an adolescent self-identifies as gay or bisexual, health-care professionals should ask, "Was this child sexually abused?" The Remafedi study reveals that 61% of self-identified gay teens who had attempted suicide had a history of sexual abuse. Sometimes a boy may not recognize an early sexual experience as abuse, but instead see it as confirmation that he is homosexual. Even adults may fail to see the incident as abuse when the abuser is another same-sexed child or adolescent. An experience of same-sex sex often establishes a lifelong sexual habit pattern in a child who is starved for same-sex attention, affection and affirmation.
The gay lobby has demanded that boys with GID be labeled as prehomosexual, and that schools and psychotherapists counsel their parents to accept the condition as normal, desirable, and unchangeable. Parents, however, have a right to know the truth, and to have access to treatment.
Today, schools issue dire warnings on the (comparatively miniscule) dangers of smoking, and tobacco companies have become liable in some cases for damages. Someday, perhaps, parents who have watched a son die of AIDS will decide to sue their pediatrician because when they brought the child for treatment for GID, they were told not to worry, or that nothing could be done. Perhaps the parents of another boy will bring suit against a school system which labeled the child as unchangeably homosexual and turned him over to a gay support group, where he contracted AIDS.
In both cases, proper diagnosis and treatment might have prevented a negative outcome.""
I put up all info from the website(directly or indirectly), for the sake of extra debate. I will brazenly show the flaws in my argument, as to be honest, while I support gay rights, I am not overly-adamant about the social issue. I instead am closer to being one of those who are undecided on the issue. I decided to bold some of the info, to bring important info on both sides(or at least try to). Thank you very much for reading. I hope to hear responses to this statistic, and hope to have provided information for both sides of the argument in my research article.
I sorta feel this is a good place to stop with my arguments, and I'd be wonderful to hear any arguments against my statements.
