Are you Ever Tempted????

[tendril]

This, too, I believe has more to do with societal influences than genetics. Women (in general) are raised to believe that love and sex are one in the same, that you can't have one without the other, while men aren't. It is expected that "boys will be boys" who will sow their wild oats, while girls are taught to want the fairytale romance instead.

Oh yeah!

 

[fgold1]

yes

right now with the way hubby is treating me i could say yes to just about any man right ow, maybe even woman

hot damn I will be on the next plane lol

 

[lovechild27]

This is a cool thread....

For those of you against monogamy...I am gonna ask...were your parents divorced when you were younger? Did they fight alot? What really pushed you to move into this lifestyle?


I dont see what is wrong with a fantasy...but sex isnt worth ruining love, trust and a friendship that has been built up over time for a fling. (just my opinion)

I think swinging is an interesting thing...I cant really say its for me though...its sorta hard to wrap my head around...

I know someone said its against our nature to settle down. Well its also in our human nature to find one other person similar to us and settle down...if it wasnt I dont think marriage would of ever been the way to go in the first place. I think our behavior would of pushed us in another direction. Marriage is a very old union...practiced when there was no government or christianity...so who was pushing the cave men to be married? It also doesnt explain why men are more likely to get remarried than women after a divorce. If they wanted to sow their oats and go nuts...why put on the chain again?

 

[James G 5]

This is what I wanted you to clarify. I interpreted the original statement as saying that women in general are more deceptive because they are genetically programmed that way.

I personally don't think genetics plays much role at all in this. I believe the main reason women tend to remain more closed mouthed about it is due to societal pressures. Even in this day and age a man, married or not, who has many partners is labeled a stud, while a woman who has the same proclivity to bed many men is still considered a slut. And if she's married, well, then she should be stoned to death--and in some countries, she is.

A good example of this continuing double standard is the recent controversy on Patricia's XTC thread at the Am Pics board. Someone posted a very harsh criticism of her for the lifestyle she leads, but outside of Lit this is the way the majority of society would see her. The critic, from what posts of his I did bother to read, however, only condemns her (and her husband for "allowing" her to behave the way she does). He doesn't say much about the dozens of men, some of them most likely married, that she is with in the photos he complains about.

Anyway, I know this is getting off the track of the original subject, but I just wanted to get my $.02 in.

You're 100% correct about societal tabbos & double standards, but I think the biology has a role as well
No, I don't think women are, in general, more deceptive than men

 

[James G 5]

This, too, I believe has more to do with societal influences than genetics. Women (in general) are raised to believe that love and sex are one in the same, that you can't have one without the other, while men aren't. It is expected that "boys will be boys" who will sow their wild oats, while girls are taught to want the fairytale romance instead.

Very true again, and that whole fairy tale/love=sex things is one of my issues with monogamy
I think the problem is more the thoughts & mores and patterns assosicated with it & used to reinforce it than monogamy ITSELF...live however you like. But when so much stuff is built up around something that it becomes an orthodoxy...well, it just leads to problems
The fairy tale ideal is about impossible to live up to
The love=sex concept leads to so much misery it's not even funny
Mebbe enough of us can raise our voices and get people to think about these things without simply being dismissed as "monogamy haters"

 

[James G 5]

Maybe it isn't genetics at all, it could just be that the stronger/more aggressive bonobos are a better fuck....

It would be interesting to hear the scientific community explain that study...LOL

Sorry James G 5, I couldn't resist.

Well, I'm pretty strong & aggresive, I'd be willing to...
ok, no, I'll derail this train of thought before it leaves the station

 

[James G 5]

You gotta admit, they got us through some lean times.

Ugh
Luckily I was drinking a lot back then and the memories are hazy
Ahh, the bad old days of me & the Evil Ex sharing a 3 bedroom appartment with 6 other adults

 

[James G 5]

right now with the way hubby is treating me i could say yes to just about any man right ow, maybe even woman

Sorry to hear it burrish
Contrary to what some people think I don't hate relationships monogamous or otherwise abd I hate to see anyone feeling this way
Take my word for it that the WORST thing you could do right now would be stepping out
Doing it out of revenge or anger or feeling hurt rarely does anything but make life worse
If you ever want to work things out with hubby you need to focus on that
Otherwise, if it's unbearable you need to leave and find someone (or someones) you can be happy with....note I didn't say "who can make you happy" 'cause that part's up to you, but don't be with someone who drags you down
Best of luck

 

[James G 5]

This is a cool thread....

For those of you against monogamy...I am gonna ask...were your parents divorced when you were younger? Did they fight alot? What really pushed you to move into this lifestyle?

I'm not against monogamy, I'm against the idea that it's the ONLY way or somehow intrinsically superior to non-monogamy

I dont see what is wrong with a fantasy...but sex isnt worth ruining love, trust and a friendship that has been built up over time for a fling. (just my opinion)

I agree, it's not...but you can have love, trust, and friendship without sexual exclusivity. One of the nice things about non-monogamy is that you can satisfy the occasional urge without there being a "fling" or an "affair" or "cheating"...what hurts the most about those things is the lies & deception. If your partner knows, that's not an issue. And for some of us poly folks, we're in group or multi partner relationships so the love, trust, and friendship is multiplied by a factor of several

I think swinging is an interesting thing...I cant really say its for me though...its sorta hard to wrap my head around...

Swinging is only ONE set of non-monogamy. There're all different ways of living non-monogamously, and not all of them work for everyone. It all depends on your inividual relationship(s) and agreements with your partner(s).

I know someone said its against our nature to settle down. Well its also in our human nature to find one other person similar to us and settle down...if it wasnt I dont think marriage would of ever been the way to go in the first place. I think our behavior would of pushed us in another direction. Marriage is a very old union...practiced when there was no government or christianity...so who was pushing the cave men to be married? It also doesnt explain why men are more likely to get remarried than women after a divorce. If they wanted to sow their oats and go nuts...why put on the chain again?

Cavemen didn't marry. Marriage, as an insitution was created largely as a method of passing inheritances and controlling property, of which women were often considered prt & parcel. Men would "buy" or "bargain" for wives as a way of obtaining their father's property. Even then monogamy wasn't common, at least not for the men. The idea of marriage as it exists today is relatively new in terms of human history. And it's not held to as tightly in most of Europe as it is in America. If you look at the history of sex & marriage in America over the last 200 years you will see where a lot of the severely strict ideas about it have come about because of the repressively Calvinistic ideas of sex prevalent in the US and (believe it or not!) as result of early feminist movements in the US thru the late 1800's in to the early 1900's where women strove to use societal programming to reinforce the ideal to protect themselves as the industrial revolution swept the US. "The History of Sex" has some great details on this.

 

[lovechild27]

I agree, it's not...but you can have love, trust, and friendship without sexual exclu

I guess its all how you view sex...it always struck me as odd that women are taught to think that sex is a one on one thing with only one man...while for men its ok to go nuts. How could any woman ever be in a relationship they deem 'good' if its alright for every man to sleep around? It seems like its just a plan to screw the chicks over big time...

I never really thought monogamy was superior...I mean if its not for you then it isnt. Most people do though...it is a sad thing.

Since your not against it...at what point did you realize that monogamy isnt the way to go for you?

 

[James G 5]

Re: I agree, it's not...but you can have love, trust, and friendship without sexual exclu

I guess its all how you view sex...it always struck me as odd that women are taught to think that sex is a one on one thing with only one man...while for men its ok to go nuts. How could any woman ever be in a relationship they deem 'good' if its alright for every man to sleep around? It seems like its just a plan to screw the chicks over big time...

I never really thought monogamy was superior...I mean if its not for you then it isnt. Most people do though...it is a sad thing.

Since your not against it...at what point did you realize that monogamy isnt the way to go for you?

I was in two serious supposedly mongamous LTR's where the women cheated LOL...so I'd say that was the women doing the screwing over. But I think ti should be a fair & equitable thing of both partners not having to be restricted...I said one of myproblems with monogamy was the mindset & ideas that come with it...it encourages a culture that, as you said, restricts women while winking at the affairs of men. That's not right.

I don't think I've EVER seen the point in monogamy, the idea's never made much sense. I've TRIED it and I can live that way but I'm not very happy doing so.

 

[lovechild27]

I don't think I've EVER seen the point in monogamy

well I can see why you wouldnt be into being a one woman man...I would probably adjust my ideas after that as well.


So in your relationship...do you date one woman and just have sex with others while she knows about it? How does one go about something like this?

 

[James G 5]

Re: I don't think I've EVER seen the point in monogamy

well I can see why you wouldnt be into being a one woman man...I would probably adjust my ideas after that as well.


So in your relationship...do you date one woman and just have sex with others while she knows about it? How does one go about something like this?

It wasn't due to the cheating...I didn't believe in monogamy prior to that
I knew both girls were interested in others & said it was OK as long as they were HONEST about what they were doing & were careful
But they both had this twisted sense of justice that said if they were with others OPENLY they'd feel obligated to allow me to do the same & they were both too possesive to do that
So instead they snuck around & lied to me about it...THAT was the problem, the lies & damage of trust

In my current serious relationship, I have a primary partner, PoutyKitten, and a few intimate friends who I see on occasion. None of them are local and I don't see them often. Pouty & I are in an LDR right now, if we were living together full time (which we hope to be soon) I would see others even less. We are both free to see others within certain paramaters (mainly, that we each be safe and don't take up time when we could be with each other to do so).

The way we got in to it was pretty simple...she's been in poly relationships before, knew I wasn't big on monogamy, and we negotiated this arrangement out. IDEALLY, we'd like to be living together one day with a full-time 3rd party, mebbe a nice submissive female we could torture & love If that were the case would any of us see others? Maybe, altho again the time thing would be an issue. We'd have to negotiate it.


It's all about boundaries, trust, communication, and respect, after all.
Oh yeah, and love, can't forget love

 

[warrior queen]

got to agree with James G 5 here -
sometimes open relationships work quite well.

mine being one of them.
my partner and i have been together for near on 12 years, and are in this for the duration.
both of us are free to play, but we are open and upfront about it.
as far as we're concerned, it's the 'lying' and 'hiding' of a fling that ruins a relationship.

i just ask permission first, as does he, and it's not a big deal.

 

[lovechild27]

And here I was thinking it was all wild naked orgies 24/7...lol.

Its nice to know that even though one thing didnt work for you you found soemthing that made you happy.

Dont you ever get jealous though..knowing your partner is with someone else?

But I guess if you view sex as just that...then whats to get jealous over?

 

[jeepman6]

To each their own....we all have the right to live life the way we please...unfortunately a lot of the time we wind up hurting somebody along the way in living our life the way we want. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[warrior queen]

To each their own....we all have the right to live life the way we please...unfortunately a lot of the time we wind up hurting somebody along the way in living our life the way we want. Just my 2 cents worth.

the only people who get hurt are those that are not completely open and honest, and as for hurting others - well, the same rule for being upfront applies....

i have never had anyone come back and be upset with me coz i hurt them - male or female - on the contrary, i have managed to remain friends with every person i ever slept with (except 1, and he doesn't count, the wanker!)

and i would not consider ever leaving my partner - we have too much love, respect and connection together to just throw it away on a fling.

but on the other hand, if he were to say 'that's enough' and want to become monogamous, then i would have to seriously consider his request.

 

[LeftyBob]

Hi....

I'm fairly new here....

I have been tempted...and I have crossed over the line. My wife is 10 years older than me...I'm 42. Over the years, our sex lives have not been in synch. When we lived together in the late 1980s, she had other lovers (I've only found this out recently). In the past five years, I have had a few one night stands and have gone to a "swing" club in NYC three or four times with a great lady I met in a local pub (she was impressed that I knew a little something about opera and rock n roll!).

Why did I do this? Many reasons. A few of which were that my wife has been on a lot of anti-depressants over the past 10 years, and has seen a bunch of shrinks. She fell in love with one, and another fell in love with her. She also did the "Wynona Ryder" thing. Twice. It's been a long grind. But I love her.

The swing club experience was fantastic.

My wife and I make love...not too often, but we do. And when we do, we fantasize about group sex, other women, etc. It turns both of us on incredibly.

But I can't, or won't, go from fantasy to reality with my wife. It is just too big of a jump. We love each other...she's my best friend....

I've met some really great people here on the Lit boards.

And before you pass judgement on me, please know that it is a long, complicated story. Just like your life, probably.

 

[lovechild27]

the only people who get hurt are those that are not completely open and honest, and as for hurting others - well, the same rule for being upfront applies

I think in your eyes it may be easy to see things that way...but I can very easily see where one could get hurt. If my guy came to me and said hey...im going to sleep with another woman...Im being honest and open...Id be devastated and very hurt. Maybe the people your with are of the same understanding of things as you are....and us who do have one person monogamous relationships are with people who do view things differently than you. Either way...some lifestyles work for some....others for others. Neither one is really wrong or right. Some people are just not into sleeping around...and its tough to understand how people can live their life that way.

 

[warrior queen]

I think in your eyes it may be easy to see things that way...but I can very easily see where one could get hurt. If my guy came to me and said hey...im going to sleep with another woman...Im being honest and open...Id be devastated and very hurt. Maybe the people your with are of the same understanding of things as you are....and us who do have one person monogamous relationships are with people who do view things differently than you. Either way...some lifestyles work for some....others for others. Neither one is really wrong or right. Some people are just not into sleeping around...and its tough to understand how people can live their life that way.

it's not like he or i just came home from work one day and said "hi honey, how was your day? oh, do you mind if i go off for a few hours and fuck someone else?"

the whole progression was over a very long period of time, and it turned out that we both felt the same things......
but it most definately was a long, slow process of discovery before we even got close to that point.
several years, in fact.

 

[tendril]

Originally posted by James G 5

I agree, it's not...but you can have love, trust, and friendship without sexual exclusivity. One of the nice things about non-monogamy is that you can satisfy the occasional urge without there being a "fling" or an "affair" or "cheating"...what hurts the most about those things is the lies & deception. If your partner knows, that's not an issue. And for some of us poly folks, we're in group or multi partner relationships so the love, trust, and friendship is multiplied by a factor of several

I think the above statement pretty much sums it up for me. If you and your partner(s) are agreed and have certain parameters for the relationship (s) to work within then why not?

 

[Wickid Cherry Pie]

Damn I've missed SO much by not visiting this thread over the last few days!
Well, what about this twist, some people do not stray to fulfill a sexual urge to be with someone else. They enjoy deceiving their partner more than the "fling" itself.
I think that some people cheat out of sexual disatisfaction, but a great deal cheat out of emotional disatisfaction. The thought that they are doing something to get a rise from their partner is the real turn on. Some people desire a jealousy fueled outburst to prove that their partner does indeed care about them.
At the root, I think that cheating is much deeper than just wanting to experience some "strange".
And who says monogamy isn't twisted?

 

[Noor]

Some people desire a jealousy fueled outburst to prove that their partner does indeed care about them.

I actually had someone accuse me of not really caring for him since I didn't care what else he was up to. Although I doubt very much think he would cheat to try and make someone jealous, to him jealousy is a sign of care.

 

[Lollygirl26]

LeftyBob..............

I think your wife is very lucky. She is lucky that you have stood by her. Stood by trough a lot. There are many men that would not have done so.

Lolly

 

[lovechild27]

it's not like he or i just came home from work one day and said "hi honey, how was your day? oh, do you mind if i go off for a few hours and fuck someone else?"

well ya I figured that. My point is, i think a lot of people would be very hurt by the idea of their partner having sex with someone else, especially if they hold sex in very high regard. For someone who sees monogamy as the only way, its hard to see how this would ever work out and be ok.

And not all monogamous relationships involve cheating. You do have people who are out to hurt their partner and dont care who they step on, but there is another whole catagory of people who are devoted through thick and thin to their partner and see sex as a perk in their relationship..not as something that rules all their decisions.