Asking for it

[thør]

The guy's attitude is a clear reflection about how he was raised. He was being a total asshole.

He was raise by an asshole.

 

[thør]

No means no.

That's it.

<end thread>

 

[stickygirl]

Yes, thanks Thor - I think this has gone as far as it can. It was never intended to be a discussion about rape, but advice. Thanks everyone, for your words

 

[IrezumiKiss]

Yes, thanks Thor - I think this has gone as far as it can. It was never intended to be a discussion about rape, but advice. Thanks everyone, for your words

It was a good spotlight on the toxic mentalities of those who low-key shill for rape and violence against women. Well made, Sticky.

 

[Lancecastor]

It was never intended to be a discussion about rape, but advice.

A Rape Advice thread would do well here.

 

[Noor]

Bullshit.

Women are the masters of non verbal and indirect communication.

They say "i want you to take me" in thousands of ways.

Or at least, actual women in real life do.

And you know this because you are a woman ?

In real life, I signal my turns and ask directly for what I want.
I do that in my cyber life as well.

 

[Noor]

Exactly.

Actual rape is very rare....faux after the fact nonconsent (buyers regret) is what most media and feminist orgs call "rape".

Wow! Am I the only person that reads your posts?

 

[adrina]

Wow! Am I the only person that reads your posts?

I ignored his post because you can't educate the unwilling.

 

[Noor]

I ignored his post because you can't educate the unwilling.

That is a nice way of putting it

 

[adrina]

That is a nice way of putting it

Probably too nice but even I have my diplomatic moments occasionally.

 

[stickygirl]

was my thinking

 

[IrezumiKiss]

Saw this in a recent Twitter discussion on this subject. Thought it apropos for the thread.

 

[AlotLikePsyche]

Zumi! I love that! ^

You make me smile.

 

[SexyLitForAll]

Zumi! I love that! ^

You make me smile.

Yup - even the most neanderthal of men should get that one...but then again, I doubt it.

 

[MstrTec]

There was a time, here in the US at least, where being disrespectful of a woman put a man at risk of a serious beat down. During this same time period, mistreating a woman (striking in any form all the way up to rape) was very likely to get the man a rope necktie (get him hung for those of you who aren't familiar with the necktie terminology). Women were respected and protected. I don't understand how we got away from this as a society.

Even with such rough reactive results, there were still those who perpetrated those hideous acts. It's sad that now the victim is blamed instead of how it was during the time mentioned above.

Why is adhering to the "Golden Rule" so hard to comprehend for people? That question there has baffled me my whole life because there's no set and clean answer. I hate it when that happens.

 

[Froya]

What time was that?

 

[MstrTec]

What time was that?

All through the building out of the American West. Sure, there were times it happened, but the results to the perpetrator were never anywhere as lenient as they are today and due to the likelihood of being caught (low population meant being easier to find no matter how hard one tried and stories would go from town to town & campfire to campfire with wild abandon), the threat of hanging was a very good deterrent against adverse behavior towards women.

Another interesting side fact of that time period, contrary to what "modern" literature and movies may portray, the crime rate was actually rather low. There were way too many natural(and un-natural in reference to the various warring Native American tribes picking off most anyone they came across) hazards that one didn't always have time to consider adverse behavior.

 

[f2k]

Speaking as a man, I don't think it's as clear cut as many in this thread makes it out to be.

Well...

Okay...

One thing is clear cut: rape is never okay! Let's just get that out of the way.

But look at it from a man's point of view. A woman walks into a bar, dressed to put all her assets on display... She flirts a bit with him... Dances with him for a while... Let him buy her a couple of drinks... Might even let him walk her home... And then give him the cold shoulder and send him packing...

Is it any wonder then, that he might get a bit upset? That he feels like he was taken advantage of?

Yes, you're allowed to dress however you want, but you should always be aware of what your clothing is saying. If your clothing says "look at how hot and sexy I am", then don't be surprised when men are trying to get you into bed. Every action has consequences, and when a women dresses to kill and flirts with a man she shouldn't be surprised when he wants to follow her home, thinking he just got lucky.

 

[Lancecastor]

Rape, shmape.

In criminal law, the defense of provocation can excuse or exculpitate.

Provocation may be a defense by excuse or exculpation alleging a sudden or temporary loss of control (a permanent loss of control is in the realm of insanity) as a response to another's provocative conduct sufficient to justify an acquittal, a mitigated sentence or a conviction for a lesser charge.

 

[MstrTec]

Rape, shmape.

In criminal law, the defense of provocation can excuse or exculpitate.

Personally, I don't give a tinker's damn what the law says about "being led on or exculpability by provocation".

Rape is Rape and should never occur. Legalese has no place in this discussion.

 

[DrDelirium]

Personally, I don't give a tinker's damn what the law says about "being led on or exculpability by provocation".

Rape is Rape and should never occur. Legalese has no place in this discussion.

The first thing a good official should do, Confucius believed, was to 'rectify names.' He felt that good government was impossible unless people meant the same things when they used the same words. One of the problems in discussing rape is that the word seems to mean different things to different people now. Saying things like 'Rape is rape,' does not clarify the situation at all. Legal standards for rape, while they vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, at least have the virtue of providing some baseline definition. Then people can proceed to discuss whether that definition ought to be more or less inclusive, or to what degree it is based on a useful social paradigm.

 

[Lancecastor]

Personally, I don't give a tinker's damn what the law says

Not surprising.

Say...will you be returning in the next Harry Potter movie?

 

[Beth87]

there's no such thing as provocation to rape. If you feel you can be provoked into rape via rejection or someone's attire, you really should seek help. There is no justification for rape.

 

[adrina]

there's no such thing as provocation to rape. If you feel you can be provoked into rape via rejection or someone's attire, you really should seek help. There is no justification for rape.

Agreed. Lack of self control - emotional and physical - on the part of the rapist. That's what it is about.

 

[stickygirl]

One of the problems in discussing rape is that the word seems to mean different things to different people now. Saying things like 'Rape is rape,' does not clarify the situation at all. Legal standards for rape, while they vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, at least have the virtue of providing some baseline definition.

Huh? I don't see how there can be confusion unless you've been stored in ice for the last few years
"The penetration, no matter how slight, of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another person, without the consent of the victim.” link

Maybe its the word consent that some folks have a problem with? Without consent it's rape. Of course proving the lack of consent between two adults has to be case by case, lawyer by lawyer and a stream of interesting and illuminating anecdotes will not progress this argument further.