Fireplay, Anyone?

[SweetErika]

The thread in the library talks about wax play a lot, and there are tons of new members, so i figured it wouldn't hurt to start a thread devoted to fireplay alone.

Love it? Hate it? A limit? Share your thoughts, knowledge and experiences, and maybe learn something new!



I just watched a bunch of fireplay and tasted it as a bottom tonight. I found it to be a thrill, very intense, and definitely something I want to do (once I've learned enough) and have done to me in the future.

 

[lil_slave_rose]

The thread in the library talks about wax play a lot, and there are tons of new members, so i figured it wouldn't hurt to start a thread devoted to fireplay alone.

Love it? Hate it? A limit? Share your thoughts, knowledge and experiences, and maybe learn something new!



I just watched a bunch of fireplay and tasted it as a bottom tonight. I found it to be a thrill, very intense, and definitely something I want to do (once I've learned enough) and have done to me in the future.

never done it, it is definantly a limit, though whether it's a 'hard' or 'soft' limit i'm not quite sure, lol i'm not sure if i have any hard limits anymore but it's not something i'm just dying to try, that's for sure, of course if Master wishes it to be so, it will be so, but i hope it's not in the near future lol...good thread SweetErika, i will continue to look in and am eager to see what others have to say

 

[liberatedslave]

May I ask what the fireplay involved exactly?

 

[MasterPhoenix]

I am definately curious about fireplay. Form the pictures I have seen, it looks hot (pun intended) but I am not sure how to go about it safely. I see a great potential for real harm in the form of second and third degree burns...

 

[the captians wench]

The first session one of my friends gave me after he'd been gone for a while involved fire play, tho I didn't know it would.

I was on my belly and he lit the candle and dripped some wax here and there. Then I felt a spot that gave a bit more of a hot sting than wax usually does, then another, and 5 in all. I'm not sure how to discribe the feeling. I really thought it was still wax until he bent over and blew them all out.

One spot did welt, not really a blister. But I really enjoyed it and would love to do it again.

To be honest tho, if i had known he was going to do that I would have objected and called red before he got with in ten feet of me. But I trust him enough that I know he always has my wellfare in mind. Infact before we started that night he gave me a rather interesting lecture on my safe words.

While he's teasing me with a knife, he tells me we're going to try some more intence things, and some new things so if I'm nervous I need to call yellow and if I become too uncomfortable I need to call red "because if you don't and you get hurt I'm going to be very VERY angry". *giggles*

 

[SweetErika]

never done it, it is definantly a limit, though whether it's a 'hard' or 'soft' limit i'm not quite sure, lol i'm not sure if i have any hard limits anymore but it's not something i'm just dying to try, that's for sure, of course if Master wishes it to be so, it will be so, but i hope it's not in the near future lol...good thread SweetErika, i will continue to look in and am eager to see what others have to say

Thanks for sharing, rose. Would you mind elaborating on why it's a limit? I'm just curious, and might be able to share something from my experience that may make you more comfortable in the event it comes up for you two, as I didn't think it'd be something I'd do either.

May I ask what the fireplay involved exactly?

Of course. I'll be clear that mine was a "tasting" - 10 0r so minutes of the Top doing techniques on my back that got increasingly more intense, and very little impact and super "showy" play. This was also an extremely experienced Top - he put on an Advanced Fireplay workshop before the party and teaches it around the country, so I felt as safe as I could in this situation.

I laid on the gurney, covered with a heavy natural-fiber tarp, and he started with a "massage" of sorts - lighting alcohol on his hand on fire, and rubbing it on me. That just felt like warm massage oil; I actually thought he was prepping my skin with something warm until he explained it. Then he used a wand in streaks across my back, rubbing behind it with his other hand as he went (to connect us and feel for hotter/cooler spots). He proceeded to put long streaks of alcohol on me and light them on fire with the wand, which looks cool and was a bit more intense.

Next, he tried some impact with a 3/4" dowel-wand/torch, which felt like being hit with hot polka dots, but the only part that hurt was being hit on the shoulderblades (I've a low pain tolerance, and my bones feel extra sensitive when pressed on/hit, like they're brusing), yet it was more uncomfortable than true pain. Finally, he arranged flash cotton in a design on my back after showing me a bit in my palm to ensure it was okay with me and I'd be ready for more. That was definitely a more concentrated heat, and while it still startled me a little when he lit it, it wasn't painful at all.

The first session one of my friends gave me after he'd been gone for a while involved fire play, tho I didn't know it would.

I was on my belly and he lit the candle and dripped some wax here and there. Then I felt a spot that gave a bit more of a hot sting than wax usually does, then another, and 5 in all. I'm not sure how to discribe the feeling. I really thought it was still wax until he bent over and blew them all out.

One spot did welt, not really a blister. But I really enjoyed it and would love to do it again.

To be honest tho, if i had known he was going to do that I would have objected and called red before he got with in ten feet of me. But I trust him enough that I know he always has my wellfare in mind. Infact before we started that night he gave me a rather interesting lecture on my safe words.

While he's teasing me with a knife, he tells me we're going to try some more intence things, and some new things so if I'm nervous I need to call yellow and if I become too uncomfortable I need to call red "because if you don't and you get hurt I'm going to be very VERY angry". *giggles*

Another couple was playing last night, and part of what made it so delicious for them and spectators was her squirming a little throughout. Before they started (with her face-up, mind you), he told her it was going to be even hotter and more intense than it was for her last time they played. I don't know if the play was actually more edgy/intense or not, but I'm sure she interpreted it as such after he planted that idea!

You bring up a good point from both sides though - is fireplay something that should be done as a surprise? I definitely see how it was advantageous in your case, but a big part of me says "NO!" I want my bottom to trust my skills enough to submit to being open to trying it (starting with me demonstrating on myself, and provided they don't have a traumatic association with fire). Plus, as it's definitely edgeplay, I feel I need consent to start, and would worry about them being harmed if it was a surprise.

I'm curious as to what others think, though.

And, from what I've learned, it sounds like your Top wasn't playing within the limits he knew to be safe. Accidents can happen, but he shouldn't have let it burn long enough to burn you. Have you talked about his level of education and experience with this, and found out if he's tried everything he can on himself many times first? Those are the things the very, very experienced players stressed over and over again.

 

[Honey_B]

Violet Wand Fireplay

My favorite way to do fireplay is with alcohol swabs and a violet wand. The swabs deliver just the right amount of alcohol (cotton balls can be a bit drippy). I swab on different patterns; wavy lines, hearts, etc - then I ignite the alcohol.

I like to do that with a violet wand. I've found it easier to control than using an open flame.

It's important to put the flames out before the alcohol has a chance to burn too long, after just a few seconds, otherwise, the skin get heated to an uncomfortable level.

 

[SweetErika]

I am definately curious about fireplay. Form the pictures I have seen, it looks hot (pun intended) but I am not sure how to go about it safely. I see a great potential for real harm in the form of second and third degree burns...

I feel the same - seeing how cautious the "experts" were last night gave me even more pause. I asked how they learned, and they said, "lots and lots and lots of reading, talking to really knowledgeable people, classes and experimenting on myself whenever possible" (clearly men can't feel what it's like on a woman's breasts, or do parts of themselves safely). I'm going to start digging up info online (maybe this will become a repository of sorts for useful info we find?), and then I'll find a good mentor at my club.

I'll no doubt start with heavier waxplay (hopefully I can arrange a tasting in the next few weeks), and keep fireplay confined to the club, since it's a much safer environment in general with lots of extra hands, fire extinguishers and first aid on hand whenever it's allowed. After I reach a certain level of knowledge, I'd feel safe experimenting on myself in our garage with Hubby w/ extinguisher standing by, but otherwise I'm not cool with the possibility of setting something in our home on fire.

I don't think 2nd and 3rd degree burns are a huge risk with someone who knows what they're doing and a safe environment, but it's definitely edgeplay all the same. I'm not much of a risktaker, and once I've put all of the safety measures in place, fireplay is something I won't hesitate to do. Like most everything, I'll start slowly and very cautiously, then work my way up gradually as I learn more. I mention this not to downplay the risk, but because I've managed to surprise myself - it's not something I'd really considered doing before last night! So, I think feeling it for myself at the hands of an exceedingly capable practitioner made a huge difference for me.

Anyway, I hope that helps some, and you have (had?) a safe journey to Rose's arms!

 

[Horus_rules]

I have been waxed before, it was like that first spray of a hot shower. The person doing it knew what she was doing and I did not get burned. She waxed my back and cleaned it off with a knife. It was very intense! I never did get to repay her or have her wax my front, but am waiting for a kinky partner to play with again.

Here is a link with some excellent guildlines for safe wax play: BDSM info: hot wax

 

[serijules]

Ma'am just recently learned this and tried it on me and I LOVE LOVE LOVE it. I love the mindfuck, I love the feeling, I love the pain when it lingers just a little too long. I love the danger of it. Very much high on my "reward" list. Wax is wonderful, but I have the mess involved (cuz I have to clean it up lol) so fireplay is awesome....all the feeling, none of the mess.

 

[BiBunny]

Scares me to death. I'd never do it with anyone other than Master and only then because I don't have "limits" with him. I posted a little about it over in rose's "Subs Screwing Up" thread, but I'll elaborate a bit more here.

I had several traumatic experiences with fire when I was young. I was never burned or anything, but when you're terrified by something at 5 or 6 years old, it's likely to stick with you. I was very upfront about it with Master before we even met. I never say that I'll "never" do anything, but I did tell him that I'd never do it without a huge amount of trust and understanding. Even after we met and were playing together on a regular basis, he assured me that I was still entitled to my limits (I had a couple of others then--I don't have those anymore). The subject never seriously came up until after I was collared.

He has pushed through all my other limits with patience and tact, so even if we'd never talked about it, it'd be safe to assume that he'll eventually do the same with fireplay. We have talked about it, though, and he's told me that we'll do it one day. I'm still petrified by it and have no idea how I'd react when faced with it. I'd try to do it, to please him, but...I don't know what fear will make me do. He knows this, too. The idea is becoming somewhat more palatable, but I doubt it'll ever be something I'm excited over.

 

[Soumis]

I definitely enjoy fireplay. Most of my experience is with wands, those spiffy kevlar oven mitts, flash cotton, and devil's fire. Devil's fire is by far my favorite and quite possibly the quickest way to a high I've ever tried. The heat is so intense and so concentrated, love it.

Much of what I love about fireplay comes from the extra sensory bonus, so to speak. Being able to hear the whoosh of air from flash cotton or the pop of devil's fire just make it better.

The only thing I'm not a fan of that can loosely be roped in with fire play is cupping. My objections to cupping are aesthetic, not physical though.

 

[the captians wench]

You bring up a good point from both sides though - is fireplay something that should be done as a surprise? I definitely see how it was advantageous in your case, but a big part of me says "NO!" I want my bottom to trust my skills enough to submit to being open to trying it (starting with me demonstrating on myself, and provided they don't have a traumatic association with fire). Plus, as it's definitely edgeplay, I feel I need consent to start, and would worry about them being harmed if it was a surprise.

I'm curious as to what others think, though.

And, from what I've learned, it sounds like your Top wasn't playing within the limits he knew to be safe. Accidents can happen, but he shouldn't have let it burn long enough to burn you. Have you talked about his level of education and experience with this, and found out if he's tried everything he can on himself many times first? Those are the things the very, very experienced players stressed over and over again.

That little speach he made for a couple of different reasons. One was because he did push a little farther than he had before. Two he tried some new things. Three this was his way of letting me know I had a way out if I was not comfortable with something he was doing. And lastly....IT SCARED THE FUCK OUT OF ME! *giggles* which is why, I'm sure, he phrased things as he did.

The welt that he left was an accedent and it wasn't even bad enough for me to really make a fuss over. He just didn't blow it out on the first blow, and I kind of got a bit of a since of panic from him when it happened. But I wasn't sure why he would be nervous or why he was even blowing on my ass in the first place since I really didn't know what was happening. had I known I most likely would have paniced and that would have caused more serious injury.

But I trust him completely, which is what allows me to just let go and let him do his thing so to speak. That night along with more intence wax play and fire play, he also did more knife play, which is, like I said, when he gave his little speach. He slid the knife along more...delecate areas and so it was sort of a "don't fucking move" type thing as well.

But to be honest, I'm not sure if he's tried anything on himself before or not. Tho I do know it was something talked about a lot at the shop, and I just can't picture anyone trying these things on him. Anyone that would even think of such a thing would be put on his hit list, and not the same one I'm on.

We do break a lot of "the rules" that I've seen around here, and heard from others. But like I said, I trust him completely, and I know that he has my well being in mind each time we play.

Thank you for your concern tho.

 

[myinnerslut]

i think that fireplay falls under the catagory of "scares me, but the idea turns me on"... youd have to make me feel very safe, put me far into a submissive mindframe, and convince me that you knew exactly what you were doing, before you could get me to consider it.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Have to admit it has never been something which was high on my list of things I must do as it has never jumped out at me as appealing on any level.F has done it in the past with other subs but curiously it just has never seemed to do anything for me one way or the other. I likely would have some jitters as I know of someone who died doing it...granted it was a situation where at least one of them had been drinking, and they were not the brightest sparks on the block, but it does show it can happen if things get out of hand.

Catalina

 

[bronntanas]

If you can get find the Weekend BDSM report, D's mariposa has a few great posts about fireplay there. I'm not patient enough to go back all the way and find it and the blankety blankety blank search function isn't working for me tonight.

 

[SweetErika]

Great responses and ideas! I'd never considered using a violet wand or heard of devil's fire, and will have to look into both now.

For those who are hesitant-petrified, you definitely have the right ideas about being open to trying a little bit *sometime* with someone who really knows what their doing and you trust completely. I think there's some variation on this, but the Top last night said it's best to usually start people face-down (he put a fire-resistant cloth on my head, and I was wearing 100% cotton jeans, which are also pretty resistant, BTW) because seeing it can invoke a lot more fear. I also appreciated that he didn't tell me the first step, so I'd already "survived" the fire before I even knew he'd started! Again, I can see where some may need to be talked through that, too, but for me it was a real confidence builder.

Have to admit it has never been something which was high on my list of things I must do as it has never jumped out at me as appealing on any level.F has done it in the past with other subs but curiously it just has never seemed to do anything for me one way or the other. I likely would have some jitters as I know of someone who died doing it...granted it was a situation where at least one of them had been drinking, and they were not the brightest sparks on the block, but it does show it can happen if things get out of hand.

Catalina

Wow. But, as you said, there's a lot of danger in mind-altering substances and stupidity. I suspect there was also an alcohol spill or dousing near/on the victim for it to result in 3rd degree burns and/or death, or perhaps clothes caught on fire or something, and they didn't respond properly.

 

[lil_slave_rose]

Thanks for sharing, rose. Would you mind elaborating on why it's a limit? I'm just curious, and might be able to share something from my experience that may make you more comfortable in the event it comes up for you two, as I didn't think it'd be something I'd do either.

hi again Erika *smiles* the reason it is a limit for me is the 'danger' in it. it scares me, alot of edge play scares me, the only thing i'm really comfortable as far as edge play goes, is being 'choked' though i don't really like it to be that tight around my neck or last for that long, just a little. alot of the reason it's a limit also is my inexperience with much of anything R/T BDSM.....my pain tolerance is not that high yet either..lol..there are alot of factors that make it a limit for me..and i think i've named them all..reading your experience sounds like it wasn't so bad but you were also with a very experienced Dom who knew how to do it right, Master doesn't, so if it were to be done, He'd have alot of learning, researching and practicing on Himself before i would be comfortable with it....as far as do i think it should be a surprise? no i think all edge play should be negotiated first, i'm not sure i could trust Him much if He sprung it on me in the middle of a scene, but that's just me and alot of others i know will disagree....

 

[Byakuya]

I'm not officially a Dom or Sub, but I think if my wife wanted to try a little fireplay I wouldn't be against it. I'd let her burn my ass a little, but I wouldn't want any fire touching my cock or balls.

 

[lil_slave_rose]

I feel the same - seeing how cautious the "experts" were last night gave me even more pause. I asked how they learned, and they said, "lots and lots and lots of reading, talking to really knowledgeable people, classes and experimenting on myself whenever possible" (clearly men can't feel what it's like on a woman's breasts, or do parts of themselves safely). I'm going to start digging up info online (maybe this will become a repository of sorts for useful info we find?), and then I'll find a good mentor at my club.

I'll no doubt start with heavier waxplay (hopefully I can arrange a tasting in the next few weeks), and keep fireplay confined to the club, since it's a much safer environment in general with lots of extra hands, fire extinguishers and first aid on hand whenever it's allowed. After I reach a certain level of knowledge, I'd feel safe experimenting on myself in our garage with Hubby w/ extinguisher standing by, but otherwise I'm not cool with the possibility of setting something in our home on fire.

I don't think 2nd and 3rd degree burns are a huge risk with someone who knows what they're doing and a safe environment, but it's definitely edgeplay all the same. I'm not much of a risktaker, and once I've put all of the safety measures in place, fireplay is something I won't hesitate to do. Like most everything, I'll start slowly and very cautiously, then work my way up gradually as I learn more. I mention this not to downplay the risk, but because I've managed to surprise myself - it's not something I'd really considered doing before last night! So, I think feeling it for myself at the hands of an exceedingly capable practitioner made a huge difference for me.

Anyway, I hope that helps some, and you have (had?) a safe journey to Rose's arms!

Master said to tell You, thanks, and He would reply Himself but His computer is off and He's getting ready to take a nap so that He can get up early and head to the airport *smiles*

 

[BiBunny]

Have to admit it has never been something which was high on my list of things I must do as it has never jumped out at me as appealing on any level.F has done it in the past with other subs but curiously it just has never seemed to do anything for me one way or the other. I likely would have some jitters as I know of someone who died doing it...granted it was a situation where at least one of them had been drinking, and they were not the brightest sparks on the block, but it does show it can happen if things get out of hand.

Catalina

All the more reason for me to NEVER DO THIS! I may send this post to a certain someone.

 

[ShinigamiSama]

ohh
this is one I'm interesting in being a part of
top or bottom

fire is, and always has been one of my favourite things, and I've managed to get prett excited when playing with it

most notably when I somehow lit my intire hand on fire with a leaky bottle of lighter fluid, I'd not notice leak when I was filling my zippo, went to test it to see if there was enough fluid and all the sudden my hand was on fire. didn't even startle me as I put it out in a quick flick and shake.

one of the things I've yet to re-create sadly

 

[Evil_Geoff]

Fireplay is real high on my list of fa-vo-rite things to do!

I was exposed to it the first time I went to a real-time BDSM function and it is one of the first "edgeplay" skills I picked up.

I learned to do "devil's fire" - the way it was taught to me was to rub the alcohol on the sub, dip your own fingers in the alcohol, light your fingers, light the sub. When your fingers get hot (which have been burning longer than the alcohol on the sub), it's time to put the sub out. And wipe them down with a cool damp cloth. Way, WAY fun!

I've done cupping the old fashioned way (burning item under overturned cup) and enjoy that a lot. I use a bottle cap or small leather pad to hold a bit of alcohol soaked cotton above the skin, light it, flip the cup over and viola'! Instant vacuum. Another way to do it is to swab the inside of the cup with alcohol, light it, flip onto the skin... *grins*

I've played with fire tom-toms and they are great visually! But make bloody sure you wring our any excess alcohol... having rivulets of fire dripping down the handle and onto your own hands is NOT in the game plan! Neither is dipping the flaming tom-tom back into the alcohol bowl... *chuckles* The fire did not spread, no one was injured, there wasn't even any damage to anything other than my pride and ego! Yes, accidents happen even to the best of us! And yes, I _had_ the fire extinguisher handy just in case.

I have, of course, done the dripping candle type wax play as well as the waxpot (no open flames so I don't consider that variety to be "fireplay") kind of waxplay.

I have NOT had the opportunity to do flaming mitt or "fire floggers" play. Those are on the agenda to get and learn one of these days.

 

[Soumis]

I learned to do "devil's fire" - the way it was taught to me was to rub the alcohol on the sub, dip your own fingers in the alcohol, light your fingers, light the sub. When your fingers get hot (which have been burning longer than the alcohol on the sub), it's time to put the sub out. And wipe them down with a cool damp cloth. Way, WAY fun!

The way I know devil's fire is a bit different. I know it as a "tail" of metal wire, almost as thick as hanger wire, with a handle of sorts, often a bit of wooden dowel. The tail end of the wire is heated, usually with a small torch, until it's rather hot, orange. You then press the end of the tail to the skin. There's a spiffy popping sound that I've heard on the receiving end of such treatment. It feels excrutiating, in a really really good way.

The first person who I ever tried fireplay with (David Walker of SAADE and Flames of Passion: Handbook of Erotic Fire Play) said that the body cannot discern area when the burns are as bad as they are from the devil's fire. So a few pin size burns and your body releases the same endorphins as if your entire body was on fire. My quick google search found one source that backs this up, but I don't know, it could be wrong.

Course, now I'm going to have to try your version of devil's fire...

edit: I forgot the mitt comment. The only thing I have to say about those is that they get reaaally hot after a while, which wasn't a problem for me, but the dom was pulling it off mighty fast.

edit 2: I realized in lab today that devil's fire, as I know, it looks an awful lot like inoculating loops that have the actually loop cut off so that the two twisted ends are free

 

[liberatedslave]

This all sound very interesting and (as lil_slave_rose said) if Sir was experienced in fireplay I might think about it. Having said that, I have very sensitive, fair skin so I may not be the best candidate for this kind of play.