House cats - killers?

[graceanne]

Just occurred to me too that cock fighting is pretty common. I think training dogs or chickens to fight is abuse, but I guess it occurred to people all over the world because they did it so much to begin with. *sigh*

I don't know if they have to train chickens to fight - roosters/cocks are naturally aggressive and attracted to shiny things like eyes. That's why you either keep them penned up or you make sure they're well handled and as tame as chickens can get.

 

[Keroin]

I like eggs. But I don't like chickens. I don't hate them, I just find them to be entirely lacking in individual personality and what group personality they have is unremarkable except for its entirely ugly bits.

They had free range of our suburban yard. Annoying to our neighbors (and me). They were just as likely to be stupid and vicious out on the grass as they were in a pen.

Vicious in my opinion means you never find a chicken being particularly nice to another chicken (in anthropomorphic terms) or grooming or caring or being beneficial to the group. The only group behavior is "GET 'EM!"

This doesn't apply to all birds, but chickens are domesticated and that accounts for a lot of intelligence and personality loss and loss of good learned behavior from any sort of normal family unit with caring parents. All I see that's left there is meat and mean.

Interesting. My only experience with chickens has been with "wild" chickens. They run all over this island but groups tend to stick within a small, geographical area, close to the tree they nest in at night. The behavior I've witnessed is quite different from what you describe.

The chickens that hang around my yard are social with one another, peaceful unless someone threatens their chicks, and have noticeable differences in personality. "Beakster" is one that I've watched since she was a chick. She is very comfortable with me and when she sees me head for the compost, she'll run out and wait for me to dump the food in - the other chickens are too scared, they wait until I'm a safe distance away.

Roosters I can do without. 4am? Huh, I wish they'd wait that long. Sometimes they start at midnight.

One of the chapters in Grandin's book, Animals in Translation, describes the selective breeding of chickens, and explains how the result is that "bad becomes normal."

Here's a preview, in which she talks about murderous rapist roosters.

I loved that book. Great examples of how selective breeding is messing up animals.

 

[Recidiva]

Interesting. My only experience with chickens has been with "wild" chickens. They run all over this island but groups tend to stick within a small, geographical area, close to the tree they nest in at night. The behavior I've witnessed is quite different from what you describe.

The chickens that hang around my yard are social with one another, peaceful unless someone threatens their chicks, and have noticeable differences in personality. "Beakster" is one that I've watched since she was a chick. She is very comfortable with me and when she sees me head for the compost, she'll run out and wait for me to dump the food in - the other chickens are too scared, they wait until I'm a safe distance away.

Roosters I can do without. 4am? Huh, I wish they'd wait that long. Sometimes they start at midnight.

I loved that book. Great examples of how selective breeding is messing up animals.

Yes, wild or feral birds are a lot smarter. Ravens would be a good example of birds that are bloody smart. They are the only birds observed who will fly toward gunfire because they've learned that guns mean dead things and consequently food.

There are a hell of a lot of smart birds in the world. In my experience, chicks hatched from shipped eggs and raised without a family unit don't really qualify, unfortunately for them.

 

[Keroin]

Yes, wild or feral birds are a lot smarter. Ravens would be a good example of birds that are bloody smart. They are the only birds observed who will fly toward gunfire because they've learned that guns mean dead things and consequently food.

There are a hell of a lot of smart birds in the world. In my experience, chicks hatched from shipped eggs and raised without a family unit don't really qualify, unfortunately for them.

In chickens, I must say, I can certainly see the relation to dinosaurs. When I watch them thundering across the yard, I always imagine they must look like feathery T-Rex's to bugs. To a cockroach, Jurassic Park is real.

 

[Recidiva]

In chickens, I must say, I can certainly see the relation to dinosaurs. When I watch them thundering across the yard, I always imagine they must look like feathery T-Rex's to bugs. To a cockroach, Jurassic Park is real.

Dinosaur: It's What's For Dinner

 

[graceanne]

In chickens, I must say, I can certainly see the relation to dinosaurs. When I watch them thundering across the yard, I always imagine they must look like feathery T-Rex's to bugs. To a cockroach, Jurassic Park is real.

LOL!!

 

[WriterDom]

Oh I saw a deer 10 feet off the road today. She quickly turned her head my way like "What the fuck is that?" I was on the bike and pretty quiet. First deer I've seen on the bike. I've stopped to help turtles across the road. Beautiful water birds every trip. Snow white huge birds with long necks. Fly really graceful. Does anyone know what they might be?

 

[graceanne]

Oh I saw a deer 10 feet off the road today. She quickly turned her head my way like "What the fuck is that?" I was on the bike and pretty quiet. First deer I've seen on the bike. I've stopped to help turtles across the road. Beautiful water birds every trip. Snow white huge birds with long necks. Fly really graceful. Does anyone know what they might be?

Swans?

 

[Recidiva]

Oh I saw a deer 10 feet off the road today. She quickly turned her head my way like "What the fuck is that?" I was on the bike and pretty quiet. First deer I've seen on the bike. I've stopped to help turtles across the road. Beautiful water birds every trip. Snow white huge birds with long necks. Fly really graceful. Does anyone know what they might be?

I don't know just by that description. I was lucky enough to see some swans with cygnets recently and that was beautiful, I consider myself lucky. Lots of herons and sand cranes down here, I'm in a bird-rich area.

 

[satindesire]

If it had a black face, it was probably a swan.

They're freaking GORGEOUS (we have them all over Honor Heights Park) but....Don't mess with them, they're mean.

 

[Shankara20]

Does anyone know what they might be?

Could it be Snipe?

I've really never seen a snipe but the older kids would send us younger kids out to hunt snipe at dusk in Kansas back in the late 50's...

 

[Recidiva]

Could it be Snipe?

I've really never seen a snipe but the older kids would send us younger kids out to hunt snipe at dusk in Kansas back in the late 50's...

I always thought snipe were fiction. Turns out they're an actual really little bird that's around in England. So that if you were good enough of a shot to hit one in the air, you were a "sniper."

 

[WriterDom]

http://identify.whatbird.com/obj/30/overview/Great_Egret.aspx

Egrets I guess. Haven't gotten close enough to see if they have black legs.

 

[WriterDom]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7SnIF2tFLI

Yeah, that's what they are.

 

[Shankara20]

I always thought snipe were fiction. Turns out they're an actual really little bird that's around in England. So that if you were good enough of a shot to hit one in the air, you were a "sniper."

Once I figured out about the snipe hunt trick I also thought they were fiction only later to learn otherwise.

The deep emotional scars from those early snipe hunting tricks caused me to resist the first time I was invited to a grunion run in So. Calif.

 

[Sir_Winston54]

Once I figured out about the snipe hunt trick I also thought they were fiction only later to learn otherwise.

The deep emotional scars from those early snipe hunting tricks caused me to resist the first time I was invited to a grunion run in So. Calif.

The grunion run is an awesome thing. I was privileged to go to one in San Diego when I was in radio school there. They're kinda bony, but they taste pretty good.

 

[Homburg]

Once I figured out about the snipe hunt trick I also thought they were fiction only later to learn otherwise.

The deep emotional scars from those early snipe hunting tricks caused me to resist the first time I was invited to a grunion run in So. Calif.

I thought of snipe hunts when I first heard of "shad planking". Sounded like hooey to me. nope. People really do plank shad.

 

[Shankara20]

I thought of snipe hunts when I first heard of "shad planking". Sounded like hooey to me. nope. People really do plank shad.

*sounds of Shank trotting over to wiki....*

 

[Sir_Winston54]

I thought of snipe hunts when I first heard of "shad planking". Sounded like hooey to me. nope. People really do plank shad.

*sounds of Shank trotting over to wiki....*

:: Followed Shank to wiki ::

Okayyy, that's ... interesting. Oily fish aren't my favorites, though.

 

[Shankara20]

:: Followed Shank to wiki ::

Okayyy, that's ... interesting. Oily fish aren't my favorites, though.

but when you mix it with partisan politics it is.....


still, errrr, Oily fish

 

[Homburg]

but when you mix it with partisan politics it is.....


still, errrr, Oily fish

I've never been to one. I can't imagine it being worth my time, or my palate's time.

 

[WriterDom]

http://www.exoticcatz.com/speciesbobverba.html

So I guess you can own bobcats in certain states.

 

[Homburg]

http://www.exoticcatz.com/speciesbobverba.html

So I guess you can own bobcats in certain states.

I read an article years ago about a breeding program in Europe. They'd brought in bobcats and were breeding them as guard animals. They're territorial, and trainable, so the company figured it would work. It sort of did.

Breeding tends to produce animals with the desired traits, and animals with the opposite traits though. So apparently they produced a line of upstanding guard cats, ready to die for their territory and trainable enough to be safe. And they produced giant, lovable housecattish pets.

The guard cat thing never caught on. The bobcats were apparently too quiet. Not enough deterrent, unlike loud dogs. They would just skulk about until the invader got close, then pounce on his head and play furry chainsaw. Not a good thing. The pet variety was more successful, but I don't know that they ever became legal.

Personally, we've domesticated enough animals through the millenia. We don't need to ruin more. And, honestly, it is arguable that dogs (and possibly cats) came to us, and essentially wanted to hang out with humans. We don't need to fuck with creatures that really don't want to hang out with us naturally.

 

[Keroin]

Thought I'd share some of the latest snorkel joy for those who are snorkel-deprived. I know it's not as good as the real thing but if you sing "Under the Sea" while you look, that helps.

Chippy the turtle...

http://i892.photobucket.com/albums/ac126/Keroin/Chippy.jpg

My wild friends, (who say, "Please don't put us in a tank!")...

http://i892.photobucket.com/albums/ac126/Keroin/Aquarium.jpg

 

[WriterDom]

My ex ex is living in the Philippines and has taken about every diving course there is to take. Her wife makes good money there so all she does is have fun and travel.