How to get the fires burning again?

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

I'm in a progressively sexless marriage.

We've had sex 4 times in the last 8 months and it wasn't very often before then. We have been going through issues. We disagree sexually now.

I like it in all of it's forms and we have done threesomes and even did a couple swap.

She's also done a 3some on her own after telling me that we would basically never do that gain. Right after that, she went and did one.

Our schedules are not working out either. She works and goes to school at night and I stay home and watch our son and cook and take care of things here.

I have had fidelity issues in the past but I have given up on that and I am trying to dedicate myself to her, but she isn't even trying to have sex with me.

Prime example. She went away with her mom to visit her sister one weekend and then the next went to celebrate her best friends birthday. Both times not even giving so much as a handjob. We don't do oral sex either. Been 9 months since that's happened and it doesn't look like it's going to.

She just doesn't want to do it.

I'm at my wit's end because she doesn't want me looking for sex, yet she won't have sex with me.

I know this is only one side of the story. I'm sorry but she won't come on to tell her side.

 

[bailadora]

Seriously, have you guys tried counseling? Cause from where I'm sitting, it appears that main "problem" isn't about sex at all but rather from a whole host of other issues that are affecting your relationship. The diminished sex seems to be just another symptom of the main issues (whatever they may be - fidelity, lack of communication, etc).

 

[SensuousSpice]

I'm new here and I know others will probably be along that will give much better advice, but I'll just make a few comments in general.

I know nothing about the ins and outs of your marriage except what you've shared in your post. However, I can tell you from my own personal experience just how difficult it can be to get past being cheated on. Trust is crucial to any relationship, and once it's been broken, rebuilding can be daunting and sometimes simply impossible. I've been cheated on twice -- the first time I was so angry and hurt, I immediately ended the relationship. The second time (in a different and more established relationship), we were able to work through and beyond it, but oh it was so painful for both of us and it took a long time, and a lot of introspection and time, for me to realize that his single infidelity was not going to be repeated.

The way you phrased the two examples of your wife going away for the week-end, without so much as giving you a handjob, sort of raised a flag for me. Do you think it is her obligation if she is going to have a week-end away, that she somehow pay for being gone by getting you off first? Sexual pleasure should be just that - a pleasure to give and to receive, but not an obligation to be totted up in a column.

I understand you're frustrated by the relatively infrequent sex. Sounds like you and your wife might benefit from some couples therapy to deal with the underlying issues that are affecting your entire relationship.

 

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

She wants to go and I will go to couples therapy with her.

But I feel it's going to be a dump on me session about how I did everything wrong and she was always right.

And I don't think that she should pay for going away, I was just thinking it would've been a nice gesture.

That's all.

I mean it's to the point that I don't even know when her periods are anymore. She told me she was on and I was like "oh" I didn't know that.

Now, she has cheated too.

It wasn't just me.

Mine was more than two years ago, but she found out about it last year and that's when the sex stopped. Her's was last year and I forgave her and moved on immediately. I love her and I married her for better or worse.

I'm an open minded person and things like that don't bother me.

But just going cold on me and when we do, it's missionary with no spark is ridiculous.

I know I shouldn't even speak on this topic because I am opening myself up to a tom of critcism.

 

[Pinkneonsocks]

The way you phrased the two examples of your wife going away for the week-end, without so much as giving you a handjob, sort of raised a flag for me. Do you think it is her obligation if she is going to have a week-end away, that she somehow pay for being gone by getting you off first? Sexual pleasure should be just that - a pleasure to give and to receive, but not an obligation to be totted up in a column.

You have to consider the fact that it's been quite sometime since they have engaged in sex regularly. I don't think there's anything wrong with him feeling it's sort of an obligation of hers, and his... to fulfill eachothers' sexual needs. Sad to say, but that's part of a marriage. It's not just sex though, and we musn't think of it that way. It's sharing something intimate with the one he loves... his wife. If she's unwilling to share that then seriously something is wrong.

So, I must agree with bailadora in the counceling approach. There has to be some underlining issues with her that is making her lose interest thus creating issues for him. They're at conflicting ends now and for the marriage to continue it's a must to come together ... although the result may not be frequent hand jobs, it will resolve the obvious conflict they're having sexually.

 

[Pinkneonsocks]

She wants to go and I will go to couples therapy with her.

But I feel it's going to be a dump on me session about how I did everything wrong and she was always right.

And I don't think that she should pay for going away, I was just thinking it would've been a nice gesture.

That's all.

I mean it's to the point that I don't even know when her periods are anymore. She told me she was on and I was like "oh" I didn't know that.

Now, she has cheated too.

It wasn't just me.

Mine was more than two years ago, but she found out about it last year and that's when the sex stopped. Her's was last year and I forgave her and moved on immediately. I love her and I married her for better or worse.

I'm an open minded person and things like that don't bother me.

But just going cold on me and when we do, it's missionary with no spark is ridiculous.

I know I shouldn't even speak on this topic because I am opening myself up to a tom of critcism.

Well, then you yourself have underlining issues which need to be resolved. Past is the past. Although tough, you have to put it behind you to grow from it. Perhaps not just couples therapy but independent therapy for both of you as well to work out your own inner issues with past cheating.

Maybe that's where her underlining issues are as well but she would have to work on those independently as well.

So, it would seem you both have personal and coupled issues. It's nothing out the norm, and I don't think anyone should down you for it. We've all had our own relationship issues, and if we someone hasn't they just haven't lived.

 

[quietwoman187]

I'm not married, so I can't fully give you thorough advice. I have no doubt those who are able to stay married happily and sexually will be able to assist a bit better. However, listening to you it sounds like both of you are experiencing the same difficulties and are trying to focus on re-starting the sex, but it also sounds as if other arenas are at work.

Regarding her preparing for her mother's birthday and her friend's party, from the standpoint of a woman, I can completely understand why she might not be in the mood then. Those are both stressful events that take a lot of planning energy or mental energy. So, in that sense, I'll have to be a total girl and tell you to stop pouting on that issue.

At the same time, I think you've pinpointed the reasons for a majority of your difficulties. You have different schedules and 'non-traditional' familial responsibilities. A friend of mine, who's probably completely different from you, initially had issues when he stayed at home with the children (although it was his idea) and it took a bit of a transition period. Also, do you have a chance to get out of the house by yourself?

While I recommend to this alot of people, it sounds as if you guys you might want to consider counseling. I might even suggest you try to wipe sex out of the equation altogether (difficult, I know), and try to re-build trust. Clearly as it's been awhile (8 mos), this won't happen over night. I can't speak for all married couples, only what I've read which intimates 3-somes sometimes don't help bring the two together. Also, if you've had fidelity issues outside what you've both agreed to, that might also lead to more difficulties.

So, that's my .05. I'll leave it to others to come up with suggestions regarding having romantic dates, platonic catch-up times, once-a-month 'dates,' or other sexual suggestions. But, regarding questions to help the other people after me - how long have you guys been married. When did you guys start to distance even further? Have you just tried a 'time out' a couple times to discuss without kids? Have you just asked her about what's going on in her life work-wise, etc.? There is the possibility, she is talking to someone else, but let me tell you it's very easy to go without sex (at least for me) for a very long time (trust me) and not notice at all, especially at times of work increase.

So, all I can suggest now is continuing to use H-T as a sounding board, being more understanding and looking up the TV series 'fortysomething' with Hugh Laurie.

 

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

she works during the day and goes to school 4 nights a week and the does clients hair on the weekends and monday's.

She in school for cosmetology.

I'm going to school in the summer and upcoming fall during the day for music technology.

Now when she went away for those two consecutive weekends, one was just an over-night visit with her mom, to see her sister.

The other was going out to a club with her frined for her B-Day, so there was really no stress involved.

She isn't talking to anyone else. That I am aware of. But, she keeps going through my emails to see if I am or not.

Now, I have had conversations with people about fantasies and the possibility of hooking up once, but that was out of frustration of lack of sex and my wife's unwillingness to even entertain the thought of it.

That was a mistake and it sets things further back. But she doesn't talk to me to tell me how she is feeling or what's going on wih her.

She is expecting me to go celebate because she's on strike. I'm trying to. I haven't had sex with anyone else since this whole thing began because I am trying to show her that I want to work this out.

But only having sex 4 times in 8 months is extreme.

I mean, I lay there in bed while she stays up sometimes and watches TV. She'll flip to the porn channel and get off that way instead of coming in the bedroom and having me help her out. I caught her doing this and it sunk my ego to know that my wife would rather play with herself than to have sex with me.

I was really starting to resent her for that.

Then the one time we talked about it, she told me she felt like I was ready to cheat on her again. Another ego blow.

So, I'm feeling a little less than opitmistic

We talked about it today on her break and doesn't see the lack of sex as a big deal, but wants to blow up that I have talked to other people because she doesn't want to.

I'm tired of jacking off. I do it 3 times a day now for 5 days a week.

I don't know what else to do.

 

[quietwoman187]

She wants to go and I will go to couples therapy with her.

But I feel it's going to be a dump on me session about how I did everything wrong and she was always right.

And I don't think that she should pay for going away, I was just thinking it would've been a nice gesture.

That's all.

I mean it's to the point that I don't even know when her periods are anymore. She told me she was on and I was like "oh" I didn't know that.

Now, she has cheated too.

It wasn't just me.

Mine was more than two years ago, but she found out about it last year and that's when the sex stopped. Her's was last year and I forgave her and moved on immediately. I love her and I married her for better or worse.

I'm an open minded person and things like that don't bother me.

But just going cold on me and when we do, it's missionary with no spark is ridiculous.

I know I shouldn't even speak on this topic because I am opening myself up to a tom of critcism.

OK. Now I'm going to slightly revise my comments based on your second post.

Did your wife cheat immediately after you cheated? Additionally, her distance after your infidelity explains even more.

It seems as if you wanted sympathy and no doubt you will receive that. Seriously, no one is trying to berate you. However, I'm a bit concerned. For all the difficulties in your marriage you seem more concerned with the loss of sex (and, again, I understand), when you already know the reason for it.

However, I still encourage you to go to counseling. It is the therapists job to remain objective so that no one will feel threatened. And you will probably have space to talk to that person individually and then together as a couple, so that you can feel even more secure.

At the same time, if I say inappropriate things to a life-long friend and then apologize. Sure, the friend might forgive me, but there might be a bit of repercussion for my actions. I might not want to deal with it and see my apology as sufficient, but the other person is still dealing with it. And, I actually might need to deal with it myself. The fact of the matter is we're all human and we make mistakes. Lord knows I wish I could be a more perfect person, and control my actions or reactions. But, that doesn't always happen

So, I would say 'man up,' man This isn't the playground. Well, okay, that's the other board , but you know what I mean. You have children, a wife, and a lot of responsibility. But, you seem a bit petulant. However, I'm assuming you aren't like that in reality and it's just frustration speaking. So all I can say is look outside yourself in terms of 'nice gestures,' or the mentality of 'now, we're even' because 'she's cheated, too'. Sadly, the world doesn't work like that.

You'll eventually get your ego stroke from some of the other people posting on this board. And, I don't want you to feel put upon.

 

[quietwoman187]

OK, after reading your third message, I'm just going to encourage you to keep talking to your wife as it sounds as if she is a bit in tuned into your emotions or your thought processes, even if it isn't flattering. But, it sounds like it helped. Just keep talking to her and telling her about your frustrations. However, you also need to let her talk about her concerns. In the interim, do see a counselor by yourself for suggestions. You could also 'journal it' or talk to guy friends. However, don't bottle it up -

 

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

It isn't that at all. It is mostly frustration speaking, because she doesn't see that as a big deal.

Now the reason for me emphasizing the sexual part is because our interaction otherwise is very good. We're kind to each other. We help each other out and we do what we can for each other. I make sure she has something hot to eat when she comes home from school at night. I go and meet he when she's coming to make sure she gets home safely.

I keep the house as clean as I can.

Every other part of our relationship is fine, but the bedroom is not there.

That's why I'm frustrated, because I don't know what else I have to do.

I'm not looking to get my ego stroked, just venting out frustration. Like I said before, I will go to counseling and I had agreed to when she first asked me to. She asked me to cut off my online friends and I did.

I have done everything she has asked me to and she still won't come near me. The two time we have had sex, I felt like I had to sneak it from her by constantly touching her getting her riled up to where she couldn't say no. She makes no moves on me and doesn't even look like she wants to.

But as I said before, do all the things we used to do together, so that's why I'm not understanding why she won'thave sex with me.

 

[SweetErika]

Does your wife know you're here?

Is she fully supporting you in seeking sex outside of your marriage?

Because as recently as four days ago, you were looking for sex with other people here. If she's not supporting you in that endeavor, it looks like you have every intention of cheating.

And if that's the case, how do you think that bodes for your relationship? How do you even think she would feel if she found out what you've been posting here?

Do your actions show you're truly committed to your wife and rebuilding the trust and marriage? Or do they show a guy who's complaining about underlying issues and saying he wants to fix the relationship while he's seeking to destroy it on the side?

Would you really want to have sex or intimacy with your spouse if she continued to do things that made you not trust her, had every intention of cheating on you, could carry a wealth of STIs from her affairs, etc.?

Please understand that my intention isn't to tear you down AT ALL. I am pointing out what appear to be inconsistencies and things for you to consider (hopefully very, very carefully) before you go any further. Actions speak louder than words, and from where I'm sitting, your behavior is SCREAMING.

If you want to have a shot at fixing it, great, but you're going to have to stop this cheating and figure out how to get rid of the mountain of resentment and move forward.

If you don't want to fix it, why prolong the inevitable divorce and cause everyone much more pain; why not move on so everyone (including your child!) has a shot at being happy?

My advice is to figure out what you truly want to do and commit to that fully. The same goes for your wife. A good therapist can probably help you both do that and work through your issues so they don't come back to bite you again and again in the future, regardless of which path you decide to take.

Best of luck to all three of you!

 

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

OK, after reading your third message, I'm just going to encourage you to keep talking to your wife as it sounds as if she is a bit in tuned into your emotions or your thought processes, even if it isn't flattering. But, it sounds like it helped. Just keep talking to her and telling her about your frustrations. However, you also need to let her talk about her concerns. In the interim, do see a counselor by yourself for suggestions. You could also 'journal it' or talk to guy friends. However, don't bottle it up -

I'm trying not bottle it up as that is something that I usually do.

I don't have friends to talk about those things with. I have lots of friends but I wouldn't want to talk about that with them.

The problem is. I have forgiven her for her mistakes, but she hasn't forgiven herself. I try to tell her that it's ok and that things happen, you live and you learn and move on.

But she holds on to these things and guilt trips herself. That come from her religious brainwashing.

 

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

Does your wife know you're here?

Is she fully supporting you in seeking sex outside of your marriage?

Because as recently as four days ago, you were looking for sex with other people here. If she's not supporting you in that endeavor, it looks like you have every intention of cheating.

And if that's the case, how do you think that bodes for your relationship? How do you even think she would feel if she found out what you've been posting here?

Do your actions show you're truly committed to your wife and rebuilding the trust and marriage? Or do they show a guy who's complaining about underlying issues and saying he wants to fix the relationship while he's seeking to destroy it on the side?

Would you really want to have sex or intimacy with your spouse if she continued to do things that made you not trust her, had every intention of cheating on you, could carry a wealth of STIs from her affairs, etc.?

Please understand that my intention isn't to tear you down AT ALL. I am pointing out what appear to be inconsistencies and things for you to consider (hopefully very, very carefully) before you go any further. Actions speak louder than words, and from where I'm sitting, your behavior is SCREAMING.

If you want to have a shot at fixing it, great, but you're going to have to stop this cheating and figure out how to get rid of the mountain of resentment and move forward.

If you don't want to fix it, why prolong the inevitable divorce and cause everyone much more pain; why not move on so everyone (including your child!) has a shot at being happy?

My advice is to figure out what you truly want to do and commit to that fully. The same goes for your wife. A good therapist can probably help you both do that and work through your issues so they don't come back to bite you again and again in the future, regardless of which path you decide to take.

Best of luck to all three of you!

I hear you, but that was again frustration acting out.

She knows I am on here.

Yes it does seem inconsistent, but that's all a part of what I am saying.

I wsh that things would go back to how they were, but it isn't.

So, I can understand where you're coming from.

And like I said, I am opening myself up to criticism and I know that.

 

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

Thanks for listening guys. I feel better now.

 

[SweetErika]

The problem is. I have forgiven her for her mistakes, but she hasn't forgiven herself. I try to tell her that it's ok and that things happen, you live and you learn and move on.

But she holds on to these things and guilt trips herself. That come from her religious brainwashing.

This is a very common issue for women especially. I do it all the time, and I had no religious upbringing.

My brain even managed to turn being raped into cheating. And then it allowed me to feel guilty about all sorts of things that weren't my fault. Logically I know the truth, but even after 10 years and lots of therapy and hard work, I still feel guilty and blame myself in some ways. And those feelings absolutely have an impact on how I function and relate to my husband.

Different situation, but I think it's a similar process and result. You wife may have a lot of trouble being intimate with you because it brings up all sorts of bad thoughts and feelings that she naturally doesn't want to get into. Give it time and therapy, for sure.

I hear you, but that was again frustration acting out.

She knows I am on here.

Yes it does seem inconsistent, but that's all a part of what I am saying.

I wsh that things would go back to how they were, but it isn't.

So, I can understand where you're coming from.

And like I said, I am opening myself up to criticism and I know that.

We all have fantasies and things like that. I felt that this site would be a place I can express that. Yes I went a little too far with seeking sex, but it has been months since the last time.

Sorry.

If you don't mean those posts anymore, my suggestion would be to edit them to say that now. There's no point in leaving them up to be misinterpreted by anyone if they're no longer relevant.

Honestly, if your ideal person had responded to one of those posts and was available for what you were seeking, would you have gone through with it? Think about that.

How old are you and your wife? How long have you been together and married?

 

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

I am 33 she is 28 with b-days coming up.

we have been together for 9 nine years total and married for 6.

I forgot to edit those posts.

 

[CWatson]

She wants to go and I will go to couples therapy with her.

But I feel it's going to be a dump on me session about how I did everything wrong and she was always right.

By your own admission, you did mess up, and inevitably that will come to light. She will say things about you that, probably, you won't like hearing. And your couples' therapist, far from taking your side, will tell you to listen to her. Getting dumped on is, unfortunately, something you will just have to deal with.

Having said that, it's a two-way street. Getting dumped on is something your wife will have to deal with too. The idea that you did everything wrong, and she was always right, is just as preposterous as the idea that she did everything wrong and you were always right. Both of you messed up. That's just how life works.

A couples' therapist is able to do something which the couple themselves are not: the therapist is able to look at things objectively. S/He will listen to your side of the story too (assuming you actually say it) (no offense, but it sounds like standing up for yourself to your wife might be something you have difficulty with) and will remind both of you that you need to make a marriage you both like. And that's to your advantage, because you're already trying to do that. Occasionally, when you're already doing something right, the therapist will take your side. (It's in our job description. )

So, srsly, I think that's the best thing you can do for yourself. No matter how much we try to help, there's only so much we can do.

Good luck to you both.

 

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

By your own admission, you did mess up, and inevitably that will come to light. She will say things about you that, probably, you won't like hearing. And your couples' therapist, far from taking your side, will tell you to listen to her. Getting dumped on is, unfortunately, something you will just have to deal with.

Having said that, it's a two-way street. Getting dumped on is something your wife will have to deal with too. The idea that you did everything wrong, and she was always right, is just as preposterous as the idea that she did everything wrong and you were always right. Both of you messed up. That's just how life works.

A couples' therapist is able to do something which the couple themselves are not: the therapist is able to look at things objectively. S/He will listen to your side of the story too (assuming you actually say it) (no offense, but it sounds like standing up for yourself to your wife might be something you have difficulty with) and will remind both of you that you need to make a marriage you both like. And that's to your advantage, because you're already trying to do that. Occasionally, when you're already doing something right, the therapist will take your side. (It's in our job description. )

So, srsly, I think that's the best thing you can do for yourself. No matter how much we try to help, there's only so much we can do.

Good luck to you both.

Hey CWatson, thanks for you input.

I have no problem standing up for myself.

Now as a person, I am not abusive, I don't call her out of her name, no matter how mad I get. And if get too upset, I leave and cool off and come back to talk later. I grew up watching my mother get beat by her man (not my father) and that showed me that that is NOT how you treat a woman.

I made my mistakes and I constantly apologize and acknowledge them.

Yes I have slipped up and talked to people, but I cut it off before anything progressed. Someone said that I need to decide what I want. I have. I've done that months ago. It just seems that none of my efforts are being fully noticed. She says she appreciates the things I do, but she doesn't show it me.

She barely shows interest in things that I get excited about. Like music. I'm going to school for that, she was a music major before she got priced out of school (she didn't have enough credits to get more financial aid).

I tell her what's going on and all she can say is "ok" to everything.

Contrast to when she is telling me about school (cosmetology), I ask her questions, I engage in the conversation. I try to understand and I listen to her. How I interpret her responses to what I'm trying to do is that she doesn't care. She says it's not like that, but hw else would you interpret that?

If I'm telling you things and all you can say is "ok" and don't ask questions if you don't understand something, then that tells me you don't care. And it's not that she says ok, it's the way she says it, in a finality kind of way.

I guess that's better than what she used to do, which was cutting me off and not letting me finish a sentence.

Other than the stuff I have posted, our interaction is good. Really.

This is just a speed bump on a long road for us.

Oh and my son who is 6 wrote his name in cursive yesterday.

 

[bailadora]

It just seems that none of my efforts are being fully noticed. She says she appreciates the things I do, but she doesn't show it me.

Or maybe she is, but just not in a form you recognize or feel validated by. I've been reading The Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman, in which he explains that people have different ways of expressing their love to someone. For some, it might be acts of service such as your hot meal example. For others, it might be through words of affirmation, physical affection, little gifts or spending time with the other person. My husband tends to express his love through little gifts and words of affirmation. And while I appreciate the gestures, what I really crave is time with him, which can sometimes be challenging due to his career. I tend to express my love for him through acts of service and physical touch and while he certainly doesn't complain about the former, what truly makes him feel loved is physical touch. I've really learned a lot from the book so far and have even learned to apply the principles to my relationship with my kids. It might be worth a look to see if it can help aid in bettering communication between you both (along with couples counseling). Best of luck to the three of you.

 

[BBC4WMILFnCPLS]

Or maybe she is, but just not in a form you recognize or feel validated by. I've been reading The Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman, in which he explains that people have different ways of expressing their love to someone. For some, it might be acts of service such as your hot meal example. For others, it might be through words of affirmation, physical affection, little gifts or spending time with the other person. My husband tends to express his love through little gifts and words of affirmation. And while I appreciate the gestures, what I really crave is time with him, which can sometimes be challenging due to his career. I tend to express my love for him through acts of service and physical touch and while he certainly doesn't complain about the former, what truly makes him feel loved is physical touch. I've really learned a lot from the book so far and have even learned to apply the principles to my relationship with my kids. It might be worth a look to see if it can help aid in bettering communication between you both (along with couples counseling). Best of luck to the three of you.

Thanks for that suggestion. I will look into that book.

I understand what you're saying and maybe I'm reading too much into what I think isn't happening as far as my efforts are concerned. It's also that those instances are few and far in between.