I miss the fitness threads and the fitness Doms!

[Keroin]

Hence the several million men and women who play golf incredibly badly while still enjoying the hell out of it.

Yes, but golf is a game, not a sport.

Speaking of picking up a sport later in life: it's not always a recipe for mediocrity to start beyond your youth. Larry Nelson, who had played baseball as a youngster, took up golf in his mid-twenties after leaving the Army. By his mid-thirties he had won several times on the PGA tour and won the United States Open and the PGA Championship.

Agreed. Sometimes we can surprise ourselves.

 

[midwestyankee]

Yes, but golf is a game, not a sport.



Agreed. Sometimes we can surprise ourselves.

Fine. You try to control an object that is four feet long in such a way so that the end of the object passes a point less than 2 inches in diameter with less than 2 degrees of variance from a line that is parallel with your hips while the end of that object is moving at about 150 kilometers per hour.

More seriously: how do you differentiate between a game and a sport?

 

[Keroin]

Fine. You try to control an object that is four feet long in such a way so that the end of the object passes a point less than 2 inches in diameter with less than 2 degrees of variance from a line that is parallel with your hips while the end of that object is moving at about 150 kilometers per hour.

More seriously: how do you differentiate between a game and a sport?

Oh Yanks...*gives noogies*...I was teasing.

Let's see though, if you can drink a beer while playing, that is a game. (See also: darts, curling).

 

[midwestyankee]

Oh Yanks...*gives noogies*...I was teasing.

Let's see though, if you can drink a beer while playing, that is a game. (See also: darts, curling).

You can drink beer while skiing (at least downhill) so does that move downhill skiing into the game category?

 

[Keroin]

You can drink beer while skiing (at least downhill) so does that move downhill skiing into the game category?

What hill are you skiing on?!!

ETA: I should have specified that you can hold a mug of beer in one hand and drink while playing...that's a game.

 

[midwestyankee]

What hill are you skiing on?!!

ETA: I should have specified that you can hold a mug of beer in one hand and drink while playing...that's a game.

You haven't been to Chicago lately, have you? Actually, I learned to ski at Sugarloaf, in Maine, which suffered a detached chair lift accident last week.

I suppose it's stretching things a bit, but on gentler hills you really could drink a beer while gliding down the slope.

So, what's next in your attempt to make golf a non sport?

 

[Keroin]

You haven't been to Chicago lately, have you? Actually, I learned to ski at Sugarloaf, in Maine, which suffered a detached chair lift accident last week.

I suppose it's stretching things a bit, but on gentler hills you really could drink a beer while gliding down the slope.

So, what's next in your attempt to make golf a non sport?

Give me a minute to ponder that...

*laughs evil laugh and strokes white fluffy cat*

 

[Homburg]

Fine. You try to control an object that is four feet long in such a way so that the end of the object passes a point less than 2 inches in diameter with less than 2 degrees of variance from a line that is parallel with your hips while the end of that object is moving at about 150 kilometers per hour.

More seriously: how do you differentiate between a game and a sport?

Competition that is force on force would be one side, and, if it is an individual sport, is there a definite element of potential danger should your skill test fail?

In other words, you are either competing player versus player in direct contest of your skill versus theirs, or you are competing in player versus environment/task, and failure sucks painfully.

The former could be things like the combatives (martial arts, football, wrestling), the skill vs skill (tennis, baseball, etc) where you are trying to counter the other person's physical skills directly, or dangerous things involving speed, heavy weights, crushing exertion, etc.

Golf is like darts with walking.

Note - I do not consider competitive shooting to be a sport, or archery. Horse racing and most equestrian sports likewise. If shooting, for example, is a sport, so is billiards.

To use my PvP/PvE concept, golf is totally PvE. Where the line is drawn there is in the danger factor. When you are schussing down a fierce slope in january and blow a turn, you turn into a cascade of bodyparts, snow, and ouch. When you blow a drive in golf, well, you have a shorter walk ahead of you.

I am also not one to consider an activity a sport when the participants can be actively out of shape and yet still good at it.

 

[midwestyankee]

Give me a minute to ponder that...

*laughs evil laugh and strokes white fluffy cat*

I'm quite sure that the presence of a white fluffy cat will prove to be to your disadvantage.

Other sports in which one could drink a beer while playing:

baseball
cricket
skydiving (not necessarily easily or wise, but feasible)
hockey (the goalie, at least; plus anyone on the bench since that's the same as drinking between turns at curling and darts)
sailing
skeet shooting (again, not necessarily wise but feasible)

 

[midwestyankee]

Competition that is force on force would be one side, and, if it is an individual sport, is there a definite element of potential danger should your skill test fail?

In other words, you are either competing player versus player in direct contest of your skill versus theirs, or you are competing in player versus environment/task, and failure sucks painfully.

The former could be things like the combatives (martial arts, football, wrestling), the skill vs skill (tennis, baseball, etc) where you are trying to counter the other person's physical skills directly, or dangerous things involving speed, heavy weights, crushing exertion, etc.

Golf is like darts with walking.

Note - I do not consider competitive shooting to be a sport, or archery. Horse racing and most equestrian sports likewise. If shooting, for example, is a sport, so is billiards.

To use my PvP/PvE concept, golf is totally PvE. Where the line is drawn there is in the danger factor. When you are schussing down a fierce slope in january and blow a turn, you turn into a cascade of bodyparts, snow, and ouch. When you blow a drive in golf, well, you have a shorter walk ahead of you.

I am also not one to consider an activity a sport when the participants can be actively out of shape and yet still good at it.

How does diving fit into your categorization? Seems to me that it would probably fall in the PvE class, no? What about timed speed skating, where your opponent on the track with you is not your only opponent; you are competing only against a clock and no one can do anything legally to alter your results.

 

[neci]

http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2009/2/14/128791102177123721.jpg

yeah, yeah okay. i can relate to fat cat.

 

[philosophygirl]

http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2009/2/14/128791102177123721.jpg

yeah, yeah okay. i can relate to fat cat.

She is fine...but she might enjoy some exercise in the water

http://turbo.inquisitr.com/wp-content/2010/04/securedownload-8.jpg

 

[Homburg]

How does diving fit into your categorization? Seems to me that it would probably fall in the PvE class, no? What about timed speed skating, where your opponent on the track with you is not your only opponent; you are competing only against a clock and no one can do anything legally to alter your results.

By diving, are you referring to diving off a board, or scuba/free diving underwater. In either case, it would be PvE as it is not force on force, or skill on skill if you prefer. I do not know of competitive scuba diving, but have seen informal competition between free divers on depth and/or time.

Speed skating is just like sprinting, long distance running, or any other "I'm faster than you!" event. It is PvP and force against force. It is just not direct force on force. Weightlifting would be the same. I am not competing directly against you, but I am trying to best your feat by application of force.

In each of these cases, I consider them leaning more towards sport simply because each requires great physical fitness to be competitive, and there is certainly an element of danger in failure.

NASCAR =/= sport

Anything involving a vehicle powered by other than you or gravity is just not a sport. Admittedly, there's serious danger inherent to failing at motorsports, but there's also serious danger inherent to soldiering, and it's not a sport.

 

[neci]

She is fine...but she might enjoy some exercise in the water

http://turbo.inquisitr.com/wp-content/2010/04/securedownload-8.jpg

http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/funny-pictures-white-cat-bath-ducky.jpg

 

[philosophygirl]

http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/funny-pictures-white-cat-bath-ducky.jpg

http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/funny-pictures-cat-shower-naked-man.jpg

 

[midwestyankee]

By diving, are you referring to diving off a board, or scuba/free diving underwater. In either case, it would be PvE as it is not force on force, or skill on skill if you prefer. I do not know of competitive scuba diving, but have seen informal competition between free divers on depth and/or time.

Speed skating is just like sprinting, long distance running, or any other "I'm faster than you!" event. It is PvP and force against force. It is just not direct force on force. Weightlifting would be the same. I am not competing directly against you, but I am trying to best your feat by application of force.

In each of these cases, I consider them leaning more towards sport simply because each requires great physical fitness to be competitive, and there is certainly an element of danger in failure.

NASCAR =/= sport

Anything involving a vehicle powered by other than you or gravity is just not a sport. Admittedly, there's serious danger inherent to failing at motorsports, but there's also serious danger inherent to soldiering, and it's not a sport.

Yes, I was referring to diving from a board or platform into a pool (see Louganis, Greg). And how is the precise application of 100 mph+ force on a golf ball not an exercise of power? Might one also consider that walking four to five miles, frequently in hilly terrain, while maintaining a controlled mental state in order to execute high-precision athletic moves adds an element of physicality that you had not taken into account?

I realize that there is a bias against golf but I contend that a lot of this bias is based on perceptions of normal people attempting to play at it. Just as it would hardly look like sport if I tried to play football, there is a tremendous difference between your average Saturday morning four-ball and competitive tournament golf.

By your definition, probably half of the events in the Olympics would not qualify as sport.

 

[FurryFury]

Me, personally? Sugar. I eat very little of either and but most of my fat comes from natural sources so I don't worry about it. It's sugar that my bod craves.

Cod bless stevia!

Thanks. That was my first instinct too. Which is almost always right.

FF

 

[teknight]

You're absolutely right...and that goes for more than just lifting, doesn't it?


More practice would help...damn catch 22. GRRRR.

And I guess I should have been specific- ballroom dancing, or, you know, dancing where you actually have to follow a pattern. FWIW, I have joined dance clubs in college (I mean student organizations with a focus on dancing, just to make myself clear), but...everything's ..sooo damn fast.
Yes, yes. Practice, practice, practice is key.

Bwahahaha.
a) I'm a little proud of the fact that I worked out yesterday and thus kept my routine up. I could have used a "it's a holiday" excuse, but didn't.
b) my quads are on fire
c) my abs quit on me after a grand total of seven decline bench ab crunches. I could have soldiered on...but I was/am winded.
d) HAHAHAHA. I had music blasting (well, off my laptop) while working out...and found myself dancing in front of the mirror...when I should have been doing deadlifts. LOL

 

[Homburg]

Yes, I was referring to diving from a board or platform into a pool (see Louganis, Greg). And how is the precise application of 100 mph+ force on a golf ball not an exercise of power?

Meh. It's not the power that is important. I guarantee that I am fuck-all stronger than Tiger Woods, but he can drive a ball so much farther than I can that it ain't funny. The LPGA golfers can do the same, and, again, I am way stronger. It is skill, plain and simple.

Is billiards a sport? I see it the same way. It is a fine motor control exhibition.

Might one also consider that walking four to five miles, frequently in hilly terrain, while maintaining a controlled mental state in order to execute high-precision athletic moves adds an element of physicality that you had not taken into account?

My postman walks more than that each day. I do not consider him an athlete. Soldiers walk, run, and jump far more, and perform equally precise fine motor control exhibitions (precision shooting) under stupendously more stressful conditions (getting shot at), and I do not consider them athletes.

I realize that there is a bias against golf but I contend that a lot of this bias is based on perceptions of normal people attempting to play at it. Just as it would hardly look like sport if I tried to play football, there is a tremendous difference between your average Saturday morning four-ball and competitive tournament golf.

/shrug

I just don't see it as a sport. I see it as a skills and mindset competition, and liken it to darts, billiards, snooker, lawn bowling, bocce, etc. None of these are sports. They are games. There is a difference.

And, dude, I'm not belittling pro golfers. They're awesome. I just don't see it as a sport. Golfers don't puke when they train. Golfers don't sweat like pigs and gasp when lining up a putt.

By your definition, probably half of the events in the Olympics would not qualify as sport.

You are correct. I've been saying this for a while. I wouldn't go so far as to say half, but they are quite a few that are not sports, and thus don't belong in the olympics IMO.

Anything equestrian and anything involving shooting. Rhythmic gymnastics. Ice dancing. Synchronised swimming. Honestly, anything where the beauty of the performance is part of the judging I am likely to find questionable as a sport.

 

[Lizzie_Borden]

So, I've entered a friend's 'The Biggest Loser' type competition, for quite a decent cash prize.

I figure I'm in with a decent shot, as I'm looking at losing a decent amount of weight in the next 16 weeks anyway... so why not some financial incentive?

Mind you, I have no idea about anyone else in said competition, but eh, it might prove to be some extra motivation when I feel like sulking and staying home.

 

[teknight]

So, I've entered a friend's 'The Biggest Loser' type competition, for quite a decent cash prize.

I figure I'm in with a decent shot, as I'm looking at losing a decent amount of weight in the next 16 weeks anyway... so why not some financial incentive?

Mind you, I have no idea about anyone else in said competition, but eh, it might prove to be some extra motivation when I feel like sulking and staying home.

Being an econ student, I will always believe that financial incentives will work.
As a psych student, I'm not so sure.
Good luck!!

 

[WriterDom]

Bah, Homburg!

Golf is an intellectual sport. Millions of people play but not that many can generate the club head speed and the accuracy to make any money at it. Much like a baseball player. There aren't that many people who can throw a baseball 100 mph and actually know where it's going. If you can you have a multimillion dollar arm.

Suppose you could outdrive Tiger? Lots of big guys can but you'll never see them anywhere around the pro tour. Unlike darts, billiards, and bowling, you have the elements to deal with and no two holes in the world are the same. I don't know of any other sport that requires as much "touch." It's a lot more than knocking a ball as far as you can. And courage. It's not you and the rest of the football team or rugby team, it's you alone with a ball and 220 yards over a lake with a landing area about the size of phone booth. Do you go for it? Do you lay up? It's 4 hours of one big chess board with no mulligan. Then you have to putt. Which I agree is a little like darts except if you are the world's straightest putter you could very well be one of the world's worst putters.

Yeah, anyone can play and you can even ride around in a little cart and drink beer but at the highest level it's not a sport? You have to be kidding. Maybe if you have the genetics of Wie you can get away with not working out but what if you are Gary Player trying to keep up with Jack and Arnie? He was into fitness decades before it became popular.

You'd probably argue that weightlifting is a sport? Wouldn't you agree that a short bus kid with great genetics and a trainer could become the greatest weightlifter in the history of the world? Go pick up heavy weight now, Bubba. Remember, hold at the top until you hear the loud noise.

 

[Keroin]

Wow! I started the first big controversy of 2011!

*waits for golfer hate mail to flow in*


(It was a joke...BTW...though darts is still not a sport.)

 

[midwestyankee]

@Homburg: any time that WD and I agree 100%, the subject of our agreement must be a universal truth.

 

[jre1962]

Wow! I started the first big controversy of 2011!

*waits for golfer hate mail to flow in*


(It was a joke...BTW...though darts is still not a sport.)

In the immortal words of the great philospher Happy Gilmore: "golf requires goofy pants and a fat ass."