Is erotica sexual harassment?

[MrHereWriting]

I don't know.

That being said, I didn't even read the description you provided because I fail to see the point. The problem arises when someone sees the description, goes "I know that person!", and starts sharing it for others who know the person to ALSO go "Yeah, you're right! That's totally her! I knew that slut does gang bangs!".

There's 7.9 billion people in the world.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I don't know.

That being said, I didn't even read the description you provided because I fail to see the point. The problem arises when someone sees the description, goes "I know that person!", and starts sharing it for others who know the person to ALSO go "Yeah, you're right! That's totally her! I knew that slut does gang bangs!".

You said a very detailed description is

pretty damn near as close as you can get to making a person identifiable without downright calling out their names.

Of course you don't know who she is, despite having a whole list of unique traits that would instantly identify her if you did know her. That's the point people are trying to make to @madelinemasoch - how will anyone know from a story? There is simply no way it can happen unless you out yourself first. None of us here have a clue where Madeline lives, let alone who she fantasises about.

 

[AchtungNight]

The only people I write about in my stories are fictional characters. Idealized versions of celebrities in some cases, but if you can separate fantasy from reality and recognize the difference, you’re not a threat to others. All you have to do to avoid someone you consider a creep but who isn’t actually dangerous is keep your distance from them and let them hang with the people who don’t think they’re a creep. Have mercy, empathy, tolerance, and understanding. Or are these concepts alien to you?

To me they’re of ultimate value next to good clean consensual fun.

 

[OverconfidentSarcasm]

There's 7.9 billion people in the world.

Okay, let's look at it this way. There's 7.9 Billion people in the world.

Now, OP writes in US English, which rules out 7.6 Billion people. Let's say OP's character also speaks US English, reducing the number by another 23%. OP will probably include the person's gender, reducing that number to 131 million. Now, let's say the character is somewhere between eighteen and sixty-five, ruling out 46% of what was left and leaving us at an even 60 million.

We've come a long way already. 8 BILLION reduced to 60 Million.

Now, that still sounds like a big number... but, remember, that's assuming OP's character is of working age and a certain gender, speaking a certain language. Only NOW do all the specifics come into play OP wanted to include. How many of those 60 million are brunette? How many have a little mole in the corner of their mouths? How many work in offices or something similar that requires them to dress in a specific way? What if OP includes a closer age range than just "she can work"? What if she talks in an accent? What kind of car is OP letting her drive, and what kind of house is she living in?

I'd say, in the end, it leaves you with maybe 5 million possible matches. And before you now come out and say "That's STILL a HUGE number"... how many people visit Lit every day?

Also, I can't help but chuckle while I keep reading response after response essentially telling OP to go ahead with it and not to worry, because, essentially, even if the person he writes about has their reputation destroyed and becomes the target of harassment, they still have to connect the story to OP's real name. And that's such a hassle...

 

[alohadave]

There's 7.9 billion people in the world.

True, but you are going to know a few hundred people, tops, in your immediate area. So if you can be identified, the pool of potential real people shrinks considerably from those 7.9 billion.

 

[MrHereWriting]

Okay, let's look at it this way. There's 7.9 Billion people in the world.

Now, OP writes in US English, which rules out 7.6 Billion people. Let's say OP's character also speaks US English, reducing the number by another 23%. OP will probably include the person's gender, reducing that number to 131 million. Now, let's say the character is somewhere between eighteen and sixty-five, ruling out 46% of what was left and leaving us at an even 60 million.

We've come a long way already. 8 BILLION reduced to 60 Million.

Now, that still sounds like a big number... but, remember, that's assuming OP's character is of working age and a certain gender, speaking a certain language. Only NOW do all the specifics come into play OP wanted to include. How many of those 60 million are brunette? How many have a little mole in the corner of their mouths? How many work in offices or something similar that requires them to dress in a specific way? What if OP includes a closer age range than just "she can work"? What if she talks in an accent? What kind of car is OP letting her drive, and what kind of house is she living in?

I'd say, in the end, it leaves you with maybe 5 million possible matches. And before you now come out and say "That's STILL a HUGE number"... how many people visit Lit every day?

Also, I can't help but chuckle while I keep reading response after response essentially telling OP to go ahead with it and not to worry, because, essentially, even if the person he writes about has their reputation destroyed and becomes the target of harassment, they still have to connect the story to OP's real name. And that's such a hassle...

Who says the writer it writing about people they know? There's a lot of lot Tik Tokkers, X users, Instagram(mers?), Youtubers, photos online, vlogs, video stories, etc.... Oh, were' back to being in the billions.

True, but you are going to know a few hundred people, tops, in your immediate area. So if you can be identified, the pool of potential real people shrinks considerably from those 7.9 billion.

4.95 billion people use social media.

People identify with fictional characters everyday. Unless you specifically point out to a person that you wrote about them, hoping for some kind of reaction, they'll never know. They may think they know, but they may also identify with Wonder Woman or one of Taylor Swift's songs. Do you know how many women I've heard say, "Oh, Swift's songs are about me."

 

[ElectricBlue]

Who says the writer it writing about people they know?

That's the whole premise of this thread - the OP's concern that writing a physical description of someone she knows might create issues for her, legally or ethically, if that person was recognised from her writing.

 

[MrHereWriting]

Artists draw inspiration from their surroundings/environments all the time. In fact, I can’t imagine where else one would draw their inspiration from aside from divine or demonic intervention. My question is both legal and ethical: is it sexual harassment to publish stories on this site that include characters which are inspired by/based on/look like real people? I’m not talking celebrities; that’s aside the point here, as I’ve already seen celebrities being discussed in Reddit threads. I’m talking about regular civilians you know or even strangers you have seen. I’m also asking both with and without the consent of the person. Is it sexual harassment? Is it illegal? Is it immoral? Is there any precedent behind this issue?

That's the whole premise of this thread - the OP's concern that writing a physical description of someone she knows might create issues for her, legally or ethically, if that person was recognised from her writing.

Not the whole premise, it seems.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Not the whole premise, it seems.

You're right. The idea of strangers makes the whole concern even more bizarre. If she doesn't know who they are, they don't know she is, so how can anyone else make a connection? Even assuming a complete stranger happened to read one of her stories and thought, gee, that sounds like me, purely from a physical description.

The thing to do, if there's the slightest concern, ethically, legally or whatever, is explicitly set the story somewhere she's never lived in her life. Or use the typical caveat used commercially: "All characters in this story are fictional. Any resemblance to any person, living or dead, is coincidental."

 

[IN_DIANA_JONES]

IMHO it is it makes me sexually harass myself every damn time I get on here! Lol just a joke people all the Ned and Maude Flanders types take a long deep breath and any type of chill the fuck out pill before crucifying me

 

[CarmineBlancheJr]

Artists draw inspiration from their surroundings/environments all the time. In fact, I can’t imagine where else one would draw their inspiration from aside from divine or demonic intervention. My question is both legal and ethical: is it sexual harassment to publish stories on this site that include characters which are inspired by/based on/look like real people? I’m not talking celebrities; that’s aside the point here, as I’ve already seen celebrities being discussed in Reddit threads. I’m talking about regular civilians you know or even strangers you have seen. I’m also asking both with and without the consent of the person. Is it sexual harassment? Is it illegal? Is it immoral? Is there any precedent behind this issue?

It's interesting that I should see this post. I was talking to someone the other day about things like this. The story went sort of like this.

I am writing a piece for LIT that involves a guy named Charles Castle, a retired FBI agent who happens to have an enormous dick. What if there actually is a former FBI agent out there who meets all the criteria to seemingly be a match for this person? Would they potentially have a lawsuit against me? What happens if his friends happen to read my story and then make him the but of jokes because of it?

I do have my boilerplate disclaimer, but it made me wonder.

My friend, who is a paralegal, said that I should be fine, but that I should remember that one of the nice things, at least for the legal industry, is that anyone has a legal right to sue anyone for anything.

 

[KeithD]

No, no one would sue you. Posted to Literotica, it's a giveaway with no commercial value. The reference is too tenuous for a case to be made even if commercial value was involved. And they'd have a devil of a time even finding you.

 

[StillStunned]

My friend, who is a paralegal, said that I should be fine, but that I should remember that one of the nice things, at least for the legal industry, is that anyone has a legal right to sue anyone for anything.

Is that true? I thought there was a process where the court determines first whether the claimant has standing. In other words, some cases are dismissed as frivolous. (Bear in mind that I know bits and bobs about the legal systems of several countries in Europe, but very little about the US except what I've learned from watching every episode of Boston Legal at least twice.)

In the situation you describe, I suspect that the evidence would have to be much more specific than just the circumstantial "well-endowed member of this profession".

 

[alohadave]

Is that true? I thought there was a process where the court determines first whether the claimant has standing. In other words, some cases are dismissed as frivolous. (Bear in mind that I know bits and bobs about the legal systems of several countries in Europe, but very little about the US except what I've learned from watching every episode of Boston Legal at least twice.)

In the situation you describe, I suspect that the evidence would have to be much more specific than just the circumstantial "well-endowed member of this profession".

Anyone can file a suit for any reason. Whether it goes forward or is dismissed is up to the judge.

The court will do everything it can to encourage both parties to resolve their issue without going to trial, but if they can't and the suit has merit, it will proceed.

Civil cases are not held to the same standards as criminal trials, since they are two entities looking to resolve a conflict, not the state prosecuting a crime.

IANAL, IANYL, TINLA

 

[gunhilltrain]

No, no one would sue you. Posted to Literotica, it's a giveaway with no commercial value. The reference is too tenuous for a case to be made even if commercial value was involved. And they'd have a devil of a time even finding you.

Wow, this thread is still going on? What I think the OP might have been alluding to was not necessarily legal issues (although that was referred to) but also a loss of status, maybe even humiliation, in the eyes of whatever social circles they are part of. The best analogy I could come up was a college newspaper, where people did indeed write "trash" about each other, right there in the printed issues. They would refer to the real names of their rivals/enemies. It was all very juvenile, but people that age are not very mature. (Neither are older people, but they hide it better.)

One guy got so upset that he collected as many copies of a certain issue that he could grab (they were distributed in bins around the campus) and he dumped them into the Hudson River. He had been the target of a silly but nasty prank in that printing.

 

[Britva415]

I thought there was a process where the court determines first whether the claimant has standing

You can't dismiss a case if it's never filed in the first place. The right to file is what we're talking about here. Beyond that, yeah, the court might tell you to go home, but it has to be on the docket to get that far.

 

[AndersonsBiographer]

It's interesting that I should see this post. I was talking to someone the other day about things like this. The story went sort of like this.

I am writing a piece for LIT that involves a guy named Charles Castle, a retired FBI agent who happens to have an enormous dick. What if there actually is a former FBI agent out there who meets all the criteria to seemingly be a match for this person? Would they potentially have a lawsuit against me? What happens if his friends happen to read my story and then make him the but of jokes because of it?

I do have my boilerplate disclaimer, but it made me wonder.

My friend, who is a paralegal, said that I should be fine, but that I should remember that one of the nice things, at least for the legal industry, is that anyone has a legal right to sue anyone for anything.

Part of the reason why I do my smut-posting from behind a VPN. And even then I don't really know if it will really do me any good. Causing an FBI agent to hate you is bad enough. What happens if an NSA agent decides to make it his mission in life to destroy you, or a Google Employee?

And we're talking about what is and is not acceptable now, today. Is your story still going to be publicly accessible on this website in another 20 years? It might be. There are stories on here that date back to before the Turn of the Millennium. Older than a lot of the posters here, I imagine. How much has changed in the time since then?

 

[AndersonsBiographer]

Wow, this thread is still going on? What I think the OP might have been alluding to was not necessarily legal issues (although that was referred to) but also a loss of status, maybe even humiliation, in the eyes of whatever social circles they are part of. The best analogy I could come up was a college newspaper, where people did indeed write "trash" about each other, right there in the printed issues. They would refer to the real names of their rivals/enemies. It was all very juvenile, but people that age are not very mature. (Neither are older people, but they hide it better.)

One guy got so upset that he collected as many copies of a certain issue that he could grab (they were distributed in bins around the campus) and he dumped them into the Hudson River. He had been the target of a silly but nasty prank in that printing.

Remember all the the articles about people running into trouble for the things that they had posted years ago on myspace?

Myspace is no longer with us, of course. But who knows what someone skilled at using the wayback machine could dig up, if he really wanted?

 

[KeithD]

Part of the reason why I do my smut-posting from behind a VPN. And even then I don't really know if it will really do me any good. Causing an FBI agent to hate you is bad enough. What happens if an NSA agent decides to make it his mission in life to destroy you, or a Google Employee?

There's no such thing as NSA agents. The National Security Agency monitors communications networks. They mostly are analysts. Nerds in tennis sneakers. If you aren't doing something like terrorism over the telephone, they won't know anything about you personally anyway. Their brief is national security, not sex.

 

[AndersonsBiographer]

There's no such thing as NSA agents. The National Security Agency monitors communications networks. They mostly are analysts. Nerds in tennis sneakers. If you aren't doing something like terrorism over the telephone, they won't know anything about you personally anyway. Their brief is national security, not sex.

Derp. You are correct.

Correct about agents, not correct about sex. They're absolutely trying to unmask the identities of literotica posters as part of their Kompromat data gathering operations.

 

[StillStunned]

Correct about agents, not correct about sex. They're absolutely trying to unmask the identities of literotica posters as part of their Kompromat data gathering operations.

Nah, at the moment they're trying to figure out who wrote which snippet in the Writing Exercise.

 

[AndersonsBiographer]

I mean, you would expect an Agency of all things to have agents when things called Bureaus and Departments often do. But those terms actually refer to the comparative ranking of each organization within the American federal government, not what their purposes are and thus what kind of employees they might need.

 

[madelinemasoch]

Wow, this thread is still going on? What I think the OP might have been alluding to was not necessarily legal issues (although that was referred to) but also a loss of status, maybe even humiliation, in the eyes of whatever social circles they are part of. The best analogy I could come up was a college newspaper, where people did indeed write "trash" about each other, right there in the printed issues. They would refer to the real names of their rivals/enemies. It was all very juvenile, but people that age are not very mature. (Neither are older people, but they hide it better.)

One guy got so upset that he collected as many copies of a certain issue that he could grab (they were distributed in bins around the campus) and he dumped them into the Hudson River. He had been the target of a silly but nasty prank in that printing.

No, I meant legally and ethically, not in regards to my social reputation.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Remember all the the articles about people running into trouble for the things that they had posted years ago on myspace?

Myspace is no long with us, of course. But who knows what someone skilled at using the wayback machine could dig up, if he really wanted?

I might have worried about that newspaper once, but it was forty-five years ago. At my present age, I'm less concerned. I didn't indulge in that collegiate stuff anyway even though I was on the staff. The odd thing is that the college library recently scanned all of that material and put it online. Now I can read all those kerfuffles from the 1970's again. But for me, it's like reading the Dead Sea Scrolls. Age has its privileges.

As for the OP: I don't know their exact age or what the specific social situation was. They hinted at it but never revealed the exact details.

 

[gunhilltrain]

No, I meant legally and ethically, not in regards to my social reputation.

Sorry, I missed that because you just posted it. I think the consensus here is that you probably don't have anything legal to worry about. Ethically: I don't know. I've admitted that I can't find an exact parallel in my own life that would be useful in your case - mainly because of the amount of time that has passed. The fact that I didn't like my equally young female news editor back in 1974 is not important now.